Italy *may* ban the Burqa

DeX2010

[QUOTE="M4Ntan"]

[QUOTE="ShadowDeathX"] They aren't forced to WEAR IT!!!ShadowDeathX

Most likely their husband forces them to wear it, and if not then who knows what he will do to her.

[QUOTE="SaudiFury"][QUOTE="CaveJohnson1"]

Good, it's nothing short of sexual repression

Whiteblade999

Living near Dearborn in Michigan I tend to see quite a few. I'm good friends with a few of the women who wear them and aren't very religious but the family is. I'm told they are afraid to not wear one because at best it usually results in being booted out of the house and at worst they get killed (you hear about this more then you would think). Sounds like repression to me if they are afraid to not wear a niqab don't you think?

[QUOTE="ShadowDeathX"][QUOTE="M4Ntan"]

Most likely their husband forces them to wear it, and if not then who knows what he will do to her.

kayoticdreamz

We are talking about ITALY not Iran....

isn't the west suppose to be about all freedoms? Yea right, you have the freedom to be repressed by the majority society.

[QUOTE="Whiteblade999"]

[QUOTE="SaudiFury"] you serious? how many Muslim women who wear the niqab do you know? i'm guessing not many. just easier to assume their all repressed.ShadowDeathX

Living near Dearborn in Michigan I tend to see quite a few. I'm good friends with a few of the women who wear them and aren't very religious but the family is. I'm told they are afraid to not wear one because at best it usually results in being booted out of the house and at worst they get killed (you hear about this more then you would think). Sounds like repression to me if they are afraid to not wear a niqab don't you think?

Being ashamed by the family is one thing. Disowning your kid (booting them out) or killing them is another.

[QUOTE="ShadowDeathX"][QUOTE="Whiteblade999"]

Living near Dearborn in Michigan I tend to see quite a few. I'm good friends with a few of the women who wear them and aren't very religious but the family is. I'm told they are afraid to not wear one because at best it usually results in being booted out of the house and at worst they get killed (you hear about this more then you would think). Sounds like repression to me if they are afraid to not wear a niqab don't you think?

Whiteblade999

Being ashamed by the family is one thing. Disowning your kid (booting them out) or killing them is another.

If this was America, I would be upset that they were going against the constitution.

But since it's not, I'll glady support any restrictions placed on Religion.

My dream: Make it illegal to teach religion to anyone under 18. - but that's never going to happen.

Will US ever do this? lolBloodseeker23

If this was America, I would be upset that they were going against the constitution.

But since it's not, I'll glady support any restrictions placed on Religion.

My dream: Make it illegal to teach religion to anyone under 18. - but that's never going to happen.

Blue-Sky

If followers of Islam want to live in modern society, they have to learn to start adapting to modern ideas, like not treating women like cattle. Women are equal to men in our world, if they can't handle that, then they can go stay in the desert.RandoIph

[QUOTE="Blue-Sky"]

If this was America, I would be upset that they were going against the constitution.

But since it's not, I'll glady support any restrictions placed on Religion.

My dream: Make it illegal to teach religion to anyone under 18. - but that's never going to happen.

RandoIph

If the Italian people feel that the Burqa goes against what their nation and people stand for, then all the power to them. I don't understand why some people think that just because something is religious it is suddenly beyond reproach.

Burka's are unnecessary. Hijabs are okay. But burkas are too anonymous. Anyone could just put one on and rob a store or commit any kind of crime and have a higher chance to get away with it

EDIT: Also, Islamic women are not *required* to wear either burkas or hijabs in non-Islamic countries, however women of any religion are required to wear a headscarf in many Arabic countries. So this is a clear double standard if countries are not "allowed" to ban the burka.

Burka's are unnecessary. Hijabs are okay. But burkas are too anonymous. Anyone could just put one on and rob a store or commit any kind of crime and have a higher chance to get away with it

EDIT: Also, Islamic women are not *required* to wear either burkas or hijabs in non-Islamic countries, however women of any religion are required to wear a headscarf in many Arabic countries. So this is a clear double standard if countries are not "allowed" to ban the burka.

garathe_den

[QUOTE="garathe_den"]

Burka's are unnecessary. Hijabs are okay. But burkas are too anonymous. Anyone could just put one on and rob a store or commit any kind of crime and have a higher chance to get away with it

EDIT: Also, Islamic women are not *required* to wear either burkas or hijabs in non-Islamic countries, however women of any religion are required to wear a headscarf in many Arabic countries. So this is a clear double standard if countries are not "allowed" to ban the burka.

NoSpeakyEnglish

Will US ever do this? lolBloodseeker23

hopefully, they are a security risk, like it or not, it is the truth.

I hope they go through with it - this madness needs to be stamped out. Not that an article of clothing is just so insulting, it's what it represents. Most Religions have been pacified through centuries of enlightenment. Islam however is still very much a threat to rationality and a type of existence that doesn't envolve worship. I'd be overjoyed to never again see another human on their knees in worship - ban the burqua, send the message that this nonsense shall not be tolerated. All of europe should follow suit, the islamification of europe is a cancer.

[QUOTE="Bloodseeker23"]Will US ever do this? lolM4Ntan

hopefully, they are a security risk, like it or not, it is the truth.

What do think, say, if I dressed up as a clown and walked the streets of the city. Should that be banned?

[QUOTE="garathe_den"]

Burka's are unnecessary. Hijabs are okay. But burkas are too anonymous. Anyone could just put one on and rob a store or commit any kind of crime and have a higher chance to get away with it

EDIT: Also, Islamic women are not *required* to wear either burkas or hijabs in non-Islamic countries, however women of any religion are required to wear a headscarf in many Arabic countries. So this is a clear double standard if countries are not "allowed" to ban the burka.

NoSpeakyEnglish

Ski masks and bandanas aren't accepted as normal attire in public places though, are they? Ski masks are for the slopes and bandanas are associated with gangs. Burkas on the other hand, are more accepted, even though they cover the entire body/face. Soi you can go into banks and not be expected to take it off because of the offense the wearer might take if confronted by a security guard or teller.

[QUOTE="CaveJohnson1"]

Good, it's nothing short of sexual repression

ShadowDeathX

Well, i wasn't sure so forgive my ignorance...

[QUOTE="The-Apostle"]

[QUOTE="SaltyMeatballs"] Those were never symbols of freedom and never will be.

That may be true but women should still be free to wear them.

They were always told that they are not as good as men and that they have to wear them so they cannot be disrespectful. They are forced to wear them, and if they are wanting to wear them, then it sounds like they have been successfully brainwashed to think that they are worthless baby makers.

and i'm not defending that law or many of the laws. your missing my point completely. if a woman wears a hijab or even the niqab (which i don't particularly like) what is it any of your business that she wears it? I mean you live in a country where women could basically walk around naked and nobody blinks an eye. hell.... they got nude beach's even. I'm merely pointing a double standard.SaudiFury

...and if I don't want my employees wearing what is essentially a mask to work, then I should be within my rights to ban the burqa in my office.

??? what are you talking about? a woman wears it so that men judge her based on her words and personality rather than on her looks. That's giving her depth not brain washing her into a baby maker. my God OT what's with the ignorance? and if you have gnorance on the subject can't you atleast look into it befoe making rash assumptions?mayceV

It's a silly concept because it proposes that women can only be taken seriously if they cover their faces, allthewhile not imposing such conditions on men. If men ALSO had to cover their faces, then you might have a point, but since the custom does not require men to cover their faces, you don't.

Which country next? I hope its mine.

[QUOTE="mayceV"] ??? what are you talking about? a woman wears it so that men judge her based on her words and personality rather than on her looks. That's giving her depth not brain washing her into a baby maker. my God OT what's with the ignorance? and if you have gnorance on the subject can't you atleast look into it befoe making rash assumptions?dkrustyklown

It's a silly concept because it proposes that women can only be taken seriously if they cover their faces, allthewhile not imposing such conditions on men. If men ALSO had to cover their faces, then you might have a point, but since the custom does not require men to cover their faces, you don't.

I can see the argument for banning them. It's difficult to see who they actually are and it's bad for identification purposes. Wearing a full face veil of any kind basically means you cannot purchase any age-restricted material (any games or movies for people over the age of 15), or buy alcohol or tobacco. Then aain, Muslim women typically won't be purchasing those types of substances ...

I just hope one day they finally ban these things in the us.

If I can't walk down the street wearing a balaclava, then Muslim women shouldn't be allowed to wear anything that covers their faces.

It's quite simple really.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="SaudiFury"] if you think so, ask a Muslim woman who wears a niqab. to her she's no longer being sexually objectified and is being taken for her words, with her looks not taken into account to influence that person's opinion of her. Zaibach

[QUOTE="Zaibach"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]I'm sorry but that's just a culture giving her that opinion.LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Zaibach"]so which are you bashing? the muslim religion or the saudi culture?

chessmaster1989

[QUOTE="Vinegar_Strokes"][QUOTE="The-Apostle"]

Personally, I actually don't believe in multiculturalism, but I also hate persecution. I just think that if a Muslim woman wants to wear a Burka she should be allowed to wear it.

nocoolnamejim

[QUOTE="Zaibach"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]I'm sorry but that's just a culture giving her that opinion.LJS9502_basic

Why should anyone have to adopt? Why can 't the two cultures co-exist?

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Zaibach"]so which are you bashing? the muslim religion or the saudi culture?

DarkGamer007

Why should anyone have to adopt? Why can 't the two cultures co-exist?

[QUOTE="chessmaster1989"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] I didn't "bash" anything....but it's cultural not religious. Europe does not have the same culture. Before immigrating one should decide if they can adapt to the new culture....not expect the new culture to adapt to them.LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="DarkGamer007"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] I didn't "bash" anything....but it's cultural not religious. Europe does not have the same culture. Before immigrating one should decide if they can adapt to the new culture....not expect the new culture to adapt to them.LJS9502_basic

Why should anyone have to adopt? Why can 't the two cultures co-exist?

It hasn't caused conflict until recent years, which oh-so-coincidentally coincides with rising anti-Muslim sentiment and uprising of extreme right wing attitudes. Yes a degree of assimilation should occur – language for example - but so should a degree of cultural freedom as multi-culturalism is part of the fabric of many western nations (and the argument for and against is perhaps for a different thread though).

This argument for security issues is tired and old and reeks a little of media fuelled lynch mob hysteria about something relatively trivial, and targeting what is an extreme minority group is akin to 'picking on the fat kid' in the playground.

The other 'well we have to adapt to them so they should adapt to us' argument too is a poor attempt at instilling xenophobia and stifle acceptance of others we should all aspire to do, not back pedal to intolerant, provincial attitudes of old.

Yes conflict does occur, especially in times of economic strife and frustration causes people to lash out as per this somewhat pointless exercise in demonising the burqa. Common sense suggests that forcefully removing a garment is more likely to isolate further, not help assimilation.

Who cares what they think, their prime minister is a joke and their roads look like that of a third world countries.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="DarkGamer007"]

Why should anyone have to adopt? Why can 't the two cultures co-exist?

poptart

It hasn't caused conflict until recent years, which oh-so-coincidentally coincides with rising anti-Muslim sentiment and uprising of extreme right wing attitudes. Yes a degree of assimilation should occur – language for example - but so should a degree of cultural freedom as multi-culturalism is part of the fabric of many western nations (and the argument for and against is perhaps for a different thread though).

This argument for security issues is tired and old and reeks a little of media fuelled lynch mob hysteria about something relatively trivial, and targeting what is an extreme minority group is akin to 'picking on the fat kid' in the playground.

The other 'well we have to adapt to them so they should adapt to us' argument too is a poor attempt at instilling xenophobia and stifle acceptance of others we should all aspire to do, not back pedal to intolerant, provincial attitudes of old.

Yes conflict does occur, especially in times of economic strife and frustration causes people to lash out as per this somewhat pointless exercise in demonising the burqa. Common sense suggests that forcefully removing a garment is more likely to isolate further, not help assimilation.

That's good that they banned it. It's a security risk and it's also sexist in my opinion.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="chessmaster1989"] If the new culture is not doing any harm to the present one nor offsetting it, then the current one should tolerate the new one.red12355

Because everything else is already banned... Try walking with a balacava on into a store, see what happens.

[QUOTE="poptart"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] Adaptation always has to occur. You can't have two separate entities. That causes conflict.LJS9502_basic

It hasn't caused conflict until recent years, which oh-so-coincidentally coincides with rising anti-Muslim sentiment and uprising of extreme right wing attitudes. Yes a degree of assimilation should occur – language for example - but so should a degree of cultural freedom as multi-culturalism is part of the fabric of many western nations (and the argument for and against is perhaps for a different thread though).

This argument for security issues is tired and old and reeks a little of media fuelled lynch mob hysteria about something relatively trivial, and targeting what is an extreme minority group is akin to 'picking on the fat kid' in the playground.

The other 'well we have to adapt to them so they should adapt to us' argument too is a poor attempt at instilling xenophobia and stifle acceptance of others we should all aspire to do, not back pedal to intolerant, provincial attitudes of old.

Yes conflict does occur, especially in times of economic strife and frustration causes people to lash out as per this somewhat pointless exercise in demonising the burqa. Common sense suggests that forcefully removing a garment is more likely to isolate further, not help assimilation.

Well, again that could be interpreted as a slightly petty attitude – the world isn't going to do it nor does the world want to, and if it does suddenly decide to adopt the burqa then we can address it then. As for now it's an extremely small number of people that if we step back for a wee second isn't causing any problem aside from a little intimidation (which is our problem not theirs).