Man robs bank for $1 to get medical care in jail.

[QUOTE="Xtasy26"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Actually, a universal health care program in the US will cause greater dependence on the government for the basic necessities such as a roof over one's head and food on the table.

WhiteKnight77

Explain Canada then? I have friends in Canada who enjoy thier Universal Health Care yet they are self sufficient enough that they don't depend on the Canadian government for the basic necessities like food or shelter. They have a thing called a "job" up in Canada, in addition to their Universal Health care.

Apparently you failed to read the part earlier where I talked about those in the US who do work and make minimum wage and could not afford to have a place to live or eat with a universal health care plan in place.

There is one thing that people making minimum wage in the U.S. really can't afford on their own though, and that's health insurance. I simply can't understand how people support limiting something as essential and basic as health care access based on one's ability to pay.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="Xtasy26"]

Explain Canada then? I have friends in Canada who enjoy thier Universal Health Care yet they are self sufficient enough that they don't depend on the Canadian government for the basic necessities like food or shelter. They have a thing called a "job" up in Canada, in addition to their Universal Health care.

Xtasy26

Apparently you failed to read the part earlier where I talked about those in the US who do work and make minimum wage and could not afford to have a place to live or eat with a universal health care plan in place.

That is nonsense. What evidence do you have that is the case. You just spouted numbers with no proof whatsoever. For the record, there are people in Canada for example that work minimum wage and they have a place to eat and a place to stay.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="Xtasy26"]

Explain Canada then? I have friends in Canada who enjoy thier Universal Health Care yet they are self sufficient enough that they don't depend on the Canadian government for the basic necessities like food or shelter. They have a thing called a "job" up in Canada, in addition to their Universal Health care.

Xtasy26

Apparently you failed to read the part earlier where I talked about those in the US who do work and make minimum wage and could not afford to have a place to live or eat with a universal health care plan in place.

That is nonsense. What evidence do you have that is the case. You just spouted numbers with no proof whatsoever. For the record, there are people in Canada for example that work minimum wage and they have a place to eat and a place to stay.

I am not talking about Canada, I am talking about the US. Do the math. US minimum wage of $7.25 for 40 hours is $290 a week. With a 50% tax rate (remember matt stated his total tax payments in Canada are 50%) to pay for regular taxes along with the increase that would have to take place to in order to pay for a US universal health care system would mean that a US citizen earning minimum wage would get to keep $580 a month.

Governments cannot provide a service without charging someone to pay for it and the US is no different. I will say it again, taxes will have to increase from their current rate in order to pay for a US universal health care plan. There is no way it could be implemented otherwise. Doing so would cause those in the US who can barely make it without government (read taxpayer) assistance to have to rely on the government (taxpayers) even more than they do now.

[QUOTE="Xtasy26"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Apparently you failed to read the part earlier where I talked about those in the US who do work and make minimum wage and could not afford to have a place to live or eat with a universal health care plan in place.

WhiteKnight77

That is nonsense. What evidence do you have that is the case. You just spouted numbers with no proof whatsoever. For the record, there are people in Canada for example that work minimum wage and they have a place to eat and a place to stay.

I am not talking about Canada, I am talking about the US. Do the math. US minimum wage of $7.25 for 40 hours is $290 a week. With a 50% tax rate (remember matt stated his total tax payments in Canada are 50%) to pay for regular taxes along with the increase that would have to take place to in order to pay for a US universal health care system would mean that a US citizen earning minimum wage would get to keep $580 a month.

Governments cannot provide a service without charging someone to pay for it and the US is no different. I will say it again, taxes will have to increase from their current rate in order to pay for a US universal health care plan. There is no way it could be implemented otherwise. Doing so would cause those in the US who can barely make it without government (read taxpayer) assistance to have to rely on the government (taxpayers) even more than they do now.

[QUOTE="Xtasy26"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Apparently you failed to read the part earlier where I talked about those in the US who do work and make minimum wage and could not afford to have a place to live or eat with a universal health care plan in place.

WhiteKnight77

That is nonsense. What evidence do you have that is the case. You just spouted numbers with no proof whatsoever. For the record, there are people in Canada for example that work minimum wage and they have a place to eat and a place to stay.

I am not talking about Canada, I am talking about the US. Do the math. US minimum wage of $7.25 for 40 hours is $290 a week. With a 50% tax rate (remember matt stated his total tax payments in Canada are 50%) to pay for regular taxes along with the increase that would have to take place to in order to pay for a US universal health care system would mean that a US citizen earning minimum wage would get to keep $580 a month.

Governments cannot provide a service without charging someone to pay for it and the US is no different. I will say it again, taxes will have to increase from their current rate in order to pay for a US universal health care plan. There is no way it could be implemented otherwise. Doing so would cause those in the US who can barely make it without government (read taxpayer) assistance to have to rely on the government (taxpayers) even more than they do now.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="Xtasy26"]

That is nonsense. What evidence do you have that is the case. You just spouted numbers with no proof whatsoever. For the record, there are people in Canada for example that work minimum wage and they have a place to eat and a place to stay.

Nibroc420

I am not talking about Canada, I am talking about the US. Do the math. US minimum wage of $7.25 for 40 hours is $290 a week. With a 50% tax rate (remember matt stated his total tax payments in Canada are 50%) to pay for regular taxes along with the increase that would have to take place to in order to pay for a US universal health care system would mean that a US citizen earning minimum wage would get to keep $580 a month.

Governments cannot provide a service without charging someone to pay for it and the US is no different. I will say it again, taxes will have to increase from their current rate in order to pay for a US universal health care plan. There is no way it could be implemented otherwise. Doing so would cause those in the US who can barely make it without government (read taxpayer) assistance to have to rely on the government (taxpayers) even more than they do now.

So much misinformation in the usa about healthcare its kinda scary.i guess hitler was right when he said "if you tell a lie enuff times people will think its true"

So how do you explain everywhere else in the developed world? Universal health care hasn't caused mass homelessness and starvation in Canada, or the UK, or France, or Germany, or any other developed country you wanna point out. These problems that you are pointing out simply don't exist.

There is one thing that people making minimum wage in the U.S. really can't afford on their own though, and that's health insurance. I simply can't understand how people support limiting something as essential and basic as health care access based on one's ability to pay.

-Sun_Tzu-

See my above post. Lets say that someone can find an apartment for $500 a month (this is what I pay for my apartment). $580 leaves $80 a month. A single person cannot buy enough food to live for a month much less pay for electricity or a phone at the least. This also excludes transportation (in many cases a necessity here in the US as public transportation sucks).

Now as to Europe and such, it also helps that there are well established transportation systems that do not rely on just cars as here in the US. Maybe it's because their governments require employers to pay more, I don't know as I never asked how much someone who worked at a McDonald's might make. If they make more than the US minimum wage, great for them, but I venture to say that they need to share a place with someone else. That woman working at a Mickey D's here in the US may have a couple of kids and need an apartment with more than one bedroom and of course, have a higher rent. There are places here in the US that rent is outrageous for something comparable somewhere else at a cheaper price even if it is in the "poor" section of town. Those problems may not exist in other countries, but would in the US.

[QUOTE="Xtasy26"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Apparently you failed to read the part earlier where I talked about those in the US who do work and make minimum wage and could not afford to have a place to live or eat with a universal health care plan in place.

WhiteKnight77

That is nonsense. What evidence do you have that is the case. You just spouted numbers with no proof whatsoever. For the record, there are people in Canada for example that work minimum wage and they have a place to eat and a place to stay.

I am not talking about Canada, I am talking about the US. Do the math. US minimum wage of $7.25 for 40 hours is $290 a week. With a 50% tax rate (remember matt stated his total tax payments in Canada are 50%) to pay for regular taxes along with the increase that would have to take place to in order to pay for a US universal health care system would mean that a US citizen earning minimum wage would get to keep $580 a month.

Governments cannot provide a service without charging someone to pay for it and the US is no different. I will say it again, taxes will have to increase from their current rate in order to pay for a US universal health care plan. There is no way it could be implemented otherwise. Doing so would cause those in the US who can barely make it without government (read taxpayer) assistance to have to rely on the government (taxpayers) even more than they do now.

And where exactly did you pull that 50% tax rate? Out of thin air? No one saying that you need a change in the tax system. But your claim that the tax rate would have to be increased to 50% for all people is just ridiculous. If that was the case, Canadians would have gone broke. Our friends up in Canada, which have a Universal Health care are NOT taxed 50%. I have plenty of friends in Canada, they are hardly broke. Many of them have a similar standard of living as they have in the US in ADDITION to their Universal Health care. Maybe you should stop putting out random tax rate out of thin air, without any proof or justification to back up your claim.

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"]

So how do you explain everywhere else in the developed world? Universal health care hasn't caused mass homelessness and starvation in Canada, or the UK, or France, or Germany, or any other developed country you wanna point out. These problems that you are pointing out simply don't exist.

There is one thing that people making minimum wage in the U.S. really can't afford on their own though, and that's health insurance. I simply can't understand how people support limiting something as essential and basic as health care access based on one's ability to pay.

WhiteKnight77

See my above post. Lets say that someone can find an apartment for $500 a month (this is what I pay for my apartment). $580 leaves $80 a month. A single person cannot buy enough food to live for a month much less pay for electricity or a phone at the least. This also excludes transportation (in many cases a necessity here in the US as public transportation sucks).

Now as to Europe and such, it also helps that there are well established transportation systems that do not rely on just cars as here in the US. Maybe it's because their governments require employers to pay more, I don't know as I never asked how much someone who worked at a McDonald's might make. If they make more than the US minimum wage, great for them, but I venture to say that they need to share a place with someone else. That woman working at a Mickey D's here in the US may have a couple of kids and need an apartment with more than one bedroom and of course, have a higher rent. There are places here in the US that rent is outrageous for something comparable somewhere else at a cheaper price even if it is in the "poor" section of town. Those problems may not exist in other countries, but would in the US.

Canadians are NOT taxed 50%. the things you're trying to claim are false.Nibroc420

What percentage of your paycheck is income taxes and what part of your paycheck is for your universal health care? Add the 2 percentages together and decide if I am close or not.

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"]Canadians are NOT taxed 50%. the things you're trying to claim are false.WhiteKnight77

What percentage of your paycheck is income taxes and what part of your paycheck is for your universal health care? Add the 2 percentages together and decide if I am close or not.

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"]

So how do you explain everywhere else in the developed world? Universal health care hasn't caused mass homelessness and starvation in Canada, or the UK, or France, or Germany, or any other developed country you wanna point out. These problems that you are pointing out simply don't exist.

There is one thing that people making minimum wage in the U.S. really can't afford on their own though, and that's health insurance. I simply can't understand how people support limiting something as essential and basic as health care access based on one's ability to pay.

WhiteKnight77

See my above post. Lets say that someone can find an apartment for $500 a month (this is what I pay for my apartment). $580 leaves $80 a month. A single person cannot buy enough food to live for a month much less pay for electricity or a phone at the least. This also excludes transportation (in many cases a necessity here in the US as public transportation sucks).

Now as to Europe and such, it also helps that there are well established transportation systems that do not rely on just cars as here in the US. Maybe it's because their governments require employers to pay more, I don't know as I never asked how much someone who worked at a McDonald's might make. If they make more than the US minimum wage, great for them, but I venture to say that they need to share a place with someone else. That woman working at a Mickey D's here in the US may have a couple of kids and need an apartment with more than one bedroom and of course, have a higher rent. There are places here in the US that rent is outrageous for something comparable somewhere else at a cheaper price even if it is in the "poor" section of town. Those problems may not exist in other countries, but would in the US.

What does this even have to do with your claim that you would have to have tax rate of 50% to have a Universal Health care like they have up in Canada.

And your claim about rent being higher in different cities in the US still doesn't give any credence to your arguement. For example, rent for an apartment in Toronto or Vancouver would be considerably higher than say Winnipeg, Manitoba. What does that even have to do with Universal Health Care is beyond me....:?

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"]Canadians are NOT taxed 50%. the things you're trying to claim are false.Nibroc420

What percentage of your paycheck is income taxes and what part of your paycheck is for your universal health care? Add the 2 percentages together and decide if I am close or not.

No, I didn't. The nice thing about my job is I get to travel. I have been to The Netherlands (met and talked to people all around Europe) and even Canada and I talk with everyone about what they pay in taxes and yes, they pay close to half their weekly paychecks in taxes to pay for all of their social programs, including health care.

Where are you getting this 50% tax rate from on minimum wage employees?-Sun_Tzu-

Facepalm.jpg

Again, the government would have to raise taxes from the 25-30% they already tax US citizens to account for the necessary funding for a universal health care plan. It is no stretch to see an increase of 20% to pay for such a program.

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"][QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

What percentage of your paycheck is income taxes and what part of your paycheck is for your universal health care? Add the 2 percentages together and decide if I am close or not.

WhiteKnight77

No, I didn't. The nice thing about my job is I get to travel. I have been to The Netherlands (met and talked to people all around Europe) and even Canada and I talk with everyone about what they pay in taxes and yes, they pay close to half their weekly paychecks in taxes to pay for all of their social programs, including health care.

Who's "They"? and are "They" educated?

Also, define "social programs", Putting money into your CPP isn't really a "social program". And unlike the USA, Canadian governments have yet to have to dip into people's pensions to pay for outragious government bailouts.

There's no numbers or proof to support your claim. Either provide some evidence, or there's no sense in continuing this discussion.

Facepalm.jpg

Again, the government would have to raise taxes from the 25-30% they already tax US citizens to account for the necessary funding for a universal health care plan. It is no stretch to see an increase of 20% to pay for such a program.

WhiteKnight77

What does this even have to do with your claim that you would have to have tax rate of 50% to have a Universal Health care like they have up in Canada.

And your claim about rent being higher in different cities in the US still doesn't give any credence to your arguement. For example, rent for an apartment in Toronto or Vancouver would be considerably higher than say Winnipeg, Manitoba. What does that even have to do with Universal Health Care is beyond me....:?

Xtasy26

Try and figure it out. How do you pay for something when you have a minimum amount of cash flow. Someone in South Carolina working at McDonald's could afford a $500 apartment on a 50% tax rate, someone in California doing the same thing at McDonald's couldn't afford a similar apartment as the rent would be even more.

Try and figure it out. How do you pay for something when you have a minimum amount of cash flow. Someone in South Carolina working at McDonald's could afford a $500 apartment on a 50% tax rate, someone in California doing the same thing at McDonald's couldn't afford a similar apartment as the rent would be even more.

WhiteKnight77

Excellent hypothetical situation.

Now connect it to reality with facts and figures? Oh, wait, no-ones being charged 50% tax, guess your point is moot.

Who's "They"? and are "They" educated?

Also, define "social programs", Putting money into your CPP isn't really a "social program". And unlike the USA, Canadian governments have yet to have to dip into people's pensions to pay for outragious government bailouts.

There's no numbers or proof to support your claim. Either provide some evidence, or there's no sense in continuing this discussion.

Nibroc420

Welders, NDT technicians, bartenders (who have held other jobs previously), crane operators, a guy that works for the town he live in (Scotland). All are educated in some fashion (might not be college, but tradesmen can earn 6 digits a year and more than some "college" educated people with bachelors and masters. Even a doctor (in Canada no less).

Social programs are anything that the government pays for with taxpayer dollars like Medicaid, Medicare, food stamps, section 8 housing, anything along those lines.

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"][QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

What percentage of your paycheck is income taxes and what part of your paycheck is for your universal health care? Add the 2 percentages together and decide if I am close or not.

WhiteKnight77

No, I didn't. The nice thing about my job is I get to travel. I have been to The Netherlands (met and talked to people all around Europe) and even Canada and I talk with everyone about what they pay in taxes and yes, they pay close to half their weekly paychecks in taxes to pay for all of their social programs, including health care.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Try and figure it out. How do you pay for something when you have a minimum amount of cash flow. Someone in South Carolina working at McDonald's could afford a $500 apartment on a 50% tax rate, someone in California doing the same thing at McDonald's couldn't afford a similar apartment as the rent would be even more.

Nibroc420

Excellent hypothetical situation.

Now connect it to reality with facts and figures? Oh, wait, no-ones being charged 50% tax, guess your point is moot.

Are you from a country with universal health care? Look at your gross pay then take a look at your net or take home pay. Are you taking home 70% of your paycheck?

Social programs are anything that the government pays for with taxpayer dollars like Medicaid, Medicare, food stamps, section 8 housing, anything along those lines.

WhiteKnight77

Our Healthcare is setup so if you make less than 22K a year it's free, up to being 100/Month once you make Over 30k(after deductions) if you have 3 or more kids.

See. I dont think you fully understand the concept, and you're simply going off about things you've heard and misunderstood.

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Try and figure it out. How do you pay for something when you have a minimum amount of cash flow. Someone in South Carolina working at McDonald's could afford a $500 apartment on a 50% tax rate, someone in California doing the same thing at McDonald's couldn't afford a similar apartment as the rent would be even more.

WhiteKnight77

Excellent hypothetical situation.

Now connect it to reality with facts and figures? Oh, wait, no-ones being charged 50% tax, guess your point is moot.

Are you from a country with universal health care? Look at your gross pay then take a look at your net or take home pay. Are you taking home 70% of your paycheck?

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"] :roll: We all know you pulled 50% out of your ***. Just admit you're wrong.Ringx55

No, I didn't. The nice thing about my job is I get to travel. I have been to The Netherlands (met and talked to people all around Europe) and even Canada and I talk with everyone about what they pay in taxes and yes, they pay close to half their weekly paychecks in taxes to pay for all of their social programs, including health care.

Is that just a province tax or a Canadian federal tax? In the US, there is a federal tax and most states charge a state income tax? If you only have to pay 10% a week, then y'all do better than the US does. I pulled a pay stub out from last year, I worked 107 hours over the course of 2 weeks (I get paid every other week). I grossed $2048.50 with $622.64 withheld in state and federal taxes, if my math is right, that is just over 30%. Overtime increases tax rates.

[QUOTE="Ringx55"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

No, I didn't. The nice thing about my job is I get to travel. I have been to The Netherlands (met and talked to people all around Europe) and even Canada and I talk with everyone about what they pay in taxes and yes, they pay close to half their weekly paychecks in taxes to pay for all of their social programs, including health care.

WhiteKnight77

Is that just a province tax or a Canadian federal tax? In the US, there is a federal tax and most states charge a state income tax? If you only have to pay 10% a week, then y'all do better than the US does. I pulled a pay stub out from last year, I worked 107 hours over the course of 2 weeks (I get paid every other week). I grossed $2048.50 with $622.64 withheld in state and federal taxes, if my math is right, that is just over 30%. Overtime increases tax rates.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]Is that just a province tax or a Canadian federal tax? In the US, there is a federal tax and most states charge a state income tax? If you only have to pay 10% a week, then y'all do better than the US does. I pulled a pay stub out from last year, I worked 107 hours over the course of 2 weeks (I get paid every other week). I grossed $2048.50 with $622.64 withheld in state and federal taxes, if my math is right, that is just over 30%. Overtime increases tax rates.

Nibroc420

That is just me, not everyone and that is just one pay check. Food stamps are (they were not actually stamps but bills) are money paid for by the taxpayer and given to those who meet certain requirements and do not earn enough money to buy food (yes there are food banks too, but usually are run by churches and other non-profit groups and not the government). Section 8 housing is housing that the government helps pay rent on, again, for those who cannot entirely pay for housing. Unfortunately in the US there is a lot of corruption in social programs (a guy working in Georgia getting food stamps in Michigan for instance) and is a big reason for the exorbitant costs related to said programs. There are many who cheat the system and receives services that they are not entitled to. Unfortunately, not enough of them that get caught to help control said costs and why our taxes are higher than Canadians apparently.

Unfortunately, not enough of them that get caught to help control said costs and why our taxes are higher than Canadians apparently.

WhiteKnight77

Good thing we Canadians aren't like that.8)

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"]

Excellent hypothetical situation.

Now connect it to reality with facts and figures? Oh, wait, no-ones being charged 50% tax, guess your point is moot.

Nibroc420

Are you from a country with universal health care? Look at your gross pay then take a look at your net or take home pay. Are you taking home 70% of your paycheck?

Unless your paycheck is small, I find that hard to believe. At my first job (making minimum wage) I used to take home almost 90% of my weekly pay. But the higher the pay the higher the taxes (this effect is greater in Canada than in the US).Canadaalso has a federal sales tax, where as the US does not.

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"][QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Are you from a country with universal health care? Look at your gross pay then take a look at your net or take home pay. Are you taking home 70% of your paycheck?

limpbizkit818

Unless your paycheck is small, I find that hard to believe. At my first job (making minimum wage) I used to take home almost 90% of my weekly pay. But the higher the pay the higher the taxes (this effect is greater in Canada than in the US). Cananda also as a federal sales tax, where as the US does not.

[QUOTE="limpbizkit818"]

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"] I take home ~80% of my paycheck. And yes, i have universal healthcare.Nibroc420

Unless your paycheck is small, I find that hard to believe. At my first job (making minimum wage) I used to take home almost 90% of my weekly pay. But the higher the pay the higher the taxes (this effect is greater in Canada than in the US). Cananda also as a federal sales tax, where as the US does not.

Oops :P

I make a lot of type-os because I am constantly switching between my laptop keyboard and my desktop. My fingers never adjust.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]Unfortunately, not enough of them that get caught to help control said costs and why our taxes are higher than Canadians apparently.

Nibroc420

Good thing we Canadians aren't like that.8)

I wouldn't say that, I know of people with an "education" that do not want to do more than they have to when it comes to work or if they care about doing it right to begin with. I also know that there are Canadians that do as little as they can such those welders I talked about earlier. US welders that go to Alberta can only teach Canadian welders how to run the equipment that they US company brings up. The Canadian welders are then supposed to run said equipment. I can't tell you the number of complaints from the US welders about the Canadians and them not running the equipment and doing everything else but weld.

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]Unfortunately, not enough of them that get caught to help control said costs and why our taxes are higher than Canadians apparently.

WhiteKnight77

Good thing we Canadians aren't like that.8)

I wouldn't say that, I know of people with an "education" that do not want to do more than they have to when it comes to work or if they care about doing it right to begin with. I also know that there are Canadians that do as little as they can such those welders I talked about earlier. US welders that go to Alberta can only teach Canadian welders how to run the equipment that they US company brings up. The Canadian welders are then supposed to run said equipment. I can't tell you the number of complaints from the US welders about the Canadians and them not running the equipment and doing everything else but weld.

Touching story.
I'll never understand why some people are against healthcare...I just don't.

He's doing it right.

We need universal health care

NOW

Touching story.
I'll never understand why some people are against healthcare...I just don't.

Sagem28

That's the idea.

America this is sad :|Solid_Tango

[QUOTE="Sagem28"]

Touching story.
I'll never understand why some people are against healthcare...I just don't.

BranKetra

That's the idea.

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="Sagem28"]

Touching story.
I'll never understand why some people are against healthcare...I just don't.

DroidPhysX

That's the idea.

The teller was so frightened that she had to be taken to the hospital to be checked out.

DroidPhysX

That is the sorriest thing I have heard in awhile. That person must be scared of their own shadow, pathetic.

[QUOTE="Oscar-Wilde"]

Also. you really are not gonna "win" this just letting you know. :P

But i've already won.

Your arguement is flawed, for all to see.

before we go on the we need universal health care has anyone stopped to consider our crushing debt? has anyone stopped to consider how to pay for it(no a bill that is miles long does not begin to count unless youve read every detail of it). but no lets just put 300 million folks on a healthcare plan and pay for it with the money the tooth fairy gives us. really folks. really? im all for affordable medicine but universal health care is not quite the answer and even if it was we lack the funds to cover it. of course other countries have universal healthcare and they have their own horror stories of how bad it is over there but i guess lets just ignore those stories cause clearly they are liars. that said this is sad but not the first time ive heard of itkayoticdreamz

Yep completely forgetting the billions and trillions of Corporate welfare that has been given through out the years.. This is whats going to bring down the SYSTEM!.. Furthermore newsflash preventive care is not only the cheapest but the most effective.. That is why other countries in the west not only pay less for theri healthcare but their average health is far better than the average American.

So what I am getting from this article is that we need to deregulate everything having to do with health care and eliminate taxes on big pharma companies so they are more willing to produce drugs to help people. I mean, if our health care system is this bad then the market obviously isn't being allowed to work properly.

So what I am getting from this article is that we need to deregulate everything having to do with health care and eliminate taxes on big pharma companies so they are more willing to produce drugs to help people. I mean, if our health care system is this bad then the market obviously isn't being allowed to work properly.

hoola

[QUOTE="Sagem28"]

Touching story.
I'll never understand why some people are against healthcare...I just don't.

BranKetra

That's the idea.

That's what baffles me about american patriotism. Those that are most proud of their "nation" are the ones that want less to do with their neighbor.

[QUOTE="Xtasy26"]

What does this even have to do with your claim that you would have to have tax rate of 50% to have a Universal Health care like they have up in Canada.

And your claim about rent being higher in different cities in the US still doesn't give any credence to your arguement. For example, rent for an apartment in Toronto or Vancouver would be considerably higher than say Winnipeg, Manitoba. What does that even have to do with Universal Health Care is beyond me....:?

WhiteKnight77

Try and figure it out. How do you pay for something when you have a minimum amount of cash flow. Someone in South Carolina working at McDonald's could afford a $500 apartment on a 50% tax rate, someone in California doing the same thing at McDonald's couldn't afford a similar apartment as the rent would be even more.

Again where in the world are you getting your 50% tax rate from is beyond me. I have friends up in Canada and NONE of them pay your so called 50% tax rate. Do they pay higher taxes than say comparable incomes in the US? Yes. But that is offset by the fact that they have Universal Health care where every citizen is taken care of and where people don't have to rob a bank just so they could get health care.

EmpCom

No what's flawed is that a poor citizen is so desperate, that he'll go to jail in order to receive medical attention.

Pretty bad that inmates can get better healthcare than underprivileged law abiding citizens