Obama has a chance in Texas!

Obama has no chance in texas. Texas is one of the last few places with real Americans who care about the American way and not people like Obama who want to mimic europe for whatever reasons.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="EvilTaru"]

Palin isn't stupid enough to not know that she doesn't have the support of the GOP establishment to win the nomination, she might be running for VP.

While it's still very early, it's not that hardtounderstand that the GOPalready knows they need tonominate someone who doesn't have strong enough support from the conservative base but with enough broad appeal to social moderates-fiscal conservatives. If the economy is still in the dumpster in 2012 theGOP candidate would be viewed as the lesser of the two evils.

EvilTaru

I doubt she's running for VP since she's all ready been there, done that. Also, with all due respect, I think my link showing her testing the water in Iowa is a little more substantial than your speculation on how smart Palin is.

How do you know the GOP candidate would be viewed as the lesser of two evils? If they put someone like Palin up, it makes Obama look better than he ordinarily would look even in spite of a slow economy. In no circumstance would Palin look like the lesser of two evils if she hasn't made adjustments by then. After all, the polls indicate that even in this slow economy, Obama is viewed more favorably.

If Obama would look like the lesser of two evils in any situation, they would just throw anybody out there, but we both know that won't happen.

Testing the waters in Iowa doesn'treally mean she thinks she has an actual chance to win the GOP primary, it keeps her in the spotlight and allow her to maintain some level of relevance. Huckabee's PAC is seeking donations too but it's pretty clear that he won't have the fund-raising powess to win the nomination either, right now it's too early to even tell who's going to be running other than maybe Mitt Romney who has way too much baggage to win the GOP nomination.

You're basically trying to set up the dream scenario in order for Obama to get a second term, when the fact is as long as the economy is in the dumpster and unemployment is still high by 2012, Obama can kiss the white house goodbye.

I'm not trying to set up a dream scenario at all (and as you can't read minds, that's nothing more than an assumption on your part) as I don't think that Palin will win the nomination. Nor do I want her to. I don't think Obama should get a free ride on the back of Palin.

But you are simply making a whole bunch of unwarranted assumptions and are not backing them up with anything but your insistence that you are riht. She could very well run. She has several things going for her: a devoted fanbase and a command of the media, etc.

Also, your use of the word "fact" when making a prediction of what will happen in the future is very telling. Historical precedent/=/fact in any way shape or form.

Obama has no chance in texas. Texas is one of the last few places with real Americans who care about the American way and not people like Obama who want to mimic europe for whatever reasons.

Espada12

You don't even live here, so who are you to say whose a real American?

There's no such thing as a "real American". If you live in America, you are an American. Period.

I think Sarah Palin could win if she had enough campaign money behind her, like lots and lots of it, I thought the midterm election and all those crazy candidates illustrated this just check out Rachel Maddow's Not A Scientific Graph of Kookiness and Electoral Viabilitylamprey263

O' Donell and Angel both lost (and they were probably the kookiest of the bunch), and there is quite a difference between running for Congress and running for President.

If not for those two kooky candidates, the Repubs might have taken the Senate.

[QUOTE="Espada12"]

Obama has no chance in texas. Texas is one of the last few places with real Americans who care about the American way and not people like Obama who want to mimic europe for whatever reasons.

GreySeal9

You don't even live here, so who are you to say whose a real American?

There's no such thing as a "real American". If you live in America, you are an American. Period.

I have enough interest in America to want to see it steered in the right direction. Liberals and their robin hood mentalities will be the death of the USA.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="Espada12"]

Obama has no chance in texas. Texas is one of the last few places with real Americans who care about the American way and not people like Obama who want to mimic europe for whatever reasons.

Espada12

You don't even live here, so who are you to say whose a real American?

There's no such thing as a "real American". If you live in America, you are an American. Period.

I have enough interest in America to want to see it steered in the right direction. Liberals and their robin hood mentalities will be the death of the USA.

I don't care if you have "interest in America." You are not an American and thus you are in no position to talk about whose a "real American," just as I would be in no position to tell you whose a "real" citizen on your country.

And this thread is not about "liberals", so please don't derail it with your tired liberal bashing.

[QUOTE="peaceful_anger"]

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

negative perception of Obama. He was always viewed favorably and he debuted in an extremely strong way. From there on, he just became more and more credible to the American people. Palin has very high negatives 2 years after her debut. The difference is in attitude. Obama gives off positive energy whereas Palin gives off negative energy. Also, the former comes off as well read and highly intelligent and knowledgeable. The former simply doesn't.

I do agree that a campaign can change perception, but she has to start working on that now (because for all intents and purpose, campaigning is starting now) and so far I don't see that happening. She is still acting like a victim.

She's not generally attacked on her policy positions, but that is because she has never coherently stated them. She deals in slogans and generalities. If her interviews are any evidence, she just doesn't have a detailed knowledge of key issues, which worries people. I don't get why she doesn't just get more substantial and shut her critics up. If she starting being substantial, I know I would stop bagging on her.

Don't get me wrong. I think my side goes much too far sometimes, but I'd say that the stuff thrown at Obama is just as bad, if not worse, than what's thrown at Palin. People have called him a secret Muslim/Kenyan, they have questioned his loyalty to this country, they have compared him to Hitler Even Sarah Palin herself has engaged in that kind of stuff with all the death panels nonsense. Yet Obama doesn't even acknowledge all this. He just ignores it or jokes about it. Palin needs to pick her battles and suck it up. Politicians always get vitriol thrown at them. That's just the way it is. It's better to just rise above it instead of constantly playing the victim card. That's not what people look for in a leader. They look for Reagan-esque optimism.

Also, it's really hard to see her as some kind of victim when she throws out just as much nasty vitriol as she receives.

GreySeal9

Simply using the overplayed mainstream liberal media card (which I don't buy into; Obama got hammered in the media for the Wright situation and he's gotten plenty of negative feedback these last two years) strikes me as an excuse not to examine what was appealing about Obama's attitude as opposed to Palin's. Still, I'll concede that you have a point about the change in perceptions regarding his qualifications. But over the time span in which Obama was on the national stage, he worked relentlessly at improving his credibility. Where is the evidence that Palin is making any effective effort at doing this?

Palin's unfavorables don't come from being tied to the murder. They come from how she handled it. After all, only 30% approve of the way she handled it. Why is that? Because she made herself seem like the biggest victim in the world when people had just died and a Congresswoman was in critical condition. That comes off as tasteless. She also has tried to tie the killer to the "left" on Hannity, which is exactly what was done to her. It's hypocritical.

Stuff like that makes her come as as immature and petty and the America people don't want someone like that as their leader.

Also, when you appear to be a divider and not a uniter, your appeal becomes very limited.

Maybe Palin's more intelligent than her way of presenting herself attests to, but in politics, presentation is everything and right now, she comes off as being anti-intellectual and not well read or informed.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="peaceful_anger"] People might have not had a negative perception of Obama (thank you media at the time), but they didn't think he was qualified to be President either. According to a CBS poll from Aug of 2007, a majority of registered voters considered Obama unqualified for the presidency. 29% of registered voters considered him qualified. Democrats were completely divided (41-41) on whether he was qualified. Looking back now, the whole thing is interesting, but question 44 tells you what Americans thought about Obama's qualifications 5 months before the Iowa caucuses.

And one reason Palin's unfavorables are up is because she has been pounded by the press relentlessly for the past 2 years....not to mention she was just basically accused of being an accessory to murder. I mean where are all the attacks on Romney considering he is "supposedly" the front runner and "THE NEXT IN LINE" for the GOP nomination. Could the fact that the media pays no attention to him what so ever be why he is seen as more favorably as a whole? But if any of the possible GOP candidates think what's happening to Palin won't happen to them, then they are even dumber than I thought. And to the people on the Rep side who want to go with the tactic of picking the candidate who the media likes, clearly didn't pay attention to the 2008 election. McCain was the media darling, the sane voice in the Rep party, but the moment he clinched the nomination, he became evil incarnate who would bring about the destruction of the US with a Bush 3rd term.

And to Palin's intelligence, I think we humans too much attempt to correlate speech patterns with intelligence. There are plenty of people that understand but don't have natural speaking abilities, and vice versa. Don't let accents or mannerisms fool you. Palin was an effective Governor who got the vast majority of her agenda passed in her first two years, and that was with the help of Dems, Indeps, and Reps who all served in her administration.

peaceful_anger

Simply using the overplayed mainstream liberal media card (which I don't buy into; Obama got hammered in the media for the Wright situation and he's gotten plenty of negative feedback these last two years) strikes me as an excuse not to examine what was appealing about Obama's attitude as opposed to Palin's. Still, I'll concede that you have a point about the change in perceptions regarding his qualifications. But over the time span in which Obama was on the national stage, he worked relentlessly at improving his credibility. Where is the evidence that Palin is making any effective effort at doing this?

Palin's unfavorables don't come from being tied to the murder. They come from how she handled it. After all, only 30% approve of the way she handled it. Why is that? Because she made herself seem like the biggest victim in the world when people had just died and a Congresswoman was in critical condition. That comes off as tasteless. She also has tried to tie the killer to the "left" on Hannity, which is exactly what was done to her. It's hypocritical.

Stuff like that makes her come as as immature and petty and the America people don't want someone like that as their leader.

Also, when you appear to be a divider and not a uniter, your appeal becomes very limited.

Maybe Palin's more intelligent than her way of presenting herself attests to, but in politics, presentation is everything and right now, she comes off as being anti-intellectual and not well read or informed.

I won't type out a huge response if you're going to bed, but:

1. Just because the country is not united doesn't mean Obama didn't try to unite. You can't unite people that don't want to be united.

2. Of course Palin, Hillary, McCain supporters are going to see bias while Obama supporters won't. All three fanbases have slanted perceptions. Also, just because Obama gets favorable coverage does not mean that the media is in his pocket at all times. He presents a better image than Palin and thus he looks better.

3. I never said Palin shouldn't defend herself. I said that she made herself seem like the biggest victim in the whole thing. One can defend themselves without being a complete victim.

4. Referring to the shooter as leftwing based on hearsay is ridiculous if one complains about that being done to them. Why couldn't she have kept the politics out of it if she was on the receiving end of politicization?

I cannot fathom a scenario where Obama could possibly win Texas, even with Palin running as the Republican presidential candidate. That said, it would be quite a misfortune for her contend for the party nomination, let alone actually be one of the two primary candidates in the general election. If such a travesty were to befall the American political system, I find it extremely unlikely that I would even vote. (i.e., I'd vote third party.)

I cannot fathom a scenario where Obama could possibly win Texas, even with Palin running as the Republican presidential candidate. That said, it would be quite a misfortune for her contend for the party nomination, let alone actually be one of the two primary candidates in the general election. If such a travesty were to befall the American political system, I find it extremely unlikely that I would even vote. (i.e., I'd vote third party.)

coolbeans90

Yeah, Obama definitely ain't winning Texas. I was being a bit provocative in my thread title so that people would come into the thread.

Still, the fact that she's only ahead a single point in Texas spells out doom for her in swing states if this trend holds.

[QUOTE="coolbeans90"]

I cannot fathom a scenario where Obama could possibly win Texas, even with Palin running as the Republican presidential candidate. That said, it would be quite a misfortune for her contend for the party nomination, let alone actually be one of the two primary candidates in the general election. If such a travesty were to befall the American political system, I find it extremely unlikely that I would even vote. (i.e., I'd vote third party.)

GreySeal9

Yeah, Obama definitely ain't winning Texas. I was being a bit provocative in my thread title so that people would come into the thread.

Still, the fact that she's only ahead a single point in Texas spells out doom for her in swing states if this trend holds.

I definitely don't contest that. In addition to being a candidate whom I don't think I could justify voting for, she'd ****ing shipwreck the election and likely drag down the Republicans in elections all over the country by mere party association. She's a political nightmare, and her presence in the right-wing political spectrum worries me far more than the News Corp conglomeration ever could.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="coolbeans90"]

I cannot fathom a scenario where Obama could possibly win Texas, even with Palin running as the Republican presidential candidate. That said, it would be quite a misfortune for her contend for the party nomination, let alone actually be one of the two primary candidates in the general election. If such a travesty were to befall the American political system, I find it extremely unlikely that I would even vote. (i.e., I'd vote third party.)

coolbeans90

Yeah, Obama definitely ain't winning Texas. I was being a bit provocative in my thread title so that people would come into the thread.

Still, the fact that she's only ahead a single point in Texas spells out doom for her in swing states if this trend holds.

I definitely don't contest that. In addition to being a candidate whom I don't think I could justify voting for, she'd ****ing shipwreck the election and likely drag down the Republicans in elections all over the country by mere party association. She's a political nightmare, and her presence in the right-wing political spectrum worries me far more than the News Corp conglomeration ever could.

And the real kicker is she probably won't back down from running no matter how many people tell her how much of liability she will be.

But who knows, maybe she won't run at all. Hopefully. I'm definitely not in the "run Palin, so Obama gets an easy win" camp.

I don't care if you have "interest in America." You are not an American and thus you are in no position to talk about whose a "real American," just as I would be in no position to tell you whose a "real" citizen on your country.

And this thread is not about "liberals", so please don't derail it with your tired liberal bashing.

GreySeal9

I'm in a great position to speak about who are real americans and who aren't. An outside is the best judge of anything :). Secondly this thread is about a liberal, I merely pointed out why he would never win. Sorry if I don't agree with you, it's simply my opinion.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

I don't care if you have "interest in America." You are not an American and thus you are in no position to talk about whose a "real American," just as I would be in no position to tell you whose a "real" citizen on your country.

And this thread is not about "liberals", so please don't derail it with your tired liberal bashing.

Espada12

I'm in a great position to speak about who are real americans and who aren't. An outside is the best judge of anything :). Secondly this thread is about a liberal, I merely pointed out why he would never win. Sorry if I don't agree with you, it's simply my opinion.

There's no rule that states this. At all. You simply pulled that out you know where.

Like I said, you are not an American, which makes your opinion on who is an American laughable. How would you know who's a real American? :lol:

A non-American trying to tell an American citizen that they are not a real American is as obnoxious at it gets.

Also, like I said, there's no such thing as a real "American." An American citizen=an American. Anything else is just subjective nonsense.

You bring your ridiculous liberal bashing into every single thread, so I'm not going to treat it like a mere opinion. The "Robin Hood" mentalities have nothing to do with the subject at hand. Let's not derail the thread.

[QUOTE="coolbeans90"]

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

Yeah, Obama definitely ain't winning Texas. I was being a bit provocative in my thread title so that people would come into the thread.

Still, the fact that she's only ahead a single point in Texas spells out doom for her in swing states if this trend holds.

GreySeal9

I definitely don't contest that. In addition to being a candidate whom I don't think I could justify voting for, she'd ****ing shipwreck the election and likely drag down the Republicans in elections all over the country by mere party association. She's a political nightmare, and her presence in the right-wing political spectrum worries me far more than the News Corp conglomeration ever could.

And the real kicker is she probably won't back down from running no matter how many people tell her how much of liability she will be.

But who knows, maybe she won't run at all. Hopefully. I'm definitely not in the "run Palin, so Obama gets an easy win" camp.

Palin has made it abundantly clear that she is completely impervious to media influence. :P I'm just hoping that she comes to the realization that she hasn't a snowball's shot in hell at actually winning the White House. If not, well, I do not think she'll perform too well in the primaries. It really doesn't seem likely that she'll be able to grow her base, and in fact I think as time goes on that she'll continue to lose public support. Her political honeymoon ended a while ago.

Glad to hear you're not in the "Democrats for Palin" camp. I'm rather fond of the idea of having two competent political parties.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="coolbeans90"]

I definitely don't contest that. In addition to being a candidate whom I don't think I could justify voting for, she'd ****ing shipwreck the election and likely drag down the Republicans in elections all over the country by mere party association. She's a political nightmare, and her presence in the right-wing political spectrum worries me far more than the News Corp conglomeration ever could.

coolbeans90

And the real kicker is she probably won't back down from running no matter how many people tell her how much of liability she will be.

But who knows, maybe she won't run at all. Hopefully. I'm definitely not in the "run Palin, so Obama gets an easy win" camp.

Palin has made it abundantly clear that she is completely impervious to media influence. :P I'm just hoping that she comes to the realization that she hasn't a snowball's shot in hell at actually winning the White House. If not, well, I do not think she'll perform too well in the primaries. It really doesn't seem likely that she'll be able to grow her base, and in fact I think as time goes on that she'll continue to lose public support. Her political honeymoon ended a while ago.

Glad to hear you're not in the "Democrats for Palin" camp. I'm rather fond of the idea of having two competent political parties.

I think she'll probably end up not getting the nomination. It's just that in cloistered Republican contests, there are a lot of ground game things she can do with her base to eek out wins in key states. I have no worries about the general, but there's always that nagging fear that she'll somehow find a path to nomination, and I just don't want her in the general election picture for so many reasons, the bolded portion of your post being among them.

I'd vote for Palin, for the lulz.

4 years of crashing and burning.

And people like Sean Hannity and Limbaugh think she actually has a chance... At least local radio conservatives are in touch with reality and know that she is NOT the solution and is just a problem they cannot get rid of.

Put her in watch Obama get 4 more years