Russia cracks down on pastafarians.

Another point to consider; WHO decides where the line is drawn in terms of what's ok to say and what isn't? Would you have that power Branketra? Do you see how obviously flawed this is, considering you might have a homophobic, racist or some other extreme form of ignorant person in power making these decisions? Russia is currently a prime example of this, by openly arresting homosexuals and people who criticize the church. chrisrooR

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"]Another point to consider; WHO decides where the line is drawn in terms of what's ok to say and what isn't? Would you have that power Branketra? Do you see how obviously flawed this is, considering you might have a homophobic, racist or some other extreme form of ignorant person in power making these decisions? Russia is currently a prime example of this, by openly arresting homosexuals and people who criticize the church. whipassmt

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%85ke_Green

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]I understand the value of speech and what it is capable of accomplishing. That is why I think sometimes limiting what people say is beneficial to the prosperity of nations people, and culture. On one side, people are totally for speech without limitation. On the other, there are some who want speech to be toally controlled. Then there are people like me who understand the quality of speech with limitations in cases meant only to cause divisiveness, rules of a household, congregation, or organization.chrisrooR

way, WAY too many people don't get this. You have a full right to express your feelings all day and all night as long as you don't harm anyone. I have the full right to either not listen, criticize it, mock it, joke about it.....and you can do it right back. Nobody can demand respect for any belief or idea....it is earned. What you don't need to earn respect for is your ability to say it.wi3boi

ITT: We recall that BranKetra is a mentally challenged individual. Please, be gentle with him.

ITT: We recall that BranKetra is a mentally challenged individual. Please, be gentle with him.

dude_brahmski

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"][QUOTE="BranKetra"]I understand the value of speech and what it is capable of accomplishing. That is why I think sometimes limiting what people say is beneficial to the prosperity of nations people, and culture. On one side, people are totally for speech without limitation. On the other, there are some who want speech to be toally controlled. Then there are people like me who understand the quality of speech with limitations in cases meant only to cause divisiveness, rules of a household, congregation, or organization.BranKetra

way, WAY too many people don't get this. You have a full right to express your feelings all day and all night as long as you don't harm anyone. I have the full right to either not listen, criticize it, mock it, joke about it.....and you can do it right back. Nobody can demand respect for any belief or idea....it is earned. What you don't need to earn respect for is your ability to say it.wi3boi

I'm sorry you have zero concept of actual freedom of speech.  Any law that restricts me from saying "fvck your music" or "fvck your religion" is not moral in the slightest.

[QUOTE="dude_brahmski"]

ITT: We recall that BranKetra is a mentally challenged individual. Please, be gentle with him.

BranKetra

I could be worse and be a fascist sh!t like you.

I'm sorry you have zero concept of actual freedom of speech.  Any law that restricts me from saying "fvck your music" or "fvck your religion" is not moral in the slightest.

wis3boi

I could be worse and be a fascist sh!t like you.

dude_brahmski

Maybe you are confused. That is not what I am.BranKetra

Read your posts ITT for proof of my posts.

Well, it's there. IDK if you can't read or if you need a dictionary.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="BranKetra"]Are you Russian? If not, what right do you have to judge them?BranKetra

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

I'm sorry you have zero concept of actual freedom of speech.  Any law that restricts me from saying "fvck your music" or "fvck your religion" is not moral in the slightest.

BranKetra

I could be worse and be a fascist sh!t like you.

dude_brahmski

Yeah, I am sure.  If someone criticizes a position you hold or your clothes or your music or politics...and you take offense to that and your first thought is "you shouldn't be able to offend me", then you need some deep self reflection.

That is not what I said. I said if you expect something to develop in Russia from your criticism of Russia and you are not a Russian citizen or even know people who live in Russia, then that is infringing on Russian sovereignty. I never said Free speech came from America, either. BranKetra

How is criticizing Russia on their limitations of speech a violation of their sovereignty? 

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"] Criticizing Russia isn't infringing on their sovereignty in the slightest. Free speech isn't even an American value, its a value of any modern society which strives to live in equality. BranKetra

Yeah, I am sure. If someone criticizes a position you hold or your clothes or your music or politics...and you take offense to that and your first thought is "you shouldn't be able to offend me", then you need some deep self reflection. wi3boi

You objected to the basis of freedom of speech, so naturally that's where I went.  I don't see a shred of logic or reason in your position.

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] That is not what I said. I said if you expect something to develop in Russia from your criticism of Russia and you are not a Russian citizen or even know people who live in Russia, then that is infringing on Russian sovereignty. I never said Free speech came from America, either. HoolaHoopMan

How is criticizing Russia on their limitations of speech a violation of their sovereignty?

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

You objected to the basis of freedom of speech, so naturally that's where I went. I don't see a shred of logic or reason in your position. wis3boi

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] That is not what I said. I said if you expect something to develop in Russia from your criticism of Russia and you are not a Russian citizen or even know people who live in Russia, then that is infringing on Russian sovereignty. I never said Free speech came from America, either. BranKetra

How is criticizing Russia on their limitations of speech a violation of their sovereignty?

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

They already do that...all the time.

Is this guy serious?

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

How is criticizing Russia on their limitations of speech a violation of their sovereignty?

lostrib

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

They already do that...all the time.

Is this guy serious?

Before I answer that, let me first ask you a question.

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

BranKetra

I'll listen.

Why is it even a criterion whether they are from my country or not?

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"][QUOTE="BranKetra"]I understand the value of speech and what it is capable of accomplishing. That is why I think sometimes limiting what people say is beneficial to the prosperity of nations people, and culture. On one side, people are totally for speech without limitation. On the other, there are some who want speech to be toally controlled. Then there are people like me who understand the quality of speech with limitations in cases meant only to cause divisiveness, rules of a household, congregation, or organization.BranKetra

way, WAY too many people don't get this. You have a full right to express your feelings all day and all night as long as you don't harm anyone. I have the full right to either not listen, criticize it, mock it, joke about it.....and you can do it right back. Nobody can demand respect for any belief or idea....it is earned. What you don't need to earn respect for is your ability to say it.wi3boi

If you think people should face criminal charges for namecalling or making fun of someones beliefs, you seriously need to think that viewpoint over. Toughen up buddy, because the real world is going to kick you in the nuts. 

[QUOTE="lostrib"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] Before I answer that, let me first ask you a question.

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life? BranKetra

They already do that...all the time.

Is this guy serious?

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] That is not what I said. I said if you expect something to develop in Russia from your criticism of Russia and you are not a Russian citizen or even know people who live in Russia, then that is infringing on Russian sovereignty. I never said Free speech came from America, either. BranKetra

How is criticizing Russia on their limitations of speech a violation of their sovereignty?

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

You objected to the basis of freedom of speech, so naturally that's where I went. I don't see a shred of logic or reason in your position. wis3boi

All I see is you being a 5-star dunce

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"] Any kind of control over speech because "someones feelings were hurt" is insane. You're actually insane if you think that laws should be in favour of those who have their feelings 'hurt'. I might not agree with neo-nazis saying what they do, but I'm going to damn well defend their right to say it. How else can you have a conversation or debate with them if you never let them spew their controversial views? chrisrooR

way, WAY too many people don't get this. You have a full right to express your feelings all day and all night as long as you don't harm anyone. I have the full right to either not listen, criticize it, mock it, joke about it.....and you can do it right back. Nobody can demand respect for any belief or idea....it is earned. What you don't need to earn respect for is your ability to say it.wi3boi

If you think people should face criminal charges for namecalling or making fun of someones beliefs, you seriously need to think that viewpoint over. Toughen up buddy, because the real world is going to kick you in the nuts.

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

How is criticizing Russia on their limitations of speech a violation of their sovereignty?

wis3boi

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

You objected to the basis of freedom of speech, so naturally that's where I went. I don't see a shred of logic or reason in your position. wis3boi

All I see is you being a 5-star dunce

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] Before I answer that, let me first ask you a question.

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life? [quote="wis3boi"]You objected to the basis of freedom of speech, so naturally that's where I went. I don't see a shred of logic or reason in your position. BranKetra

All I see is you being a 5-star dunce

I have, and I ain't moving from the more moral position, thanks.

[QUOTE="BranKetra"][QUOTE="wis3boi"]

All I see is you being a 5-star dunce

wis3boi

I have, and I ain't moving from the more moral position, thanks.

Also, why are you thanking me?

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] Judge yourself before you judge others.BranKetra

I have, and I ain't moving from the more moral position, thanks.

Also, why are you thanking me?

Not comprehending a single argument I presented...so adorable.

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] Judge yourself before you judge others.BranKetra

I have, and I ain't moving from the more moral position, thanks.

Also, why are you thanking me?

Is he serious?

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

I have, and I ain't moving from the more moral position, thanks.

lostrib

Also, why are you thanking me?

Is he serious?

with a post count that high, I hope not.  Seriously delusional

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

I have, and I ain't moving from the more moral position, thanks.

lostrib

Also, why are you thanking me?

Is he serious?

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] If people allowed verbal abuse in every area of life, bullying would be much more common of an event. The Russian government is enforcing something United States schools and some private organizations do. That is not insane or crazy. It is a form of control. As far as Russian events are going, that is their business. What goes on in the United States is mine. It would be different if I were working directly with governments or international organizations. [quote="wi3boi"]way, WAY too many people don't get this. You have a full right to express your feelings all day and all night as long as you don't harm anyone. I have the full right to either not listen, criticize it, mock it, joke about it.....and you can do it right back. Nobody can demand respect for any belief or idea....it is earned. What you don't need to earn respect for is your ability to say it.BranKetra

If you think people should face criminal charges for namecalling or making fun of someones beliefs, you seriously need to think that viewpoint over. Toughen up buddy, because the real world is going to kick you in the nuts.

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"] I think you're a grade A pussmaster.

 

If you think people should face criminal charges for namecalling or making fun of someones beliefs, you seriously need to think that viewpoint over. Toughen up buddy, because the real world is going to kick you in the nuts.

chrisrooR

Where his feelings are hurt.

[QUOTE="GazaAli"]If you want to troll people then you must be ready to face the consequences of your actions. I wouldn't comment this way if they actually had a mature and respectful agenda regardless if it collides with others beliefs. But to march the streets making fun of what others hold dear and sacred just for the hell of it, no.famicommander

[QUOTE="famicommander"][QUOTE="GazaAli"]If you want to troll people then you must be ready to face the consequences of your actions. I wouldn't comment this way if they actually had a mature and respectful agenda regardless if it collides with others beliefs. But to march the streets making fun of what others hold dear and sacred just for the hell of it, no.lightleggy

You're missing a very important detail. Pastafarians aren't violating the rights of Chritians. 

His post makes no mention of it being ok to violate peoples rights. 

[QUOTE="lightleggy"][QUOTE="famicommander"] So the appropriate response to non-violent actions which may be insensitive is violent repression? They make fun of what others believe because to them, those beliefs are absurd. They have just as much right to voice those beliefs as religious people have to proselytize theirs. To advocate or even to be apathetic about violence against them just because their beliefs make you uncomfortable is disgusting. No matter what anyone says, it's not okay to respond to words with violence. toast_burner

You're missing a very important detail. Pastafarians aren't violating the rights of Chritians. 

His post makes no mention of it being ok to violate peoples rights. 

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] That is not what I said. I said if you expect something to develop in Russia from your criticism of Russia and you are not a Russian citizen or even know people who live in Russia, then that is infringing on Russian sovereignty. I never said Free speech came from America, either. BranKetra

How is criticizing Russia on their limitations of speech a violation of their sovereignty?

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

People can and do, I don't care if they do.  

Now answer the quesiton. 

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"] I think you're a grade A pussmaster.

If you think people should face criminal charges for namecalling or making fun of someones beliefs, you seriously need to think that viewpoint over. Toughen up buddy, because the real world is going to kick you in the nuts.

chrisrooR

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

How is criticizing Russia on their limitations of speech a violation of their sovereignty?

HoolaHoopMan

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

People can and do, I don't care if they do.  

Now answer the quesiton. 

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] Before I answer that, let me first ask you a question.

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

BranKetra

People can and do, I don't care if they do.  

Now answer the quesiton. 

seriously?

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="lightleggy"] That's pretty much like saying that religious folks have the right to violent the rights of the gay community because they find homosexuality to be a horrible thing.lightleggy

You're missing a very important detail. Pastafarians aren't violating the rights of Chritians. 

His post makes no mention of it being ok to violate peoples rights. 

Not sure if serious

[QUOTE="lightleggy"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]

You're missing a very important detail. Pastafarians aren't violating the rights of Chritians. 

His post makes no mention of it being ok to violate peoples rights. 

wis3boi

Not sure if serious

yeah... most people don't respect the WBC but they still have the right to hate gay people and be assholes out in public

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

[QUOTE="lightleggy"] It's basically a hate group with no agenda other than mocking people for their beliefs, I refuse to respect a group like thatlostrib

Not sure if serious

yeah... most people don't respect the WBC but they still have the right to hate gay people and be assholes out in public

not even that...I was thinking "Who the hell actually believes pastafarianism is anything but an internet meme?"  Some people can't be assed to learn for themselves though

[QUOTE="lostrib"]

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

Not sure if serious

wis3boi

yeah... most people don't respect the WBC but they still have the right to hate gay people and be assholes out in public

not even that...I was thinking "Who the hell actually believes pastafarianism is anything but an internet meme?"  Some people can't be assed to learn for themselves though

True, but even so "hate groups" have just as much right to freedom of speech as anyone else.  

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

[QUOTE="BranKetra"] Before I answer that, let me first ask you a question.

Would you like citizens of a country other than your own criticizing what you do in your daily life?

BranKetra

People can and do, I don't care if they do.  

Now answer the quesiton. 

seriously?

lostrib

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"][QUOTE="BranKetra"] Because the result of being ARRESTED from criticizing someone or an institution is INSANE. I don't care if people criticize me, but if they do I most certainly don't think they should be arrested. I think they should be free to their opinion, and I'm free to mine. BranKetra

seriously?

lostrib

courtesy :lol: 

I am very happy that BranKetra has no meaningful say about what goes on in the states. Days like these make me take comfort in the fact that one person really doesn't fvcking matter.

[QUOTE="lostrib"]

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

Not sure if serious

wis3boi

yeah... most people don't respect the WBC but they still have the right to hate gay people and be assholes out in public

not even that...I was thinking "Who the hell actually believes pastafarianism is anything but an internet meme?"  Some people can't be assed to learn for themselves though