Seeing is believing

  • 57 results
  • 1
  • 2

This topic is locked from further discussion.

Avatar image for jazzkrotch
jazzkrotch

827

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#51 jazzkrotch
Member since 2009 • 827 Posts

alright you win im off now.RowCla

I didn't mean to "win", it just happened. Actually, no one is a winner, only the truth is.

Avatar image for MrGeezer
MrGeezer

59765

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#52 MrGeezer
Member since 2002 • 59765 Posts

Hallucination & dreams are pictures submitted from the mind, so you could say you are looking at these things with you're minds eye, and this topic is for seeing with your ordinary sight, you see?RowCla

But "ordinary sight" is just as much "seeing with your mind's eye".

The eye doesn't make pictures, it simply transmits a signal to the BRAIN, which is where sight REALLY occurs. If you damage the brain you can remove someone's ability to see, even though their EYES are 100% fully functional.

NOTHING that you see is ever an accurate representation of reality. Because your eyes aren't the same eyes as mine or a dog's or a mantis shrimp's. Furthermore, your BRAIN is not the same as mine, a dog's, or a mantis shrimp's. If you, me, a dog, and a mantis shrimp were all made to look at the same scene and describe what it looked like, we would NOT see the same thing. That is, what you and I see would probably be VERY close (since our eyes and brains are simlar), and both of our perceptions would be vastly different from that of the dog or the mantis shrimp or the fly.

The thing is that there are NO objective criteria for what that one scene SHOULD or DOES look like. Absolutely none. The fly sees something very different than what you and I see. And both you and the fly are correct. That IS what the scene looks like, from the point of view of both you and the fly.

Or to take a familiar example, take a camera. Suppose you see a beautiful sunset, so you take out your camera and take a picture. You then look at that picture later and say "pfft, that's not what that scene looked like." But you're wrong. That IS what the picture looked like TO THE CAMERA. And the camera's opinion is JUST as valid as yours. Your eyes are different than the camera's lens. Your brain is different than the camera's internal processor. But there are NO objective criteria making YOUR interpretation of the scene any more CORRECT than your camera's. The ACTUAL scene still remains UNSEEN. Unseen by you, your camera, the dog, and everyone else. EVERYONE is simply converting a limited part of reality into something that can be seen by the limitations of the observing device. YOU are an observing device. You are an observing device honed by millions of years of evolution (actually more like billions, if we extend this to its logical conclusion). And no observing device sees reality 100%. Observing devices generally tend to observe specific things FOR A REASON. Just as digital cameras are supposed to make images that look a certain way, that's merely survival of the fittest. Humans make digital cameras. Therefore, humans want pictures from digital cameras to look good. When a digital camera makes pictures that just look ****ed up to the people who want to look at pictures, that camera dies. Meanwhile, the cameras that make pretty pictures survive, and are then refined with additional models. Similarly, the needs of a mantis shrimp or a fly do NOT have the same requirements. If mantis shrimp saw reality the same way that humans see reality, then there would be no more mantis shrimp. They all would have gone extinct. Different observing devices occupy different ecological niches. And the requirements for how an observing device is supposed to see varies WILDLY.

With respect to eyesight, that's all we are. An observing device, who renders data in a particular way that promotes our continued survival. And THAT'S IT. We have a particular limited range of vision for a REASON. Because THAT range of vision is advantageous to our survival. But to say that what I see represents reality is erroneous in the extreme. What I see is VALID, but it's an inherently limited and biased rendering of reality based on what my body decides is fit to add in or subtract out. I see a red car, but the car does not OBJECTIVELY look red. The car simply reflects light of a certain wavelength and amplitude and frequency. The intrinsic properties of the reflected light are objective, but it's absolutely fallacious to say that the car looks objectively red. I see red. Someone with total color blindness will NOT see red. Someone who is completely blind will see that car as just looking black (just as black as everything else, with no difference between the car and anything else). And EVERYONE's interpretation of a red car is equally valid. The blind person's eye is STILL getting hit with photons of the same wavelength as the photons that are hitting your eye. Just as your eyes are constantly being bombarded by the same "invisible light" that a mantis shrimp can EASILY see. The car does NOT objectively look red, and your body's rendering of the car as being red is no more accurate than the blind person's rendering of the car as not looking like a goddamn thing.

Avatar image for BiancaDK
BiancaDK

19092

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 35

User Lists: 0

#53 BiancaDK
Member since 2008 • 19092 Posts
alright you win im off now.RowCla
Bwahahaha! *licks your tears* mhmm... something so salty, yet so sweet. =3
Avatar image for DrSponge
DrSponge

12763

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#54 DrSponge
Member since 2008 • 12763 Posts
Air?KLAX42
Brownian motion.
Avatar image for b3yondstupidity
b3yondstupidity

12500

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 8

User Lists: 0

#55 b3yondstupidity
Member since 2007 • 12500 Posts
Air? Gravity? Aliens?
Avatar image for BeepBoop16
BeepBoop16

562

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#56 BeepBoop16
Member since 2008 • 562 Posts

"Seeing is believing".

In order to disprove the above statement we must find an example where "seeing is believing" is not true. I cannot think of any.

Things that do not disprove statement:

-Things we cannot see e.g. gravity, air. The statment is "seeing is believing," not "the only things you believe in are those things that you can see." Again, we must find something that we can see, and still not believe in it.

-Hallucinations. "Seeing is believing", not "That what we see must be real." When we are hallucinating we believe that what we see is real, even if it isn't. We might question if what we saw was real afterwards, but whilst we were actually seeing it, we were indeed, believing in it.

-Picture of unreal things e.g. Aliens. When you are looking at a picture of an alien, you are not looking at an alien, you are looking at the image of an alien. And you believe the image itself, what you are actually looking at, to be real, read this.

-Things you can touch but not see e.g. you're in a dark room but you can still touch an object and therefore believe in it, without seeing it. Again, the statement only suggests that we must believe in that which we see, not that what we must see all that we believe in.

Why I think that this statement is true and therefore cannot be disproven:

You see only that which you believe; because it is the belief that causes the object to exist in the first place i.e. you must believe in something in order to see it, so everything you see you believe in.

Avatar image for MKLOL
MKLOL

2080

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#57 MKLOL
Member since 2007 • 2080 Posts
You're brain?! My brain?! omg...