Should britian deport terrorist suspects if they're going to be tortured?

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duxup

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#51 duxup
Member since 2002 • 43443 Posts

Why don't they just exile him from Britain? Make it illegal for him to be there? He can go anything else except in the country.

Plus, just because he is there illegally doesn't mean that he isn't guarenteed to basic British rights.

helium_flash
Well Jordan is going to take him, but if they didn't the issue is WHERE do you send him? Nobody you trust is going to want him, and some places the dude will be off the radar and will get support, so you don't want him to go there.
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Ninja-Hippo

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#52 Ninja-Hippo
Member since 2008 • 23434 Posts
[QUOTE="duxup"] I can understand why they'd want the photos to see if someone or something important got caught in the pic so they'd have a lead. The thing is I think the lesson learned there is to ALLOW folks to take photos like crazy. My point being that the harassment itself is enough. There are plenty of reports of folks just being harassed by cops for taking photos.

Yup. The police really need to chill and stop acting like a private army. They've become far too politicised if that's even a word.
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lucky326

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#53 lucky326
Member since 2006 • 3799 Posts
Truth be told I don't care what happens when they go back to their country, if there not British then they can get back where they belong because it certainly isn't here they can go back to whatever country they came from and die for all I care.
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Ninja-Hippo

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#54 Ninja-Hippo
Member since 2008 • 23434 Posts
[QUOTE="helium_flash"]

Why don't they just exile him from Britain? Make it illegal for him to be there? He can go anything else except in the country.

Plus, just because he is there illegally doesn't mean that he isn't guarenteed to basic British rights.

duxup
Well Jordan is going to take him, but if they didn't the issue is WHERE do you send him? Nobody you trust is going to want him, and some places the dude will be off the radar and will get support, so you don't want him to go there.

Sadly international human rights laws say you can only be deported back to your home country, or to a country which wants to try you in their courts for crimes committed on their soil. You cant just deport someone to a random country who agrees to take them off your hands. Thus the only country we could have deported him to was Jordan, as that's his home nation.
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Funky_Llama

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#55 Funky_Llama
Member since 2006 • 18428 Posts
Apparently 'he is wanted on terrorism charges in Algeria, the United States, Belgium, Spain, France, Germany, Italy, and his native Jordan.' In that case why not send him to, say, France? Gets rid of the problem of what to do with him without him getting tortured.
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Ninja-Hippo

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#56 Ninja-Hippo
Member since 2008 • 23434 Posts
Apparently 'he is wanted on terrorism charges in Algeria, the United States, Belgium, Spain, France, Germany, Italy, and his native Jordan.' In that case why not send him to, say, France? Gets rid of the problem of what to do with him without him getting tortured.Funky_Llama
They dont want him.
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freshgman

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#57 freshgman
Member since 2005 • 12241 Posts
[QUOTE="helium_flash"]

Why don't they just exile him from Britain? Make it illegal for him to be there? He can go anything else except in the country.

Plus, just because he is there illegally doesn't mean that he isn't guarenteed to basic British rights.

plus in brittain he would get a fair trial. instead of torture and immediate execution
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Funky_Llama

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#58 Funky_Llama
Member since 2006 • 18428 Posts
[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]Apparently 'he is wanted on terrorism charges in Algeria, the United States, Belgium, Spain, France, Germany, Italy, and his native Jordan.' In that case why not send him to, say, France? Gets rid of the problem of what to do with him without him getting tortured.Ninja-Hippo
They dont want him.

But it says he's wanted on terrorism charges D: I'd just send him to all of those countries but Jordan to face all of the charges.
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duxup

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#59 duxup
Member since 2002 • 43443 Posts
Sadly international human rights laws say you can only be deported back to your home country, or to a country which wants to try you in their courts for crimes committed on their soil. You cant just deport someone to a random country who agrees to take them off your hands. Thus the only country we could have deported him to was Jordan, as that's his home nation.Ninja-Hippo
It makes sense in some cases. The US picked up some Chinese dudes in Afghanistan. Turns out the US was offering cash to the locals to identify terrorists. The locals picked out two strangers staying in the town. Turned out they were just some dudes passing thru who had nothing to do with terrorists. The thing is they're part of a minority in China who are persecuted and just for leaving the country and being who they are they're likely to be jailed and tortured in China. The US managed to get some country to take them but they're pretty much stuck there without their families.
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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#60 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"][QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]Apparently 'he is wanted on terrorism charges in Algeria, the United States, Belgium, Spain, France, Germany, Italy, and his native Jordan.' In that case why not send him to, say, France? Gets rid of the problem of what to do with him without him getting tortured.Funky_Llama
They dont want him.

But it says he's wanted on terrorism charges D: I'd just send him to all of those countries but Jordan to face all of the charges.

Meh. Jordan said they won't torture him. Maybe they really won't. Maybe they'll just kill him and wash their hands of it.
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Ninja-Hippo

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#61 Ninja-Hippo
Member since 2008 • 23434 Posts
[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"] Sadly international human rights laws say you can only be deported back to your home country, or to a country which wants to try you in their courts for crimes committed on their soil. You cant just deport someone to a random country who agrees to take them off your hands. Thus the only country we could have deported him to was Jordan, as that's his home nation.duxup
It makes sense in some cases. The US picked up some Chinese dudes in Afghanistan. Turns out the US was offering cash to the locals to identify terrorists. The locals picked out two strangers staying in the town. Turned out they were just some dudes passing thru who had nothing to do with terrorists. The thing is they're part of a minority in China who are persecuted and just for leaving the country and being who they are they're likely to be jailed and tortured in China. The US managed to get some country to take them but they're pretty much stuck there without their families.

I dont think the US is obliged to agree to the same ridiculous liberal human rights laws that we're bound to in europe. :P
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helium_flash

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#62 helium_flash
Member since 2007 • 9244 Posts
[QUOTE="helium_flash"]

Why don't they just exile him from Britain? Make it illegal for him to be there? He can go anything else except in the country.

Plus, just because he is there illegally doesn't mean that he isn't guarenteed to basic British rights.

duxup
Well Jordan is going to take him, but if they didn't the issue is WHERE do you send him? Nobody you trust is going to want him, and some places the dude will be off the radar and will get support, so you don't want him to go there.

Can't you just put someone in exile, where if they are caught on your soil they will be arrested?
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duxup

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#63 duxup
Member since 2002 • 43443 Posts
[QUOTE="duxup"][QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"] Sadly international human rights laws say you can only be deported back to your home country, or to a country which wants to try you in their courts for crimes committed on their soil. You cant just deport someone to a random country who agrees to take them off your hands. Thus the only country we could have deported him to was Jordan, as that's his home nation.Ninja-Hippo
It makes sense in some cases. The US picked up some Chinese dudes in Afghanistan. Turns out the US was offering cash to the locals to identify terrorists. The locals picked out two strangers staying in the town. Turned out they were just some dudes passing thru who had nothing to do with terrorists. The thing is they're part of a minority in China who are persecuted and just for leaving the country and being who they are they're likely to be jailed and tortured in China. The US managed to get some country to take them but they're pretty much stuck there without their families.

I dont think the US is obliged to agree to the same ridiculous liberal human rights laws that we're bound to in europe. :P

Maybe not the same laws but legally we're not supposed to send someone where they will be persecuted either. Not that the Gov has been very good about that the last 7 or so years....
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Ninja-Hippo

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#64 Ninja-Hippo
Member since 2008 • 23434 Posts
Can't you just put someone in exile, where if they are caught on your soil they will be arrested?helium_flash
He was banned from our country, but got in on a forged passport. That's how stupid this whole thing is; it doesn't matter how he will be treated wherever it is he ends up going, because he shouldn't have been here in the first place.
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duxup

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#65 duxup
Member since 2002 • 43443 Posts
[QUOTE="duxup"][QUOTE="helium_flash"]

Why don't they just exile him from Britain? Make it illegal for him to be there? He can go anything else except in the country.

Plus, just because he is there illegally doesn't mean that he isn't guarenteed to basic British rights.

helium_flash
Well Jordan is going to take him, but if they didn't the issue is WHERE do you send him? Nobody you trust is going to want him, and some places the dude will be off the radar and will get support, so you don't want him to go there.

Can't you just put someone in exile, where if they are caught on your soil they will be arrested?

He doesn't want to leave, so you have to put him on a plane somewhere.
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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#66 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
[QUOTE="helium_flash"]Can't you just put someone in exile, where if they are caught on your soil they will be arrested?Ninja-Hippo
He was banned from our country, but got in on a forged passport. That's how stupid this whole thing is; it doesn't matter how he will be treated wherever it is he ends up going, because he shouldn't have been here in the first place.

He wasn't even supposed to be there today. :o
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hokies1313

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#67 hokies1313
Member since 2005 • 13919 Posts
Deport him, what his home country decides to do with him is none of the British's business. How would the UK like it if another country failed to extradite a British criminal back to the UK because that country felt that what the UK would do was cruel?
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tofu-lion91

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#68 tofu-lion91
Member since 2008 • 13496 Posts
lol Why should he get to benefit from what he preaches against? Send him home.Jandurin
This :)
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Ninja-Hippo

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#69 Ninja-Hippo
Member since 2008 • 23434 Posts
Deport him, what his home country decides to do with him is none of the British's business. How would the UK like it if another country failed to extradite a British criminal back to the UK because that country felt that what the UK would do was cruel?hokies1313
It's not a case of what we think, it's the law.
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tofu-lion91

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#70 tofu-lion91
Member since 2008 • 13496 Posts
[QUOTE="hokies1313"]Deport him, what his home country decides to do with him is none of the British's business. How would the UK like it if another country failed to extradite a British criminal back to the UK because that country felt that what the UK would do was cruel?Ninja-Hippo
It's not a case of what we think, it's the law.

They should change the law then. Some things just don't make sense when it comes to the law :l
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