Syria to give up weapons?
Man, only Obama could make Russia seem like the level headed good guys.
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The US Congress will eat this up, Putin will be made to look the good guy, Assad has a way out, and Obama looks completely foolish.
The US Congress will eat this up, Putin will be made to look the good guy, Assad has a way out, and Obama looks completely foolish.
jimkabrhel
Actually it makes Obamas step up to a military strike look pretty good. It looks to make the Russians appear as if they were forced to do this to prevent a strike.
But it will only look good if we don't strike.
Yeah... this is hilarious.
Bunch of senile people trying negotiate. Stop with the chemical weapons, it angers us, but continue on with the destruction and downfall of Syria using guns.
Syria to give up weapons?
Man, only Obama could make Russia seem like the level headed good guys.
Master_Live
:roll: Ah yes because this was the problem.. Not because they were killing their own civilians in large droves..
[QUOTE="jimkabrhel"]Or Russia owns Syria and is complying to the US wishes or else US will kick Russia out of Syria? If you think that the Russians will just sit there and watch as their interests are being threatened, think again. Obama and Kerry will still push for a strike, they already made themselves fools of the century, they feel cornered and threatened and it explains some of the rather irrational behavior. They lost already but don't want to admit it or seem as losers. Russia is trying to protect it self from the extremists as well. If the rebels win, they will go after Israel right after, and eventually will end up north in the Caucasus region. If Syria falls, Middle East will fall into chaos, all right at Russia's door step in their sphere of influence. This new plan is a rather genius move on the part of the Russians. The Syrians couldn't come up with it, even if they did, nobody would listen. Syria doesn't have the means for this sort of project, and thats where the Russians come in. They have the international standing and the capability to get this done. This removes any possibility for a reasonable intervention, since all Obama and Kerry preached was stopping chem. weapons use, since there won't be any chem. weapons. This is getting very interesting, possibly the most interesting International "crisis" since the cold war. Only now reason is used as a weapon, and the good vs evil is flipped. Who would have thought.The US Congress will eat this up, Putin will be made to look the good guy, Assad has a way out, and Obama looks completely foolish.
LOXO7
[QUOTE="LOXO7"][QUOTE="jimkabrhel"]Or Russia owns Syria and is complying to the US wishes or else US will kick Russia out of Syria? If you think that the Russians will just sit there and watch as their interests are being threatened, think again. Obama and Kerry will still push for a strike, they already made themselves fools of the century, they feel cornered and threatened and it explains some of the rather irrational behavior. They lost already but don't want to admit it or seem as losers. Russia is trying to protect it self from the extremists as well. If the rebels win, they will go after Israel right after, and eventually will end up north in the Caucasus region. If Syria falls, Middle East will fall into chaos, all right at Russia's door step in their sphere of influence. This new plan is a rather genius move on the part of the Russians. The Syrians couldn't come up with it, even if they did, nobody would listen. Syria doesn't have the means for this sort of project, and thats where the Russians come in. They have the international standing and the capability to get this done. This removes any possibility for a reasonable intervention, since all Obama and Kerry preached was stopping chem. weapons use, since there won't be any chem. weapons. This is getting very interesting, possibly the most interesting International "crisis" since the cold war. Only now reason is used as a weapon, and the good vs evil is flipped. Who would have thought.The US Congress will eat this up, Putin will be made to look the good guy, Assad has a way out, and Obama looks completely foolish.
muscleserge
What do you mean by attacking Isreal? Do you mean terrorist attacks or declaring a war of some sorts? Because the latter won't happen.
[QUOTE="Master_Live"]
Syria to give up weapons?
Man, only Obama could make Russia seem like the level headed good guys.
sSubZerOo
:roll: Ah yes because this was the problem.. Not because they were killing their own civilians in large droves..
Allegedly, the results aren't even in yet, and there is equally as much if not more evidence to point to the rebels. The same rebels that eat human organs, slaughter children, destroy churches and monasteries, and the very same ones who already used chem. weapons just earlier this summer. The very same "rebels" that the Americans are fighting in the Middle East, the same "rebels" the Russians are fighting in the Caucus region. What do you think will happen to the 10% of Syrians who are christians if the "rebels" win?If you think that the Russians will just sit there and watch as their interests are being threatened, think again. Obama and Kerry will still push for a strike, they already made themselves fools of the century, they feel cornered and threatened and it explains some of the rather irrational behavior. They lost already but don't want to admit it or seem as losers. Russia is trying to protect it self from the extremists as well. If the rebels win, they will go after Israel right after, and eventually will end up north in the Caucasus region. If Syria falls, Middle East will fall into chaos, all right at Russia's door step in their sphere of influence. This new plan is a rather genius move on the part of the Russians. The Syrians couldn't come up with it, even if they did, nobody would listen. Syria doesn't have the means for this sort of project, and thats where the Russians come in. They have the international standing and the capability to get this done. This removes any possibility for a reasonable intervention, since all Obama and Kerry preached was stopping chem. weapons use, since there won't be any chem. weapons. This is getting very interesting, possibly the most interesting International "crisis" since the cold war. Only now reason is used as a weapon, and the good vs evil is flipped. Who would have thought.[QUOTE="muscleserge"][QUOTE="LOXO7"] Or Russia owns Syria and is complying to the US wishes or else US will kick Russia out of Syria?deeliman
What do you mean by attacking Isreal? Do you mean terrorist attacks or declaring a war of some sorts? Because the latter won't happen.
Of course the latter won't happen, but all these trained Islamist combatants will have to end up somewhere, and with Israel right at the border it should be no surprise.[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="Master_Live"]
Syria to give up weapons?
Man, only Obama could make Russia seem like the level headed good guys.
muscleserge
:roll: Ah yes because this was the problem.. Not because they were killing their own civilians in large droves..
Allegedly, the results aren't even in yet, and there is equally as much if not more evidence to point to the rebels. The same rebels that eat human organs, slaughter children, destroy churches and monasteries, and the very same ones who already used chem. weapons just earlier this summer. The very same "rebels" that the Americans are fighting in the Middle East, the same "rebels" the Russians are fighting in the Caucus region. What do you think will happen to the 10% of Syrians who are christians if the "rebels" win? If the Assad regime falls or loses control over big portions of the country, the Christian Syrians could be in some big trouble (as well as the Alawites), it could be like what happened in Iraq but possibly worse because there might not be any ground forces. The Syrian army recently intervened in a village to stop Islamist rebels from going after the Christians there.Putin has in the past stated that Russia would protect Christians throughout the world.
Allegedly, the results aren't even in yet, and there is equally as much if not more evidence to point to the rebels. The same rebels that eat human organs, slaughter children, destroy churches and monasteries, and the very same ones who already used chem. weapons just earlier this summer. The very same "rebels" that the Americans are fighting in the Middle East, the same "rebels" the Russians are fighting in the Caucus region. What do you think will happen to the 10% of Syrians who are christians if the "rebels" win? If the Assad regime falls or loses control over big portions of the country, the Christian Syrians could be in some big trouble (as well as the Alawites), it could be like what happened in Iraq but possibly worse because there might not be any ground forces. The Syrian army recently intervened in a village to stop Islamist rebels from going after the Christians there.[QUOTE="muscleserge"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]
:roll: Ah yes because this was the problem.. Not because they were killing their own civilians in large droves..
whipassmt
Putin has in the past stated that Russia would protect Christians throughout the world.
The whole Christian protection thing is from the days of the Russian Empire, and the third Rome idea. How far will the new Russia take this idea, idk, but interesting to see. Russia is protecting its interests against the interests of the Saudis, Qatar and NATO. Syria became an epicenter of this conflict. Qatar needs a pipeline through Syria, Saudis are supporting the Muslim Brotherhood and Al-Quada, and NATO needs Syria to get to Iran. Russia is protecting its gas market in the EU, as well as to prevent a surge of Islamic terrorists to its borders if Assad falls, the Russian patriarch asked Putin to help the Christians in Syria, who are mostly Orthodox, with roots from the North Caucuses. Some of them even speak Russian still while being 2nd and 3rd gen. Syrians. This is a brief overview of some driving forces behind the conflict. Its sad to see the US leadership be so eager to help the enemy though. Assad ain't no saint, but he kept the turmoil under wraps. If he falls, there will be something along the lines of genocide. With no foreign troops on the ground, the "rebels" will run wild. Israel and Christians will be the next victims.[QUOTE="whipassmt"]If the Assad regime falls or loses control over big portions of the country, the Christian Syrians could be in some big trouble (as well as the Alawites), it could be like what happened in Iraq but possibly worse because there might not be any ground forces. The Syrian army recently intervened in a village to stop Islamist rebels from going after the Christians there.[QUOTE="muscleserge"] Allegedly, the results aren't even in yet, and there is equally as much if not more evidence to point to the rebels. The same rebels that eat human organs, slaughter children, destroy churches and monasteries, and the very same ones who already used chem. weapons just earlier this summer. The very same "rebels" that the Americans are fighting in the Middle East, the same "rebels" the Russians are fighting in the Caucus region. What do you think will happen to the 10% of Syrians who are christians if the "rebels" win?muscleserge
Putin has in the past stated that Russia would protect Christians throughout the world.
The whole Christian protection thing is from the days of the Russian Empire, and the third Rome idea. How far will the new Russia take this idea, idk, but interesting to see. Russia is protecting its interests against the interests of the Saudis, Qatar and NATO. Syria became an epicenter of this conflict. Qatar needs a pipeline through Syria, Saudis are supporting the Muslim Brotherhood and Al-Quada, and NATO needs Syria to get to Iran. Russia is protecting its gas market in the EU, as well as to prevent a surge of Islamic terrorists to its borders if Assad falls, the Russian patriarch asked Putin to help the Christians in Syria, who are mostly Orthodox, with roots from the North Caucuses. Some of them even speak Russian still while being 2nd and 3rd gen. Syrians. This is a brief overview of some driving forces behind the conflict. Its sad to see the US leadership be so eager to help the enemy though. Assad ain't no saint, but he kept the turmoil under wraps. If he falls, there will be something along the lines of genocide. With no foreign troops on the ground, the "rebels" will run wild. Israel and Christians will be the next victims.:lol: Yeah clearly, so what exactly are the rebels going to do against Israel, who has a military that can kick the collective ass of the entire Middle East? And I am sorry but what? Genocide? Where was the outcry during Darfur and Rwanda? And I don't appreciate you insinuating that I am supporting either side of this.. Just pointing out the specific fact that these policy making has absolutely nothing to do with "saving lives"..
According to Obama, the point of the strikes was to deter Assad from using chemical weapons again. Well, if Russia's proposal comes to fruition and goes off without a hitch, it will effectively do what the US wanted, without having to incur further casualties. So I say this is the way to proceed. Now, if the US's intentions within Syria were not about stopping the use of chemical weapons, and the whole chemical weapon attack was just an excuse for military action, then I could see the US trying to discredit this initiative and pushing for military action anyways. From my personal perspective, it seem to me that the US could care less about the plight of the Syrian people and are just using the chemical weapon attack as a way to bring about a regime change.
Personally I feel that revolutions should come from within if the goal is to end up with a stable nation that stands for the people. If the US interferes and helps the rebels, obviously Washington is gonna start calling their favors. The US isnt going to spend millions helping rebels and then just hand them the nation and complete control all willy nilly. Whomever is placed in power will be a staunch US supporter who will more likely than not end up making policies that are more beneficial to the US than his own people.
Also lets not forget the anarchy that will ensue if the Assad government is toppled. I'm not saying that Assad is a great leader or any such thing, but under him there is some semblance of order. Look at Iraq, the US says its free...but how much better is it now? Yes Saddam was a terrible dictator, but atleast back then you knew what not to do to minimize your chances of being tortured/killed. Now Iraq is a free for all. It doesnt matter who you support, or what your views are, you can blown up just walking down the street. Is it worth it? I guess only people living in that situation will know.
I think that Assad and other dicatators should be toppled, but revolutions that are given and not earned, rarely end very well.
Of they don't care about the plight of the Syrian people, they care about the President saying something he shouldn't had said in the first place but then being box in to having to do something just to save the President's ass.From my personal perspective, it seem to me that the US could care less about the plight of the Syrian people and are just using the chemical weapon attack as a way to bring about a regime change.
II_Seraphim_II
Anyone feel like this was kind of planned to begin with?
Seems like too much of a level-headed solution to come up out of thin air.
The whole Christian protection thing is from the days of the Russian Empire, and the third Rome idea. How far will the new Russia take this idea, idk, but interesting to see. Russia is protecting its interests against the interests of the Saudis, Qatar and NATO. Syria became an epicenter of this conflict. Qatar needs a pipeline through Syria, Saudis are supporting the Muslim Brotherhood and Al-Quada, and NATO needs Syria to get to Iran. Russia is protecting its gas market in the EU, as well as to prevent a surge of Islamic terrorists to its borders if Assad falls, the Russian patriarch asked Putin to help the Christians in Syria, who are mostly Orthodox, with roots from the North Caucuses. Some of them even speak Russian still while being 2nd and 3rd gen. Syrians. This is a brief overview of some driving forces behind the conflict. Its sad to see the US leadership be so eager to help the enemy though. Assad ain't no saint, but he kept the turmoil under wraps. If he falls, there will be something along the lines of genocide. With no foreign troops on the ground, the "rebels" will run wild. Israel and Christians will be the next victims.[QUOTE="muscleserge"][QUOTE="whipassmt"] If the Assad regime falls or loses control over big portions of the country, the Christian Syrians could be in some big trouble (as well as the Alawites), it could be like what happened in Iraq but possibly worse because there might not be any ground forces. The Syrian army recently intervened in a village to stop Islamist rebels from going after the Christians there.
Putin has in the past stated that Russia would protect Christians throughout the world.
sSubZerOo
:lol: Yeah clearly, so what exactly are the rebels going to do against Israel, who has a military that can kick the collective ass of the entire Middle East? And I am sorry but what? Genocide? Where was the outcry during Darfur and Rwanda? And I don't appreciate you insinuating that I am supporting either side of this.. Just pointing out the specific fact that these policy making has absolutely nothing to do with "saving lives"..
So the "rebels" will just stop? What does Israel's military have anything to do with this? If the "rebels" carry out an attack, who is Israel going to fight? Syria? The "rebels" are already killing Christians, what do you think will happen to them if Assad falls? Darfur and Rwanda don't have the location that Syria has, nor its political ties. I didn't insinuate anything, just pointed out what you left off. Policy? Lives? I'm lost here.[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="muscleserge"] The whole Christian protection thing is from the days of the Russian Empire, and the third Rome idea. How far will the new Russia take this idea, idk, but interesting to see. Russia is protecting its interests against the interests of the Saudis, Qatar and NATO. Syria became an epicenter of this conflict. Qatar needs a pipeline through Syria, Saudis are supporting the Muslim Brotherhood and Al-Quada, and NATO needs Syria to get to Iran. Russia is protecting its gas market in the EU, as well as to prevent a surge of Islamic terrorists to its borders if Assad falls, the Russian patriarch asked Putin to help the Christians in Syria, who are mostly Orthodox, with roots from the North Caucuses. Some of them even speak Russian still while being 2nd and 3rd gen. Syrians. This is a brief overview of some driving forces behind the conflict. Its sad to see the US leadership be so eager to help the enemy though. Assad ain't no saint, but he kept the turmoil under wraps. If he falls, there will be something along the lines of genocide. With no foreign troops on the ground, the "rebels" will run wild. Israel and Christians will be the next victims.muscleserge
:lol: Yeah clearly, so what exactly are the rebels going to do against Israel, who has a military that can kick the collective ass of the entire Middle East? And I am sorry but what? Genocide? Where was the outcry during Darfur and Rwanda? And I don't appreciate you insinuating that I am supporting either side of this.. Just pointing out the specific fact that these policy making has absolutely nothing to do with "saving lives"..
So the "rebels" will just stop? What does Israel's military have anything to do with this? If the "rebels" carry out an attack, who is Israel going to fight? Syria? The "rebels" are already killing Christians, what do you think will happen to them if Assad falls? Darfur and Rwanda don't have the location that Syria has, nor its political ties. I didn't insinuate anything, just pointed out what you left off. Policy? Lives? I'm lost here. Israel also conducted military strikes against Palestine for in response to terrorist attacks coming from that region, so an Israeli retaliation is not unfeasible.[QUOTE="muscleserge"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]So the "rebels" will just stop? What does Israel's military have anything to do with this? If the "rebels" carry out an attack, who is Israel going to fight? Syria? The "rebels" are already killing Christians, what do you think will happen to them if Assad falls? Darfur and Rwanda don't have the location that Syria has, nor its political ties. I didn't insinuate anything, just pointed out what you left off. Policy? Lives? I'm lost here. Israel also conducted military strikes against Palestine for in response to terrorist attacks coming from that region, so an Israeli retaliation is not unfeasible. Against whom? Assad? Civilians? Palestine isn't in civil war, and they have elected Hamas, I wouldn't compare the two.:lol: Yeah clearly, so what exactly are the rebels going to do against Israel, who has a military that can kick the collective ass of the entire Middle East? And I am sorry but what? Genocide? Where was the outcry during Darfur and Rwanda? And I don't appreciate you insinuating that I am supporting either side of this.. Just pointing out the specific fact that these policy making has absolutely nothing to do with "saving lives"..
deeliman
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