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Vietnam and Korean, simply because it's amusing watching/reading about 'The world's superpower' not minding their own business, and then getting owned my China-men hiding in holes.Fightingfan
I don't think 58,000 American dead compared to 1.5 million + North Vietnam/Viet Cong dead constitutes "America getting owned"... The war was going fine, every major North Vietnamese offensive was repulsed prior to US leaving (including Tet Offensive), the US public simply didn't want us there (because didn't think it was justified, especially after secret invasions/bombings in neutral Laos were revealed)... Which is why Nixon took the "graceful" peaceful exit when he had a chance and then NV re-invaded SV AFTER the US withdrew completely from the country (apart from our consulate in Saigon).
Same situation in Korea... I hardly think hundreds of thousands of dead is comparable to tens of thousands when arguing you are the victor... North Korea beat South Korea... US led coalition comes in and saves South Korea, nearly destroys North Korea, China comes in with 1.5m + troops and saves them... Once again hardly a "beating" considering it was a few hundred thousand coalition troops (at its peak, much less than that in many cases), operating IN LAND against a force that at its peak was four times as large, still inflicting highly contrasted casualties on the enemy...
In chronological order, for your great studying pleasure:
The Eighty Years' War of the Dutch rebels against the Spanish Empire
World War 1
The Spanish Civil War between the National rebels and the Republican government
World War 2 (especially the Russian Campaign/Great Patriotic War)
The Soviet War in Afghanistan
The 2008 South Ossetia War between Russia and Georgia
Oh and on topic:
- Mexican American War
Highly overlooked in US history, which is silly lol... US war of aggression, which resulted in the invasion of Mexico and subsequent capture of Mexico City forcing Mexico to give the US what is now the entire southwest US (from Texas' early western border to top of California). I don't understand why this war is so overlooked... We went to Mexico, said "hey Mexico we will buy all that land" (because President Polk wanted west coast ports). Mexico was like "na that's a large part of our country" and Polk was like "kthxbye", put a few thousand troops on a disputed border with Texas/Mexico, Mexico responded by putting troops there as well, patrols fire on each other, Polk goes to congress and says "look what Mexico did, US dead on US soil" the rest is history.
- US Civil War
- WW1
- WW2
World War 2. Simple as that. There will never be another conflict as large as WWII (and that's a good thing). Everything about it was so massive in scale it is unbelievable.
It's not just the size, but it was how it was fought. No WMDs, everything was conventional. Tactics shifted greatly. Civilians were now the targets of the major powers, not just soldiers. The war machine was so great in each nation that a pure military engagementwas impossible. You had to target the war machine, which meant targeting civilians.
Then there is the politics. It gets very complicated. Especially when you start looking at Eastern Europe and how pretty much everybody was killing everybody for their own reasons. It's an increadible look at humanity at our worst.
Other wars that are interesting are Vietnam and Korea, just becuase the dynamics of the superpowers and the whole cold war thing.
Holy crap.For me, it's WWII. I have read 59 books on it just in the past 6 years alone.
WhiteKnight77
[QUOTE="Wasdie"]No WMDsgamerguru100Except for the two atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki
Well yeah. WMDs ended the fighting but they weren't present throughout the war.
The existant of WMDs changed war and international politics forever and have made everything very difficult to analyze.
You seem to know your stuff. Cool. I accept you.World War 2. Simple as that. There will never be another conflict as large as WWII (and that's a good thing). Everything about it was so massive in scale it is unbelievable.
It's not just the size, but it was how it was fought. No WMDs, everything was conventional. Tactics shifted greatly. Civilians were now the targets of the major powers, not just soldiers. The war machine was so great in each nation that a pure military engagementwas impossible. You had to target the war machine, which meant targeting civilians.
Then there is the politics. It gets very complicated. Especially when you start looking at Eastern Europe and how pretty much everybody was killing everybody for their own reasons. It's an increadible look at humanity at our worst.
Other wars that are interesting are Vietnam and Korea, just becuase the dynamics of the superpowers and the whole cold war thing.
Wasdie
You are awesome.Oh and on topic:
- Mexican American War
Highly overlooked in US history, which is silly lol... US war of aggression, which resulted in the invasion of Mexico and subsequent capture of Mexico City forcing Mexico to give the US what is now the entire southwest US (from Texas' early western border to top of California). I don't understand why this war is so overlooked... We went to Mexico, said "hey Mexico we will buy all that land" (because President Polk wanted west coast ports). Mexico was like "na that's a large part of our country" and Polk was like "kthxbye", put a few thousand troops on a disputed border with Texas/Mexico, Mexico responded by putting troops there as well, patrols fire on each other, Polk goes to congress and says "look what Mexico did, US dead on US soil" the rest is history.
- US Civil War
- WW1
- WW2
C2N2
WWI
so much death and absolute devistation of the land in such a tight space. it also had so many firsts. planes were first being used. tanks. submarines. machine guns. etc...
plus the horrors of the mustard gas, the gas masks, the mountains of corpses being used as cover. man, im messed up huh?
[QUOTE="Fightingfan"]Vietnam and Korean, simply because it's amusing watching/reading about 'The world's superpower' not minding their own business, and then getting owned my China-men hiding in holes.C2N2
I don't think 58,000 American dead compared to 1.5 million + North Vietnam/Viet Cong dead constitutes "America getting owned"... The war was going fine, every major North Vietnamese offensive was repulsed prior to US leaving (including Tet Offensive), the US public simply didn't want us there (because didn't think it was justified, especially after secret invasions/bombings in neutral Laos were revealed)... Which is why Nixon took the "graceful" peaceful exit when he had a chance and then NV re-invaded SV AFTER the US withdrew completely from the country (apart from our consulate in Saigon).
Same situation in Korea... I hardly think hundreds of thousands of dead is comparable to tens of thousands when arguing you are the victor... North Korea beat South Korea... US led coalition comes in and saves South Korea, nearly destroys North Korea, China comes in with 1.5m + troops and saves them... Once again hardly a "beating" considering it was a few hundred thousand coalition troops (at its peak, much less than that in many cases), operating IN LAND against a force that at its peak was four times as large, still inflicting highly contrasted casualties on the enemy...
K/D doesn't matter in war, it's the objective that matters. Example, America could lose three million troops and Russia lose one-million, but if America prevents Russia from overtaking America, America won.
It's still interesting seeing an inferior culture(financially, education wise), and lacking 'muscle'(troop numbers) defeat/prevent America from accomplishing their purpose. There's no debating America lost both wars, if they won em, Communism wouldn't exist in Korea; and regarding Vietnam, America lost strategically there's no debating that.
The Cold War, it is a unique period in human history.
As Wasdie said, there has never been a conflict as large as WW2, yet we have never come as close to an unprescedented level of destruction as we did during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]Holy crap.For me, it's WWII. I have read 59 books on it just in the past 6 years alone.
gamerguru100
What can I say, I like to read and that is even working a job that often has 12 hour days.
WWII, considering the modernization of warfare, the global scale, the times leading to the war and the politics of it (esp. on the European side), the number of interesting arenas, and the impact on the future world.
WW2
QUOTE="Fightingfan"]Vietnam and Korean, simply because it's amusing watching/reading about 'The world's superpower' not minding their own business, and then getting owned my China-men hiding in holes.
....
[QUOTE="jetpower3"][QUOTE="Fightingfan"]Vietnam and Korean, simply because it's amusing watching/reading about 'The world's superpower' not minding their own business, and then getting owned my China-men hiding in holes.Kevlar101
It doesn't sound like you have a very comprehensive understanding of either conflict, if you're going to say things as silly as that.
:lol: the Americans never even made it out of South Vietnam, they were getting their asses kicked so badHad we made a full-on attempt to win the war, rather than use it as a staging ground for our technology, we would have won the war easily. We could've eliminated North Korea and China (at that time) from the map, no question about it. But we had to consider the impact with U.S.S.R.
I'm sure the puny country you belong to would never even have had a chance to do that.
Back on topic....World War 2 (and I enjoy talking with the the remaining American vets on what they remember about it).
Also, the American Civil War has become increasing interesting to me, since I live close to Gettysburg, Pa.......where the turning point to the war happened in July 1863
What still fascinates me at Gettysburgh is Picket's Charge, whereby a mile wide row of Confederate soldiers (a freaking mile!) came charging at the outmanned Union Army and their cannons. Must of been a scary sight for the Union Army but they won, and turned the entire War around.
:lol: the Americans never even made it out of South Vietnam, they were getting their asses kicked so badI'm sure the puny country you belong to would never even have had a chance to do that. I live in the U.S. :? lol i'm in no puny country my friend :lol:[QUOTE="Kevlar101"][QUOTE="jetpower3"]
It doesn't sound like you have a very comprehensive understanding of either conflict, if you're going to say things as silly as that.
AFBrat77
The American Civil War is pretty interesting. First sinking of a ship by a submarine, first use of ironclad ships in battle, first use of Gatling guns, the fact that many of the locations it took place in are within driving distance, etc.
Also, WWII is interesting, simply because of how many theatres there were going on.
The 'War Of The Worlds'..
This planet needs a good kick up the backside for everyone to eventually work together as one!
Roll on an Alien Invasion!
[QUOTE="jetpower3"]
[QUOTE="Fightingfan"]Vietnam and Korean, simply because it's amusing watching/reading about 'The world's superpower' not minding their own business, and then getting owned my China-men hiding in holes.Fightingfan
It doesn't sound like you have a very comprehensive understanding of either conflict, if you're going to say things as silly as that.
The whole point of the Korean War was due to the division of Korea, America wanted to rid Communism, barely made it to North Korea, and then lost(which is why North Korea is still under communistic rule).The Vietnam war was total ass rape, Gorilla tactics AKA campers destroyed the American troops, tons of U.S troops died and they had to withdrawl, doesn't sound like a win to me.
If you're referring to my word choice, *Face palm* that's obviously satire.
*And technically the Korean war is still going on.
If by the campers you are referring to Viet Cong then you are wrong. The Viet Cong cease to be operational force after the Tet Offensive the VIet Cong were decimated during the Tet Offensive. In fact Giap used the Viet Cong as cannon folders at the first phase of the Tet Offensive. Why is this you ask? Some historians conclude this was so the North Vietnamese didn't have to share power with southerns after the war was over.[QUOTE="Fightingfan"]The whole point of the Korean War was due to the division of Korea, America wanted to rid Communism, barely made it to North Korea, and then lost(which is why North Korea is still under communistic rule).[QUOTE="jetpower3"]
It doesn't sound like you have a very comprehensive understanding of either conflict, if you're going to say things as silly as that.
Vader993
The Vietnam war was total ass rape, Gorilla tactics AKA campers destroyed the American troops, tons of U.S troops died and they had to withdrawl, doesn't sound like a win to me.
If you're referring to my word choice, *Face palm* that's obviously satire.
*And technically the Korean war is still going on.
If by the campers you are referring to Viet Cong then you are wrong. The Viet Cong cease to be operational force after the Tet Offensive the VIet Cong were decimated during the Tet Offensive. In fact Giap used the Viet Cong as cannon folders at the first phase of the Tet Offensive. Why is this you ask? Some historians conclude this was so the North Vietnamese didn't have to share power with southerns after the war was over. Its "Cannon Fodder"............... not "Cannon Folder"Easily World War 2. The amount of people fighting, the different theaters, and the development of newer technology etc. I've read plenty of books on it and there always seems to be fresh material or insight into something I didn't know. It really was a WORLD WAR. HoolaHoopManIt makes WW1 look not so much like a world war, but more like International Civil War 5, or the Great European War.
Easily World War 2. The amount of people fighting, the different theaters, and the development of newer technology etc. I've read plenty of books on it and there always seems to be fresh material or insight into something I didn't know. It really was a WORLD WAR. HoolaHoopMan
With the fall of the Soviet Union and the Iron Curtain, there is more material available to study and be able to write or rather, rewrite history as a more fuller story has emerged that can be told. This also goes for Cold War era.
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