Why are you an atheist?

[QUOTE="Merc_Scar"]I'm atheist because I don't think that the Christian god, or the bible, make any logical sense. I used to think as a poor little kid why I went to church every morning. Then I started skipping with my friend(I went to a catholic school). I was raised as a catholic and I honestly never understood any of that bull. GabuEx

Well, first, it's not exactly a either/or thing between Christianity and atheism; otherwise, there wouldln't exactly be the dozen other religions out there.

That said, however, I think that you kind of missed the real point of the Bible (though I can't blame you - many others are guilty of this too). One passage I like was written by St. Augustine of Hippo in the early fifth century, and reads as follows:

"With the scriptures it is a matter of treating about the faith. For that reason, as I have noted repeatedly, if anyone, not understanding the mode of divine eloquence, should find something about these matters (about the physical universe) in our books, or hear of the same from those books, of such a kind that it seems to be at variance with the perceptions of his own rational faculties, let him believe that these other things are in no way necessary to the admonitions or accounts or predictions of the scriptures. In short, it must be said that our authors knew the truth about the nature of the skies, but it was not the intention of the Spirit of God, who spoke through them, to teach men anything that would not be of use to them for their salvation."

In other words, the Bible wasn't intended as a scientific or historical textbook, and treating it as such is pretty much missing the point. It is a book that is intended to instruct humans in how to live their lives, and is teeming with a message of unbounded and overflowing love that all humans ought to aspire to. Taken in this way, I think it's really a rather beautiful book with a lot of passages teeming with profundity, even if one does not accept the literal factual accuracy of accounts contained therein.

[QUOTE="WhiteSnake5000"][QUOTE="OrkHammer007"]

I'm not an atheist. I'm too open-minded to reject the idea of a higher power out of hand.

OrkHammer007

That just seems to me to be a way of countering any potential Biblical innaccuracies. That's like an historian protesting at the criticism he receives for his poor grammar, because of course he is an historian and not a linguist.MetalGear_Ninty

I look at it this way: if the Bible is not literally true, does it truly matter? Was that ever even its intention? If it causes me or anyone else to love their neighbor, to give to charity, and to remain humble in life, then has it not made the greatest accomplishment any book could hope to make?

People get so caught up in worrying about the singular trees that they never once see the forest.

[QUOTE="MetalGear_Ninty"]That just seems to me to be a way of countering any potential Biblical innaccuracies. That's like an historian protesting at the criticism he receives for his poor grammar, because of course he is an historian and not a linguist.GabuEx

I look at it this way: if the Bible is not literally true, does it truly matter? If it causes me or anyone else to love their neighbor, to give to charity, and to remain humble in life, then has it not made the greatest accomplishment any book could hope to make?

People get so caught up in worrying about the singular trees that they never once see the forest.

[QUOTE="MetalGear_Ninty"]That just seems to me to be a way of countering any potential Biblical innaccuracies. That's like an historian protesting at the criticism he receives for his poor grammar, because of course he is an historian and not a linguist.GabuEx

I look at it this way: if the Bible is not literally true, does it truly matter? Was that ever even its intention? If it causes me or anyone else to love their neighbor, to give to charity, and to remain humble in life, then has it not made the greatest accomplishment any book could hope to make?

People get so caught up in worrying about the singular trees that they never once see the forest.

I think believing in God would have to take 100% faith in the Bible and its teachings. I can't believe in something like that without proof. And I doubt I could worship a God who is so clearly evil, petty, and immoral as the Old Testament God.Bourbons3

Also, you seem to not realize why God did those things in the Old Testament (which btw, it's the same God in both the OT and NT).

Existence. One man might assume that there is a power (that represents itself) within this existence, while someone else believes that the power is what is seen. When you die,and your body decomposes, parts of what you were still exist. Your vision and memory, who you think you are now is just a byproduct of existence, a specific formation of cells, what we understand them as. I don't think everything we can think of is possible. Only the logical things that don't conflict with our reality. WhiteSnake5000

Science is a wonderful way to understand what's going on in the world around us, but it does a miserable job of explaining the aesthetic aspects of life and spirit.

well the thing is gabu, while the bible may have brought you happyness , love and all he positive things ( which i am very happy for you), their is the ugly side and the fact that much much much blood has been spilled over god, and the bible , in the name of god, and over the word of the bible.. does the war brought on by religion counterbalance the love it can also bring? or does it overshadow it. this i cannot answer.. but it does make you think.nimatoad2000

If one truly actually reads the Bible and attempts to really understand what it's saying (which unfortunately requires that one understand the Greek and Hebrew - no easy task), it's pretty darn obvious to me that the Bible in no way, shape, or form encourages anything of the sort. The purity of religion is simply one of a very, very long list of casualties of human stupidity, greed, hatred, and wrath. At the heart of every tragedy lies not religion, but the darkness of humanity.

Then what your worshiping is not a religion, but a philosophy and all talk of the supernatural is redundant.MetalGear_Ninty

Perhaps, or perhaps thoughts of such things is what lead to such a philosophy. At the heart of it, however, I truly believe that that is what Christianity is all about, and it saddens me to no end to see people concern themselves with such trivialities, all while ignoring the important stuff.

[QUOTE="WhiteSnake5000"]Existence. One man might assume that there is a power (that represents itself) within this existence, while someone else believes that the power is what is seen. When you die,and your body decomposes, parts of what you were still exist. Your vision and memory, who you think you are now is just a byproduct of existence, a specific formation of cells, what we understand them as. I don't think everything we can think of is possible. Only the logical things that don't conflict with our reality. OrkHammer007

Science is a wonderful way to understand what's going on in the world around us, but it does a miserable job of explaining the aesthetic aspects of life and spirit.

I personally dont agree with many of the things religions expects of people and the idea of worship is something I disagree with. To bow down and submit to anything just because it is more poweful is wrong. That goes against the sense that everyone is equal. What kind of person that loves you threatens to punish you by not sending you to your room, but by burning in hell forever and ever and ever and ever and ever.

Religion also causes a truckload of snobbery with many saying to me how the fact that they are religious means they have purpose and that I might as well be dead.

That is of course met with a threat of me ending this persons to ability to realise said purpose and end further bashing of my apparent 'lack' of morals and ethics since I am an atheist. Atheist to the core.

[QUOTE="Bourbons3"]I think believing in God would have to take 100% faith in the Bible and its teachings. I can't believe in something like that without proof. And I doubt I could worship a God who is so clearly evil, petty, and immoral as the Old Testament God.mindstorm

Also, you seem to not realize why God did those things in the Old Testament (which btw, it's the same God in both the OT and NT).

That's not exactly what I would call blind acceptance, the two are not the same at all. I can see, feel, touch, hear, and smell people. I interact with people everyday, and have done so for my entire life. You can't do any of these things with god. Though I imagine someone may reply to tell me that "god will touch you if you only open your heart and mind to him," or some such nonsense.

Because I don't have any proof God exists and I don't want to just "have faith" in something.CreepingDeath_

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Rz47t92IH8

have faith in king diamond , but seriously watch the video, he gets interviewed and they attempt to use a priest and other stuff to bash him and win in an arguement but they didnt know that the king is really good at persuasive arguement and keeps his cool. ( theirs 2 parts)

No matter what you do humanity will not survive. And even if you could live forever would you want to? Death is a part of every human being. And calling religion a fairytale shows ignorance. Are you saying that there is nothing outside of science. That science can see all. Science is created by observations. There is limits on what we can observe and derive there after. If you think that we have the ability to get to the reaility of the workings of everything then you are a fool. No matter what questions you answer more questions will arrive from the answers you have created. And if you will die anyways why does it matter if humans survive. And why do you care if someone else is religious?

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]

[QUOTE="Bourbons3"]I think believing in God would have to take 100% faith in the Bible and its teachings. I can't believe in something like that without proof. And I doubt I could worship a God who is so clearly evil, petty, and immoral as the Old Testament God.FlyingArmbar

Also, you seem to not realize why God did those things in the Old Testament (which btw, it's the same God in both the OT and NT).

That's not exactly what I would call blind acceptance, the two are not the same at all. I can see, feel, touch, hear, and smell people. I interact with people everyday, and have done so for my entire life. You can't do any of these things with god. Though I imagine someone may reply to tell me that "god will touch you if you only open your heart and mind to him," or some such nonsense.

Then what your worshiping is not a religion, but a philosophy and all talk of the supernatural is redundant.MetalGear_Ninty

Perhaps, or perhaps thoughts of such things is what lead to such a philosophy. At the heart of it, however, I truly believe that that is what Christianity is all about, and it saddens me to no end to see people concern themselves with such trivialities, all while ignoring the important stuff.

No matter what you do humanity will not survive. And even if you could live forever would you want to? Death is a part of every human being. And calling religion a fairytale shows ignorance. Are you saying that there is nothing outside of science. That science can see all. Science is created by observations. There is limits on what we can observe and derive there after. If you think that we have the ability to get to the reaility of the workings of everything then you are a fool. No matter what questions you answer more questions will arrive from the answers you have created. And if you will die anyways why does it matter if humans survive. And why do you care if someone else is religious?

illegalimigrant

I personally dont agree with many of the things religions expects of people and the idea of worship is something I disagree with. To bow down and submit to anything just because it is more poweful is wrong. That goes against the sense that everyone is equal. What kind of person that loves you threatens to punish you by not sending you to your room, but by burning in hell forever and ever and ever and ever and ever.

agent_ryu

What kind of person indeed - which is one of the many, many things that has lead me to the conclusion that no such thing is ever mentioned in the (properly translated) Bible. The original Greek phrase used to describe the punishment sinners will receive is aionion kolasin - kolasin here meaning "correction; chastisement; punishment" and aionion meaning "of or pertaining to a period of time of indeterminate length". In other words, not eternal punishment, but a corrective punishment spanning an unspecified period of time.

In addition to that, the description of hell describes it as a place of burning sulfur, which at first glance sounds like a threatening place, but in reality burning sulfur was used for a long time as an agent of purification, used to fumigate sick rooms and ward off disease. Thus, the reality is a far cry from the eternal hellfire many preach - those who die unrepentant of their sins are subjected to a purification of their souls, not an eternal torture chamber.

God does love everyone, and it's precisely for that reason that we are all instructed to love everyone unconditionally, to turn the other cheek, and to give our shirt also to one who demands our cloak, so that we can share in the same love that God holds for everyone. God does not want us to bow down to him as some sort of dictator, but rather he wants us to love him by loving each and every one of his creation.

Religion also causes a truckload of snobbery with many saying to me how the fact that they are religious means they have purpose and that I might as well be dead.

That is of course met with a threat of me ending this persons to ability to realise said purpose and end further bashing of my apparent 'lack' of morals and ethics since I am an atheist. Atheist to the core.

agent_ryu

A lot of things have been corrupted by human failings; that religion is one of those is regrettable, but is not the fault of religion. No matter what something says, someone out there will figure out how to twist it to their own end.

[QUOTE="OrkHammer007"]That sounds rather cold and unfeeling. It takes the mystery and beauty out of life, and reduces it to mere chemical interactions. It's like putting the Mona Lisa under a microscope, rather than standing back and admiring the beauty of the overall work.

Science is a wonderful way to understand what's going on in the world around us, but it does a miserable job of explaining the aesthetic aspects of life and spirit.

WhiteSnake5000

Besides, human feeling cannot be quantified as scientifically. There are people who feel that a higher power exists, and makes their lives better. No amount of dissection will ever explain that, nor will it ever truly eradicate it.

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]

[QUOTE="Bourbons3"]I think believing in God would have to take 100% faith in the Bible and its teachings. I can't believe in something like that without proof. And I doubt I could worship a God who is so clearly evil, petty, and immoral as the Old Testament God.FlyingArmbar

Also, you seem to not realize why God did those things in the Old Testament (which btw, it's the same God in both the OT and NT).

That's not exactly what I would call blind acceptance, the two are not the same at all. I can see, feel, touch, hear, and smell people. I interact with people everyday, and have done so for my entire life. You can't do any of these things with god. Though I imagine someone may reply to tell me that "god will touch you if you only open your heart and mind to him," or some such nonsense.

Hey, have you ever read about Joseph Fletcher -- your thoughts about Christianity are very much in line with his. If you haven't already done so, I'd reckon you'd enjoy reading up about him.MetalGear_Ninty

I can't say I have, but I'll make a note to look him up sometime.

I don't have any faith. I don't care to know about how we all got here, and I also don't believe in something I can't see. In the end we all die anyway. I'm not going to waste my time worshiping something I can't actually communicate with for real. I'm not convinced by reading the bible. It's definitely not believable to begin with. There are so many religions out there that have this idea of some god, it is ridiculous. Life's too short for all of that in my opinion.

Edited just for you :)

tepni

[QUOTE="tepni"]

I don't have any faith. I don't care to know about how we all got here, and I also don't believe in something I can't see. In the end we all die anyway. I'm not going to waste my time worshiping something I can't actually communicate with for real. I'm not convinced by reading the bible. It's definitely not believable to begin with. There are so many religions out there that have this idea of some god, it is ridiculous. Life's too short for all of that in my opinion.

Edited just for you :)

MrPraline

[QUOTE="Bourbons3"]I think believing in God would have to take 100% faith in the Bible and its teachings. I can't believe in something like that without proof. And I doubt I could worship a God who is so clearly evil, petty, and immoral as the Old Testament God.mindstorm

Also, you seem to not realize why God did those things in the Old Testament (which btw, it's the same God in both the OT and NT).

[QUOTE="FlyingArmbar"]

[QUOTE="mindstorm"] Not trying to enter a debate, but nothing can be 100% proven except your own existence. You "blindly accept" that people exist outside of your own mind do you not? Evidence is all that is needed. I could argue this further but hopefully you at least get my point.

Also, you seem to not realize why God did those things in the Old Testament (which btw, it's the same God in both the OT and NT).

mindstorm

That's not exactly what I would call blind acceptance, the two are not the same at all. I can see, feel, touch, hear, and smell people. I interact with people everyday, and have done so for my entire life. You can't do any of these things with god. Though I imagine someone may reply to tell me that "god will touch you if you only open your heart and mind to him," or some such nonsense.

I'm going to call it a night soon so I won't be here to debate with you for all that long, as much as I'm sure that saddens you. :P

Perhaps the things that I perceive are not truly real (as likely as that is, as I'm sure you don't believe that you are living in The Matrix).

But EVERY human being on the Earth is capable of perceiving other people, and no one on this Earth is capable of perceiving god (again, despite what "those" christians might say). That's really all that I think matters.

If everything that I perceive is merely part of my imagination, then to be honest, I think I have bigger problems than wondering whether or not god is real (to be honest, I'm not really wondering).

Applying scientific methods to the Bible proves nothing, it merely reveals the flaws. It's like condemning the beauty of the Mona Lisa because brushtroke #1411-F went left instead of up and to the right. Besides, human feeling cannot be quantified as scientifically. There are people who feel that a higher power exists, and makes their lives better. No amount of dissection will ever explain that, nor will it ever truly eradicate it.OrkHammer007

Because there are those that arent selfish and care about the world they leave behind for others. And calling atheists a tool is himarious as a relgious person you're sucking up to God to get to heaven the same way Joe the copy guy does to get a promotion.

[QUOTE="MrPraline"]

[QUOTE="tepni"]

I don't have any faith. I don't care to know about how we all got here, and I also don't believe in something I can't see. In the end we all die anyway. I'm not going to waste my time worshiping something I can't actually communicate with for real. I'm not convinced by reading the bible. It's definitely not believable to begin with. There are so many religions out there that have this idea of some god, it is ridiculous. Life's too short for all of that in my opinion.

Edited just for you :)

illegalimigrant

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]

[QUOTE="Bourbons3"]I think believing in God would have to take 100% faith in the Bible and its teachings. I can't believe in something like that without proof. And I doubt I could worship a God who is so clearly evil, petty, and immoral as the Old Testament God.Bourbons3

Also, you seem to not realize why God did those things in the Old Testament (which btw, it's the same God in both the OT and NT).

The beliefs of Christianity and other religions change according to the findings of new scientific discoveries. Not that long ago the majority of certain religious people doubted evolution and dinosaurs. Now they are more welcoming to their existence as more and more proof comes forward. There have been many beliefs in many Gods throughout history. I see religion as a human way of answering the unknown. As soon as some aspects become known that that religion tries to explain the religious beliefs are changed to include these new findings in their beliefs. That is why I am an atheist.

You know even if God came to earth and did whatever it is he does (Flood, Burn make blind people unblind) I would only acknowledge his existence not worship him. Even then there is no proof that the God religions talke about is him or if it is the things they say arent what he said.

[QUOTE="illegalimigrant"][QUOTE="MrPraline"]Agreed.

Bourbons3

I don't like the arrogant atheists.

the ones that think they have all the answers, I had this atheist ( who wasn't even out of collge mind you), telling methat it would have been relatively easy to create a universe from nothing.

we don't even understand gravity so you don't know sheet about the universe, no one does, just admit that instead of coming up with some unprovable pseudoscience.

raaaagggggeeeeeee

[QUOTE="illegalimigrant"][QUOTE="MrPraline"]Agreed.

Bourbons3

[QUOTE="Bourbons3"][QUOTE="mindstorm"] Not trying to enter a debate, but nothing can be 100% proven except your own existence. You "blindly accept" that people exist outside of your own mind do you not? Evidence is all that is needed. I could argue this further but hopefully you at least get my point.

Also, you seem to not realize why God did those things in the Old Testament (which btw, it's the same God in both the OT and NT).

mindstorm

Let them have their "feelings", the sincerity of those feelings is merely psychological. They are the one's giving up the will to truly think, they are the ones who limit themselves to believe in one way To think of an omnipotent god in one certain way is crazy. People have so many delusions and images in their head of what existence truly is. Where it all started and how it will end, or will it end? It is apparent, no matter how much Christians argue it, the bible in many cases has proved to be wrong. Disregarding its importance in the history of human kind. It is only but a book, and the impractical things described in it are just imagery. It is like trying to picture a mathematical equation. Only it's an endless wall of numbers. And it all came about with our minds ability to wonder. Eventually that thought process would lead to God. Which was most certainly man-made. A toddler might believe in Santa Clause, an adult will most likely not. An early human would believe the bible as many of you do know. Mankind is still young. However, one who has observed his existence, will see it as something much more complex than any Christian. And that is why that the atheist man will eventually dominate the other man. It is maybe not science that will ever explain the way man thinks about god, but eventually it will throw Christianity (for the most part) into the depths.WhiteSnake5000

Personally, I don't see why scientific advancements would cause Christianity to be "thrown into the depths". The vast majority of Christians out there have no problem at all reconciling the current scientific body of knowledge with the Bible. The idea that a lot of the Bible is allegorical or parabolic is nothing new - even in the earliest days of Christianity, the theological school of Alexandria was saying just that. I really think that those who are looking forward to the day when religion goes away are pinning the blame on the wrong thing. Religion isn't the problem; the problem is, as it always is, humans. Jesus doesn't pop out of the Bible and tell anyone that they should hate their neighbor and wage war on those who believe in something else; humans come to that conclusion all on their own. If there's one big thing that people like Stalin, Mao, and Pol Pot proved, it's that humans most certainly do not need religion in order to commit atrocities and for tragedies to come to pass.

If there's one thing that atheists - or at least strong atheists, those who believe that God does not exist - have a tendency to do that bothers me, it's pridefully lording over religion and its perceived incorrectness in the wake of scientific advancement. I really think this makes no sense - despite the stories included in every religion, religion really is fundamentally not about historical or scientific fact, but about things that science really can never even attempt to answer, such as the meaning of life, the essence of love, and the human spirit. Science can tell me many things, but one thing it cannot tell me is how I ought to live my life, how I ought to bring happiness to others, and how I ought to care for my fellow man. People might arrive at answers to those questions without religion, but they certainly did not arrive at answers to those questions through science - at its heart, science only tells us what is, not what ought to be.

I think that those who view religion and science as being fundamentally in conflict with one another - regardless of whether that person takes the side of religion or science - are fundamentally not understanding at least one of the two fields.

Do we need physical proof to believe in God? You can't prove to anyone that you are consious does that make not true?

I don't like the arrogant atheists.

the ones that think they have all the answers, I had this atheist ( who wasn't even out of collge mind you), telling methat it would have been relatively easy to create a universe from nothing.

we don't even understand gravity so you don't know sheet about the universe, no one does, just admit that instead of coming up with some unprovable pseudoscience.

raaaagggggeeeeeee

Deano

[QUOTE="WhiteSnake5000"]Let them have their "feelings", the sincerity of those feelings is merely psychological. They are the one's giving up the will to truly think, they are the ones who limit themselves to believe in one way To think of an omnipotent god in one certain way is crazy. People have so many delusions and images in their head of what existence truly is. Where it all started and how it will end, or will it end? It is apparent, no matter how much Christians argue it, the bible in many cases has proved to be wrong. Disregarding its importance in the history of human kind. It is only but a book, and the impractical things described in it are just imagery. It is like trying to picture a mathematical equation. Only it's an endless wall of numbers. And it all came about with our minds ability to wonder. Eventually that thought process would lead to God. Which was most certainly man-made. A toddler might believe in Santa Clause, an adult will most likely not. An early human would believe the bible as many of you do know. Mankind is still young. However, one who has observed his existence, will see it as something much more complex than any Christian. And that is why that the atheist man will eventually dominate the other man. It is maybe not science that will ever explain the way man thinks about god, but eventually it will throw Christianity (for the most part) into the depths.GabuEx

Personally, I don't see why scientific advancements would cause Christianity to be "thrown into the depths". The vast majority of Christians out there have no problem at all reconciling the current scientific body of knowledge with the Bible. The idea that a lot of the Bible is allegorical or parabolic is nothing new - even in the earliest days of Christianity, the theological school of Alexandria was saying just that. I really think that those who are looking forward to the day when religion goes away are pinning the blame on the wrong thing. Religion isn't the problem; the problem is, as it always is, humans. Jesus doesn't pop out of the Bible and tell anyone that they should hate their neighbor and wage war on those who believe in something else; humans come to that conclusion all on their own. If there's one big thing that people like Stalin, Mao, and Pol Pot proved, it's that humans most certainly do not need religion in order to commit atrocities and for tragedies to come to pass.

If there's one thing that atheists - or at least strong atheists, those who believe that God does not exist - have a tendency to do that bothers me, it's pridefully lording over religion and its perceived incorrectness in the wake of scientific advancement. I really think this makes no sense - despite the stories included in every religion, religion really is fundamentally not about historical or scientific fact, but about things that science really can never even attempt to answer, such as the meaning of life, the essence of love, and the human spirit. Science can tell me many things, but one thing it cannot tell me is how I ought to live my life, how I ought to bring happiness to others, and how I ought to care for my fellow man. People might arrive at answers to those questions without religion, but they certainly did not arrive at answers to those questions through science - at its heart, science only tells us what is, not what ought to be.

I think that those who view religion and science as being fundamentally in conflict with one another - regardless of whether that person takes the side of religion or science - are fundamentally not understanding at least one of the two fields.

[QUOTE="Deano"]

I don't like the arrogant atheists.

the ones that think they have all the answers, I had this atheist ( who wasn't even out of collge mind you), telling methat it would have been relatively easy to create a universe from nothing.

we don't even understand gravity so you don't know sheet about the universe, no one does, just admit that instead of coming up with some unprovable pseudoscience.

raaaagggggeeeeeee

WhiteSnake5000

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="WhiteSnake5000"]Let them have their "feelings", the sincerity of those feelings is merely psychological. They are the one's giving up the will to truly think, they are the ones who limit themselves to believe in one way To think of an omnipotent god in one certain way is crazy. People have so many delusions and images in their head of what existence truly is. Where it all started and how it will end, or will it end? It is apparent, no matter how much Christians argue it, the bible in many cases has proved to be wrong. Disregarding its importance in the history of human kind. It is only but a book, and the impractical things described in it are just imagery. It is like trying to picture a mathematical equation. Only it's an endless wall of numbers. And it all came about with our minds ability to wonder. Eventually that thought process would lead to God. Which was most certainly man-made. A toddler might believe in Santa Clause, an adult will most likely not. An early human would believe the bible as many of you do know. Mankind is still young. However, one who has observed his existence, will see it as something much more complex than any Christian. And that is why that the atheist man will eventually dominate the other man. It is maybe not science that will ever explain the way man thinks about god, but eventually it will throw Christianity (for the most part) into the depths.WhiteSnake5000

Personally, I don't see why scientific advancements would cause Christianity to be "thrown into the depths". The vast majority of Christians out there have no problem at all reconciling the current scientific body of knowledge with the Bible. The idea that a lot of the Bible is allegorical or parabolic is nothing new - even in the earliest days of Christianity, the theological school of Alexandria was saying just that. I really think that those who are looking forward to the day when religion goes away are pinning the blame on the wrong thing. Religion isn't the problem; the problem is, as it always is, humans. Jesus doesn't pop out of the Bible and tell anyone that they should hate their neighbor and wage war on those who believe in something else; humans come to that conclusion all on their own. If there's one big thing that people like Stalin, Mao, and Pol Pot proved, it's that humans most certainly do not need religion in order to commit atrocities and for tragedies to come to pass.

If there's one thing that atheists - or at least strong atheists, those who believe that God does not exist - have a tendency to do that bothers me, it's pridefully lording over religion and its perceived incorrectness in the wake of scientific advancement. I really think this makes no sense - despite the stories included in every religion, religion really is fundamentally not about historical or scientific fact, but about things that science really can never even attempt to answer, such as the meaning of life, the essence of love, and the human spirit. Science can tell me many things, but one thing it cannot tell me is how I ought to live my life, how I ought to bring happiness to others, and how I ought to care for my fellow man. People might arrive at answers to those questions without religion, but they certainly did not arrive at answers to those questions through science - at its heart, science only tells us what is, not what ought to be.

I think that those who view religion and science as being fundamentally in conflict with one another - regardless of whether that person takes the side of religion or science - are fundamentally not understanding at least one of the two fields.

If there's one thing that atheists - or at least strong atheists, those who believe that God does not exist - have a tendency to do that bothers me, it's pridefully lording over religion and its perceived incorrectness in the wake of scientific advancement. I really think this makes no sense - despite the stories included in every religion, religion really is fundamentally not about historical or scientific fact, but about things that science really can never even attempt to answer, such as the meaning of life, the essence of love, and the human spirit. Science can tell me many things, but one thing it cannot tell me is how I ought to live my life, how I ought to bring happiness to others, and how I ought to care for my fellow man. People might arrive at answers to those questions without religion, but they certainly did not arrive at answers to those questions through science - at its heart, science only tells us what is, not what ought to be.

I think that those who view religion and science as being fundamentally in conflict with one another - regardless of whether that person takes the side of religion or science - are fundamentally not understanding at least one of the two fields.

GabuEx

Yeah I personally am a strong Atheist but what annoys me is in school whenever there is some scientific dicovery thats all over the news there are always those annoying religious people that arent necessarily in the top of their science class that come to question me about my belief in that discovery as if I'm the represenative of Atheism. They stereotype me as the guy that dosent believe in Religion because of science and I can somehow live my life based on science. They cant tell that I dont give a damn and they shouldnt flatter themselves thinking that something like science pulled me away from being religious.

The air pulled me away from religion, that is the strength that constituted my belief in God when I was a tiny kid that never really gained common sense till I was 11.

I am not eager for you to believe anything. I present what I personally think. You can keep thinking what you keep thinking, I doubt it will matter in our life time. WhiteSnake5000

Because there are those that arent selfish and care about the world they leave behind for others. And calling atheists a tool is himarious as a relgious person you're sucking up to God to get to heaven the same way Joe the copy guy does to get a promotion.

agent_ryu

...I'm not sure if you're talking to me, but I don't see anyone calling atheists "a tool".

I get the sense that you don't exactly hold many nice words for those who are religious, and to be perfectly honest I don't blame you one bit. A lot of religious people, and especially the most vocal religious people, are jerks at best, and downright dangerous at worst. But that's not religion; that's human failings. People also do terrible things in the name of getting rich, or for any number of stupid reasons.

I don't know if there's anything that I can say or do to convince you that I'm not "sucking up" to God, but I honestly am thoroughly and completely unconcerned with my eternal destiny after I die. If I go to eternal hellfire for not listening to the fundamentalists, then I did so without regret. When I praise God, I do so in thanks for what I see as the signs he has given me for how to conduct myself in life and how to be compassionate to my fellow man. Even if I knew for a fact that there was no afterlife, I would change nothing I am doing one bit, because acting in this way makes me perfectly happy in this life too.

You know even if God came to earth and did whatever it is he does (Flood, Burn make blind people unblind) I would only acknowledge his existence not worship him. Even then there is no proof that the God religions talke about is him or if it is the things they say arent what he said.

agent_ryu

God doesn't need anything from us. He already has everything he needs. Whatever he does, he does it for our benefit out of love, and similarly, the way in which he wishes so dearly for us to love him is through love of his creation. He is not some sort of dictator who wants us to bow down and submit; he is a loving parent who wants his children to be happy.