Why does everyone consider Cobain a genius?

He inspired an audience at a specific place and time. I'd imagine you'd have to be at that time and place to understand.LJS9502_basic

Besides being in probably the biggest rock band in the past 20 years, and creating incredible catchy songs that would make Lady Gaga jealous, he was an incredible talented musician. You don't hear lots of bands creating hit after hit after hit that appealed to such a wide audience. If thats not impressive then I dont know what is.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]No. His lyrics resonated with people. Looking at it from today's standpoint you probably don't see it. But his lyrics are what got him the notice. Time has a way of making us see things as they are today...and not as they were.Lonelynight

I don't know. I wouldn't think someone who made grunge music is a genius, I mean it's not really that great of music at all. His lyrics weren't that great at all, he couldn't really play guitar and he couldn't sing that well, I don't really know why hes so popular.

He destroyed hair music. Which would be the modern equivlent of some one destorying Boy Bands, sadly that did not happen.

I mean, I like Nirvana... but what makes him a genius? All of the lyrics of his "Nevermind" album don't make any sense to me. He's just saying words but they have no meaning. How that makes you a genius, I have no idea.

[QUOTE="needled24-7"]

he was an above average songwriter (this could be debated) and a less than average singer and guitarist. but he was considered great by many people trying to be nonconformists, who were actually very conforming.

heysharpshooter

This man speaks truth

Indeed. It's the usual conformist-paradox.
I still think he's overrated, didn't like Nirvana much anyway.

I mean, I like Nirvana... but what makes him a genius? All of the lyrics of his "Nevermind" album don't make any sense to me. He's just saying words but they have no meaning. How that makes you a genius, I have no idea.

BMD004

The same way some "artist" paint a square and it's suddenly modern art of geniusness.

I don't know. I wouldn't think someone who made grunge music is a genius, I mean it's not really that great of music at all. His lyrics weren't that great at all, he couldn't really play guitar and he couldn't sing that well, I don't really know why hes so popular.

joshrocks2245

Nirvana were already the biggest band on the planet at the time of his death, so clearly him dying is the only reason he's well known. As far as genius: there's more to genius than technical skill. There's thousands of guitarists out there that could play circles around Cobain, but can't write a worthwhile tune to save their life. That said I wouldn't call Cobain a "genius", but rather a musician who had skill enough for what he set out to do, who played with feeling, who knew how to write a hook, and who understood that simple and catchy resonates more with people than the ability to cram a thousand notes into a song.

worlock77

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

Nirvana were already the biggest band on the planet at the time of his death, so clearly him dying is the only reason he's well known. As far as genius: there's more to genius than technical skill. There's thousands of guitarists out there that could play circles around Cobain, but can't write a worthwhile tune to save their life. That said I wouldn't call Cobain a "genius", but rather a musician who had skill enough for what he set out to do, who played with feeling, who knew how to write a hook, and who understood that simple and catchy resonates more with people than the ability to cram a thousand notes into a song.

majoras_wrath

Have you ever heard "you know you're right"? Based on that one song... It was going to be great.

[QUOTE="heysharpshooter"]

[QUOTE="needled24-7"]

he was an above average songwriter (this could be debated) and a less than average singer and guitarist. but he was considered great by many people trying to be nonconformists, who were actually very conforming.

yourmajesty90

This man speaks truth

Indeed. It's the usual conformist-paradox.
I still think he's overrated, didn't like Nirvana much anyway.

Yes, I was such an anti-conformist as a toddler when I was rocking out to Nirvana...:roll:

I have to say, the irony in some people in this thread trying to say Nirvana fans know nothing about music is just too much. Anyone who knows ANYTHING about music would be able to see what was so great about Kurt and Nirvana.

They came out and blew up while hair metal was still popular. This would be like some death metal band becoming absolutely HUGE and getting all over the radio.

Why did this happen? Kurt was a hell of a writer that's why. Easily the best song-writer I have seen to this day.

But "oh his music was so simple!" and yes it was. Heres the thing, he took simple chords and created a freaking musical revolution by doing so. He never tried to be some Godly guitarist and I do believe they ended up bringing a fourth member on tour to play guitar towards the end.

There are so many bands out there full of technically skilled musicians who likely practice constantly who could never even DREAM of coming close to accomplishing as much as he did.

He simply had an incredible gift for writing music and playing it with a level of emotion that was out of this world.

he made simple rock music that was really popular with non-musician kids who thought White Snake was lame because their parents listened to them...

he made simple rock music that was really popular with non-musician kids who thought White Snake was lame because their parents listened to them...

heysharpshooter

He rocked hard and wrote amazing songs both from his guitar riffs and lyrically. Also playing powerchords doesn't take away any of a riffs greatness.

He was a good song writer, an Ok musician, but most importantly he helped start the end of hair metal and spoke to a growing demographic. Add in his untimely death and BAM, you've got yourself an idol. With all that being said, Alice in Chains>>Pearl Jam>>>>>>>>Nirvana. Bring it. HoolaHoopMan

He had a great voice and was able to write some music that whilst unconventional in structure and chord progression was still very accessible - no mean feat. Nirvana turned the music industry on its head - counter-culture became mainstream and everyone trawled the thrift shops looking for faux-grunge attire. Arguably he/they opened the door enabling other bands to walk through and acheive success they arguably would not have if Nirvana hadn't laid the foundation for them. And he's dead.

Nevermind is a great album, and it's a shame Nirvana didn't last a bit longer. I think some of the biterness towards Cobain here probably has a lot to do with his popularity. If Nirvana had became a cult band I doubt people would be taking the same attitude they are now in this topic. Also I doubt a lot of bands Nirvana influenced would have sounded as they do now. Regardless they made great music that was original for it's time, that's more than most artists achieve so I don't see why I shouldn't see him a genius.

Cobain is one of the most overrated and undeserving "icons" in pop culture history.

His fans are obsessive teeny-boppers who weren't even around when Nirvana was big.

Cobain is one of the most overrated and undeserving "icons" in pop culture history.

His fans are obsessive teeny-boppers who weren't even around when Nirvana was big.

DaJuicyMan

Hey we're not all teeny boppers, we're boppers of all ages.

Cobain is one of the most overrated and undeserving "icons" in pop culture history.

His fans are obsessive teeny-boppers who weren't even around when Nirvana was big.

DaJuicyMan

Cobain is one of the most overrated and undeserving "icons" in pop culture history.

His fans are obsessive teeny-boppers who weren't even around when Nirvana was big.

Cobain is one of the most overrated and undeserving "icons" in pop culture history.

His fans are obsessive teeny-boppers who weren't even around when Nirvana was big.

He was good I'll admit that, but glorifying him like that is just wrong. I'm not saying he wasn't a genius, but some fans think of him like a godlike figure of rock. In my opinion most of his fame came because of his premature deathDarthkaiser

[QUOTE="Darthkaiser"]He was good I'll admit that, but glorifying him like that is just wrong. I'm not saying he wasn't a genius, but some fans think of him like a godlike figure of rock. In my opinion most of his fame came because of his premature deathLJS9502_basic

True - I don't know how it went over there in the States, but in the UK initially it was all the common room boys at college who had Bleach, then Nevermind broke and everyone bought it. I remember watching their now infamous performance of Smells Like on Top Of The Pops in the UK here (genius) – completely out or sorts with music of that time. Everyone just went beserk for Nirvana – even the tabloids ran cringe worthy articles on 'how to dress grunge'. They became massive enough for it to became cool to not like them anyway...

I don't recall a whole lot of people saying Cobian is a genius.:?

Personally, I think Foo Fighters are the better band.

I mean, I'll admit he's a good lyricist. But in terms of musical compossing he was fairly average And he wasn't anything special guitar/vocal wise. Fairly average musician. So what makes him such a "genius" that people tend to consider him to be?

DmadFearmonger

nirvana and cobain are overrated indeed

You don't realize how good his voice is until you hear other people try to sing teen spirit. They simply can't do it.

He had a great voice and was able to write some music that whilst unconventional in structure and chord progression was still very accessible - no mean feat. Nirvana turned the music industry on its head - counter-culture became mainstream and everyone trawled the thrift shops looking for faux-grunge attire. Arguably he/they opened the door enabling other bands to walk through and acheive success they arguably would not have if Nirvana hadn't laid the foundation for them. And he's dead.

poptart

His music was simply trying to rip off the Pixies (as was almost every popular band in the Nineties and many still today). He just made it popular.

[QUOTE="poptart"]

He had a great voice and was able to write some music that whilst unconventional in structure and chord progression was still very accessible - no mean feat. Nirvana turned the music industry on its head - counter-culture became mainstream and everyone trawled the thrift shops looking for faux-grunge attire. Arguably he/they opened the door enabling other bands to walk through and acheive success they arguably would not have if Nirvana hadn't laid the foundation for them. And he's dead.

psychobrew

His music was simply trying to rip off the Pixies (as was almost every popular band in the Nineties and many still today). He just made it popular.

Rip off? Lol nooo, that was only Smells like... that he openly admitted trying to copy. There are numerous bands which he rated highly and no doubt was influenced by, and listening to Bleach it's hard to pinpoint a Pixies reference in there...

Cobain and "genius" in the same sentence...:lol:

He wrote angst-filled teen/tween lyrics which is fine and I can understand where he gets that respect from. As a guitarist though he was pretty much a joke. Anybody who plays guitar knows that pretty much.

[QUOTE="heysharpshooter"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] His legacy was secure before he died. As I said whether you like the music or not...you have to be in the time and place it hit. His lyrics fit in with the disaffected youth of that time period and THAT is why he has the legacy. Not his death.....LJS9502_basic

I doubt that very much... turing your life into a Greek Tragedy with some buckshot is a surefire way to immortality... especially if you are banging some crazy lady on the side all MacBeth style...

good point

Cobain and "genius" in the same sentence...:lol:

He wrote angst-filled teen/tween lyrics which is fine and I can understand where he gets that respect from. As a guitarist though he was pretty much a joke. Anybody who plays guitar knows that pretty much.

Saturos3091

Technically no, but that kind of misses the point. He took on a dirty fuzz box sound and play with a punk ethos - live they were awesome, and he was actually reasonably tight live, although thankfully not too tight or clean...

Cobain is one of the most overrated and undeserving "icons" in pop culture history.

His fans are obsessive teeny-boppers who weren't even around when Nirvana was big.

[QUOTE="LostProphetFLCL"]Yes, I was such an anti-conformist as a toddler when I was rocking out to Nirvana... I have to say, the irony in some people in this thread trying to say Nirvana fans know nothing about music is just too much. Anyone who knows ANYTHING about music would be able to see what was so great about Kurt and Nirvana. They came out and blew up while hair metal was still popular. This would be like some death metal band becoming absolutely HUGE and getting all over the radio. Why did this happen? Kurt was a hell of a writer that's why. Easily the best song-writer I have seen to this day. But "oh his music was so simple!" and yes it was. Heres the thing, he took simple chords and created a freaking musical revolution by doing so. He never tried to be some Godly guitarist and I do believe they ended up bringing a fourth member on tour to play guitar towards the end. There are so many bands out there full of technically skilled musicians who likely practice constantly who could never even DREAM of coming close to accomplishing as much as he did. He simply had an incredible gift for writing music and playing it with a level of emotion that was out of this world.Lonelynight

Well there is always an element of luck in anything of this nature.

I am sure there have been plenty of potentially great bands that nevern made it because of bad luck.

Still doesn't change the fact he managed to accomplish so much in such short time.

Oh and also, to those who are going on saying Nirvana wouldn't be remembered the way they are if Cobain hadn't died young, that's why we have gone on to forget bands like The Who and Aerosmith after they lost their touch...:roll:

Even had Nirvana lasted and put out crap records, they still already had themselves cemented in music history thanks to the albums they had already put out.

If Guns and Roses can be remembered for one legendary album, Nirvana would have surely been remembered fondly for the 3 great albums they had released.

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"][QUOTE="LostProphetFLCL"]Yes, I was such an anti-conformist as a toddler when I was rocking out to Nirvana... I have to say, the irony in some people in this thread trying to say Nirvana fans know nothing about music is just too much. Anyone who knows ANYTHING about music would be able to see what was so great about Kurt and Nirvana. They came out and blew up while hair metal was still popular. This would be like some death metal band becoming absolutely HUGE and getting all over the radio. Why did this happen? Kurt was a hell of a writer that's why. Easily the best song-writer I have seen to this day. But "oh his music was so simple!" and yes it was. Heres the thing, he took simple chords and created a freaking musical revolution by doing so. He never tried to be some Godly guitarist and I do believe they ended up bringing a fourth member on tour to play guitar towards the end. There are so many bands out there full of technically skilled musicians who likely practice constantly who could never even DREAM of coming close to accomplishing as much as he did. He simply had an incredible gift for writing music and playing it with a level of emotion that was out of this world.LostProphetFLCL

Well there is always an element of luck in anything of this nature.

I am sure there have been plenty of potentially great bands that nevern made it because of bad luck.

Still doesn't change the fact he managed to accomplish so much in such short time.

Oh and also, to those who are going on saying Nirvana wouldn't be remembered the way they are if Cobain hadn't died young, that's why we have gone on to forget bands like The Who and Aerosmith after they lost their touch...:roll:

Even had Nirvana lasted and put out crap records, they still already had themselves cemented in music history thanks to the albums they had already put out.

If Guns and Roses can be remembered for one legendary album, Nirvana would have surely been remembered fondly for the 3 great albums they had released.

[QUOTE="LostProphetFLCL"]

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"]Or maybe he was just lucky to be at the right place at the right time.jimmyjammer69

Well there is always an element of luck in anything of this nature.

I am sure there have been plenty of potentially great bands that nevern made it because of bad luck.

Still doesn't change the fact he managed to accomplish so much in such short time.

Oh and also, to those who are going on saying Nirvana wouldn't be remembered the way they are if Cobain hadn't died young, that's why we have gone on to forget bands like The Who and Aerosmith after they lost their touch...:roll:

Even had Nirvana lasted and put out crap records, they still already had themselves cemented in music history thanks to the albums they had already put out.

If Guns and Roses can be remembered for one legendary album, Nirvana would have surely been remembered fondly for the 3 great albums they had released.

How in the hell did you get that I was suggesting Axl was a genius?

Pay attention to the thread and you will see that there were a few people sugessting that the only reason Nirvana is remembered in the fond way they are is because of Kurt's death and that no one would care about the band had they continued on and eventually made some bad records.

I was pointing out how silly of an idea that was considering plenty of beloved bands have lived to see themselves go WAY downhill.

[QUOTE="jimmyjammer69"][QUOTE="LostProphetFLCL"]

Well there is always an element of luck in anything of this nature.

I am sure there have been plenty of potentially great bands that nevern made it because of bad luck.

Still doesn't change the fact he managed to accomplish so much in such short time.

Oh and also, to those who are going on saying Nirvana wouldn't be remembered the way they are if Cobain hadn't died young, that's why we have gone on to forget bands like The Who and Aerosmith after they lost their touch...:roll:

Even had Nirvana lasted and put out crap records, they still already had themselves cemented in music history thanks to the albums they had already put out.

If Guns and Roses can be remembered for one legendary album, Nirvana would have surely been remembered fondly for the 3 great albums they had released.

LostProphetFLCL

How in the hell did you get that I was suggesting Axl was a genius?

Pay attention to the thread and you will see that there were a few people sugessting that the only reason Nirvana is remembered in the fond way they are is because of Kurt's death and that no one would care about the band had they continued on and eventually made some bad records.

I was pointing out how silly of an idea that was considering plenty of beloved bands have lived to see themselves go WAY downhill.

I think you've got to separate the lasting success of a band from the iconic status of their frontman.

Axl is a laughing stock now precisely because he did continue beyond when he had something relevant to say/sing to fans. Jim Morrison is forever an hero because he died in his prime. That's just the way it goes. People don't stop to look at the crap Jim Morrison actually churned out in his lyrics in the light of now because they'd rather focus on the tortured artist who never lived to make an idiot of himself during his midlife crisis and what he meant socio-politically blah, blah.

Personally I don't doubt that had Axl died mid-success he'd be considered as much an icon as Kurt. What was unique about Cobain, and what I think attracted so many fans and made his face the ideal T-shirt image, was his refusal to stop shouting a rebellious anti-corporate message as Nirvana made themselves and their label rich. That's something very admirable, but I wouldn't call it genius.

Um, who?

Because he died young.