App Store For Modded Content - Good Idea Or Bad Idea?

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Rammone-X

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#1 Rammone-X
Member since 2008 • 187 Posts

Hello Everyone. This is actually my first blog post on Gamespot ever (well second actually, but first in the last 3 years) and so pardon me, for I might not be appropriately versed in blog paraphernalia.

If you bought Oblivion, Fallout, Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Skyrim, etc... for the PC, chances are you might have a couple of mods installed for those games on your machine. I for one can't play any of those games without some sort of modifications. Lets face it, mods are great. They are amazing, when done right and well. I'm not a modder per say (though I'm a developer) and so I may not be qualified to make that remark, and so I'm going to "go out on a limb" and say I'm speaking from the consumer's perspective; You know, the group of people who take the chance to download a mod and either spend more time with their PCs than their families as a result, or re-image their operating systems.

In any case, mods for PC games are great and they add extra replay value to a game. Ok, now I put together this blog post because I was on Skyrim Nexus this morning looking through the wonderful mods, and I was thinking to myself "How much effort does it take to efficiently mod a game?' That is to say add new content, redesign content, fix flaws, etc. Alot of work goes into modding? What can a modder gain other then the zeal from doing something they love? I appreciate modding so much that anytime a modder can make an absolutely fantastic mod and they have a link to donate, I absolutely make sure I do. I guess thats my way of saying thank you, and that is in no way disqualifying a thumbs up in a post, or an endorsement, etc...

let me structure some of my thoughts a little, I just re-read the post above and a lot of things started buzzing around in my mind...

(1) Would it be a good idea to develop some sort of paradigm where modders get compensated in some fashion, as App developers do in an app store or android market? Now first lets get things straight. Ultimately, I see the general consensusleaning towards publisher profitability with this, and costs incurred by mod patrons i.e. we the consumers, and with that I say this: I am not advocating this as much as I want people to pay for mods (don't know if that conveyed what I am saying). In other wordsI PREFER MODS TO BE FREE!(sorry, just thought I would make that clear for all trolls out there who take one sentence from a blog out of context and run with it)

For the sake of this blog post, and deliberation & discussion, I would love to know what you guys think. The thing is, other than the joy of doing what they love, what do modders gain from modding?

(2) Could this paradigm incorporate the game makers as well? It would make sense that the modders cannot profit from the content they produce as through some patenting/copyright laws, the idea and intellectual property isn't theirs to begin with; But picture this: What if, just what if there was a way to get a developer/publisher involved in a modding venture where they could get compensated for the mod as well. That is both the modder and publisher both get compensated. Say for example, they had a modding contest. They create a theme and premise for a mod (i.e. for Skyrim it could be a mod centered around becoming a Thalmor recruit) whoever can create the best content centered around that theme would get some sort of prize. Better yet, the developer/publisher (in this instance BethesdaSoft/Zenimax) would market the content as a DLC of some sort and share the profits from it with the modder.

These are just some examples of paradigms that to some might be absurd, but to others could hint on something. The whole point was to spur some discussion about this.

Lets face it, we love mods, part of the reason we love mods are stated above, but in particular, they make a game better, and they are free, but --

(Take away questions)

  • What motivates a modder to continue modding other than their passion for it?
  • How can it be encouraged even more within the gaming community. Passion might not be enough to spark or continue the modding tradition
  • Can publisher/developer-based monetary incentives encourage or ultimately ruin the modding experience and culture? Or (here's one for you he he!) can it maybe create a viable deviation from the dreaded "priced DLC boom we have reached at this point?" If people had the opportunity to create what content they want in a game i.e. that is to control what they play and how they play would they choose that rout or stick with what they are used to doing? A good example is social media, user propelled web content, etc. It isn't necessarily controlled, just moderated; and I think it's done pretty well. Modding encouraged & moderated by game makers, but propelled and some what controlled by the consumers could either be a win-win for both parties or an epic fail.
  • What models and paradigms could this new system alter positively/negatively, or change? (i.e. DLC business model)

These are just a little of the things I was thinking about when it came to modding. Hopefully this would spur some positive/negative opinions on the matter....

So, What do you think?

Rammone-X

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DanielDust

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#2 DanielDust
Member since 2007 • 15402 Posts
Most do it for fun and repeatedly state that they don't really want to gain anything from them, because they'd also have to support their mods if certain things were to happen (problems) and they'd have to do it ASAP, not when they want or have the time to. As I see it, you need free games to efficiently do this, something that Valve already started to implement for TF 2. There's also the problem of too many modders getting the wrong idea and start to publish trash filling such "apps" with nothing but mediocrity, let's face it, most mods out there suck, there are a lot of good mods because there's an obscene amount of terrible mods behind them, maybe somebody would have a good idea and a half decent implementation, they could take it further, make it awesome, but they decide to never work on that mod again once they get what they wanted, money (I'm not talking about the present modding scene, but an effect that selling certain mods would have) and the last problem, just because you ask for money, doesn't mean somebody or a group won't just pay a little each, get 1 copy of that mod and mod it into the game for free, for them and many others.
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heatfanman101

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#3 heatfanman101
Member since 2008 • 2877 Posts

Isn't Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm doing something very similar to this?

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#4 DanielDust
Member since 2007 • 15402 Posts

Isn't Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm doing something very similar to this?

heatfanman101

Yep, the community has the possibility to sell anything they make from maps to mods, but from what I saw the modding community doesn't seem that interested, they also can't make jaw dropping mods (see some vids malu made, the guy that made the WoW machinima tool, he has INSANE mods in the works, but they can only be played online through alternate means, not straight from the game, but the editor), because mods have a size limit, they always had in Blizz's game, that's why you don't see mods with lots of custom content, only altered content that is already in the game.

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Rammone-X

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#5 Rammone-X
Member since 2008 • 187 Posts

So the idea isn't as far-fetched as I thought. I never really played StarCraft (never really been much of an RTS fan) but I'll have to see what they've setup so far.

This whole Idea came about because I've really begun to realize that the statement "Gamers know what gamers want" is more accurate to me, than I would like to admit, as now I play a lot of moddable games solely because of their mods i.e. I sold my Skyrim on PS3 to buy it on PC just for the mods.

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James00715

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#6 James00715
Member since 2003 • 2484 Posts

You would have to convince Bethesda to go along with it. Currently, the terms of service prevent mod makers from charging for their mods. If they do it anyways, Bethesda can choose to sue them in court (usually send Cease & Desist first though). This hasn't happened yet most likely because no one has tried to charge for a Bethesda RPG mod yet. Something similar happened with WoW add-ons where developers made premium add-ons that were behind a paywall. One example was Carbonite which had a free "lite" version and a paid full version, but Blizzard changed their add-on rules and sent C&D letters to any developers that were breaking the new rules. The only way it could work is if the developer gets a piece of every sale. That can only happen in a closed system like Battle.net where you have to be logged in all the time.

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Rammone-X

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#7 Rammone-X
Member since 2008 • 187 Posts
Understood. Though, my opinion is developers are probably profiting off of mods indirectly... I'm refering to the possibility of increased sales based on the availability of mods. I think people are more inclined to buy a game with a high replay value, and modding adds to the replay value of a game to a certain degree. In my case, I bought a PC version of Skyrim just because it's huge mod base...
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lordlunch2

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#8 lordlunch2
Member since 2006 • 544 Posts
I'm a somewhat knowledgeable web developer and I'm always trying to think of cool new ideas and I have to say this one's actually pretty good. :) As stated before I don't think you could charge people for the mods, but you could make it to where the creators could require the viewer to HAVE to go to their website to download the mod instead of directly from the services. Thus, generating them ad revenue. Organization is something the modding world lacks for the most part. There are tons of mods for Crysis that I always see people looking for and can't find. As well as many other games. Good idea man, wish I had of thought of it lol....
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James00715

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#9 James00715
Member since 2003 • 2484 Posts

I'm a somewhat knowledgeable web developer and I'm always trying to think of cool new ideas and I have to say this one's actually pretty good. :) As stated before I don't think you could charge people for the mods, but you could make it to where the creators could require the viewer to HAVE to go to their website to download the mod instead of directly from the services. Thus, generating them ad revenue. Organization is something the modding world lacks for the most part. There are tons of mods for Crysis that I always see people looking for and can't find. As well as many other games. Good idea man, wish I had of thought of it lol....lordlunch2

Yeah, the website owner does have some options for income. They can create a premium account system with the typical features of faster downloads, no ads, etc. Some websites that do this have come up with profit sharing with the mod authors. I can't remember which site it was that did this. Besides donations, I think it's the only way mod authors can get money for their mods, but of course it's not reliable like a real pay per mod system is. Not enough that a mod author could do it for a living.

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Rammone-X

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#10 Rammone-X
Member since 2008 • 187 Posts

Check this out. This is a "Contribution Agreement" that Steam has pertaining to exactly what we've been talking about. I don't know if you guys remember, or know about this, but Bethesda made an announcement sometime ago about integrating modding and some Skyrim DLC components into Valve (I'm sketchy on the details but I believe thats what they pretty much said). Anyway, I was reading some forums and people were talking about this contribution agreement. Apparently, this will probably become a reality with Skyrims release of the creation kit.

Steam's WorkShop Contribution Agreement.

http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/workshoplegalagreement

Forum Discussing the Contribution Agreement

http://emmates.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=skyrim&thread=435&page=2

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Rammone-X

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#12 Rammone-X
Member since 2008 • 187 Posts

I'm a somewhat knowledgeable web developer and I'm always trying to think of cool new ideas and I have to say this one's actually pretty good. :) As stated before I don't think you could charge people for the mods, but you could make it to where the creators could require the viewer to HAVE to go to their website to download the mod instead of directly from the services. Thus, generating them ad revenue. Organization is something the modding world lacks for the most part. There are tons of mods for Crysis that I always see people looking for and can't find. As well as many other games. Good idea man, wish I had of thought of it lol....lordlunch2

I believe thats what the joint venture between Bethesda Soft and Valve (Steam) aims to accomplish