Steam is possibly the best thing about PC gaming right now.
Why do people despise steam?
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Double post would mean that I had the same exact post twice in a row. Regardless you can pretend you know me all you want doesn't make what I said any less true :)testfactor888Actually a double post means that you make two consecutive posts in a row whether the content was the same or not. As long as you have something different to say in each post it doesn't really bother me at all so carry on.
Why do I like Steam? Well the Steam games I've bought were retail and used Steamworks, so it's not the sales and ease of access (not until I stop being lazy and get my PayPal account working). I love the Steam program ... having my games listed neatly, access to servers and friends lists and all that sort of stuff.
[QUOTE="General_X"][QUOTE="uberpunage101"]The fact you are complaining about a SALE speaks volumes to me, especially when its almost universally agreed that Steam has some of the best and most frequent sales around. why Does it matter that there is a sale if the game isn't worth buying? And especially since that sale took the place of 2 other sales that could've been on 2 different days?After Monkey Island took up 2 days in the Lucas Arts Sale, I lost all faith in Steam.
uberpunage101
- That weekend happened to include International Talk Like a Pirate Day, so if you were expecting anything else to be the weekend deal, you must have been highly uninformed.
- Unlike mediocre games like Force Unleashed and Empire at War, Monkey Island actually made Lucasarts a big player in the industry. People used to praise Lucasarts as much for their adventure games as they did for their Star Wars games, so it's only fair that their best games take up half of the sale. I was actually disappointed that they only had two of their adventure games on sale, and was sick of seeing Star Wars stuff every day.
- Yes, the Monkey Island 1 Special Edition was a bit bland, but I don't see how anyone could say that Monkey Island 2 isn't worth $5. I bought it for $10, and would have gladly payed double that for it.
- It's a great sale for a series with a large fanbase. Why on earth are you complaining? Would you rather they cater to *your* specific tastes?
Anyway, back on topic, I dislike how Steam price fixes games in Australia, but I get so many cheap games from them that the ocassional expensive one doesn't really bother me - I just boycott them, or wait for a good sale on another site. Other than that, Steam is awesome.
[QUOTE="billbraskypwnsu"]I think uberpunage is ripping on Monkey island, NOT steam. I don't know many people who dislike steam. Mostly they just prefer consoles or prefer hard copies, it's not that steam is inherently bad, it's just something else is better in their opinion. testfactor888I think you are Uberpunage wrong. 2 accounts online at the same time with different IPs? Hard to pull off.
1. They screw their customers by not letting them play the games that they bought.
2. Tricking customers into beliving a game doesn't have drm, when it has one of the worst AKA securom.
3. They used to think 1 dollar is 1 euro.
4. They are monopolizing the digital distribution system.
etc
1. They screw their customers by not letting them play the games that they bought.
ucme4k
Whoever still games on Windows 98 are screwing themselves over.
Love the idea of the automatic updates and the chat system is very slick etc. I'm not really up on how it stops piracy. It seems like a good idea in practice. The most laughable complaint was when someone whined that there were "too many sales!"
I'll give this much to Steam and Valve: its a hell of a lot better than when it started. When it was first started when HL2 came out it was a nightmare. Nothing worked. Now its almost essential.
[QUOTE="testfactor888"][QUOTE="billbraskypwnsu"]I think uberpunage is ripping on Monkey island, NOT steam. I don't know many people who dislike steam. Mostly they just prefer consoles or prefer hard copies, it's not that steam is inherently bad, it's just something else is better in their opinion. uberpunage101I think you are Uberpunage wrong. 2 accounts online at the same time with different IPs? Hard to pull off. 1. No it isn't. 2. Gamespot doesn't display user IP addresses.
Points 1,2&4 are all ridiculous! 3 was an actual problem but they sorted that out.1. They screw their customers by not letting them play the games that they bought.
2. Tricking customers into beliving a game doesn't have drm, when it has one of the worst AKA securom.
3. They used to think 1 dollar is 1 euro.
4. They are monopolizing the digital distribution system.
etc
ucme4k
[QUOTE="ucme4k"]Points 1,2&4 are all ridiculous! 3 was an actual problem but they sorted that out. LOL? 3 is the only one that might not be considered an actual problem... 1,2 and 4 are big issues and proves that a company like valve doesn't give a **** about its customers. Oh wait.1. They screw their customers by not letting them play the games that they bought.
2. Tricking customers into beliving a game doesn't have drm, when it has one of the worst AKA securom.
3. They used to think 1 dollar is 1 euro.
4. They are monopolizing the digital distribution system.
etc
Daytona_178
Your a steam fanboy so no point saying anything, ignore my post. SorrySteam is possibly the best thing about PC gaming right now.
Daytona_178
I find it funny when people call companies like Valve "monopolizing". When they are just providing services a million times better than their competitors, its called being "successful".
These kids crack me up :lol:
...Because different people have different opinions? Doesn't make them automatically "Trolls" or "Haters" or whatever label you want to put on em, it makes them people with opinions... just like y'alls opinions that Steam is awesome. The idea that "Steam rules" or that Steam can't fail to be good is no different that the idea that Steam isn't good. Both sides are opinions and are 100% valid to the person presenting them. Once you start saying that people Anti-Steam "suck" or whatever, then you become what you are labeling (eg whining self entitled people [note, this is not pointed at any one person directly]). Believe it or not there are billions of people in the world, tons have internet access... and not everyone thinks that Steam is a "Gift from the Gods".carlosjuero
Ah, the voice of common sense. Good post, and I agree.
From my perspective, I don't hate Steam, and I have bought games via Steam in the past. However, I do have some reservations about it, and it currently doesn't fully fit with my needs.
For example, I do have a reasonable connection speed, but my current ISP has a cap on bandwidth, so I have to be careful how much I download in a month. My choice, I know, but I needed reliability of service in my location, more than unlimited bandwidth, because I work mostly from home. I'm sure many other people are in similar situations where they have to juggle issues regarding their net connection - and certainly there are still regions in the UK that cannot even get broadband services. So Steam is not an ideal solution for everyone.
Secondly, I'm not the only gamer in my household, and the sad truth is that Steam is a service focused largely on the 'individual' rather than 'families' within a household. When I buy a console game, or a PC game without DRM (or very loose DRM) my sons (and occasionally my wife) can also play it without issue. When I buy a game via Steam (or one that has to be tied to a Steam account), though, only I can play it, or I have to allow someone else access to my Steam account. Not an ideal situation - and indeed that would go against Steam's own Terms of Service. I'm certainly not going to buy the same game twice or three times on Steam just because other members of my family want to play the same game, because that would not be financially viable, and I view needless duplication as waste. So unfortunately the console version (if there is one) wins hands down every time. Families tend to share - and Steam (and indeed many other digital distribution services) just does not fit well with that. I wouldn't go out and buy three copies of a DVD movie or a music album. Why on earth should I do that for games? Just a ludicrous idea, no matter how much the PC game industry in general wants to move in that direction.
Lastly, as someone else mentioned, the fact that some games sold on Steam also use other forms of DRM, such as SecuROM, and may not indicate that fact on the game's page is also an issue, as I've had problems with SecuROM in the past and tend to avoid games that use it. As Steam is a 'service', not a product, absolute transparency and clarity is key to building a good relationship with the consumer base, and taking that a step further, there is really no reason, nowadays, why an EULA for a particular game cannot be read online prior to purchase through digital distributors.
These three factors currently make the Steam service my last choice when buying games, rather than the first choice. As for the Steam service itself, I think it's generally quite good, and never experienced any technical problems while using it. The sales offer very good value for money, but overpricing of many games (and disparity of pricing between regions) is still an issue, and something they should try to work harder on.
Steam to me is amazing.. But I can see one huge HUGE complaint about it.. And that is the poor Europeans that get immensely inflated costs for games.. sSubZerOo
You know Valve has to pay export taxes correct? Despite not exporting anything physical, selling any type of "goods or services" outside of the US as a US company, you are required to pay export taxes to the US government... Just FYI before you bash Steam as ripping off people in EU...
1. They screw their customers by not letting them play the games that they bought.
2. Tricking customers into beliving a game doesn't have drm, when it has one of the worst AKA securom.
3. They used to think 1 dollar is 1 euro.
4. They are monopolizing the digital distribution system.
etc
ucme4k
Wow cry some more.
1. Doesn't even make since? They drop support for Windows 98 and ME and that means they are screwing ALL of their customers out of EVERYTHING they have ever bought? Hardly. That is nonsense... And if you are on Windows 98, you can't even run anything available on Steam anyways for fudge sake.
2. Valve eliminates 90% of DRM... They never claimed to be DRM free, they said they will try to be... If a publisher won't let their game be sold without DRM, then Valve can either do what they say or not sell the game... And since Valve exists for the sole reason of selling games and making money... It is common sense what they will do. Do you even know what you are saying? There are about 40 games on Steam that download with DRM (out of thousands of games)... And 50% of them are Ubisoft and Games for Windows Live games...
3. This hasn't been an issue for a while? But obviously you wouldn't know that since it would go against your argument, so you just ignore it and pretend Valve is still at fault.
4. How is MW2 running on Steamworks a monopoly? Oh and once again there is a lot of nonsense... Ever heard of anti-trust laws? Yeah... Here in the United States, it is against the law to monopolize an industry... And you are HEAVILY fined if you get that far (ask Microsoft)... Valve has never even been accused or investigated for such a thing...
Did you just make up all of your points on the spot without looking into anything or what?
I LOVE STEAM
steam will always have my full support
Steam has saved PC gaming. Without it we wouldn't have all these awesome sales.
Steam is awesome, I'm no fanboy.
If you can't play a game, its not steam trying to stop you. If you truly think they are trying to stop you, go buy some common sense.
[QUOTE="General_X"][QUOTE="uberpunage101"]The fact you are complaining about a SALE speaks volumes to me, especially when its almost universally agreed that Steam has some of the best and most frequent sales around. why Does it matter that there is a sale if the game isn't worth buying? And especially since that sale took the place of 2 other sales that could've been on 2 different days?After Monkey Island took up 2 days in the Lucas Arts Sale, I lost all faith in Steam.
uberpunage101
I can't speak for everyone, but I ended up buying both of those games, glad they were on sale.
[QUOTE="ucme4k"]Points 1,2&4 are all ridiculous! 3 was an actual problem but they sorted that out.1. They screw their customers by not letting them play the games that they bought.
2. Tricking customers into beliving a game doesn't have drm, when it has one of the worst AKA securom.
3. They used to think 1 dollar is 1 euro.
4. They are monopolizing the digital distribution system.
etc
Daytona_178
Did they? I still see people complaining on the $1 = 1 euro topic on Steam forums.
[QUOTE="carlosjuero"]...Because different people have different opinions? Doesn't make them automatically "Trolls" or "Haters" or whatever label you want to put on em, it makes them people with opinions... just like y'alls opinions that Steam is awesome. The idea that "Steam rules" or that Steam can't fail to be good is no different that the idea that Steam isn't good. Both sides are opinions and are 100% valid to the person presenting them. Once you start saying that people Anti-Steam "suck" or whatever, then you become what you are labeling (eg whining self entitled people [note, this is not pointed at any one person directly]). Believe it or not there are billions of people in the world, tons have internet access... and not everyone thinks that Steam is a "Gift from the Gods".RobertBowen
Ah, the voice of common sense. Good post, and I agree.
From my perspective, I don't hate Steam, and I have bought games via Steam in the past. However, I do have some reservations about it, and it currently doesn't fully fit with my needs.
For example, I do have a reasonable connection speed, but my current ISP has a cap on bandwidth, so I have to be careful how much I download in a month. My choice, I know, but I needed reliability of service in my location, more than unlimited bandwidth, because I work mostly from home. I'm sure many other people are in similar situations where they have to juggle issues regarding their net connection - and certainly there are still regions in the UK that cannot even get broadband services. So Steam is not an ideal solution for everyone.
Secondly, I'm not the only gamer in my household, and the sad truth is that Steam is a service focused largely on the 'individual' rather than 'families' within a household. When I buy a console game, or a PC game without DRM (or very loose DRM) my sons (and occasionally my wife) can also play it without issue. When I buy a game via Steam (or one that has to be tied to a Steam account), though, only I can play it, or I have to allow someone else access to my Steam account. Not an ideal situation - and indeed that would go against Steam's own Terms of Service. I'm certainly not going to buy the same game twice or three times on Steam just because other members of my family want to play the same game, because that would not be financially viable, and I view needless duplication as waste. So unfortunately the console version (if there is one) wins hands down every time. Families tend to share - and Steam (and indeed many other digital distribution services) just does not fit well with that. I wouldn't go out and buy three copies of a DVD movie or a music album. Why on earth should I do that for games? Just a ludicrous idea, no matter how much the PC game industry in general wants to move in that direction.
Lastly, as someone else mentioned, the fact that some games sold on Steam also use other forms of DRM, such as SecuROM, and may not indicate that fact on the game's page is also an issue, as I've had problems with SecuROM in the past and tend to avoid games that use it. As Steam is a 'service', not a product, absolute transparency and clarity is key to building a good relationship with the consumer base, and taking that a step further, there is really no reason, nowadays, why an EULA for a particular game cannot be read online prior to purchase through digital distributors.
These three factors currently make the Steam service my last choice when buying games, rather than the first choice. As for the Steam service itself, I think it's generally quite good, and never experienced any technical problems while using it. The sales offer very good value for money, but overpricing of many games (and disparity of pricing between regions) is still an issue, and something they should try to work harder on.
Your point about having to have more then 1 paid for copy to share with the family is my only real complaint. I bought Metro 2033 and Just Cause 2 and sense they are both Steam locked I'll not be able to install them on my son's computer when I'm done with them. I even bought them on DVD cause I prefer to have hard copies and that will do no good. So when a game comes out that I have a choice to buy from them or get a disk that isn't Steam locked you'll know where I'll be. This is another reason I'm not into DD as a way of doing business into the future.
why do we have to have a thread about this twice a week?? I mean really guys, people are gonna hate, no matter what you say or do. It can be the best of the best and their still gonna b***h about it. I'm not trolling, but these threads are starting to get really old :?
[QUOTE="ucme4k"]
1. They screw their customers by not letting them play the games that they bought.
2. Tricking customers into beliving a game doesn't have drm, when it has one of the worst AKA securom.
3. They used to think 1 dollar is 1 euro.
4. They are monopolizing the digital distribution system.
etc
Buttons1990
Wow cry some more.
1. Doesn't even make since? They drop support for Windows 98 and ME and that means they are screwing ALL of their customers out of EVERYTHING they have ever bought? Hardly. That is nonsense... And if you are on Windows 98, you can't even run anything available on Steam anyways for fudge sake.
2. Valve eliminates 90% of DRM... They never claimed to be DRM free, they said they will try to be... If a publisher won't let their game be sold without DRM, then Valve can either do what they say or not sell the game... And since Valve exists for the sole reason of selling games and making money... It is common sense what they will do. Do you even know what you are saying? There are about 40 games on Steam that download with DRM (out of thousands of games)... And 50% of them are Ubisoft and Games for Windows Live games...
3. This hasn't been an issue for a while? But obviously you wouldn't know that since it would go against your argument, so you just ignore it and pretend Valve is still at fault.
4. How is MW2 running on Steamworks a monopoly? Oh and once again there is a lot of nonsense... Ever heard of anti-trust laws? Yeah... Here in the United States, it is against the law to monopolize an industry... And you are HEAVILY fined if you get that far (ask Microsoft)... Valve has never even been accused or investigated for such a thing...
Did you just make up all of your points on the spot without looking into anything or what?
I never cried i am just saying that there are reasons and all of those are valid. I like steam, i buy games there, but please all u steam fanboys denying everything like steam is a angel and has no problems and its perfect lolol
On point 1.
I never said they screwed all their customers they screwed a minority do u think they would screw a majority of customers? NO! That is not acting like a greedy business! A greedy business screws the minority for more money or to waste less or just to laugh at their face. My point is they didn't have to proibit all those 98 users from playing counter-strike or whatever between themselves after that update, they could have a older steam client just for them that wouldn't be supported, that way win/win valve wastes no money on 98 and they play games, but they prefered to screw their customers, i suspect this was arranged with microsoft since they would actually profit with this.
On point 2.
valve elimitinating 90% of drm? steam is DRM! So all of their games have drm! Please stick on the points or else u look more like a fanboy. Did steam find the cure for aids also? This also has to do with monopolizing since they force other digital distribuitors to use 3rd party drms like securom,tages etc. And apparently they even brainwashed their customers to thinking steam isn't a drm lolol
You probably mean good old games eliminates 90% of drm? Since all of their games are drm-free and 90% is closer to a 100% then 0%
On point 3.
LOL fallout 1 is 9.99 euros on europe and 9.99 dollars on america and there are numerous others. So next time search a little before talking.
On point 4.
LOL they force installation through steam, so yeah that is a step towards monopolizing.
clear sky is only on steam and there are other games.
Valve bribes companies to do that so they can get a greater share of the market and they are already almost monopolizing it.
Am i complaining ? NO. i am just saying they are not perfect, something that steam fanboys seem to be blind about. Every service or company has its problems and there are reasons to hate them, blizzard with starcraft 2 for example, look at all the 1 stars on the user reviews on amazon, u think that is a mere coincidence?. Do i hate steam? no, but there are reasons to hate them like i proved on my points.
[QUOTE="Buttons1990"]
[QUOTE="ucme4k"]
1. They screw their customers by not letting them play the games that they bought.
2. Tricking customers into beliving a game doesn't have drm, when it has one of the worst AKA securom.
3. They used to think 1 dollar is 1 euro.
4. They are monopolizing the digital distribution system.
etc
ucme4k
Wow cry some more.
1. Doesn't even make since? They drop support for Windows 98 and ME and that means they are screwing ALL of their customers out of EVERYTHING they have ever bought? Hardly. That is nonsense... And if you are on Windows 98, you can't even run anything available on Steam anyways for fudge sake.
2. Valve eliminates 90% of DRM... They never claimed to be DRM free, they said they will try to be... If a publisher won't let their game be sold without DRM, then Valve can either do what they say or not sell the game... And since Valve exists for the sole reason of selling games and making money... It is common sense what they will do. Do you even know what you are saying? There are about 40 games on Steam that download with DRM (out of thousands of games)... And 50% of them are Ubisoft and Games for Windows Live games...
3. This hasn't been an issue for a while? But obviously you wouldn't know that since it would go against your argument, so you just ignore it and pretend Valve is still at fault.
4. How is MW2 running on Steamworks a monopoly? Oh and once again there is a lot of nonsense... Ever heard of anti-trust laws? Yeah... Here in the United States, it is against the law to monopolize an industry... And you are HEAVILY fined if you get that far (ask Microsoft)... Valve has never even been accused or investigated for such a thing...
Did you just make up all of your points on the spot without looking into anything or what?
I never cried i am just saying that there are reasons and all of those are valid. I like steam, i buy games there, but please all u steam fanboys denying everything like steam is a angel and has no problems and its perfect lolol
On point 1.
I never said they screwed all their customers they screwed a minority do u think they would screw a majority of customers? NO! That is not acting like a greedy business! A greedy business screws the minority for more money or to waste less or just to laugh at their face. My point is they didn't have to proibit all those 98 users from playing counter-strike or whatever between themselves after that update, they could have a older steam client just for them that wouldn't be supported, that way win/win valve wastes no money on 98 and they play games, but they prefered to screw their customers, i suspect this was arranged with microsoft since they would actually profit with this.
On point 2.
valve elimitinating 90% of drm? steam is DRM! So all of their games have drm! Please stick on the points or else u look more like a fanboy. Did steam find the cure for aids also? This also has to do with monopolizing since they force other digital distribuitors to use 3rd party drms like securom,tages etc. And apparently they even brainwashed their customers to thinking steam isn't a drm lolol
You probably mean good old games eliminates 90% of drm? Since all of their games are drm-free and 90% is closer to a 100% then 0%
On point 3.
LOL fallout 1 is 9.99 euros on europe and 9.99 dollars on america and there are numerous others. So next time search a little before talking.
On point 4.
LOL they force installation through steam, so yeah that is a step towards monopolizing.
clear sky is only on steam and there are other games.
Valve bribes companies to do that so they can get a greater share of the market and they are already almost monopolizing it.
Am i complaining ? NO. i am just saying they are not perfect, something that steam fanboys seem to be blind about. Every service or company has its problems and there are reasons to hate them, blizzard with starcraft 2 for example, look at all the 1 stars on the user reviews on amazon, u think that is a mere coincidence?. Do i hate steam? no, but there are reasons to hate them like i proved on my points.
Jesus man... I would insult you but I would get moderated so I am just going to ignore you.
Can't say I love Steam. Of course I don't hate it either. The one problem I had so far with Steam was forgetting my old account and setting up a new one which made the Steam games unplayable. But, Steam worked with me to fix that problem. That's it. I wouldn't give Steam a marching band and a parade. But, I certainly don't hate it.
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