Trump tax plan discussion.

This garbage will pass, and a Democrat president in a few years will make a half assed attempt to get it removed. See what Obama did for the bush tax cuts...he half assed it. Both Republicans and Democrats are on the same side.

You need to completely purge all politicians who get even one nickle from corporate sources or rich individuals. That's the only way you will see change.

The Senate parliamentarian has ruled that Corker's trigger request cannot be included in the bill under reconciliation rules so they are changing the bill now - reportedly with the "trigger" automatically going into effect.

Link

@mattbbpl: Interesting, so instead of potential tax increases they will happen in six years regardless of the state of the economy. My guess is that they can just change their minds later with a new piece of legislation, but do you think that this will piss off the freedom caucus?

@Serraph105: That's a possibility, yes. I'm not sure what each of the two parties considers a bridge too far, but we'll see shortly.

@n64dd: No, it didn't.

Adjusted or "real" economic growth in the U.S. plummeted during Reagan's terms (and shortly after) before flattening out during those of H.W. and Clinton. Bush emulated Reaganomics, causing the greatest rescission in United States history. Under Obama's fiscal policy, economic growth has slowly climbed.

Stop bullshitting and just google a graph or something. "Trickle Down Economics" isn't a valid theory of economics nor has it ever worked. It's what they call "donor maintenance" in the Republican Party.

@wizard: You may want to give some kind of explanation as to how economic growth "plummeted" in the 80's, especially when common knowledge is not on your side. Reagan’s years in office saw per-capita GDP grow 23.4%. From 1982-84, unemployment fell more than 3%, inflation fell more than 7%, and corporate earnings were up 29%. I don't know anyone who doesn't see the 80's as anything other than a boom.

Bush's deregulation had a lot more in common with Clinton than it did with any Reagan policy. It was the Clinton signed Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act that was a precursor to the subprime mortgage crisis, and allowed the responsible entities to take on more risk due to being "too big to fail".

FYI, the finance industry donates to Democrats as much as Republicans.

They are now a single vote shy of passage.

Republican Senate efforts to secure support for an overhaul of the nation's tax system regained momentum Friday morning as GOP Sens. Ron Johnson and Steve Daines signaled their support for the bill.

That leaves Republican leaders to just bring one of Republican Sens. Susan Collins of Maine, Jeff Flake of Arizona and Bob Corker of Tennessee on board -- assuming no further changes upset senators who are already backing the bill.

I sincerely believe this will pass. Thanks for the continued updates matt.

@Serraph105: You're welcome. I enjoy following the nuts and bolts of big legislation like this because it provides a great window into how government really works in our system.

Apparently it will add 1 trillion to the deficit, as well.

I hate America

Coming from the arty who lambasted Obama and Dems for deficit mismanagement. They are all hypocrites.

Yeah, I would not be opposed to a riot in Washington.....

If fiscal policy like this bill keeps up for many years, you wont be seeing a riot in Washington, you will be seeing a revolution.

@Nick3306: Honestly we are over due for one brother

Now we're in for it. Kim Jong Un has a big problem with this bill.

https://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report/kim-jong-un-fears-that-gop-tax-bill-makes-his-plan-to-destroy-us-redundant

the goal here is to pass something, anything. not effectively and efficiently overhaul the tax system. GOP is absolutely STARVING for a legislative win at this point. they have no choice but to vote yes.

@mattbbpl: I've got this update :)

McConnell Says Republicans Have the Votes to Pass the Tax Bill

@Serraph105: Ugh. Are they still planning to hold the vote tonight?

So how many years from now until we have cries to cut spending due to these laughable tax cuts? I'm not sure about the GOP turnover on caring about the deficit at this point. I'm assuming they'll yoyo back to the other spectrum at some point.

Last Wednesday

Oh, and Tuesday two weeks ago.

@mattbbpl: I believe so yes.

Ah, so a tax raising trigger is out of the question but budget cuts won't be. How am I not surprised.

It's only fair. We have a spending problem, not a revenue problem.

@vl4d_l3nin:

Firstly, yes, "plummeted" is a strong word in isolation, I'm using it when comparing Reagan's economic years with pre-recession (1980) and post recession (1990) overall economic health. So inflation, GDP growth, and deficit all considered. There was a recession immediately after and leading up to when Reagan left office which can be directly attributed to Reagan. Economic growth under Reagan in the early 1980 (80-82) is largely an economic rebound from the 1980's recession with a response from Volker and the Fed by effectively combating inflation and then lowering interest rates phenomenally, thus increasing per capita spending. So Reagan's economic boom (middle/lower 1980's) was a post recessional bounce, some very smart financial moves by Volker, and the very temporary economic boom that comes from drastically lowering the highest marginal tax rate (much higher than it is today at a whopping 70%).

Reagan essentially took a great move by the Fed, a post-recession boom, a massive tax cut, and managed?

1. Turning the United States a complete 180 to the largest debtor in the world (fixed by H.W. and Clinton) 2. Essentially gifted a historic comeback in inflation which was left to the same late recession values it was at when he entered office (fixed two years after leaving by H.W.) 3. Sending the United States back into a small recession in 1990 because the "Reagan Boom" from Reaganomics isn't a sustainable way for long term healthy economics.

Similar to point (3), look at GDP growth percentiles now that the highest marginal rate has been almost halved in the last 30 years and see that the economic stability is fubar compared to the 1950-1970's that had the highest marginal tax rate. That and the widely accepted view that there are diminishing returns in economic growth when further lowering the highest marginal tax rate (or the cooperate tax now because the highest rate is already quite low) indicates a dead end for Reaganomics. Trump's tax plan will add 1.3 Trillion to the deficit, even worse growth in actual jobs than Reagan (who unlike Obama and Trump enjoyed a far, far, superior domestic job market). Even Reagan Era economists aren't supportive of this tax plan. It's fundamentally asinine and represents a rock bottom for so called fiscal conservatives.

TL;DR - Reaganomics hurt long term economic growth, wasted the most important factors of "Reagan Boom", turned the U.S. into a debt whore, and laid the foundation for long term economic woes in Bush and Trump who both look for a short term poorly planned economic boom.

Bush emulated Reagan tax cuts. Under Bush the highest marginal tax rate was the lowest of the 21st century, and in addition to his war and other tax cuts (but not on the lowest earners) the deficit skyrocketed to accommodate it. I have no idea what makes you believe otherwise.

GDP growth history indicates that a low deficit, high marginal tax rate, and large domestic job market yield the healthiest economy.

I was wondering why I hadn't heard about a final vote taking place yet, so I did a quick search to see what the holdup was.

They're still writing the thing, crossing out excerpts and writing additions in the margins.

after all the fits republicans had for YEARS over pelosi's "we have to pass it before we can see what's in it" quote they turn around and do the exact same fucking thing..

mind boggling.

Yeah, it's fucking astounding, and you know they're going to pass it anyways.

It was always politics.

Another win for The Don

Snapping necks and cashing checks

Maybe you guys will start to get it together with a possible run in 2024. Maybe even roll out Hillary again. Keep the faith, fellas.

Our government in action. This is the tax plan that was passed by the most admired Legislative body in the world, the model of developing and developed nations....writing in the margins of a bill that will affect the tax plan of the entire country.

Rich get richer, poor get poorer.

Looking forward to Recession 2.0.

F uck these people.

And it passed.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/12/01/senate-passes-huge-tax-cuts-after-last-minute-changes-conference-house-next/914701001/

It's intriguing how people who are for the (like 5% of) rich get picked in politics. It can't be that of all the candidates there isn't someone who represents more than like 5% of a country. But it still happens, even in my country.

Why do American politicians (and to some degree US citizens) seem so opposed against lowering the taxes for the poor, raising it for the rich? Or if we go even bolder, just a tax raise for the rich?

What a bizarre post.

Your taxes are going up while the rich and powerful continue to feed at the trough on your expense. And the country’s finances will go down the drain. Is that less important to you than “owning libruls”? This tax plan is extremely unpopular so I don’t see how it’s even a win for the Trump administration based off the platform he ran on. If anything, it’s a failure on that metric.

This tax plan and the proposed budget will hurt Trump supporters most. The so-called “coastal elites“ you people rail against won’t get anywhere near hit as hard as the people in middle and rural America.

The modern American conservative movement really is intellectually bankrupt, it’s no wonder they‘re the laughing stock of the country and the world.

Surprising it passed but good news.

@perfect_blue: You chose the losing side, champ.

Better luck next time

Us winners are too busy making America great again to get sucked into petty internet squabbles.

The Wall comes next. Maybe you guys can gather en masse with your pussyhats and shout at the sky or something while we begin construction.

Easy, Frank castle is a brainwashed idiot who belives anything his republican masters tell him

Yes taking from the poor to give to the rich is awesome. If only Robin Hood thought of that. Delusional. smh

I can't wait until the backlash grounds reps.

Thanks for the comfirmation that you’re just a troll with nothing of value to say.

Come on you know those hardworking rural and poor conservatives are concerned with the wealthy donors. How could they not be?

so when are they going to get rid of the socialist government welfare known as patent regulations and IP protections? I guess some type of welfare is acceptable as long as it benefits the rich, but other types of welfare that benefits the masses isn't acceptable. Welcome to the new world order.

@frank_castle: Your water bottle should be labeled trump base..............

@frank_castle said:

I genuinely pity the lost souls who worship this charlatan.

A big part of it is this, the creation of Grover Norquist (which is signed by most if not all Republican Senators):

This item stems from the Supply-Side theory of economics that was created during the Reagan administration, creating the idea that if the tax breaks go the richest individuals and business that money will be dispersed to the workers in a "trickle down" manner.

Supply-Side itself comes from something called the Laffer Curve, which is an unfounded tax measuring device.

@R3FURBISHED: And has never done what the GOP professes it does. So they know it's a lie but do it anyway or are they that stupid?

@R3FURBISHED said:

@horgen said:

@xdude85 said:

Rich get richer, poor get poorer.

Looking forward to Recession 2.0.

F uck these people.

Why do American politicians (and to some degree US citizens) seem so opposed against lowering the taxes for the poor, raising it for the rich? Or if we go even bolder, just a tax raise for the rich?

A big part of it is this, the creation of Grover Norquist (which is signed by most if not all Republican Senators):

This item stems from the Supply-Side theory of economics that was created during the Reagan administration, creating the idea that if the tax breaks go the richest individuals and business that money will be dispersed to the workers in a "trickle down" manner.

Supply-Side itself comes from something called the Laffer Curve, which is an unfounded tax measuring device.

Wow... Republicans have to sign that?