Kobe is NOT the best ...

[QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="-Halftime-"]

Chump was probly the wrong word lol.

What I'm saying is, even before this year, I felt that Nash was an overrated player. He definitely turned the Suns around but he is aging, doesn't play defense, and can't lead his team to a title. Which is why I'd rather have Billups, and possibly even Deron Williams over him. Younger, better defensive PG's.

badaboom187

Anyone would take a younger PG over an older one lol. Still nash is a better shooter then them. They each excell at different things.

i love Kobe though... he's amazing.. so no im not biased.

Oh course Kobe is not the best........Glibert Arenas is! Im still mad because of the loss to Cleveland, but next 2 games is in Washington. We should at least win at home.SuperAgentZero

......what? Arenas is the best player EVER.... are you serious or joking? because that riddiculous.

I just playing. Gilbert Arenas is my favorite player, but no the best........very close though. Anyway, the best player is LeBron James!!!SuperAgentZero

Stop trying to be funny, because you fail horribly.

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]MJ is the best ever. I know lots of people who say Kobe is the best even though he is not even close.Just_Osmo

No one on these forums has ever claimed that... so why post this thread where no one has said it?

Actually I hear that alot in real life and on these Boards

Just now:

Announcers - "Kobe reminds me a lot of Michael Jordan..."

;)

[QUOTE="Just_Osmo"]

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]MJ is the best ever. I know lots of people who say Kobe is the best even though he is not even close.tmac200913

No one on these forums has ever claimed that... so why post this thread where no one has said it?

Actually I hear that alot in real life and on these Boards

Can you find one post that backs up your claim that people have said that? And not anyone with under 400 posts because chances are they came in here once said something stupid and disapeared forever.

Just now:

Announcers - "Kobe reminds me a lot of Michael Jordan..."

;)

II-FBIsniper-II

Being reminded of soemone isnt the same as being better or the same as them.

[QUOTE="II-FBIsniper-II"]

Just now:

Announcers - "Kobe reminds me a lot of Michael Jordan..."

;)

Just_Osmo

Being reminded of soemone isnt the same as being better or the same as them.

[QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="II-FBIsniper-II"]

Just now:

Announcers - "Kobe reminds me a lot of Michael Jordan..."

;)

II-FBIsniper-II

Being reminded of soemone isnt the same as being better or the same as them.

No but you posted this in the Kobe is the best thread.. so it seemed liek you were posting it as evidence. Sorry if I was wrong.

[QUOTE="II-FBIsniper-II"][QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="II-FBIsniper-II"]

Just now:

Announcers - "Kobe reminds me a lot of Michael Jordan..."

;)

Just_Osmo

Being reminded of soemone isnt the same as being better or the same as them.

No but you posted this in the Kobe is the best thread.. so it seemed liek you were posting it as evidence. Sorry if I was wrong.

I thought it was funny that I was reading the posts comparing KB to MJ, and the announcers said that.

[QUOTE="SuperAgentZero"]I just playing. Gilbert Arenas is my favorite player, but no the best........very close though. Anyway, the best player is LeBron James!!!Darth_Revan_666

Stop trying to be funny, because you fail horribly.

Who said I was tying to be funny! IM DEAD SERIOUS!!!

[QUOTE="Darth_Revan_666"]

[QUOTE="SuperAgentZero"]I just playing. Gilbert Arenas is my favorite player, but no the best........very close though. Anyway, the best player is LeBron James!!!SuperAgentZero

Stop trying to be funny, because you fail horribly.

Who said I was tying to be funny! IM DEAD SERIOUS!!!

The best player ever in teh nba is me. Im seriousz

I never heard that. But he is the best active player.twopic58

[QUOTE="Solid_Link22"][QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="Solid_Link22"]

this is all I have to say

Just_Osmo

Fanboy much? As an unbiased fan of the NBA i can say hands down MJ is betetr then Kobe. Hence 6x NBA champ, 5x NBA MVP, 6x NBA FInals MVP, and 14x NBA All Star.

Kobe has what 2 rings 0 MVP's?

Kobe has 3 rings and I am not trying to argue. I just stated my personal opinion which many people disagree with and I really couldn't care much because Kobe himself said when compared to MJ he is just trying to be Kobe Bryant and nobody else. I do believe that Kobe is better though. Again, that is my personal opinion.

Your BIASED opinion... so it really doesn't count. I don't think anyone can be compared to Air Jordan. Even if they exceed him in stats andawards he will be considered the best ever... and thats my UNBIASED opinion.

Your "Unbiased Opinion" is just as Biased as the opinion you claim is biased. An opinion is an opinion. There is no cold hard fact/evidence that can state conclusively without a shadow of a doubt who is/isn't the greatest player in NBA history. Many argue for MJ, many argue for Wilt, many argue for Magic, Bird, Oscar Robertson and guess what, they all have a good case. MJ did his damage in the 90's after Magic, DR J, and Bird had retired or were a shadow of their former selves. MJ never won until Scottie came, never won without Phil as coach, and never won without his TEAM. MJ is one of the greatest, no doubt but to say that you are being unbiased when claiming he is the greatest is ridiculous. At the end of the day, many could have just as much of an argument to say Kobe is the greatest as you have right now to claim MJ is.

AR

[QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="Solid_Link22"][QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="Solid_Link22"]

this is all I have to say

scoobiesnackarf

Fanboy much? As an unbiased fan of the NBA i can say hands down MJ is betetr then Kobe. Hence 6x NBA champ, 5x NBA MVP, 6x NBA FInals MVP, and 14x NBA All Star.

Kobe has what 2 rings 0 MVP's?

Kobe has 3 rings and I am not trying to argue. I just stated my personal opinion which many people disagree with and I really couldn't care much because Kobe himself said when compared to MJ he is just trying to be Kobe Bryant and nobody else. I do believe that Kobe is better though. Again, that is my personal opinion.

Your BIASED opinion... so it really doesn't count. I don't think anyone can be compared to Air Jordan. Even if they exceed him in stats andawards he will be considered the best ever... and thats my UNBIASED opinion.

Your "Unbiased Opinion" is just as Biased as the opinion you claim is biased. An opinion is an opinion. There is no cold hard fact/evidence that can state conclusively without a shadow of a doubt who is/isn't the greatest player in NBA history. Many argue for MJ, many argue for Wilt, many argue for Magic, Bird, Oscar Robertson and guess what, they all have a good case. MJ did his damage in the 90's after Magic, DR J, and Bird had retired or were a shadow of their former selves. MJ never won until Scottie came, never won without Phil as coach, and never won without his TEAM. MJ is one of the greatest, no doubt but to say that you are being unbiased when claiming he is the greatest is ridiculous. At the end of the day, many could have just as much of an argument to say Kobe is the greatest as you have right now to claim MJ is.

AR

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons. Jordan is the best. His stats, awards, and acheivments put him above everyone else.

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons.

nVidiaGaMer

and how many times did he beat those pistons?

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons.

andyboiii

and how many times did he beat those pistons?

how many times has Kobe gotten to the finals without shaq?

[QUOTE="andyboiii"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons.

nVidiaGaMer

and how many times did he beat those pistons?

how many times has Kobe gotten to the finals without shaq?

None, just like MJ never went to the finals without Scottie. I suggest you research your NBA history because Wilt was statistically the most dominating player in the history of the game, up there with Babe Ruth for the most dominating one man athlete in history of sport. Bill Russell won 11 championships, the celts never won before him and after he retired didn't win for years. Shaq never won a championship without Kobe, had Penny when he went to the finals and had Dwayne when he won his other title. MJ not being a team player in the 80s and taking his team to the playoffs isn't the feat you make it out to be. Look at Lebron taking his team to the finals with hardly any role players. So once again, MJ is not the greatest player as that is a relative term. He can be your choice for the greatest but by no means does that solidify him as THE greatest.

Regarding MJ's stats, awards, and achievements making him the greatest, consider that MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to individual scoring records both seasonal and individual games. Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to rebounds (yes, different positions but stats none the less). Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Bill Russell in titles (MJ 6 in a 15 year career to Bill's 11 in 14 years). Achievements? Like the MVP? MJ as the MVP of a season cannot argue for his greatness over somebody else receiving the MVP in another season. How can you compare MJ's MVP season to say Wilt's, Bill Russells, Magic Johnson's? So no, the argument cannot be made that MJ is the greatest player ever by looking at these areas, all one can surmize is that he is one of the greatest.

AR

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"][QUOTE="andyboiii"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons.

scoobiesnackarf

and how many times did he beat those pistons?

how many times has Kobe gotten to the finals without shaq?

None, just like MJ never went to the finals without Scottie. I suggest you research your NBA history because Wilt was statistically the most dominating player in the history of the game, up there with Babe Ruth for the most dominating one man athlete in history of sport. Bill Russell won 11 championships, the celts never won before him and after he retired didn't win for years. Shaq never won a championship without Kobe, had Penny when he went to the finals and had Dwayne when he won his other title. MJ not being a team player in the 80s and taking his team to the playoffs isn't the feat you make it out to be. Look at Lebron taking his team to the finals with hardly any role players. So once again, MJ is not the greatest player as that is a relative term. He can be your choice for the greatest but by no means does that solidify him as THE greatest.

Regarding MJ's stats, awards, and achievements making him the greatest, consider that MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to individual scoring records both seasonal and individual games. Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to rebounds (yes, different positions but stats none the less). Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Bill Russell in titles (MJ 6 in a 15 year career to Bill's 11 in 14 years). Achievements? Like the MVP? MJ as the MVP of a season cannot argue for his greatness over somebody else receiving the MVP in another season. How can you compare MJ's MVP season to say Wilt's, Bill Russells, Magic Johnson's? So no, the argument cannot be made that MJ is the greatest player ever by looking at these areas, all one can surmize is that he is one of the greatest.

AR

The experts put MJ as the best ever. Wilt got second place for the centers (first place was Bill Russel).

This is what they had to say " Consider them in turn. Bill Russell was a great winner. Russel's Celtics won 11 titles in a 13-year span. He was also one of the best if not the best defender ever to play, a distinction for which there are no adequate statistics. He averaged 22.5 rebounds per game. But Bill Russell wasn't a great scorer, since he averaged just 15.1 points per game on 44% shooting."

"As great as Chamberlain was he was on championship teams only twice in fifteen years (1967 and 1972). He seemed to have difficulty mastering the balance of individual excellence and team play."

[QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"][QUOTE="andyboiii"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons.

nVidiaGaMer

and how many times did he beat those pistons?

how many times has Kobe gotten to the finals without shaq?

None, just like MJ never went to the finals without Scottie. I suggest you research your NBA history because Wilt was statistically the most dominating player in the history of the game, up there with Babe Ruth for the most dominating one man athlete in history of sport. Bill Russell won 11 championships, the celts never won before him and after he retired didn't win for years. Shaq never won a championship without Kobe, had Penny when he went to the finals and had Dwayne when he won his other title. MJ not being a team player in the 80s and taking his team to the playoffs isn't the feat you make it out to be. Look at Lebron taking his team to the finals with hardly any role players. So once again, MJ is not the greatest player as that is a relative term. He can be your choice for the greatest but by no means does that solidify him as THE greatest.

Regarding MJ's stats, awards, and achievements making him the greatest, consider that MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to individual scoring records both seasonal and individual games. Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to rebounds (yes, different positions but stats none the less). Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Bill Russell in titles (MJ 6 in a 15 year career to Bill's 11 in 14 years). Achievements? Like the MVP? MJ as the MVP of a season cannot argue for his greatness over somebody else receiving the MVP in another season. How can you compare MJ's MVP season to say Wilt's, Bill Russells, Magic Johnson's? So no, the argument cannot be made that MJ is the greatest player ever by looking at these areas, all one can surmize is that he is one of the greatest.

AR

The experts put MJ as the best ever. Wilt got second place for the centers (first place was Bill Russel).

This is what they had to say " Consider them in turn. Bill Russell was a great winner. Russel's Celtics won 11 titles in a 13-year span. He was also one of the best if not the best defender ever to play, a distinction for which there are no adequate statistics. He averaged 22.5 rebounds per game. But Bill Russell wasn't a great scorer, since he averaged just 15.1 points per game on 44% shooting."

"As great as Chamberlain was he was on championship teams only twice in fifteen years (1967 and 1972). He seemed to have difficulty mastering the balance of individual excellence and team play."

The experts... and that proves one is the best how? The experts have opinions as well... There isn't an all inclusive unity within the NBA experts of who is/isn't the greatest. If you can show me all experts (how do you define an expert?) state that MJ is the greatest than you might have a point, however you can't because they all don't agree. So again, we are back at the beginning. There is no GREATEST, there are simply individuals who are AMONG the greatest.

AR

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"][QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"][QUOTE="andyboiii"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons.

scoobiesnackarf

and how many times did he beat those pistons?

how many times has Kobe gotten to the finals without shaq?

None, just like MJ never went to the finals without Scottie. I suggest you research your NBA history because Wilt was statistically the most dominating player in the history of the game, up there with Babe Ruth for the most dominating one man athlete in history of sport. Bill Russell won 11 championships, the celts never won before him and after he retired didn't win for years. Shaq never won a championship without Kobe, had Penny when he went to the finals and had Dwayne when he won his other title. MJ not being a team player in the 80s and taking his team to the playoffs isn't the feat you make it out to be. Look at Lebron taking his team to the finals with hardly any role players. So once again, MJ is not the greatest player as that is a relative term. He can be your choice for the greatest but by no means does that solidify him as THE greatest.

Regarding MJ's stats, awards, and achievements making him the greatest, consider that MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to individual scoring records both seasonal and individual games. Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to rebounds (yes, different positions but stats none the less). Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Bill Russell in titles (MJ 6 in a 15 year career to Bill's 11 in 14 years). Achievements? Like the MVP? MJ as the MVP of a season cannot argue for his greatness over somebody else receiving the MVP in another season. How can you compare MJ's MVP season to say Wilt's, Bill Russells, Magic Johnson's? So no, the argument cannot be made that MJ is the greatest player ever by looking at these areas, all one can surmize is that he is one of the greatest.

AR

The experts put MJ as the best ever. Wilt got second place for the centers (first place was Bill Russel).

This is what they had to say " Consider them in turn. Bill Russell was a great winner. Russel's Celtics won 11 titles in a 13-year span. He was also one of the best if not the best defender ever to play, a distinction for which there are no adequate statistics. He averaged 22.5 rebounds per game. But Bill Russell wasn't a great scorer, since he averaged just 15.1 points per game on 44% shooting."

"As great as Chamberlain was he was on championship teams only twice in fifteen years (1967 and 1972). He seemed to have difficulty mastering the balance of individual excellence and team play."

The experts... and that proves one is the best how? The experts have opinions as well... There isn't an all inclusive unity within the NBA experts of who is/isn't the greatest. If you can show me all experts (how do you define an expert?) state that MJ is the greatest than you might have a point, however you can't because they all don't agree. So again, we are back at the beginning. There is no GREATEST, there are simply individuals who are AMONG the greatest.

AR

no you can't, but you certainly can group 10 who deserve the title of greatest. However, in terms of overall skill and achievements--both individual and team--, MJ is the best.

[QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"][QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"][QUOTE="andyboiii"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons.

dkhw

and how many times did he beat those pistons?

how many times has Kobe gotten to the finals without shaq?

None, just like MJ never went to the finals without Scottie. I suggest you research your NBA history because Wilt was statistically the most dominating player in the history of the game, up there with Babe Ruth for the most dominating one man athlete in history of sport. Bill Russell won 11 championships, the celts never won before him and after he retired didn't win for years. Shaq never won a championship without Kobe, had Penny when he went to the finals and had Dwayne when he won his other title. MJ not being a team player in the 80s and taking his team to the playoffs isn't the feat you make it out to be. Look at Lebron taking his team to the finals with hardly any role players. So once again, MJ is not the greatest player as that is a relative term. He can be your choice for the greatest but by no means does that solidify him as THE greatest.

Regarding MJ's stats, awards, and achievements making him the greatest, consider that MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to individual scoring records both seasonal and individual games. Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to rebounds (yes, different positions but stats none the less). Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Bill Russell in titles (MJ 6 in a 15 year career to Bill's 11 in 14 years). Achievements? Like the MVP? MJ as the MVP of a season cannot argue for his greatness over somebody else receiving the MVP in another season. How can you compare MJ's MVP season to say Wilt's, Bill Russells, Magic Johnson's? So no, the argument cannot be made that MJ is the greatest player ever by looking at these areas, all one can surmize is that he is one of the greatest.

AR

The experts put MJ as the best ever. Wilt got second place for the centers (first place was Bill Russel).

This is what they had to say " Consider them in turn. Bill Russell was a great winner. Russel's Celtics won 11 titles in a 13-year span. He was also one of the best if not the best defender ever to play, a distinction for which there are no adequate statistics. He averaged 22.5 rebounds per game. But Bill Russell wasn't a great scorer, since he averaged just 15.1 points per game on 44% shooting."

"As great as Chamberlain was he was on championship teams only twice in fifteen years (1967 and 1972). He seemed to have difficulty mastering the balance of individual excellence and team play."

The experts... and that proves one is the best how? The experts have opinions as well... There isn't an all inclusive unity within the NBA experts of who is/isn't the greatest. If you can show me all experts (how do you define an expert?) state that MJ is the greatest than you might have a point, however you can't because they all don't agree. So again, we are back at the beginning. There is no GREATEST, there are simply individuals who are AMONG the greatest.

AR

no you can't, but you certainly can group 10 who deserve the title of greatest. However, in terms of overall skill and achievements--both individual and team--, MJ is the best.

Again, in your opinion he is. That doesn't = fact. Someone who argues for Magic, Wilt, Kareem, Oscar Robertson have just as much reason and support for their pick as you have for yours.

AR

[QUOTE="tmac200913"][QUOTE="Just_Osmo"]

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]MJ is the best ever. I know lots of people who say Kobe is the best even though he is not even close.Just_Osmo

No one on these forums has ever claimed that... so why post this thread where no one has said it?

Actually I hear that alot in real life and on these Boards

Can you find one post that backs up your claim that people have said that? And not anyone with under 400 posts because chances are they came in here once said something stupid and disapeared forever.

Look up some posts for your self man its not hard to find Kobe fanboys.....Go Here and click a few pages back... Plus I hear it all tha time off tha Internet.

But Im not sayin Kobe is better than Jordan, Im just sayin Kobe fans say that alot

[QUOTE="dkhw"][QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"][QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"][QUOTE="andyboiii"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Michael Jordan was not a team player in the 80's even being a one man team he was able to get into the playoffs against the Pistons.

scoobiesnackarf

and how many times did he beat those pistons?

how many times has Kobe gotten to the finals without shaq?

None, just like MJ never went to the finals without Scottie. I suggest you research your NBA history because Wilt was statistically the most dominating player in the history of the game, up there with Babe Ruth for the most dominating one man athlete in history of sport. Bill Russell won 11 championships, the celts never won before him and after he retired didn't win for years. Shaq never won a championship without Kobe, had Penny when he went to the finals and had Dwayne when he won his other title. MJ not being a team player in the 80s and taking his team to the playoffs isn't the feat you make it out to be. Look at Lebron taking his team to the finals with hardly any role players. So once again, MJ is not the greatest player as that is a relative term. He can be your choice for the greatest but by no means does that solidify him as THE greatest.

Regarding MJ's stats, awards, and achievements making him the greatest, consider that MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to individual scoring records both seasonal and individual games. Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Wilt when it comes to rebounds (yes, different positions but stats none the less). Consider MJ doesn't hold a torch to Bill Russell in titles (MJ 6 in a 15 year career to Bill's 11 in 14 years). Achievements? Like the MVP? MJ as the MVP of a season cannot argue for his greatness over somebody else receiving the MVP in another season. How can you compare MJ's MVP season to say Wilt's, Bill Russells, Magic Johnson's? So no, the argument cannot be made that MJ is the greatest player ever by looking at these areas, all one can surmize is that he is one of the greatest.

AR

The experts put MJ as the best ever. Wilt got second place for the centers (first place was Bill Russel).

This is what they had to say " Consider them in turn. Bill Russell was a great winner. Russel's Celtics won 11 titles in a 13-year span. He was also one of the best if not the best defender ever to play, a distinction for which there are no adequate statistics. He averaged 22.5 rebounds per game. But Bill Russell wasn't a great scorer, since he averaged just 15.1 points per game on 44% shooting."

"As great as Chamberlain was he was on championship teams only twice in fifteen years (1967 and 1972). He seemed to have difficulty mastering the balance of individual excellence and team play."

The experts... and that proves one is the best how? The experts have opinions as well... There isn't an all inclusive unity within the NBA experts of who is/isn't the greatest. If you can show me all experts (how do you define an expert?) state that MJ is the greatest than you might have a point, however you can't because they all don't agree. So again, we are back at the beginning. There is no GREATEST, there are simply individuals who are AMONG the greatest.

AR

no you can't, but you certainly can group 10 who deserve the title of greatest. However, in terms of overall skill and achievements--both individual and team--, MJ is the best.

Again, in your opinion he is. That doesn't = fact. Someone who argues for Magic, Wilt, Kareem, Oscar Robertson have just as much reason and support for their pick as you have for yours.

AR

Based on awards and acheivements MJ is the best ever. He has the most ppg avg. at 30+ which is 2 points higher then Wilt. He has several more awards, accomplishments, and records then anyone else and because of that he is the best.

Based on awards and acheivements MJ is the best ever. He has the most ppg avg. at 30+ which is 2 points higher then Wilt. He has several more awards, accomplishments, and records then anyone else and because of that he is the best.

LOL, still not understanding that there is no "BEST", that that term is relative. There is no conclusive way to judge what that means. MJ averaged 30.1 ppg for his career

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01.html

Wilt Chamberlain averaged 30.1 ppg for his career

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/chambwi01.html

Wilt holds many more records than MJ. Wilts rebounds outdid Michael. Michael has only about 1,000 more assists for his career as a shooting guard as Wilt has as a center. Wilt has 4 MVP's, Michael has 5. Bill Russell has 5 MVP's and 11 rings to Michael's 6. Magic's numbers all around match up to MJ and he had 3 MVP's and 5 rings. Oscar averaged a triple double for his career and his assists are more than Michael as well as more rebounds. They all have mvps, all won championships, all scored a great amount of points. Michael was a great defensive player as was Russell and Wilt (blocks weren't recorded at the time). Again, there is no conclusive way to prove your argument that MJ is the greatest.

Wilts Records

100-POINT GAME - March 2, 1962, vs. New York at Hershey, Pa.

• 100 - holds single-game records for most points
• 59 - most points in one half
• 36 - most field goals made
• 22 - most field goals made in one half
• 63 - most field goals attempted
• 37 - most field goals attempted in one half
• 21 - most field goals attempted in one quarter
• 28 - shares single-game record for most free throws made

NBA REGULAR-SEASON RECORDS

Career

• 118 - most games with 50 or more points
• 9 - most seasons leading league in field goal percentage
• 23,924 - most rebounds
• 22.9 - highest rebounds-per-game average (minimum 400 games)
• 7 - shares career record for most consecutive seasons leading league in scoring (1959-60 through 1965-66)

Single-Season

• 45 - holds single-season records for most games with 50 or more points (1962)
• 3,882 - most minutes played (1962)
• 4,029 - most points (1962)
• 50.4 - highest points-per-game average (1962)
• 2,707 - most points by a rookie (1960)
• 1,597 - most field goals made (1962)
• 35 - most consecutive field goals made (February 17 through February 28, 1967)
• 3,159 - most field goals attempted (1962)
• .727 - highest field goal percentage (1973)
• 1,363 - most free throws attempted (1962)
• 2,149 - most rebounds (1961)
• 1,941 - most rebounds by a rookie (1960)
• 27.2 - highest rebounds-per-game average (1961)

Single Game
* record set on March 2, 1962, vs. New York at Hershey, Pa.

• *100 - most points
• *59 - most points in one half
• *36 - most field goals made
• *22 - most field goals made in one half
• *63 - most field goals attempted
• *37 - most field goals attempted in one half
• *21 - most field goals attempted in one quarter
• 58 - most points by a rookie (January 25, 1960, vs. Detroit)
• 1.000 - highest field goal percentage (minimum 15 made)
  (15-for-15, January 20, 1967, vs. Los Angeles;
  18-for-18, February 24, 1967, vs. Baltimore; and
  16-for-16, March 19, 1967, vs. Baltimore)
• 55 - most rebounds (November 24, 1960, vs. Boston)
• 45 - most rebounds by a rookie (February 6, 1960, vs. Syracuse)
• *28 - shares single-game record for most free throws made (March 2, 1962, vs. New York at Hershey, Pa.)

Points
* record set on March 2, 1962, vs. New York at Hershey, Pa.

• 118 - holds career records for most games with 50 or more points
• 7 - shares career records for most consecutive seasons leading league in scoring (1959-60 through 1965-66)
• 45 - most games with 50 or more points (1962)
• 4,029 - most points, single season (1962)
• 50.4 - highest points-per-game average (1962)
• 2,707 - most points by a rookie (1960)
• *100 - most points, game
• *59 - most points in one half
• *36 - most field goals made
• *22 - most field goals made in one half
• *63 - most field goals attempted
• *37 - most field goals attempted in one half
• *21 - most field goals attempted in one quarter
• 58 - most points by a rookie (January 25, 1960, vs. Detroit)

Rebounds

• 23,924 - most rebounds, career
• 22.9 - highest rebounds-per-game average (minimum 400 games)
• 2,149 - most rebounds—2,149 (1961)
• 1,941 - most rebounds by a rookie (1960)
• 27.2 - highest rebounds-per-game average (1961)
• 55 - most rebounds (November 24, 1960, vs. Boston)
• 45 - most rebounds by a rookie (February 6, 1960, vs. Syracuse)

HONORS

• NBA Most Valuable Player (1960, 1966, 1967, 1968)
• NBA Rookie of the Year (1960)
• All-NBA first team (1960, 1961, 1962, 1964, 1966, 1967, 1968)
• All-NBA second team (1963, 1965, 1972)
• NBA All-Defensive first team (1972, 1973)

NBA PLAYOFF RECORD

• NBA Finals Most Valuable Player (1972)
• 26 - most rebounds in one half (April 16, 1967, vs. San Francisco)
• 32.0 - holds single-series playoff record for highest rebounds-per-game average (1967)
• 41 - holds single-game playoff records for most rebounds (April 5, 1967, vs. Boston)
• 26 - most rebounds in one half (April 16, 1967, vs. San Francisco)
• 53 - most points by a rookie (March 14, 1960, vs. Syracuse)
• 24 - shares single-game playoff records for most field goals made (March 14, 1960, vs. Syracuse)
• 48 - most field goals attempted (March 22, 1962, vs. Syracuse)
• 25 - most field goals attempted in one half (March 22, 1962, vs. Syracuse)

NBA ALL-STAR GAME RECORD

• NBA All-Star Game Most Valuable Player (1960)
• 197 - holds career record for most rebounds
• 42 - holds single-game records for most points (1962)
• 16 - most free throws attempted (1962)
• 10 - most field goals made in one half (1962)
• 17 - shares single-game records for most field goals made (1962)
• 16 - most rebounds in one half (1960)

I am trying to find MJ's records and from what I have seen, they are far less.

AR

scoobiesnackarf

Based on awards and acheivements MJ is the best ever. He has the most ppg avg. at 30+ which is 2 points higher then Wilt. He has several more awards, accomplishments, and records then anyone else and because of that he is the best.

LOL, still not understanding that there is no "BEST", that that term is relative. There is no conclusive way to judge what that means. MJ averaged 30.1 ppg for his career

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01.html

Wilt Chamberlain averaged 30.1 ppg for his career

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/chambwi01.html

Wilts rebounds outdid Michael. Michael has only about 1,000 more assists for his career as a shooting guard as Wilt has as a center. Wilt has 4 MVP's, Michael has 5. Bill Russell has 5 MVP's and 11 rings to Michael's 6. Magic's numbers all around match up to MJ and he had 3 MVP's and 5 rings. Oscar averaged a triple double for his career and his assists are more than Michael as well as more rebounds. They all have mvps, all won championships, all scored a great amount of points. Michael was a great defensive player as was Russell and Wilt (blocks weren't recorded at the time). Again, there is no conclusive way to prove your argument that MJ is the greatest.

AR

Michaels playoff average is 32. The best record ever is 72-10 only because of MJ. If you were to replace MJ with Magic, Wilt, or Russel, could the Bulls still of been as good? NO. Michael tops everyone because he had no weaknesses like any other players and he made his teammates better a part that Wilt and Oscar were lacking.

Wilt also played worse in the playoff averaging a mere 22.5 points per game.

No other player is known for being the greatest worldwide like Michael Jordan. His name on the statue in Chicago has engraved on it all of his awards and it also says the best player ever (quite possibly the greatest athlete in all of sports history).

Lets see anyone in sports go into retirement like Michael did and then come back stronger then ever ... its unheard of.

Michaels playoff average is 32. The best record ever is 72-10 only because of MJ. If you were to replace MJ with Magic, Wilt, or Russel, could the Bulls still of been as good? NO. Michael tops everyone because he had no weaknesses like any other players and he made his teammates better a part that Wilt and Oscar were lacking

nVidiaGaMer

please tell me you're kidding. Oscar Robertson used to average 28 points 10 rebounds and 9 assist, again how did he not make his teammates better?

[QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"]nVidiaGaMer

Based on awards and acheivements MJ is the best ever. He has the most ppg avg. at 30+ which is 2 points higher then Wilt. He has several more awards, accomplishments, and records then anyone else and because of that he is the best.

LOL, still not understanding that there is no "BEST", that that term is relative. There is no conclusive way to judge what that means. MJ averaged 30.1 ppg for his career

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01.html

Wilt Chamberlain averaged 30.1 ppg for his career

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/chambwi01.html

Wilts rebounds outdid Michael. Michael has only about 1,000 more assists for his career as a shooting guard as Wilt has as a center. Wilt has 4 MVP's, Michael has 5. Bill Russell has 5 MVP's and 11 rings to Michael's 6. Magic's numbers all around match up to MJ and he had 3 MVP's and 5 rings. Oscar averaged a triple double for his career and his assists are more than Michael as well as more rebounds. They all have mvps, all won championships, all scored a great amount of points. Michael was a great defensive player as was Russell and Wilt (blocks weren't recorded at the time). Again, there is no conclusive way to prove your argument that MJ is the greatest.

AR

Michaels playoff average is 32. The best record ever is 72-10 only because of MJ. If you were to replace MJ with Magic, Wilt, or Russel, could the Bulls still of been as good? NO. Michael tops everyone because he had no weaknesses like any other players and he made his teammates better a part that Wilt and Oscar were lacking.

Wilt also played worse in the playoff averaging a mere 22.5 points per game.

No other player is known for being the greatest worldwide like Michael Jordan. His name on the statue in Chicago has engraved on it all of his awards and it also says the best player ever (quite possibly the greatest athlete in all of sports history).

Lets see anyone in sports go into retirement like Michael did and then come back stronger then ever ... its unheard of.

LOL 72-10 only because of MJ? Hmm, I guess Scottie, Dennis Rodman, Harper, etc... didn't play any role in that. Regarding replacing a player, well lets see... if you replace Bill Russell with MJ, they don't win at all since Russell was the center and gave them exactly what they needed, a shot blocker rebounder who would get the fast break going. Try to replace wilt with MJ, guess what, not good. Wilt rebounded, blocked, scored as a center. Get MJ instead of Magic, not good. Magic as a PG got the ball to his teammates, scored when needed. etc... horrible argument. MJ had no weaknesses? Neither did Oscar Robertson, neither does Kobe, neither does Lebron, neither did Larry Bird, neither did Magic. Oscar didn't make his team mates better? Heh. Wilt didn' tmake his team mates better? Heh. Your total lack of education regarding the game and its history proves my point for me. Thanks.

AR

Once again the proof is in. If you were to replace MJ with any other player then that player would not be capable of leading the Bulls.

Also lets see anyone retire and come back better then ever ... only Michael did.

Michael Jordan is the best.

90% of people agree with this.

Majority rules.

END OF TOPIC. FINAL POST.

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Lets see anyone in sports go into retirement like Michael did and then come back stronger then ever ... its unheard of.

scoobiesnackarf

LOL 72-10 only because of MJ? Hmm, I guess Scottie, Dennis Rodman, Harper, etc... didn't play any role in that. Regarding replacing a player, well lets see... if you replace Bill Russell with MJ, they don't win at all since Russell was the center and gave them exactly what they needed, a shot blocker rebounder who would get the fast break going. Try to replace wilt with MJ, guess what, not good. Wilt rebounded, blocked, scored as a center. Get MJ instead of Magic, not good. Magic as a PG got the ball to his teammates, scored when needed. etc... horrible argument. MJ had no weaknesses? Neither did Oscar Robertson, neither does Kobe, neither does Lebron, neither did Larry Bird, neither did Magic. Oscar didn't make his team mates better? Heh. Wilt didn' tmake his team mates better? Heh. Your total lack of education regarding the game and its history proves my point for me. Thanks.

AR

I approve of this ownage

nVidia learn some basketball knowledge

/thread

This post is like beating a dead horse. Nobody is getting there point across. In my opinion Jordan is the best ever, and i'm sure if you asked every single person in the world who is the best, Jordan would get the majority of the votes, but once again it's ALL OPINION. Nobody can ever say with 100% certainty who the best player is in any sport. Hell if i wanted to i could say Scottie Pippen is the best ever. It would just be opinion. Everyone is entitled to their own.sixringz1

EXACTLY!

Once again the proof is in. If you were to replace MJ with any other player then that player would not be capable of leading the Bulls.

Also lets see anyone retire and come back better then ever ... only Michael did.

Michael Jordan is the best.

90% of people agree with this.

Majority rules.

END OF TOPIC. FINAL POST.

nVidiaGaMer

LOL!!! Dude, you are acting like a little kid who brought his basketball to school, got whooped in a game and then said "THATS IT, I WIN, I AM TAKING MY BALL HOME!!!"

AR

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Once again the proof is in. If you were to replace MJ with any other player then that player would not be capable of leading the Bulls.

Also lets see anyone retire and come back better then ever ... only Michael did.

Michael Jordan is the best.

90% of people agree with this.

Majority rules.

END OF TOPIC. FINAL POST.

scoobiesnackarf

LOL!!! Dude, you are acting like a little kid who brought his basketball to school, got whooped in a game and then said "THATS IT, I WIN, I AM TAKING MY BALL HOME!!!"

AR

even if it sounded childish the post was correct. The majority agree MJ is the best all time.

it saddens me to see the legacy of one of the greatest players is fostering a torrent of ignorant fans that are disrespectful of other equally great players.

[QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Once again the proof is in. If you were to replace MJ with any other player then that player would not be capable of leading the Bulls.

Also lets see anyone retire and come back better then ever ... only Michael did.

Michael Jordan is the best.

90% of people agree with this.

Majority rules.

END OF TOPIC. FINAL POST.

Just_Osmo

LOL!!! Dude, you are acting like a little kid who brought his basketball to school, got whooped in a game and then said "THATS IT, I WIN, I AM TAKING MY BALL HOME!!!"

AR

even if it sounded childish the post was correct. The majority agree MJ is the best all time.

And that means what? I see you fail to grasp the concept as well... No one can say who is the greatest since its a relative term... where as 18-1 isn't ;)

AR

[QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Once again the proof is in. If you were to replace MJ with any other player then that player would not be capable of leading the Bulls.

Also lets see anyone retire and come back better then ever ... only Michael did.

Michael Jordan is the best.

90% of people agree with this.

Majority rules.

END OF TOPIC. FINAL POST.

scoobiesnackarf

LOL!!! Dude, you are acting like a little kid who brought his basketball to school, got whooped in a game and then said "THATS IT, I WIN, I AM TAKING MY BALL HOME!!!"

AR

even if it sounded childish the post was correct. The majority agree MJ is the best all time.

And that means what? I see you fail to grasp the concept as well... No one can say who is the greatest since its a relative term... where as 18-1 isn't ;)

AR

And you fail to grasp the concept of how the majority of peoples opinions hold him as the greatest. Which was my point, that even though his post was childish it was true. not that he is the greatest ever, but that the majority of NBA fans agree that he is the best ever. Not that it means anything, its all opinions.

[QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Once again the proof is in. If you were to replace MJ with any other player then that player would not be capable of leading the Bulls.

Also lets see anyone retire and come back better then ever ... only Michael did.

Michael Jordan is the best.

90% of people agree with this.

Majority rules.

END OF TOPIC. FINAL POST.

Just_Osmo

LOL!!! Dude, you are acting like a little kid who brought his basketball to school, got whooped in a game and then said "THATS IT, I WIN, I AM TAKING MY BALL HOME!!!"

AR

even if it sounded childish the post was correct. The majority agree MJ is the best all time.

And that means what? I see you fail to grasp the concept as well... No one can say who is the greatest since its a relative term... where as 18-1 isn't ;)

AR

And you fail to grasp the concept of how the majority of peoples opinions hold him as the greatest. Which was my point, that even though his post was childish it was true. not that he is the greatest ever, but that the majority of NBA fans agree that he is the best ever. Not that it means anything, its all opinions.

I still wouldn't agree that the majority of NBA fans agree he is the best ever considering there are possibly billions of fans around the world. While a great amount do view him as the greatest that is true. And yes, it is all opinions which is the only point that I was trying to make.

AR

[QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="Just_Osmo"][QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

Once again the proof is in. If you were to replace MJ with any other player then that player would not be capable of leading the Bulls.

Also lets see anyone retire and come back better then ever ... only Michael did.

Michael Jordan is the best.

90% of people agree with this.

Majority rules.

END OF TOPIC. FINAL POST.

scoobiesnackarf

LOL!!! Dude, you are acting like a little kid who brought his basketball to school, got whooped in a game and then said "THATS IT, I WIN, I AM TAKING MY BALL HOME!!!"

AR

even if it sounded childish the post was correct. The majority agree MJ is the best all time.

And that means what? I see you fail to grasp the concept as well... No one can say who is the greatest since its a relative term... where as 18-1 isn't ;)

AR

And you fail to grasp the concept of how the majority of peoples opinions hold him as the greatest. Which was my point, that even though his post was childish it was true. not that he is the greatest ever, but that the majority of NBA fans agree that he is the best ever. Not that it means anything, its all opinions.

I still wouldn't agree that the majority of NBA fans agree he is the best ever considering there are possibly billions of fans around the world. While a great amount do view him as the greatest that is true. And yes, it is all opinions which is the only point that I was trying to make.

AR

Majority doesnt mean 90%. It can be split up between many players and MJ may only have 30% of the votes, but that would still be the largest number. Which would be the Majority.

IE: 20% Voted Bird 20% vote Magic 25% vote Wilt 35% Vote MJ

MJ has the majority, it may not be overwhelming but it is the MAJORITY.

(those numbers were purely fictional to get my point across)

LOL I stopped taking that guy seriously when he said Oscar Robertson didn't make his teammates better.

I agree that MJ is the best ever but c'mon. Saying something like that about the Big O just shows how much some people don't know about basketball.

what the boston fanboy said, no one called him the best player ever. Yea he's good, but not the best ever.mohfrontline

I'm not a boston fanboy. Im a boston SUPERFAN.

Kobe is the best active player and will pass up Jordan statistically. Jordan however is the best player ever to put a jersey on the NBA. Besides kobe's best season still isnt as good as jordan's best season, plus Jordan does have 6 rings and Kobe only has 3.

Right now? Kobe is the best, not even Lebron can shoot and drive the paint like Kobe.