Apparently Xbox Live's New Terms of Service MUST be accepted; no opting out

Turns out that option doesn't exist, according to a statement released to Kotaku. Users must agree to the new Terms of Service, and the ability to opt-out only relates future Terms of Service agreements.

That's a huge difference.

"Users must agree to the new clause to the Terms of Use in order to continue using Xbox LIVE," said the company. "Changes to the Terms of Use are designed to ensure that our customers have an easy way to file a dispute without requiring formal legal action."

As previously discussed, there was supposed to be a way for US consumers to opt-out by writing a letter to Microsoft.
That no longer is possible since that clause references to future updates and not this one.
You waiver all your legal rights goodbye or be forced to stop using XBL at all. ****c ####move by Microsoft, as usual.

Source: Kotaku, GiantBomb
http://kotaku.com/5865797/now-microsoft-wants-to-stop-you-taking-them-to-court

That is marginally worst that Sony's agreement (marginally in that you do have an opt out for Sony but seriously, how many do you expect to use it). DerekLoffin

Well if you don't agree to use their product on their terms, they don't want you useing it.

What's the issue here?

I'm not really seeing any problem.

They not making you give up your first born here, they just don't want you modding or tampering with their products etc.

OH TEH EVILS MICROSFTZ ANDS SONEYS!!!

So what's so bad about the new terms of service? Or is it that you just can't opt out of them unless you no longer wish to use Xbox Live?Hexagon_777

I'm still unconvinced of the legality of a move like this, really.

edit: the move being the agreement about the whole lawsuit thing.

[QUOTE="DerekLoffin"]That is marginally worst that Sony's agreement (marginally in that you do have an opt out for Sony but seriously, how many do you expect to use it). SaltyMeatballs

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]So what's so bad about the new terms of service? Or is it that you just can't opt out of them unless you no longer wish to use Xbox Live?DrTrafalgarLaw

What's the issue here? I simply don't see any. Even forums such as this place have an agreement (that nobody reads) before you can complete signing up. Everything nowadays has a "Terms of Agreement" that everyone just skims through if at all, checks a box and clicks ACCEPT.

What's the issue here? I simply don't see any. Even forums such as this place have an agreement (that nobody reads) before you can complete signing up. Everything nowadays has a "Terms of Agreement" that everyone just skims through if at all, checks a box and clicks ACCEPT.

lunatic0495

[QUOTE="SaltyMeatballs"][QUOTE="DerekLoffin"]That is marginally worst that Sony's agreement (marginally in that you do have an opt out for Sony but seriously, how many do you expect to use it). DrTrafalgarLaw

Terms of USE. If you don't like what they say, then tough sh!t for you.foxhound_fox

What is in the Terms of Service that makes this a big deal?abusedbunny

I think this is a bit of serious underhanded legal manipulation on Microsoft's part.

I just watched Erin Brockovich the other day and this reminds me of how the evil corporation actually sent people out telling the townsfolk about the chemicals in the water, lying and actually saying it was good for them, just so they could create a legal situation where those people wouldn't be able to sue for any illness if they didn't do so within a year of being told because in law after being told they only have a year to file a suit. That part however was never made clear to the townsfolk, nor the part about them actually lying about the poisonous affects of the chemicals in the water.

This kind of legal manipulation needs to be dealt with very severely in my opinion indeed because these lawyers are taking advantage of their privileged position and detailed knowledge of the law system to trick people into giving away rights they would never actually give away if they fully understood what they were doing when signing these contracts and accepting these conditions.

The same basic thing is happening here imo albeit in a slightly less life threatening way.

I absolutely abhor this kind of abuse of power.

tos's tend to collapse under any real legal challenge anyway so why worry about it?

this hardly changes anything.

if you are harmed in some way a judge won't even consider that you clicked a button as grounds for dismissal of a case.

crying over this is as senseless as crying over the ps3 one was.

Guess you're screwed if you stick to closed systems like consoles where mostly everything belongs to the console manufacturer. It's almost like a monopoly.

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Terms of USE. If you don't like what they say, then tough sh!t for you.DrTrafalgarLaw

yes... this is the outcome, you have no rights ever again for the rest of your life.

bill gates is going to show up at your honeymoon and declare primae noctis.

tos's tend to collapse under any real legal challenge anyway so why worry about it?

this hardly changes anything.

if you are harmed in some way a judge won't even consider that you clicked a button as grounds for dismissal of a case.

crying over this is as senseless as crying over the ps3 one was.

Riverwolf007

[QUOTE="DrTrafalgarLaw"][QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Terms of USE. If you don't like what they say, then tough sh!t for you.Riverwolf007

bill gates is going to show up at your honeymoon and declare primae noctis.

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

[QUOTE="DrTrafalgarLaw"] So you think it's right for them to create a totaliarian control mechanism over their own closed platform, that takes away basic civil rights that we fought hundreds of years for, recorded in the consititution? Do you think it's fine for companies to stand above the law?DrTrafalgarLaw

bill gates is going to show up at your honeymoon and declare primae noctis.

arbitration agreements still have to be entered into court records and are subject to judicial review.

you can also reject the settlement of an arbitrition agreement within 3 months of the award.

aside from the overtones of "MS iz da eeevil empire" that the OP is riddled with, I'd like to go on record in saying that if you TRULY have an issue with signing the ToS for XBL, please don't sign it at all and play the ps3... I like my xbl to be un hacked and problem free... thanks.

aside from the overtones of "MS iz da eeevil empire" that the OP is riddled with, I'd like to go on record in saying that if you TRULY have an issue with signing the ToS for XBL, please don't sign it at all and play the ps3... I like my xbl to be un hacked and problem free... thanks.

TheEroica

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

[QUOTE="DrTrafalgarLaw"] So you think it's right for them to create a totaliarian control mechanism over their own closed platform, that takes away basic civil rights that we fought hundreds of years for, recorded in the consititution? Do you think it's fine for companies to stand above the law?DrTrafalgarLaw

bill gates is going to show up at your honeymoon and declare primae noctis.

well, if my Xbox 360 comes to life and eats my cat and dog, maybe then I'll be pissed about signing my terms of servicelamprey263

Well if you don't agree to use their product on their terms, they don't want you useing it.

What's the issue here?

Wasdie

^^ This.

While I agree that Microsoft as draconian and evil as EA, it's a ToS for gosh sake.

It's your fault you succumbed to registering to a terrible service where you have to pay to connect and play with others.

I know I did. :|

isn't every single online thing has this, like alll MMOs have this, good luck playing WoW without accepting the ToS

isn't every single online thing has this, like alll MMOs have this, good luck playing WoW without accepting the ToS

gamer-adam1

[QUOTE="gamer-adam1"]

isn't every single online thing has this, like alll MMOs have this, good luck playing WoW without accepting the ToS

Riverwolf007

[QUOTE="DrTrafalgarLaw"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]oh dear god, yes... this is the outcome you have no rights ever again for the rest of your life.

bill gates is going to show up at your honeymoon and declare primae noctis.

Riverwolf007

arbitration agreements still have to be entered into court records and are subject to judicial review.

you can also reject the settlement of an arbitrition agreement within 3 months of the award.

I think all copmanies are doing this, because they people who use the product can sometimes have the iq of rock. and suing the company because the person did something stupid, and the company didn't tell them not to do it.

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

[QUOTE="DrTrafalgarLaw"] I'm talking about rights to pertaining consoles. Consumer laws exist for a reason and Microsoft is now circumventing them to the extreme. In the end, you won't die or be enslaved after agreeing but you say it's okay for coorporations like this to have this kind of freedom taken away from you. Look at Origin for example, or the horrid horde of DRM...it's damaging your consumer rights because no one stands up against it. So it's okay if it's a console, but before you know it we'll have to sign agreements for commercial airliners that in case of (fatal) injury or death, and it's been scientifically proven it's a mechanical neglect or error, you can't sue the company any way. I'm moving away from consoles fortunately.gamer-adam1

arbitration agreements still have to be entered into court records and are subject to judicial review.

you can also reject the settlement of an arbitrition agreement within 3 months of the award.

I think all copmanies are doing this, because they people who use the product can sometimes have the iq of rock. and suing the company because the person did something stupid, and the company didn't tell them not to do it.

[QUOTE="gamer-adam1"]

isn't every single online thing has this, like alll MMOs have this, good luck playing WoW without accepting the ToS

Riverwolf007

if the place you work at, does do something that you couldn't prevent, than you would still be able to go to court. this is just stopping people from getting easy money.

So what's so bad about the new terms of service? Or is it that you just can't opt out of them unless you no longer wish to use Xbox Live?Hexagon_777

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]So what's so bad about the new terms of service? Or is it that you just can't opt out of them unless you no longer wish to use Xbox Live?Phazevariance

its kiinda sick seeing all these fanboys just accepting it, i think is bs a company makes a move ike that.

[QUOTE="Phazevariance"][QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]So what's so bad about the new terms of service? Or is it that you just can't opt out of them unless you no longer wish to use Xbox Live?Hexagon_777

it doesn't sound right, but take time to think about it, already in the past company's have given back to consumers when something out of there hands happen. without being sued. suing a company over them getting hacked, when it is not a company that specializes in it, than it is kinda like, suing the company you worked for because someone drove into the store, and the store didn't do anything to stop it.

but since when can you opt out of a tos, and still play online?

its kiinda sick seeing all these fanboys just accepting it, i think is bs a company makes a move ike that.

Krelian-co

they do it because it is way too easy to sue, and people DO go around just to sue companys for money, blame the customer not the company

its kiinda sick seeing all these fanboys just accepting it, i think is bs a company makes a move ike that.

Krelian-co

Then don't play any MMO or download programs then. :lol:

I hear in their next up-date you'll sign in blood.