Are simulators games?

They aren't really. They are simulators. You can enjoy them sure..

If you're weird.

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

Those usually have a very basic story or atleast are accessible enough.

AdrianWerner

And I don't see what accessibility has to do with software being game or not. You're bassicaly making a point here that only simplistic gameplay can be considered games.

Using your logic we could just as well only label casual games as games and remove stuff like Dark Souls from games list.

So you're trying to tell me that something like VBS (Arma for military training purposes) is simply a game made for entertainment?

Games need stories? That makes no sense at all.SW__Troll

I didn't say that was the one sole requirement. They should be made for the purpose of entertainment, above all.

If you play them then they're games. That's all there is to it.

[QUOTE="SW__Troll"]Games need stories? That makes no sense at all.nameless12345

I didn't say that was the one sole requirement. They should be made for the purpose of entertainment, above all.

What you're not recognizing is that just because you don't enjoy them doesn't mean others don't.

I am not entertained by strategy games. Give StarCraft II all the 9.5 scores in the world, I still am not entertained by it. Doesn't mean it's not a game though.

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

[QUOTE="SW__Troll"]Games need stories? That makes no sense at all.NeonNinja

I didn't say that was the one sole requirement. They should be made for the purpose of entertainment, above all.

What you're not recognizing is that just because you don't enjoy them doesn't mean others don't.

Actually I do enjoy some sims myself. What I'm trying to tell here is that some of these type of games serve more the purpose of training rather than entertainment.

Actually I do enjoy some sims myself. What I'm trying to tell here is that some of these type of games serve more the purpose of training rather than entertainment.

nameless12345

[QUOTE="NeonNinja"]

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

I didn't say that was the one sole requirement. They should be made for the purpose of entertainment, above all.

nameless12345

What you're not recognizing is that just because you don't enjoy them doesn't mean others don't.

Actually I do enjoy some sims myself. What I'm trying to tell here is that some of these type of games serve more the purpose of training rather than entertainment.

[QUOTE="NeonNinja"]

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

I didn't say that was the one sole requirement. They should be made for the purpose of entertainment, above all.

nameless12345

What you're not recognizing is that just because you don't enjoy them doesn't mean others don't.

Actually I do enjoy some sims myself. What I'm trying to tell here is that some of these type of games serve more the purpose of training rather than entertainment.

Games do not need to have entertainment as their primary purpose, though. Games can also serve to educate, provide interaction or improve certain skills using the element of entertainment as a means of achieving these goals.

So you're trying to tell me that something like VBS (Arma for military training purposes) is simply a game made for entertainment?

nameless12345

What I'm trying to tell here is that some of these type of games serve more the purpose of training rather than entertainment.

nameless12345

There's a huge difference between professional simulators and videogames belonging into simulation genre. They might be named similiar, but they nowhere near the same thing. Heck, military uses software for training commanders too, but does this mean any realistic PC RTS isn't a game anymore?

Most "simulators" are hardly sims anyhow... it's simply a good marketing term, and most customers are able to figure that out.

Microsoft Fight Sim doesn't train you to flly a plane, even though it can serve as a practice tool while in flight school

Sim City doesn't make you into an urban planner

Street Cleaning Sim... well, it's just awesome

and on and on

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

So you're trying to tell me that something like VBS (Arma for military training purposes) is simply a game made for entertainment?

AdrianWerner

Correct. Arma is a game while VBS isn't.

Microsoft Fight Sim doesn't train you to flly a plane, even though it can serve as a practice tool while in flight schoolsantoron

I would say simulators aren't games because they lack a goal and they're not big on pretend. But some simulators do let you pick certain scenario's that offer challenges and the goal of docking the ship or delivering the load, and you are still pretending to actually control an airplane or ship, so I guess some simulators might be a bit game-y.

[QUOTE="jun_aka_pekto"]

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]

I think they aren't. Serious sims such as iRacing, rFactor, DCS Warthog, ect. are not games in my opinion. They have no story, aren't accessible and their primary use is for serious training which could benefit real-life careers. The only exception to this rule are games like Arma which do have a story and you don't need to be a military expert to play them.

Discuss.

nameless12345

Games are games including simulators. Pacman, Asteroids, Dig Dug, etc don't have stories. But, they're just as much games as simulators. Simulators may have a realistic aspect to them. That doesn't preclude them from being games since there are those who derive enjoyment from them including yours truly.

Well, technically anything that involves interaction could be seen as a game of sorts. But sims like flight simulators, race simulators, driving simulators, boat and train simulators, ect. serve a specific purpose - not to entertain but more as a training tool.

For example racing games such as Gran Turismo, Forza and Need For Speed are still games whereas iRacing, rFactor and the like aren't games anymore but can be seen as serious racing tools.

I am sorry but not.. Just because your certified on microsoft simulator doesn't mean you can fly a jumbo jet.. You clearly have no idea the difference between a simulator you buy at your local electronics store, and the multi million dollar ones people train in.

I would say simulators aren't games because they lack a goal and they're not big on pretend. But some simulators do let you pick certain scenario's that offer challenges and the goal of docking the ship or delivering the load, and you are still pretending to actually control an airplane or ship, so I guess some simulators might be a bit game-y.

KungfuKitten

[QUOTE="KungfuKitten"]

I would say simulators aren't games because they lack a goal and they're not big on pretend. But some simulators do let you pick certain scenario's that offer challenges and the goal of docking the ship or delivering the load, and you are still pretending to actually control an airplane or ship, so I guess some simulators might be a bit game-y.

skrat_01

Lets not forget that simulators are extremely vague.. They can include things like Silent Hunter 3 where you command a U-boat, there are obvious clear goals in that game.

Yes. There's interaction, there's challenges, there's choice.skrat_01

But then this is also a game, isn't it? :D

[QUOTE="skrat_01"]Yes. There's interaction, there's challenges, there's choice.nameless12345

But then this is also a game, isn't it? :D

Totally don't go knocking all those typing games though, Typing of the Dead is amazing, and there's absolutely nothing negative that can be said about it. Ever.

Lets not forget that simulators are extremely vague.. They can include things like Silent Hunter 3 where you command a U-boat, there are obvious clear goals in that game.

sSubZerOo

-plays x-plane9 (a flight simulator ofcorse), flys 10,000 ft in the air, does a swan dive, and smashes into the ground- Wow that was fun...

It must be a game.

[QUOTE="KungfuKitten"]

I would say simulators aren't games because they lack a goal and they're not big on pretend. But some simulators do let you pick certain scenario's that offer challenges and the goal of docking the ship or delivering the load, and you are still pretending to actually control an airplane or ship, so I guess some simulators might be a bit game-y.

skrat_01

Correct. Arma is a game while VBS isn't.

nameless12345

rFactor is similiar. Nobody uses it for actuall training. What some teams did was license the engine and build their own training tool around it. This is why there's separate version of rFactor called rFactor PRO made solely as a box of tools to built your own professional simulator from. The rFactor itself just too much of game to be usable for such purposes.

I would say simulators aren't games because they lack a goal and they're not big on pretend.

KungfuKitten

[QUOTE="skrat_01"][QUOTE="KungfuKitten"]

I would say simulators aren't games because they lack a goal and they're not big on pretend. But some simulators do let you pick certain scenario's that offer challenges and the goal of docking the ship or delivering the load, and you are still pretending to actually control an airplane or ship, so I guess some simulators might be a bit game-y.

KungfuKitten

I wouldn't say stories. I'd say OBJECTIVES. Something either just to complete (with or without a time limit), or just to score points. That makes it a game.