Blizzard Says Valve's DOTA Trademark Doesn't Seem The Right Thing To Do

kotaku

Defence of the Ancients Allstars was a Warcraft III mod. Now, Valve is trying to trademark the name. That doesn't sit very well with Blizzard, the developers of Warcraft III.

"To us, that means that you're really taking it away from the Blizzard and Warcraft III community and that just doesn't seem the right thing to do," Blizzard's Rob Pardo told Eurogamer.

"[We feel] a little bit of confusion, to be honest. Certainly, DOTA came out of the Blizzard community... It just seems a really strange move to us that Valve would go off and try to exclusively trademark the term considering it's something that's been freely available to us and everyone in the Warcraft III community up to this point."

"Valve is usually so pro mod community. It's such a community company that it just seems like a really strange move to us... I really don't understand why [they would do it], to be honest."

Well, you do. It's because Valve's game, unlike the mod, is a retail product that will sell for money, so a trademark is needed. But we get your point. Just because it's needed doesn't make it kosher.

Valve is already facing a battle in its attempts to trademark the name, with one of DOTA's creators filing a competing trademark in an attempt to retain some sense of ownership over the brand. Which, considering most people want a community-created project to remain something for a community and not for someone to own, is probably missing as much of the point as Valve's own actions.

Valve shouldn't trademark DOTA - Blizzard [Eurogamer]

Blizzard vs Valve. Hmm, interesting.

Id rather let valve do what they want because the network of bnet 2.0 has a very bad set up for an actual dota game honestly.

I would have thought Valve would trademark DOTA in accordance with its creators.
This story doesn't make sense to me.

Its already out and everyone has it, not like anyone is going to lose it. I am sure they'll keep that mod free to download but just it'll have TM after it.JohnF111

That's where you're wrong. If Valve successfully trademarks the name 'DOTA' and/or 'Defense of the Ancients', nobody has the right to use that name anymore unless officially license by Valve. In other words, Valve has the legal right to sue someone for capitalizing on their trademark. The whole irony is that dota has been around for so long, and been independent of Valve. What Valve is doing now is basically snatching up a popular and well used name for themselves, and if you or anyone else ever use it, you have to pay them. Blizzard is right about Valve ripping off the modding community.

I would have thought Valve would trademark DOTA in accordance with its creators.
This story doesn't make sense to me.

KungfuKitten

DOTA is just some name given by some guy who created a Warcraft 3 mod. Obviously that guy didn't trademark the name, and who would? Do you think the guy who created 'Footman Wars' or 'Vampirism' trademarked the names respectively? Valve wouldn't just say "Hey, that average joe made that mod, let's put his name in the trademark."

Valve doesn't simply take over mods, in this case IceFrog himself signed up with Valve to lead a team to develop DOTA 2.

Hate it when people think Valve is just taking over stuff without the author's consent.

Blizzard should have trademarked DOTA a long time ago.SamiRDuran

You see, Blizzard isn't like Valve. If Blizzard trademarked Dota, they are doing the exact same thing Valve is doing now to the creater of Dota - making a retail version of something you created, and filing the full rights to themselves.

[QUOTE="SamiRDuran"]Blizzard should have trademarked DOTA a long time ago.jhcho2

You see, Blizzard isn't like Valve. If Blizzard trademarked Dota, they are doing the exact same thing Valve is doing now to the creater of Dota - making a retail version of something you created, and filing the full rights to themselves.

You obviously dont have all the facts, they are making it with the creator of DoTA as the lead for it...

Valve doesn't simply take over mods, in this case IceFrog himself signed up with Valve to lead a team to develop DOTA 2.

Hate it when people think Valve is just taking over stuff without the author's consent.

Vesica_Prime

IceFrog isn't even the creator of Dota. Eul created Dota on vanilla Reign of Chaos. Guinsoo made the Frozen Throne version. IceFrog continued their work in a much later version. I've played Dota for many many years now. And IceFrog is came in quite late into the Dota lifeline. And when he did, the game was already famous.

[QUOTE="jhcho2"]

[QUOTE="SamiRDuran"]Blizzard should have trademarked DOTA a long time ago.edinsftw

You see, Blizzard isn't like Valve. If Blizzard trademarked Dota, they are doing the exact same thing Valve is doing now to the creater of Dota - making a retail version of something you created, and filing the full rights to themselves.

You obviously dont have all the facts, they are making it with the creator of DoTA as the lead for it...

You mean IceFrog?

[QUOTE="edinsftw"]

[QUOTE="jhcho2"]

You see, Blizzard isn't like Valve. If Blizzard trademarked Dota, they are doing the exact same thing Valve is doing now to the creater of Dota - making a retail version of something you created, and filing the full rights to themselves.

jhcho2

You obviously dont have all the facts, they are making it with the creator of DoTA as the lead for it...

You mean IceFrog?

yes. but i now see he came in later, i didnt play dota as it was boring as hell though.

[QUOTE="Vesica_Prime"]

Valve doesn't simply take over mods, in this case IceFrog himself signed up with Valve to lead a team to develop DOTA 2.

Hate it when people think Valve is just taking over stuff without the author's consent.

jhcho2

IceFrog isn't even the creator of Dota. Eul created Dota on vanilla Reign of Chaos. Guinsoo made the Frozen Throne version. IceFrog continued their work in a much later version. I've played Dota for many many years now. And IceFrog is came in quite late into the Dota lifeline. And when he did, the game was already famous.

If the original authors of Dota really cares about Dota then they would have stuck to developing the mod rather than just abandon it and leave development to IceFrog since 2005.

[QUOTE="jhcho2"]

[QUOTE="edinsftw"]

You obviously dont have all the facts, they are making it with the creator of DoTA as the lead for it...

edinsftw

You mean IceFrog?

yes.

read my post above

Why call it DotA? Valve is trying to cash in on the established name. League of Legends & Heroes of Newerth use the same concept under original names. This seems like a really dog act - Very Activision like. Yet even though Blizzard are partnered with Activision, they still didn't trademark DotA.. I really didn't expect this from Valve.

Why call it DotA? Valve is trying to cash in on the established name. League of Legends & Heroes of Newerth use the same concept under original names. This seems like a really dog act - Very Activision like. Yet even though Blizzard are partnered with Activision, they still didn't trademark DotA.. I really didn't expect this from Valve.

Twin-Blade

[QUOTE="Twin-Blade"]

Why call it DotA? Valve is trying to cash in on the established name. League of Legends & Heroes of Newerth use the same concept under original names. This seems like a really dog act - Very Activision like. Yet even though Blizzard are partnered with Activision, they still didn't trademark DotA.. I really didn't expect this from Valve.

II_Seraphim_II

Blizzard vs Valve. Hmm, interesting.

waltefmoney

Both (Valve and Blizzard) are wrong. DotA is a mod, a community work, which is open and free, and exist from years ago, far before any of them take an eye over the concept or the name.

DotA community didn't registered any name due makes no sense that a freely modable content could be copyrighted in the hands of a single company or platform. Blizzard used to understand this, so never tried to stole the name. Blizzard also, did nothing for DotA community or their members. Blizzard tried to capitalize the DotA success making the modding environments in the Starcraft II editor and Battle.net 2.0 a nightmare for potential modders, so the community refused to port DotA to SC II. So Blizzard choked and finally put a internal team to develop the "mod" himselves. On the other hand, Valve tried to capitalize the name hiring a DotA modder to deploy a new game based in DotA concepts.

All are wrong; if you want to do a DotA game then use a new game (i.e.: League Of Legends) . Otherwise will svcks due 1) your aren't the owner of "DotA" franchise, no one is and 2) DotA is a free and moddable concept, once is developed for a developer in a close environment isn't DotA anymore.

Don't see the problem. Icefrog is the current owner of DotA and he went to Valve wanting to make this sequel.

[QUOTE="JohnF111"]Its already out and everyone has it, not like anyone is going to lose it. I am sure they'll keep that mod free to download but just it'll have TM after it.jhcho2

That's where you're wrong. If Valve successfully trademarks the name 'DOTA' and/or 'Defense of the Ancients', nobody has the right to use that name anymore unless officially license by Valve. In other words, Valve has the legal right to sue someone for capitalizing on their trademark. The whole irony is that dota has been around for so long, and been independent of Valve. What Valve is doing now is basically snatching up a popular and well used name for themselves, and if you or anyone else ever use it, you have to pay them. Blizzard is right about Valve ripping off the modding community.

This isn't true. You can't copyright "blue", this is the reason behind the "Blu-Ray Disc" brand. Neither Valve or Blizzard can register Defense Of The Ancients/Allstars/DotA, due these names are their own properties. Is like trying to copyright a common word.

Don't see the problem. Icefrog is the current owner of DotA and he went to Valve wanting to make this sequel.

Wanderer5

Icefrog was one of the capital members in the DotA community, but the rights are collective and the name was never registered.

[QUOTE="jhcho2"]

[QUOTE="JohnF111"]Its already out and everyone has it, not like anyone is going to lose it. I am sure they'll keep that mod free to download but just it'll have TM after it.Ondoval

That's where you're wrong. If Valve successfully trademarks the name 'DOTA' and/or 'Defense of the Ancients', nobody has the right to use that name anymore unless officially license by Valve. In other words, Valve has the legal right to sue someone for capitalizing on their trademark. The whole irony is that dota has been around for so long, and been independent of Valve. What Valve is doing now is basically snatching up a popular and well used name for themselves, and if you or anyone else ever use it, you have to pay them. Blizzard is right about Valve ripping off the modding community.

This isn't true. You can't copyright "blue", this is the reason behind the "Blu-Ray Disc" brand. Neither Valve or Blizzard can register Defense Of The Ancients/Allstars/DotA, due these names are their own properties. Is like trying to copyright a common word.

I can't believe Blizzard didn't trademark it. But isn't it just the name? like aren't they making a whole new universe for this game? Its not Warcraft 3 units etc. biggest_loser

The rules of agreement with the Warcraft III Editor didn't give Blizzard the chance to stole the mod and the names. This is why SC II editor is flopping so hard: the new agreements are too restrictive and the community refuses to use the new environment.

I wonder what Icefrog is feeling after two of the greatest devs argue about his game.

Anyway, wouldn't this be Icefrog's decision whether to give it to valve or not?

I for one don't feel sorry for Blizzard.

Money can do miracles buddy. Just a few thousands or millions and youll see how easily you can copyright , DOTA name. As you did with Counter strike.. You cant deny the power of money. AzatiS

Dear god, this is what I hate about this forum.

Valve never stole Counter-Strike nor Dota, instead the creators of the mods signed up with Valve to release their mod as a full retail game.

Never thought I had to type in big, yellow letters but hey. Sometimes I underestimate the misinforming and laziness in these forums.

I wonder what Icefrog is feeling after two of the greatest devs argue about his game.

Anyway, wouldn't this be Icefrog's decision whether to give it to valve or not?

LIONHEART-_-

[QUOTE="Vesica_Prime"]

[QUOTE="AzatiS"] Money can do miracles buddy. Just a few thousands or millions and youll see how easily you can copyright , DOTA name. As you did with Counter strike.. You cant deny the power of money. AzatiS

Dear god, this is what I hate about this forum.

Valve never stole Counter-Strike nor Dota, instead the creators of the mods signed up with Valve to release their mod as a full retail game.

Never thought I had to type in big, yellow letters but hey. Sometimes I underestimate the misinforming and laziness in these forums.

I don't hate these forums. I hate how the misinformed make wrong statements about matters they do not understand. Which you are demonstrating rather well.

Cheers.

It was never to Blizzard's to begin with.

It was the communities, more specifically the creators.

IPs are something personal, honestly I am still pretty damn eh about Valve's acquisition of it.

I can't believe Blizzard didn't trademark it. But isn't it just the name? like aren't they making a whole new universe for this game? Its not Warcraft 3 units etc. biggest_loser

[QUOTE="AzatiS"] Money can do miracles buddy. Just a few thousands or millions and youll see how easily you can copyright , DOTA name. As you did with Counter strike.. You cant deny the power of money. Vesica_Prime

Dear god, this is what I hate about this forum.

Valve never stole Counter-Strike nor Dota, instead the creators of the mods signed up with Valve to release their mod as a full retail game.

Never thought I had to type in big, yellow letters but hey. Sometimes I underestimate the misinforming and laziness in these forums.

WHO SAID VALVE (caps to see it because i dont like colors ) STOLE COUNTER STRIKE name OR DOTA name?.... SIGN UP = get paid by valve to WORK UNDER VALVE... I mean you quote me for what reason?... wake up....AzatiS

Money can do miracles buddy. Just a few thousands or millions and youll see how easily you can copyright , DOTA name. As you did with Counter strike.. You cant deny the power of money. AzatiS

[QUOTE="jhcho2"]

[QUOTE="JohnF111"]Its already out and everyone has it, not like anyone is going to lose it. I am sure they'll keep that mod free to download but just it'll have TM after it.Ondoval

That's where you're wrong. If Valve successfully trademarks the name 'DOTA' and/or 'Defense of the Ancients', nobody has the right to use that name anymore unless officially license by Valve. In other words, Valve has the legal right to sue someone for capitalizing on their trademark. The whole irony is that dota has been around for so long, and been independent of Valve. What Valve is doing now is basically snatching up a popular and well used name for themselves, and if you or anyone else ever use it, you have to pay them. Blizzard is right about Valve ripping off the modding community.

This isn't true. You can't copyright "blue", this is the reason behind the "Blu-Ray Disc" brand. Neither Valve or Blizzard can register Defense Of The Ancients/Allstars/DotA, due these names are their own properties. Is like trying to copyright a common word.

It's true you can't copyright common names. You can't copyright 'Defense' or 'Ancients' individually, but you can copyright 'Defense of the Ancients'. How do you think Hollywood copyrights their movies made up of a combination of common words?

[QUOTE="LIONHEART-_-"]

I wonder what Icefrog is feeling after two of the greatest devs argue about his game.

Anyway, wouldn't this be Icefrog's decision whether to give it to valve or not?

AzatiS

Hmm okay. Can't blame Blizzard though because Icefrog uses their game in the first place to make that DotA.

[QUOTE="AzatiS"]

WHO SAID VALVE (caps to see it because i dont like colors ) STOLE COUNTER STRIKE name OR DOTA name?.... SIGN UP = get paid by valve to WORK UNDER VALVE... I mean you quote me for what reason?... wake up....Vesica_Prime

Money can do miracles buddy. Just a few thousands or millions and youll see how easily you can copyright , DOTA name. As you did with Counter strike.. You cant deny the power of money. AzatiS

LoL... So you clearly deny that CS team working under VALVE or VALVE paid to game copyrights? Tell me that

Tell me again where i said they stoled anything?

EDIT : so wont hurt anyone feelings

As i said its not that blizzard hold Valve in order to use DOTA name. Actually Blizz CANT DO anything about it. Only the CO-makers of DOTA can talk here. And only themAzatiS

Money can do miracles buddy. Just a few thousands or millions and youll see how easily you can copyright , DOTA name. As you did with Counter strike.. You cant deny the power of money. AzatiS

[QUOTE="II_Seraphim_II"][QUOTE="Twin-Blade"]

Why call it DotA? Valve is trying to cash in on the established name. League of Legends & Heroes of Newerth use the same concept under original names. This seems like a really dog act - Very Activision like. Yet even though Blizzard are partnered with Activision, they still didn't trademark DotA.. I really didn't expect this from Valve.

SamiRDuran

1. Valve needs to come up with a new name.
2. maybe The creator can keep the whole name and Valve can keep the abbreviated name with a different meaning like Destruction of the A...

How would valve feel if Blizzard took a RTS type mod from a Valve game and tried the same thing I think their responce would be the same.

SO VALVE come up with a different name that is as close as you can legally get.

I really dont get you people...alot of people who do modding are actually trying to get a job in programming or game design, it looks good on the resume and is actually almost needed actually to get a job as you need proof of your work. You guys are acting as if valve is forcing them to make a bunch of money off an idea they had...

LOOOOOOOOOOl... So you clearly deny that CS team working under VALVE or VALVE paid to game copyrights? Tell me thatAzatiS

No, I never stated the CS team never worked under Valve. Stop putting words in my mouth. Anyway what you quoted stated that no one can copy a 'common word', and then you stated that Valve pays vast amounts of money just to copyright something that is of 'common word' hence implying that Valve did some ill acts in order to get the copyrights.

Anyway I find anyone who thinks 'LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOl' or whatever is a really good punchline/insult/told ya phrase to be not really worth my time so have fun languishing in your false views.

Valve doesn't simply take over mods, in this case IceFrog himself signed up with Valve to lead a team to develop DOTA 2.

Hate it when people think Valve is just taking over stuff without the author's consent.

Vesica_Prime