Do Nintendo really have the best first party games?

On topic, sure, but they're still human. Their best of the best is better than Sony or Microsoft's, but their middle and lesser entries becomes more of a crapshoot.

Like do I want New Super Mario Bros 2 or Uncharted 3? Not either one, they're lesser entries in franchises that were once so much better. Would I like easyass Kirby or Halo Reach for my next disappointing game? I dunno. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for creating fucking statues in the pantheon of gaming but man can Nintendo's first party have quality dips, ex. the 3DS.

For my taste in games (creativity, gameplay, and exceptional level design) Nintendo as a first party developer isn't even touched by the other two. They still produce some of the most well designed games to this day. Just look at Pikmin 3 and Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze. They are a couple of the best games from the past decade easily and their attention to detail, amount of quality content, and level of real challenge are completely unmatched by the offerings of Sony and Microsoft. Indies and some 3rd party games are the only things that compete with what Nintendo produces.

I think the fact that Nintendo captivates with gameplay alone without relying on story telling is a testament to their talent. They don't need cinematic trends to bolster their experiences. They utilize the unique qualities of this medium so well it's all they need. Sony, while they do make some great titles, have a tendency to lean too heavily on the cinematic and the gameplay is usually second tier or mediocre.

@wiiboxstation said:

Quality is subjective so it is not a fact that they are excellent games. It's a fact that you and reviewers think they are. Reviews are opinions not facts and people only tend to use them when they favor their own opinion. If you believe they are better then 90% of games, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it so, I don't have anything to say about it.

Some of the best selling games in the west last gen were 1st party Nintendo games. Nintendo makes games for everyone, you choice to categorize their games from being appealing to the western audience. When that is fall from the truth. Nintendo does not need to change themselves to meet a market that they are already do well in.

Also, their best development studio is from Texas. Retro Studios has produced the Metroid Prime series which I consider to be some of the best action adventures in the industry and the new Donkey Kong games which I can say without doubt are the best platformers I've ever played in my 20+ years of gaming.

Look at the jump from Super Mario to Super Mario 3. Then the evolution to Super Mario World. The complete alteration of gameplay in Super Mario World 2. The genre-defining Mario 64. Then the open-world exploration of Mario Sunshine. From there go on to spherical worlds of Galaxy 1 and 2. They then go on to produce a wildly entertaining MULTIPLAYER Mario to the mix. Yeah TC you're right. It's the same old Mario for the last 30 years. The changes made in the main Mario games alone trump those made to any game series. The biggest fallacy in this thread is that Nintendo doesn't take gameplay risks with it's franchises.

One need only look to Metroid. Every expected Metroid Prime to flounder because it was a 1st person game. We all know how that turned out. Another incredible game that proved a genre can break past what it is usually billed to be.

Only a blind fanboy would think that. How anyone can question the brilliance of Nintendo EAD is beyond me.

Nintendo has clearly made some wild and stupid choices with their hardware. This much is 100% fact. But to question their software development?

There's a reason why fanboys beg Nintendo to go third party.

Everyone always says all Nintendo has is Mario and Zelda. Let's break that statement down. A poster already confirmed how much bs that is. Now let's look at it from the other perspective and say that those are all Nintendo has. Name a main series Mario or Zelda game that scored below 90% on MC. I'll wait...

For me , they used to be best many many years ago . However the story is quite different now ,for the last 12+ years . Same old IPs doesn't interest me , and new ones are also uninteresting for me .

Of course alot of people still find them interesting and I respect their opinion . Actually I think that Nintendo first party guys are the only ones who still realize the difference between PC and Console gaming .

True . Gone Home reviews and GOTY awards are the perfect example of how critics these days , focus on social justice and story telling in games than actual gameplay . The time of complex RPGs winning GOTY is long gone .

Ever wondered why Ryse didn't get as high scores as Gone Home .? Good or bad , at least it had actual gameplay and solid presentation . The answer is lack of social justice in it and devs didn't try too hard to be controversial .

@Cloud_imperium: You do realize some of the best games released in the past fifteen years all came from Nintendo, right?

• Super Mario Galaxy (2007)- GOTY 2007
• Super Mario Galaxy 2 (2010)
• Metroid Prime (2002) GOTY 2002
• Twilight Princess (2006)
• Wind Waker (2003)- GOTY 2003
• Skyward Sword (93 on Gamerankings) (2011)
• Super Mario 3D World (2013)
• Smash Bros Brawl (2008)
• Fire Emblem Awakening (2013)

They used to innovate the software and hardware. Now they just innovate the hardware.

That's all subjective. Like saying strawberries are the best fruit. Some will agree, others won't.

I agree with you BUT what you just said doesnt make Nintendo the best company when it comes to best first party games. Another kart , another smash ,another Zelda , another mario .. and another 100 spin offs of side games based on those characters... Sorry to me thats far from best .

And if you want my personal opinion , thats the main reason why Wii U isnt selling ... People got bored of that formula and new generation doesnt give a shit about those titles. Whose left ? The nostalgic fans around the globe , thats it.

@AzatiS:

How many games have outsold Mario Kart this year? I would imagine watch dogs. Can't think of anything else.

Just because it's a game that has been out for years and years it doesn't diminish its quality. Do you think watch dogs is better than gta because it's new and gta has been around for about 20 years?

I can understand people get bored of the same game. I'm bored of fifa and cod. However I can still recognize if they are good or not. I won't let my disposition effect the game quality or lack of.

Zelda a link between world's and Mario 3d were 2 of the best games that came out in 2013. A link between world's won a few prizes for the goty.

They are still phenomenal games. That's not an opinion that is a fact.

As I said , those games don't interest me any more and I don't believe in GOTYs .

coming from someone with titanfall in their avatar

online only multiplayer game with no story and won't even work in a few years

Nintendo makes the best games for playing socially, you know in the same room with people you actually know...not 12 year olds who's parents don't have time for them

@wiiboxstation said:

You obviously do not know what a fact is despite how you definitively use the term. A game being phenomenal is an opinion not a fact as a games quality is subjected to the person playing it. There is no one game source who dictates the quality of a game, that is fact. GOTY means nothing in the end. It is a meaningless award given by a publication based on opinion(s). There is no one GOTY that represents the entirety of the gaming community decided upon by a source chosen by the entire gaming community.

Once again if you believe Nintendo are the best, good for you. Just because others share your opinion doesn't make suddenly make it fact. Facts can't be disputed. The quality of games can.

Outside of LoZ, Star Fox, Pokemon and Fire Emblem I find their IP's mediocre at best.

you mean a game that focuses 100% on gameplay? and did it well? but "EMEGHERD NO STORY" ...

not a very smart reply was it?

Yes of course. Its all subjective though.

All they have for me is console zelda(Im not fond of handheld zelda) and metroid.

@FlamesOfGrey: There is one fact to consider. According to Gamerankings, Super Mario Galaxy is the greatest game of all time. Ocarina of Time is second, and I pointed out in page one that 7 of the games on the all time best ranking is from Nintendo. Compare that to Sony's 5 (even fewer since Naughty Dog, Polypamy, and MediaMolecule are second party developers).

If you have different tastes, good for you. However, and this applies to everyone, you cannot use subjective claims to say that Nintendo doesn't produce good games anymore, when in fact, Nintendo games released in the past 10 years are still critically acclaimed.

Yes. Nintendo's consoles are built simply around their first party library, and the quality > quantity mantra.

That's not to say that I don't need my dose of Halo or God of War.

I believe Nintendo has at least one franchise in every genre of games, and most of those games are polished as hell and quite enjoyable.

The only drawbacks I can see with ninty is that they release a lot of platformers (even if they are damned good ones), and this strange perception people have of them only releasing Mario , Metroid , Zelda , and Pokemon.

also Retro Studios is a western dev and so is Next Level.

What Nintendo has is consistency to their brand. Whether it's one of their more "mature" franchises like Metroid, or "kiddie" ones like Kirby, there is a certain charm that ties them all together. Take Smash Brothers vs Playstation all Stars. Both are good games, but Smash Brothers takes characters from very different franchises without it feeling forced. Watching Pikachu beat up Captain Falcon doesn't phase me. Watching Nathan Drake Fight Kratos just looks odd. Throw in Parapa the Rapa and all my ability to suspend disbelief is drained.

Long story short, Nintendo has a certain style. You like it or you don't. It's nothing to start a fight over.

Their games are quality and definitely the best out there but their consoles are total shit. This brings the quality of their exclusives down. It comes to a point in which you have to decide between PS4, Xbox Uno or the fanservice machine.

Uh... how does having lower quality hardware bring down exclusives? By that logic, did all the PS2 exclusives get brought down in quality?

I think they have the best first party myself. They don't do storytelling well that's true but they focus on gameplay and overall polish, this is where they shine.

Obviously if some of the things you look for in a game are great storytelling, the best online features and cutting edge graphics Nintendo aren't going to be on the top of your list. I'm sure nobody would argue that the gameplay is rock solid and the games highly polished though. If they do then they probably haven't played many Nintendo games.

Just go look at any meta ranking site or top selling franchises chart and you can see for yourself. On top of that, look at the number of franchises and variety of games they have.

Obviously they're one of the best, otherwise their hardware would utterly fail.

After buying a WiiU last month, I can safely say that Nintendo has the best in house gaming talent in the industry. Games like Mario Kart, Pikmin 3, Super Mario 3D World and others offer a much more fun-centric experience than anything the X1 or PS4 do.

What does that mean really ? Im not playing sales , im playing games. With the same logic of yours Wii Fit or Wii Sports are better games than all mario kart and Zelda games combined ...

Who told you i dont recognize them as good games , thats a sentence out of your butt i guess. Theres no disposition , theres reality and if you accepting facts , see the whole picture not what you like more out of it.

That right there made me laugh ...

I agree with you though , theyre one of the best BUT for a specific audience which as new generation of gamers kicks in ...they dont give an F! and they need to do something drastic ( new IPs maybe? ) to lure new generation in or Wii U will be dead in less than 3 years from now.

Well they have a large set of IP, and they do have a range of new IP too. They just tend to be a bit smaller and remain in the shadow of their icons (Mario, DK and Zelda). They still exist, are pretty decent and add to the "Variety" aspect of their catalogue.

In theory yes , they have a large set of IP ... What will push Wii U sales out of all those IPs when already most of them showing their age more than ever ?

I wonder , if Mario couldnt , Kart obviously didnt and Smash wont .... what can out of this "large" set of IPs , because variety is missing with one way or another , save the day when most of big names are out with not that much of a success ?

You calling variety when 90% of their games being platforms with different names and heroes but same formula ... i dont think so... and thats the main problem with Wii U.. It is missing all those great third party titles to fill the serious gap their first party titles lefting when it comes to variety. There are tons of different genres out there and sadly Wii U filling very few when all other consoles filling all !!

I want to say yes... Reason why is that, I don't know what games are first party for Sony or Microsoft except for God Of War and Halo, lol. I know a lot of Nintendo's first party games and characters though, so I'd say that the reason I think Nintendo has the best First Party games/characters is because they stand out from their library and are easily recognizable.

You say about lack of Quality, as much as i think Mario is rehashed and a lot of the other franchises they have, I have to say the level of quality within there games is just amazing, all there games flow and are super smooth, and are great fun even now, they have the best first party games out of all the consoles without a doubt, every game to come out on the wii u is pretty much an exclusive so they have 10 times more exclusives than both microsoft and sony put together, even tho i'm a fan of sony exclusive and love them i still have respect for the nintendo brand

Well you're being too platform specific and hardware sales focused. I'm talking about variety and quality of software in general. Also, no, it's not just the same formula with different names. Even Donkey Kong TF vs New Super Marios Bros. U (the most similar set of IPs, and the thing you're probably getting at) have a completely different feel and visual style. Just because they share the same genre doesn't take away from the variety. Besides, it's not just limited to these games. Just look fairly new IP/games such as Pushmo, Captain Toad, Splatoon, as well as other games that demonstrate variety like Pikmin, Zelda, Mario, Donkey Kong, Animal Crossing, Xenoblade/X, Warioware, Earthbound, and the concepts/upcoming games from this year's E3 (Giant Robot and Gaurd). This list is just off the top of my head, I'm sure there's plenty more. You'd be stupid to think that Warioware and Mario are the same formula with a different name or hero. You can say that with every 2 pairs of games I just mentioned.

Yes, they do by a landslide. With that said, I personally don't care about the franchises/characters anymore and with good reason. I've been playing games with Mario in it since I was 6-7 years old. I'm not that young now, so for 20+ years I've played Mario games. I'm personally sick of that character and the ones involved with Mario titles(that goes for Donkey Kong, Kirby, and the like). Nintendo does have Zelda and Star Fox, so I will be getting a Wii U just for those games.

Even though I am sick of the Characters that inhabit Nintendo's world, I have to admit they do one thing better than any other first party...and that is make video games. We're in the age where interactive movies are taking home GOTY's and are the most popular genre. I'm glad Nintendo is still around to give us actual games if we want it.

@FlamesOfGrey: why can't quality be objective? I would say things like fun and preference are surely subjective, but there are better ways to do things than others.

Example: would you consider a camera that stares at a wall in a platformer so the player wouldn't be able to see what they're doing better than one that gives the player a good view to be able to play well simply because someone thinks it is?

No, it's objectively worse, and no opinion will change that. I can think a Civic is a better racing car than a Ferrari, but that doesn't make it so.

@MirkoS77: Look at the definition of subjective and objective, then read your post again. It's clear that even a "broken" camera angle is still subjective.

Depends in personal taste.. Personally have never been a huge Nintendo 1st party games fan... Having said that they have huge talent and quality titles..

I think Sony has a better line up of 1st party devs & games !!

Yes, most definitely. I can't think of any developer that comes close. People judge the catalog wrong. People will say "Well I think X game sucks because I don't like it." What's wrong with that is it doesn't take into account the quality of the release. Nintendo Land is a great example. They've just got so much ground covered it is rather astounding. More development houses should adopt Nintendos design philosophy. The character of their games really show through.

Also, the Mario has been rehashed is just nonsense. Mario is simply a vessel for the game. Each Mario game really has a unique feel to it--with the exception of the "New" series, apparently(only finished the wiiu one). But, compare Mario Bros to Mario 3 to Mario World to 64 to Sunshine to Galaxy to 3D World? Only a moron would call that rehash.

I don't think they do, no. I couldn't play more than a few hours of Mario Kart 8 because the gameplay is still completely busted and depends entirely on random dumb luck on most 100cc courses, and ALL 150cc courses. It's a frustrating and outdated game. Mario 3D World was just plain boring. I really, really tried to like the game. But compared to games like Mario Galaxy 1&2, it was just horrifyingly bland, uninspired, and boring.

NSMBU and NSLU were pretty good though. They've been surprisingly hit and miss. I mean, I didn't like Mario Sunshine as much as what came before it either, but I still managed to find enough about it to like that I got a good time out of it. Mario 3D World is the only Mario game I've ever played that, when asked to describe it in one word, that word was and is… "boring".

If im stupid thinking that Wario or Mario bringing the same formula , aka being platforms , while games like Pikmin , Zelda , Mario , Donkey , Animal Crossing and Xenoblade are the variety you talking about , you really need to reconsider what variety means and above all , what stupidity is.

Also if Pushmo world ( 79 metacritic ) , Captain Toad ( another one of the same platforms with different hero than mario all that is ) and Splatoon are the new IPs you waiting for or praising as something coming from the best of the best ... well thats sad.

Oh man... You're generalizing every platformers as one... And how come Nintendo IPs don't have variety? There's Pikmin (RTS), Zelda (Open World, Action-Adventure, ARPG, Beat 'em Up, Hack 'n' Slash), Mario (2D Platformer, 3D Platformer, RPG, Arcade Racer, Sports, Party, Puzzle, Pinball), Donkey Kong (2D Platformer, 3D Platformer, Arcade Racer), Animal Crossing (Life Simulator), Xenoblade Chronicles (Open World, ARPG); plus Fire Emblem (SRPG), Metroid (2D Platformer, FPS, Action-Adventure, Pinball) Kid Icarus (2D Platformer, Action-Adventure, On-Rails), Kirby (2D Platformer, Arcade Racer, Puzzle), Star Fox (On-Rails Shooter, TPS, Open World, Action-Adventure), Wario (2D Platformer, 3D Platformer, Party, Puzzle) Advance Wars (SRPG), Golden Sun (RPG), Sin and Punishment (On-Rails), Pokemon (RPG, Card Game, Pinball, SRPG, Beat 'em Up, Open World, Action-Adventure, Puzzle), F-Zero (Arcade Racer), EarthBound/Mother (RPG), Pushmo/Crashmo (Puzzle), The Wonderful 101 (Hack 'n' Slash), Splatoon (TPS), Code Name: S.T.E.A.M. (SRPG), etc.

Both Pushmo and Crashmo have 85+ Metacritic. Also, why do you dismiss Splatoon? That game is being pushed heavily and it's not just some kind of indie local multiplayer game. They intend to add Single Player Campaign, 4 vs. 4 Online Multiplayer, and customization; not to mention the game got a huge amount of fanart in an extremely short time. And besides those, there's also Code Name: S.T.E.A.M. He did not say anything about them being from the best of the best.

What's up with your vendetta against Nintendo fans?

The difference is that is you generalizing the word VARIETY . Platform is platform , period. Variety means ...variety. Variety is synonym to different genres when it comes to video gaming since NES era. You cant come here and change that , calling Wii U having great variety when it comes to first party when 80% of them are generic platformers with different mechanics. Thats not variety.

Look what you did , you calling Zelda as 4 different genres game , big time roflocopter !! Now that you get what i mean , count me how many times you said the word platform and how many times the word RPG ! Thats all there is to it , you proving my point again and again. Thnx for that.

If you calling that variety .. good for you !! Now you want me to get started how many genres Nintendo missing which cant find either from 2nd or 3rd party developers ? You dont want me to start what Wii U missing now ill write a wall of text for 2 pages... So please, dont make me do that. VAriety rofl... But your logic , PS4/X1 with indies alone beating Wii U ass ...come on now.

You mean the platform genre or not? Does Mario play like Sonic, Metroid, Mega Man, Donkey Kong, or Kirby? You're basically defining FPS and fighters too.

Zelda comes to have those genres because of Zelda II: Adventure of Link and Hyrule Warriors. And because there's a lot of platformers and RPGs, you're going to ignore what else the games do?

I wasn't even freaking talking about the Wii U or comparing it to PS4/X1. And if you do so care to make a list to see that Nintendo is so below the average, do it about Sony, M$ or someone else 1st party IPs because you're taking in consideration tons of publishers and developers as if everyone shared the same IPs against one publisher and its 2nd party developers.

@AzatiS: Going by your logic, Knack is the same thing as Mario, Forza is the same thing as Mario Kart, and Mass Effect is the same thing as Pokemon.

Yes they really do. When Nintendo is on their A game, nothing can match it.