Do we really need next gen consoles at this time?

After all the talk of the ps 4k (neo) and the rumors of a 4k capable xbox it only makes you wonder if we really need those systems in the near future.

I mean the xbox360 and ps3 were obliterated without any mercy by nvidia's 8800 gtx, which released a year after the x360 and even before the ps3 hit the shelves. Yet those consoles aimed to be as powerfull as possible and to last as long as possible and because of that the production costs went trough the roof.

So there was no way both console manufacters were going abandon these systems. Yet both systems were not capable to run a pc game like crysis. Still, both consoles were home to a lot of good games and there was a lot of room for creativity within the bounds of the consoles hardware.

However it is true that the current gen consoles were pretty weak for their time at release, yet there is a major difference with previous gen consoles and there is a lot of room for creativity again but apparently the focus has now gone to 4K, which is imo a bit weird since the current gen consoles can't do 1080p properly for most games.

Heck some games suffer even at 900p or have to be patched a zillion times before the framerates are acceptable and now they're talking about 4k.

I sense a similar scenario, where resolution is pushed to the max and where the framerates are left in the dust. If I want graphics fidelity , I'll buy a game pc and keep the console for console games like sports and fighting games, multiplayer oriented games and maybe the odd exclusive.

At this time , especially with the game library the current gen consoles have, I can't see any reason to upgrade to a 4k console in the near future, heck I don't even have a 4k tv and I'm not planning to buy one soon either.

My current TV is five years old and I don't see myself getting a new one anytime soon. 4K is lost on me, as well as the vast majority of TV owners.

No we don't. Sony, MS, and Nintendo are just trying to cash in.

OPTIONS! Options everywhere...

Its an option. Some people like Double Sundays some people just want a single scoop.

It doesn't hurt anyone and its the same eco systems.

I more than likely won't be buying.

No.

It won't stay an option and by the time it isn't an option anymore they will again fail to deliver acceptable framerates, even at lower res than 4k.

NX is another year off (maybe longer if rumor is true), next Xbox is also at least another year off, and Sony's next thing this year is a mid-generation reiteration mostly to boost power to make VR viable.

As far as I know though MS is planning future compatibility, and I don't see why Sony couldn't do the same. So they wouldn't be replacing current console generation market but developing off of it and expanding the current brand market.

I wish that's what MS/Sony could have done with last gen, MS said same thing about future compatibility then but didn't commit. Sony not doing so made sense since surely the Cell really gummed up the works there but I'm not sure what MS's excuse was.

Is it shitty what Sony and MS are doing? Sure. New console gen? No.

Assuming the rumors are true, resolution is not enough of a reason to bother upgrading (and clearly not if you don't have a 4K tv). But if the intention is to alter the business model and permit scaling levels of performance, it becomes a viable consideration.

Ummm, Crysis was ported to both the 360 and PS3.

And to answer your question, its not about if we need them, but if there is an audience interested in more powerful consoles right now, which I can confidently say yes there is.

Games aren't going to be native 4K on these new consoles. The new consoles will simply be able to playback 4K movie content. Games will still be 1080p, but with better visuals and frame rates.

@emgesp: The rumor for the Neo - as put forth by Kotaku in their original piece - is games will be supported at 4K resolution, though the current technological capabilities indicate it will be achieved through upscaling. Eurogamer's piece indicated that Sony's internal docs de-emphasized resolution in favor of higher performance, so I can't say if it's been corroborated.

Guess we can only wait and see.

We'll know soon enough. If they sell or not, becuase the public will tell us.

4K TV's already upscale 1080p content. Point of Neo is to make VR better.

4K is a waste of resolution. Until graphic cards can easily push the resolution and its a standard format for TV its just another sales gimmick.

We don't need, hell I'm even ok with my Wii U. But this is not just about how poorly the consoles compare with the PC, it's more about how they do with the new emerging tech. 4k is being pushed by both all tv\monitor manufacturers and media broadcasters. This means that within this gen consoles would be a step back. This in a gen where the debate is centered on how many pixels can console X push. Plus, simultaneously VR is being pushed big time, and again there's the risk of this gen completely missing that train, or just offer a mediocre alternative.

Also, this new iteration of PC GPUs apparently are aiming for performances that delivers 4K and VR at very attractive prices.

To finalise, we had the Wii U failure that forced Nintendo to make the NX, thus (probably) catalyzing the competition to react.

Al in all it's kind of a perfect storm.

Umm yes, Nintendo and Microsoft are both walking around with shit in their underpants..

Nobody is forced to buy one, if he/she already has current hardware...and since the services and the games are the same, you can just move on.

Yes

NO

Short answer, no. But looks like they're coming anyway. It'll be interesting to see how the market reacts.

I just hope they don't get too greedy and start releasing new models every year with small upgrades, like phones.

I can't support the practice. I buy consoles so I don't have to think about hardware for a good long while. Here I am not even half way through gen 8 thinking about new hardware.... Shitty practice if you ask me.

Maybe they're trying to lock us in like Verizon and sprint etc.. We all get to pay monthly fees to play games and sign contracts for data... each gig used over your contract limit means extra charges, but hey, you get a new ps4 every year*

*price of new console will be delineated through your contract fee until device is paid off in full...

And it was downgraded in almost all aspects.

It doesn't even run on the same engine. I have bought crysis for the pc and the xbox 360. I played crysis on a pc that could max it out. I don't think I have ever seen such a big difference between a console and a pc version, it simply looks a full gen apart.

PC gamers lined up to buy the GTX 1070 it flew off the shelves and is sold out.

I think it will do well if Sony markets it right to hardcore console type gamer.

Better multiplats. Higher Graphic Detail, Smoother Framerate, Higher Resolution.

All sony would have to do is show off multiplats on it and a comparison with the xb1 version and it would be all over.

I don't think you realize how much more successfull the consoles are when you look at multiplats.

Look at fallout 4 , sales on the consoles are way higher.

People that want to spent this kind of money on game hardware are in the minority.

No, you have PC :P

@04dcarraher said:

@commander said:

@04dcarraher said:

@emgesp said:

@commander said:

Yet both systems were not capable to run a pc game like crysis.

Ummm, Crysis was ported to both the 360 and PS3.

And it was downgraded in almost all aspects.

It doesn't even run on the same engine. I have bought crysis for the pc and the xbox 360. I played crysis on a pc that could max it out. I don't think I have ever seen such a big difference between a console and a pc version, it simply looks a full gen apart.

you can see the differences but it doesn't tell the whole story, the levels are smaller too.

not to mention 'da foliage'

So PC gamers that make Nvidia billions of dollars a year are a minority? This system is just a way for sony to make more money. They don't care who is a minority or not.

The console revisions are not going to be running games, with state of the art graphics, at 4k, even at 30fps. Their target is 1080/60 and the ability to have UHD video playback, which should have been what the consoles out right now were capable of right from the start of gen 8.

Sony have everything to lose with this move, after all they have a massive lead in the console market. MS have very little to lose with the Xbox One not selling very well and the realisation that they can actually tap into the PC Games market as well (if they do it right, which so far they haven't).

It's all marketing crap being force fed into consumers by shill sites, just like this one.

An APU with that kind of power wasn't available in 2013 and even if they could get it the TDP would have been too high in a console form factor.

The only reason why the NEO and Scorpio are getting boosts is thanks to 14nm Finfet.

@GarGx1: SONY has nothing to lose here

They show commercial of XB1 Multiplat like call of duty next to PS4 Neo version on TV and next time the console gamer is in a store they will pickup the one they saw on TV.

IF im in best buy i see 400 dollar Neo a 350 dollar ps4 or 300 xb1 what one do you think I will get? Hint probably the best item on the shelf especially if only 100 dollars more.

Little Jimmy's Mum doesn't agree with you.

I've said this before, the conversation, in millions of households around the world, will go along the lines of

Little Jimmy: Mum I want the new PS4, it's only $400 [insert whatever currency]

Mum: What's wrong with the PS4 you have now?

Little Jimmy: Um.. nothing but the new one has better graphics.

Mum: No, go do your homework.

This is what both Sony and MS will be up against with a console revision

If the rumors are true and ps4 games will just have a Neo mode, I don't see it as a different generation. No more than Sega CD or 32x were next gen in their day.

Nope, but Sony knows people will buy it, so I get why they are doing it. Uncharted 4 is already being heralded as one of the best games visually. The thing is, I don't think console optimization is a thing anymore since they are using pc architecture, and all the background processing these new consoles do, so that may be the ps4 completely tapped out unlike previous generations where console visuals constantly got better and better.

@GarGx1:

LOL pretty much and I think it's the complete oposite, Sony has the most to lose. Nintendo and MS have the weaker console and they are behind Sony so it makes since to try and do something to get back into good graces of gamers. Sony has about what, 40 million PLAYSTATION sold and they coming out with a new console in 2 to 3 years? Unless they give a good reason for this and not alienate current PS4 owners at the same time, this can easily turn out to be a bust.

I see the PS4 Neo the same as the N3DS ... it is still a 3DS that play 3DS games I can think of only one title that play better on the N3DS and everything else is pretty much the same.

I remember hoping there won't be any frame rate issue with the 3DS on in Bravely Default ( especially near the Vampire castle ) but it still does that with the N3DS ... only SMASH who have better loading time. Everything else is the same.

So I bet it will be the same with the NEO, old game won't do better and new one may have programmation that let them use some the NEO power and maybe a few exclusive that can't run on normal PS4.

you mentioned the gtx 1070, high end graphics card buyers are a minority with the general gaming population.

I understand that you say that sony wants to make more money, but consoles have never been about high end graphics like the pc. I mean, the people that want high end graphics buy pc hardware, I doubt they will suddenly trade in their gaming pc for a high end console.

Yes we need them. Gaming needs to evolve with ever improving hardware. We can't expect to still be playing new games on consoles 11 years later like the 360. Gens should be around 4 years if you ask me. BC needs to happen though.

To answer your question:

Would going from 900p, 30fps to 1080p, 60fps be worth it for a few hundred dollars?

I'm waiting till the next Xbox to buy a console. My pc with a Gtx 970 is enough for another 4 years I believe. Xbox always has a strong console then a weak console then a strong again, in terms of sales.

I guess we'll see. I know a lot of people went to ps4 just for better multiplatform games and would never touch a PC they would probably upgrade to a NEO.

I also know a lot of PC gamers who own a PS4 and would probably sell the old one and upgrade to this.

Then there is people who are just going to a store and want the newest best product who haven't even boughten a console and still have a 360/ps3 or just a new to gaming person.

If i go into the store i don't want to buy 100 dollar ps3/360, or an iphone 5, i want the new iphone 6 or whatever just came, I don't want something old.

It's a tough question, because I think that the console world is changing anyway - by that I mean, what we consider a "game console" is changing. I think all game consoles are slowly moving closer to what we see with devices like Apple TV; no physical media at all, all content downloadable, and a box that is focused on games but that provides a platform for all kinds of entertainment.

It could be that console manufacturers are moving closer to an interative hardware development plan, where we see new models every couple of years, but there's still broadly "backwards compatibility" with software. I mean, think of your smart phone, and the way that when a new phone comes out, the older models don't immediately become redundant for new game releases. I can sort of see consoles going in that direction.

As for whether or not they "need" to? Well, I'd actually have said that hardware power is becoming less important over time, not more important. I mean, despite all the comparisons between PC and console graphics, I actually don't see a huge difference there; when you see side-by-side videos, it's rare to see a highly noticeable change from console to PC. Mostly, you get things like better frame rate, longer draw distances, and maybe improved anti-aliasing and stuff...but that's about it. And as hardware evolves, I think it's clear that the horsepower is there, and it's not so much a horsepower problem, but rather an optimisation and porting problem (as well as a disk space problem!)

That said, the key reason why I can imagine the sudden need for more powerful consoles is because of the adoption of VR technology. If Sony and Microsoft are keen to push VR as being a significant part of the console experience (which makes sense - I think VR makes more sense in the living room than it does in the study on a PC), then it's going to be necessary to have the hardware to support it. It won't necessarily make sense to wait another three years to put that into the market if they want to capitalise on early-adoption of VR sooner rather than later.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. Nothing too concrete...I guess it all comes back to the broader landscape changing. I'm not sure if frequently-updating console hardware is a good or a bad thing, so long as I'm not constantly being blocked from playing my existing library. For me, backwards compatibility is the biggest hurdle to jump in order to convince me to keep updating my hardware (and obviously in the PC world, that is a non-issue really).

I'm more than happy with current gen consoles and I can't afford to buy anymore new consoles for at least another 3 years.

It can run 4K no with max out graphics,i am sure in medium it can,is not like the PS4 is running ultra 1080p now,let alone the xbox one.

What will sony lose with this move.? Neo is not the PS5,is a PS4 with stronger components,it play the same games,use the same PSN,same saves everything for all intended purposes it works exactly like a PC would if you had one with a 7850 and one with a 480,still will play the same games and do the same things.

It is on MS side that people have claim the unit is a successor,not on the PS side.

How will they tap into the PC market by making xbox games available on PC.? Well that just kill the xbox why do you need it if you can play on PC xbox games + PC games which you can't play on xbox one.

And little jimmy doesn't agree with you .

And your argument like always is total garbage,the PS4 is $350 still if little jimmy has one is because his mom already put out $400 or $350 for one.

Second what make you think little jimmy is sony's target.? Isn't little jimmy the target Nintendo seek.?

3rd why in hell it has to be some one who already own a PS4,this is one of the most pathetic arguments ever use here,no one who owns a PS4 need to buy a new PS4 no one,all games will be compatible between models.

Not only that sony has sold 40 million units MS 20 and nintendo like 13,than 73 million units is not even what the xbox 360 sold on its life cycle,and half of what the PS2 sold alone,last gen more than 260 million consoles were sold,73 million sold until now that leave a freaking truckload of millions of people without a console now,which mean even if sony sell every single unit to a new PS owner still can sell more than what the normal PS4 has sold until now.

I don't think MS will break compatibility between platforms either so,again the same apply to MS.

They have nothing to lose,at all.

Is a stronger model not a successor console,that mean every single Neo sold count toward the PS4 numbers in the same way any GPU sold on PC count toward increasing PC numbers regardless of the model.

You people act as if this was a successor which is a joke.

Second how you can see sony as losing more,and not MS and Nintendo is a joke,hell at least Nintendo can be consider a successor arriving 5 years after launch,but the Scorpio arriving in 4 years,is basically on the same spot sony is,1 year doesn't make that much difference,specially for those who are getting an xbox one this year and last year.

Is exactly the same situation,but again this move on sony side is do to AMD moving to finfet,shrinking the current Soc sony has now,would cost them more than using a more powerful one,so is a no brainer that sony will update their model,MS will face this to as they use the same Soc from the same company,the only difference here is that since MS had a huge case on launch they can still use the same soc and deliver a smaller xbox one version,and latter on do the same thing sony is doing.

There is no alienation all games work on both platforms and there is nothing that show that sony will release a new model in 2 year or 3,this move happen to coincide with AMD movement,cost reduction is a most for consoles is how the get to offer cheaper prices as the generation goes on so saving on that Soc is crucial.

Not sure if I can agree on Nintendo...

Though, Neo isn't next-gen in any way, shape, or form in my eyes, and Scorpio is debatable depending on specs.