Final Fantasy 16 meets expectations!

@Jag85: Not true. You do know developer have to pay a fee to the physical and digital retailers. Also you have no clue what the development and advertising cost of the game is.

We already know dev teams bring in less that half from physical games and less than 70% from digital games.

@Pedro said:

😂

False. Again, we already went over this before:

Square Enix already made a profit on FF16 back when it launched in June 2023. Anything they've sold after that is pure profit.

@Jag85: I’m stating your math is false.

@mesome713: Square Enix already confirmed they made a profit on the game. Your opinion is irrelevant.

@Jag85: fanboys getting upset by this game’s success 🤣

Not really

Yes really...

Final Fantasy Pixel Remasters have sold 3 million copies

FF 1-6 came out 29-36 years ago, yet they're still selling to this day. Same goes for FF 7-15. They're all still selling to this day, years and decades later.

Good at the first half? I dunno. I realized pretty fast that you need to spend a lot of time watching the main characters in a car and that the combat system is unbelievably dumbed down. Square messed up.

@Jag85: Yet not on the UK top 40. That’s some impressive legs.

But these are older games that many players didn't get to play.

And nowhere near the rate as many top AAA franchises.

Is there a particular reason why texasgoldrush is more obsessed with Final Fantasy/Square than i about Halo Infinite/343i? What's the lore behind it all???

Square does have some of my favorite games, thats why.

So you're hate following the developer like i hate follow Ubishit?😊

All the mainline FF games from FF1 to FF15 have had strong legs. For example:

• FF1 - From 400K in 1987 to 3.4M in 2023 = 8.5x multiplier (and still selling for 36 years)
• FF7 - From 5M in 1997 to 14.1M in 2022 = 2.8x multiplier (and still selling for 26 years)
• FF15 - From 5M in 2016 to 10M in 2022 = 2x multiplier (and still selling for 7 years)

Most AAA franchises don't come anywhere close to Final Fantasy legs. Most AAA games tend to be heavily front‑loaded, with most of their sales coming from the launch period and then slowing down significantly after launch. FF games tend to be less front-loaded in the launch period, but went on to make most of their sales long after launch.

1. Digital sales are not included in UK charts. Most sales are digital nowadays.

2. The world does not revolve around the UK.

Did it, though? Did it really?

*sigh*

Don't worry guys, it'll get ported to PC and like the last few games PC will take the sales from "meets" to "exceeds" expectations 😋 PC gamers out here singlehandedly saving gaming from itself. You're welcome.

@Jag85: And yet FFXVI cant keep on the top charts. Some legs mate. Game has heavy discounts already and still not selling good. Tears of the Kingdom hasnt left the charts yet. Now thats some strong legs. And remember FF use to sell more than Zelda. My have the mighty have fallen. Thats what happens when you screw over your fans.

@mesome713: Again, the world does not revolve around UK physical charts. On the US charts (both physical and digital), FF16 is performing far better. The US is FF's primary market nowadays, not the UK (or Japan anymore, unfortunately).

I remember him saying years ago that FF6 is his favourite RPG... There's a tendency for some FF6 fans to obsessively hate on every FF that came after FF6 (except for FF9).

Because FF6 did not make the mistakes later games did.

And FF6 is not really my fave RPG anymore.

Yet FF games rarely top 10 million (and when they do, its close), and they sell from the bargain bin, like FFXV did.

And newer FF games are frontloaded. Look at FFVII Remake.

What mistakes?

What is your fave RPG now? I'm guessing it's either Witcher 3, Cyberpunk 2077, or Dragon Quest XI.

Legs is not about the total number sold, but the multiplier from launch to lifetime sales. All the mainline FF games from FF1 to FF15 have multipliers between 2x and 9x. That's what you call strong legs. Weak legs would be below 2x multiplier (e.g. most other AAA games).

FF7R sold 3.5M at launch and then 7M about 3 years later. That's a 2x multiplier. And that's despite being given away to over 30M PS+ subscribers on top of that. FF7R has strong legs.

First off, the first six games were re-released, and FFVI got the sales it deserved through strong word of mouth. I bet the biggest chunk of those sales was FFVI.

Second, FFVIR sold 5 million a bit after launch, then sold 2 million years after. People just didn't put money for it after the fanbase.

Nowhere near Skyrim or Witcher 3 levels, or even Monster Hunter World.

Overloading and swerving the plot in a thematically ineffective manner. I noticed almost every FF game after VI does this, and they fail to understand why VI's swerve worked. XVI was egregious.

1. No disagreement there.

2. FF7R sold 2.5M in its first week, then 5M in 5 months, and then 7M in 3 years. So the launch-to-lifetime multiplier is still 2x. You're also ignoring the fact that FF7R was downloaded by over 30M PS+ subscribers on top of that. Yet it still managed a 2x sales multiplier despite that. FF7R has strong legs.

3. Skyrim had a 3x multiplier (10M to 30M). The Witcher 3 had an 8x multiplier (6M to 50M). Monster Hunter World had a 5x multiplier (5M to 23M). Their legs are around the same ball park as FF games. The raw sales are larger, but that's not what legs are about. The legs are about the multipliers (from launch to lifetime), not the raw sales.

Raw sales matter.

And no, with the level of hype FFVIIR received, 7 million is not a great sales number. It really struggled after the first year.

Raw sales is not legs. Learn the difference.

Again, a 2x multiplier from 3.5M launch to 7M lifetime is strong legs. Stop shifting the goal post. And for the record, the 30M+ PS Plus downloads also matter.

Depends what you're looking for. Most people don't go into a story thinking about how thematically effective it is. What most people care about in a story is how engaging the plot is and how much they care about the characters. That's what made the FF series so beloved, and something FF 4-10 were very effective at (well, to an extent for 5 and 8).

Regarding thematic effectiveness, I know you're probably referring to the Sephiroth swerve in FF7. You've mentioned before how you dislike that swerve because it goes against the earlier Midgar arc's strong environmental message... But that's the point. Sephiroth is what you get when you take environmental activism to extreme lengths. If anything, it shows FF7 was nuanced and bold enough to highlight the negative side-effects of its own message. The game isn't forcing its message on you, but lets you decide for yourself how to interpret it, like a good work of art... unlike many modern writers who are all too eager to force their message on the audience. FF7's more nuanced, subtle approach is something many modern writers could learn from.

No, Sephiroth's motive has nothing to do with extreme environmentalism. Next, Jenova ruins his storyline by being too vague, and as an alien, basically clashes with the game's environmental themes. The problem with FFVII is its swerve clashes with its themes by introducing things that go against them.

And no, being thematically effective is central to storytelling.

@texasgoldrush: Sephiroth was preaching about how he wants to save the planet from humanity. That's an extreme form of environmentalism. But of course, his real motives are due to personal trauma, just that he needs an ideology to justify it. That ties into another major theme of the game: trauma. That's something all the major characters experience and handle in different ways. It's not clashing with the environmental theme, but complimenting it by portraying the ideological conflict in a more complex manner.

No, thematic effectiveness is not a necessity for storytelling. Many great stories don't have a strong or clear message, but are simply telling an engaging story for audiences to enjoy and be invested in. And that's fine. Not every story needs a message.

@Jag85: Bro FFRemake sold almost 4 million in a couple days. Then after being $19.99 for years now in 2023 has sold only 7 million. Thats not legs...thats we cant get this crap off the shelf. Meanwhile Breath of the Wild went from selling 5 million every year. Thats legs. FF is a joke now.

@mesome713: Wrong. FF7R sold 3.5M at launch and then doubled that with 7M over the next 3 years. That's a 2x multiplier. That's legs.

In terms of prices, most of those 7M sales were full price. After selling 5M at $60, it went to PS+ where 30M+ subscribers downloaded it. The next 2M sales then came from Intergrade on PS5 and PC at $70. According to SteamDB, it's still sold for $70 today and never dropped below $40 at any point. When the price does eventually drop to $20, it should sell millions more (like FF15).

Or it just clashes because extraterrestrial elements are added (both Jenova and Meteor) which muddles the themes earlier in the game and gives Sephiroth motive decay, like Blizzard characters. FFXVI did this crap too, going away from the theme of slavery to just kill God.

This is the problem with FF past VI, just kill God or another lazy swerve tries to get them out of corners the writers wrote themselves in. This is why Necron happens.

5M in launch window, 2M afterward. And it is not a hit on PC.

And you want to talk about full price sales, CP2077 slaughtered FFVIIR in sales.

@texasgoldrush: That’s cause FFRemake has no legs. Games in 2023 still at 7m. And this Clown Cow claims it was at 7 mil not long after launch. Bro is delusional. He just can’t accept that FF is selling worst than it ever has.

@mesome713:

That game was on 1 console and a remake. Those are not bad numbers.

Nope. Launch window is first month, not six months. It sold 3.5M in the launch window and then another 3.5M over the next three years. As for PC, we don't have a breakdown of how much it sold on PC, including both Epic Store and Steam. All we know is that it sold 2M between PS5 and PC, while priced around $60-70, translating to $120-140M revenue. That makes it a hit on PS5 and PC.

Again, you keep shifting the goal post. The topic is legs, not raw sales. CP2077 had an incredible launch, but weak legs. It sold 13M in its launch month and then 20M in two years. That's only a 1.5x multiplier, which means weak legs. That also doesn't take into account that a large chunk of those 13M launch sales were returned, and that most of those additional 7M sales came from $30 discounts. If we also take into account CP2077's huge $316M budget (along with additional costs for DLC and the Edgerunners anime), it's safe to say FF7R is more profitable than CP2077.

Again, that ties into another major theme of the game: trauma and mental health. Both Cloud and Sephiroth clearly suffer from PTSD. Sephiroth had rational motives to begin with, before gradually descending into madness. He is clearly not mentally sane, so his motives stop being rational as he loses his sanity. You're looking for a clash of themes where there is none.

Also, the FF16 spoilers are completely unnecessary. Edit out those FF16 spoilers, as many here haven't yet played it, including myself.

FF 1-6 also involved a "swerve" where the real villain is revealed and/or there's some kind of false deity you have to take down. You're acting like this didn't happen in FF 1-6 as well.