Has The Shooter Landscape Changed?

This is a pretty big deal. Battle Royale and competitive arena shooters seem to have replaced the shooters of old. Halo, COD and Battlefield seeing a dip in streaming viewership is new this past year. Halo has been suuuuuper low since launch. And the big streamers bounced off the game within a week. That’s very disappointing imo. Infinite is great! But gamers don’t seem to care…

The BR train doesn’t look like it’s gonna stop anytime soon.

Yeah, I have been saying for a long time that MS just didn't get the memo. People have long moved on from Halo/Gears.

Bad example. BF2042 is the most broken piece of shit we've had in like 10 years. The fact that it has more than 100 people on the servers is an achievement on its own. Halo Infinite launched in alpha stage. So little content its laughable.

Release a proper fps that is not a BR, and it'll be played by a shitload of people. Escape From Tarkov is a good example of this.

For sure it has. It has been poisoned by free to play micro-transaction genres like BR and hero shooters. This is no more evident than how it has negatively affected the Battlefield franchise. BF 2042 is a joke of a game that is just chasing trends and has no soul. DICE/EA don't know how to make a good BF game anymore.

Meh. I prefer SP shooters.

MP trash can died on i dont care.

couple years late on this "realization" lulz

Over 20 million people are playing Halo Infinite. It's a game that you play, not watch, hence why these weird battle Royale streamers are so against non-BR shooters. They'll lose their viewer count if they play anything but a BR.

So, they pretend to enjoy COD and Apex Legends. It's what the 12 years olds like to watch.

@hardwenzen: 'Release a proper fps that is not a BR, and it'll be played by a shitload of people. Escape From Tarkov is a good example of this.'

We're talking about games being watched as a form of entertainment, not played.

@ghosts4ever: Lol shut up. You always brag about your skills and how you play hardcore games yet you’re too cowardly to play multiplayer where the real skill is.

Same thing applies, but to a lesser extent.

"FPS viewers have moved away from casual respawn arena shooters."

The message started well. Then it got retarded.

I think streaming numbers is an unreliable measure of a game's actual popularity. After all, people who watch games aren't necessarily people who buy games. There are plenty of popular games with low streaming numbers, and even the viewer numbers fluctuate over time according to events and updates.

That being said, it is also true that Battle Royale games are the top dogs right now, both in terms of viewer and player numbers. I wouldn't say the trend has moved on, though; more like carved out a piece for itself in the gaming market. The facts that other types of shooters remain successful, and that the BR market has pretty much consolidated around PUBG, Fortnite, Warzone and Apex Legends with no real room for more players (as Ubisoft found out the hard way recently) attests to this.

So yes, things change. But no, non-Battle Royale shooters aren't going anywhere.

I'll never understand why people watch others play games, it's just to weird.

Of course it changes, just like any other landscape.

There was a time in the early 2000's where military shooters appeared to be at the top of the food chain, with Call of Duty and the likes being among the most popular. Nowadays, while military shooters still get made, they're no longer at the top.

I think what it means is in another 10 years or so, when the proportion of active gamers has been swamped by the younger generation that is more accustomed to and/or interested in stream viewing, then the answer will be yes.

But right now his stat is completely misleading - Because there's a generational difference in how people view streamer content that is correlated with what people play. His numbers technically only mean one thing: of the people who slurp up game streams (mostly younger gamers) they overwhelmingly prefer to watch casual BR game streams that they presumably (but not technically indicated by this) also prefer to play. Instead of his so-called casual arena shooters.

The people who don't sit around watching game streams -young and old- aren't even represented in his statistic, and thus their preferences in games aren't either. As someone noted above: halo infinite actually has a player count that dwarfs the type of numbers he is using

Don't really care about twitch and not sure if that is really a barometer for anything. As for free to play, COD has Warzone, Halo Infinite multiplayer is free to play, I read a rumor that Naughty Dog may be working on some kind of free to play multiplayer. As long as it's good, I'm ok with it.

@xantufrog: I think their is something to this though.

A quick google search will show that yes Halo Infinite has seen a large player drop since launch. Active players at least. Go look at the steam numbers. And it went from being a top twitch performer to almost nothing.

Go watch some of the Act Man's videos on Halo Infinite, the guy is a huge Halo nerd, and while he says the core of Infinite is great once you play it for a while the cracks in the gameplay loop and lack of content become really noticeable.

Infinite simply doesn't have the content to keep an audience right now. It's shockingly bare bones. ESPECIALLY compared to the MCC.

I really think it needed another year delay. First impressions mean a lot in the gaming industry and Halo missed it's chance.

Using viewership and not active players as a benchmark is a sad state for gaming.

Gotta love this generation of kids that always make everything about themselves. Instead of enjoying the products and work that are being put out, they have to watch someone to be invested. It's always about the person and not not the product. Reaction videos, streamers, let's play videos. God, I hate this generation.

@Juub1990: Gen Z kids are a weird bunch. They'd rather watch other people play games than actually play the games themselves.

Even if the landscape has changed, is the argument that games like halo, bf and cod shouldn’t be made any more?

Are we saying don’t bother with games that don’t attract huge twitch viewer numbers ?…. In which case Sony would be screwed.

Dice screwed up with 2042….but if games like that aren’t made, I’m out. Need me some mp gaming.

Let us not act as if the behavior of people watching others play a game is new. It might be newish in popularity in video games but it is very common in other games that are not video games.

Yes, the arena shooter is niche. And frankly it has been for a while.

It's why we have Fortnite and haven't had a new Unreal Tournament in years.

Yeah but the question is: do publishers take this data seriously? If so I think we are in trouble, and it might explain the w ay things are and have been going (down the drain).

@mrbojangles25: That is a valid concern and I currently don't have enough enough to know if they do. With that said, the bottom line is what developers and publishers cater the most to. If viewer doesn't net income, it is of no value.

Top 5 highest-grossing shooters in 2020:

1. PUBG - $2.82 billion
2. Garena Free Fire - $2.13 billion
3. Call of Duty: Modern Warfare / Warzone - $1.93 billion
4. Fortnite - $1.4 billion
5. Call of Duty: Black Ops Cold War - $678 million

The top four were all battle royale games.

Yet, folks in this thread claim there’s no correlation between twitch viewership and actual popularity of games.

Someone nailed it in this thread though. Halo Infinite lacks content. And 343 has been waaaaaaaaaaaay too slow rolling out new content and updates. That’s the biggest complaint against Respawn with Apex. But 343 makes them look quick in comparison

@goldenelementxl: It drives me insane that no one else point's the lack of content out enough! Especially compared to other Halo Games.

Infinite should have RELEASED with more content than Halo 5 BUT IT didn't! People reviewing the game aren't big halo players so it simply passes over them in their reviews.....because they don't realize it. But the true Halo fans point it out and get crucified.

It's fucking stupid

Halo and Gears are just dull compared to some other games out there. No loadouts, No perks/skills, no real weapon variety (everyone spawns with the same weapons), having to find weapons on the map just leads to camping and players who have memorized the maps having an advantage.

And tactical, team based shooters got left in the dust a decade ago. At least we still have R6 Siege.

I’m pleased Halo didn’t chase the trends and just stuck to being Halo. If that means it’s not popular with blue haired streamer then so be it.

Just because some games do not have streaming popularity, does not mean they are not popular in general. Certain games are better suited towards streaming. BR games are good for streaming because they are slower paced and it allows for the streamer to interact with the audience. Also, each round will have its own narrative based on the events that happen. This is very different from somebody streaming a TDM match where it is generally the same shit over and over and more just a showcase of skill. A BR streamer is generally going to have a better stream than a TDM streamer and will inject more of their personality into the stream and build a better community.

As for the importance of streaming popularity and how much developers/publishers value it... They value it a lot because it ties into their marketing and overall player engagement. Every stream being watched is free exposure to the game and showcasing available micro-transactions available for purchase. Streamers (especially the big ones) are called influencers for a reason. They influence purchases and player engagement. Even if players spend more time watching a game than playing it, they are more likely to spend money in the game after being exposed to a cool skin, charachter, or whatever from a stream.

The Halo playerbase has fallen off a cliff on PC.

@Star67: that's fair, but it doesn't change my point that they are presenting a slice of data about one thing and implying it means something else.

Like I said in my post - in 10 years I bet this will truly mean what they imply it means now. I certainly see the trend, and your halo stats align with that - but the data they use to make their point don't actually make their point

@Pedro: Gotta agree, but like I said I can't wrap my head around watching people play games when I could just play them myself.

I have so much trouble understanding stream views as a metric. YouTube is far more popular than the most active streaming platforms, yet no one uses that as a metric, because that would be stupid.

Maybe, or maybe we live in an age people would rather watch other people play games than play games themselves.

regardless, i'm thinking Call of Duty and Halo Infinite will be just fine.. Call of Duty is still topping charts and Halo Infinite clearly has the largest base of players the game has seen to date (20 million at last count and it launched last month) .. BF2042 seems to have it's own set of problems but that's likely another discussion..

not every game is going to attract tons of Twitch views.. and that's fine.. as @BassMan illustrated, Battle Royale is just better designed for that medium.. but clearly there's room for differing levels of success, particularly in the FPS genre..

I'm sure Doom Eternal was both a critical and commercial success but likely doesn't have a very large Twitch following..

I personally believe we'll see Battle Royale introduced into Halo Infinite during it's "10 year" lifespan and maybe that'll help the Twitch presence.. But until then, i think they just wanted to make a good Halo game.. on that front, i think they succeeded.. as far as Call of Duty, i hope they stop the annual releases and give the teams more time to innovate and/or do other projects..

It may just be that a new audience is interested in watching others play games and not necessarily a transition of gamers being more interested in watching others play games.

Watched a couple of Streams. Mostly asshole trolls spamming emotes for attention and when you can talk it's "MONEY GIB" for that privilege.

No?

This why I was suspect on MS crowing about 20 million players. Halo is good, but it doesn't seem to have legs like what's already out there. Guess MS is gonna have to buy every popular shooter dev until they have the hot one again.

That is interesting point of view coming from you. Weren't you the one celebrating that Sea of Thieves was a flop? Now it has more people playing it than all the games you have hyped. Funny how that worked out.😎

Pretty much how I feel these days when it comes to modern MP games they don't appeal to me I aged out.

Sea of Thieves sucks. You don't have to celebrate games like that anymore, Pedro. Microsoft bought themselves much better shit now.

@warmblur said:

Pretty much how I feel these days when it comes to modern MP games they don't appeal to me I aged out.

yeah man remember quake 3 arena an unreal tournament an stuff tribes im too old for this new shiz

Not very stealthy downplaying of Halo: Infinite with this OP. ;o

Much mooaaar creative stealth is needed TC if you want to fool us SW vets. lol :P

Still bitter and even more bitter that the game surpassed all the games you hyped.😂

Battlefield 2042 and Vanguarde are bad examples, the worst games in their respective series.

I mean look at how awful this game looks and feels, in every part of its existence. It sucks all the fun out.

@hardwenzen: can also attest to this.

Halo is just grade A incompetence by 343. They've done a bad job with their progression, their battle pass, and are taking long to fix shit (BTB is broken right now). The game itself bangs and was doing hot, HCS was doing hot.

Beyond that, sure the market has shifted towards the battle royale being king of the mountain, but those games are frankly kind of boring after awhile, Halo is a lot closer to a proper competitive game than those likes as well. Its the BRs that are by nature a casual game, their appeal is there general randomness and luck factor to give people less stressful Ls.

Losing as a team in Siege, Halo, or even bitch ass CoD, is more on the players, less on "oh we just dropped in a bad spot, oh he just made it to a gun first, oh they just got the drop on us out of nowhere"