I Agree With Cliffy, I dont Understand Mirror's Edge

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xX0LDSCH00LXx

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#51 xX0LDSCH00LXx
Member since 2007 • 1423 Posts
i understand mirrors edge.. I just dont like itVendettaRed07
I wont even download it from the marketplace.
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skrat_01

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#52 skrat_01
Member since 2007 • 33767 Posts
[QUOTE="glitchgeeman"]

[QUOTE="Jamiemydearx3"]Mirror Edge is good, but the gun play is very..Very terrible. As is the A.I.JangoWuzHere

If I'm not mistaken, the gun play is meant to suck. The game encourages you to NOT use guns. Why would anyone buy Mirror's Edge with the intent of playing it as a shooter? You're supposed to find creative ways to beat your opponents, and firing a gun is not very creative (unless you're going to do it Stanglehold style in slow-motion :P).

I will admit though, the AI is pretty stupid, I hope they get tougher in the later levels.

terrible excuse.

If you are going to implant a feature its best for the devs. to make it work its best.

I know its not a shooter but if you are going to allow guns and such then at least make those parts fun.

Agreed.

I think the shooting aspect needs to be redesigned completely, otherwise the other mechanics seem to work seamlessly.

From the 'Offical Discussion' thread:

My biggest gripe is that the combat isnt fluid at all.

It feels so awkward and jumpy compared to the flow of the running, it really kills the pace. Same with the shooting mechanics, and the way it has been done.

There (indeed) needs to be more motion during combat, and much better use of the first person POV.

For instance when Faith is holding a pistol her arm should be out towards the center of the screen, and move correctly while in motion - having it almost static in the corner looks way too odd.

Combat needs to be more fluid than stopping and waiting for a guy to swing at your to disarm - or waiting to time a kick. There should be more focus on movement in combat, and disarming on the fly - running from your enemies, and using weapons to fire back rather than aggressively attack or fire fowards.

Kind of like in John Woo movies - lets say hard boiled - how the characters always move during combat, leaping over things ect. However when they move with weapons they always fire them defensiveley blind firing as they move, roll, jump ect.

Im not sure how you could do this game design wise, but it would suit ME well.

Having some sort of ability for the character to perceive where she is being fired at from, and blind fire with the push of a button / trigger (causing the a.i. to slow down the chase, and possibly be forced to cover), while the player figures out an escape route.

If you have combat it needs to be much more mobile and fluid like the rest of the game - however it needs more of an element of risk (attacking with weapons, firing back ect.) than scaling / leaping across the environment.


Think it was the darkness, but in it you could use how it did handing dual weapons as an example. Both hands moved almost independently, and they did seem to have plenty of auto aim, however they were inaccurate it was a tradeoff for the amount of firepower too pistols could dish out, and encouraged the player to move with them, and play aggressively because of the 'special kills' you could do when you were in a close proximity of a baddie (e.g. stick a pistol in a dudes mouth).


What I am trying to say is Faiths arms need to more far more independently during combat than they do. A traditional shooter st-yled crosshair in the center (resulting in firing fowards and agressive gunplay) does not cut it, as it does not fit the flow and sty-le of the game at all tbh.

skrat_01

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GranReyUno

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#53 GranReyUno
Member since 2007 • 1542 Posts

Everyone let's not take Cliffy B. so serious, for one he likes being called Cliffy B. plus he is no different than those gamers who never touches a single player campaign and play online 48hrs straight living off nothing more than Snicker bars and Mountain Dew.

He is bound to not make sense here and there but knows his way around a shooter.

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BioShockOwnz

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#54 BioShockOwnz
Member since 2006 • 52901 Posts

I already believed, but if I wouldn't have, the demo would've made me a believer. Yessir!

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PSP107

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#55 PSP107
Member since 2007 • 18982 Posts
looks boring
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VendettaRed07

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#56 VendettaRed07
Member since 2007 • 14012 Posts
[QUOTE="SSCyborg"]

[QUOTE="gunswordfist"][QUOTE="VendettaRed07"]the only thing about this game is that because of the lack of combat, and your mostly on the run, the story i think should be more compelling than, you have to deliver a message.. yay. Or the world should have like, you know more people in it that you can run through or interact with.Planeforger

Games are about gameplay, not story. Nobody is going to buy ME for its story.

:S

I'd buy ME for its story. It is an RPG after all.

He was clearly talking about Mirror's Edge, not Mass Effect (also, Mass Effect had a -very- disappointing story that ended just when it was getting interesting, but that's off-topic).

But yeah, I agree that there are some games, like RPGs and adventure games, that people will buy for their stories. Mirror's Edge won't be one of those games.

my point being that i need some motivation to run away more than delivering letters, normally i wouldnt care as much if there was more combat in this game but 90% of the time your just running away and delivering messages (from what i hear and thats basically exactly what the demo was) but i just think that story is needed more in a game like this because i just would get kinda bored just running around and running away from guys without a real reason to do so, they wanna kill me i know, but thats kinda weak i think

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Leejjohno

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#57 Leejjohno
Member since 2005 • 13897 Posts
I really enjoyed the Demo. As for Cliffy? Your opinion actually holds more weight than his going by that guys gaming opinions.
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VendettaRed07

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#58 VendettaRed07
Member since 2007 • 14012 Posts

cliffy b is like micheal bay. they can't understand anything that doesn't blow up with lots of fire.ronniepage588

god, i wish that was true. If only transformers had been all explosions and fire. Instead it was lame/ horrible stock jokes with stupid characters that i dont care about, lame RIdICULOUSLY lame story, and then an hour and a half later optimus prime shows up, does nothing, a few explosions happen and shia laboufhoehfe saves the day.. wohoo

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-Mad_Rhetoric-

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#59 -Mad_Rhetoric-
Member since 2008 • 1765 Posts
i understand mirrors edge.. I just dont like itVendettaRed07
I understand mirrors edge but I don't know if I like it
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Timstuff

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#60 Timstuff
Member since 2002 • 26840 Posts
Unfortunately, I've even met some people who are interested in Mirror's Edge and yet they still don't "get it." I was talking with one of my room mates about the game, and his reaction was "Oh yeah, that game looks so cool. It's like, the guards are all around you, and then you see your legs come up and kick the snot out of them!" The point of this game is not that it's a first person shooter where you can do Karate. It's a platform game with a first person camera, that attempts to emulate what it feels like to do parkour. Unfortunately, today's weapon-obsessed game consumers seem to only care about wether or not a game has cool fighting and / or shooting mechanics. I'm worried that some of these more shallow people, once they play the game will be disappointed that it doesn't play the way they expected, and then move on. People would rather play a game like Ninja Gaiden that is mercilessly violent and full of swords and sorcery, than play a game that lets you feel what it's like to be a real Ninja. :(
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Omni-Wrath

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#61 Omni-Wrath
Member since 2008 • 1970 Posts
[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

he doesn't understand Metal Gear Solid 4,

VanHelsingBoA64

Hmm? Cliffy B has stated he's actually a Kojima fan.

Although, I do agree this was a rather dumb thing to say.

He said he loved the game.

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Rockman999

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#62 Rockman999
Member since 2005 • 7507 Posts
Ahh the good ole' open zone at N4G.com,the place where the fun is at.I advise anyone who gets tired of SW's opression choked atmosphere to vacation over at N4G' open zone for tons of laughter.Anayways there's no need for me to comment any further since I already comented in the original news post.
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-Mad_Rhetoric-

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#63 -Mad_Rhetoric-
Member since 2008 • 1765 Posts

Unfortunately, I've even met some people who are interested in Mirror's Edge and yet they still don't "get it." I was talking with one of my room mates about the game, and his reaction was "Oh yeah, that game looks so cool. It's like, the guards are all around you, and then you see your legs come up and kick the snot out of them!" The point of this game is not that it's a first person shooter where you can do Karate. It's a platform game with a first person camera, that attempts to emulate what it feels like to do parkour. Unfortunately, today's weapon-obsessed game consumers seem to only care about wether or not a game has cool fighting and / or shooting mechanics. I'm worried that some of these more shallow people, once they play the game will be disappointed that it doesn't play the way they expected, and then move on. People would rather play a game like Ninja Gaiden that is mercilessly violent and full of swords and sorcery, than play a game that lets you feel what it's like to be a real Ninja. :(Timstuff

fortunatly people can choose what they want to play, im sure many people will buy ME but there are many gamers that don't see what you see, does that make me bad?

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munu9

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#64 munu9
Member since 2004 • 11109 Posts
What's not to understand about mirrors edge? You jump around tall building in first person and beat up bad guys. :|
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Eyezonmii

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#65 Eyezonmii
Member since 2008 • 2145 Posts

SO games now need to be understood to be good?

ITS A VIDEO GAME.

Atleast Mirror's edge looks different than your tpyical run and gun game...it does new stuff, i don't care if its a chick doing some odd things, if it looks cool and plays fun, thats what counts.

Cliffy was being to picky for the hell of it, so people can talk about him, his ego's through the roof after he did a flook with gears of war (thanks to the many games that inspired it) he thinks his the best developer in the world.

I don't hate him, but like any other OVER the top talking devs, they need to hold back a bit. its just gets silly.

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C_BozkurT_C

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#66 C_BozkurT_C
Member since 2008 • 3580 Posts

Then maybe Cliffy's an idiot-Sniper99-

or maybe some find Mirror's Edge dull?

everyone has opinions ya know

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scorch-62

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#67 scorch-62
Member since 2006 • 29763 Posts
The only thing I don't understand is why the hell it's in first-person. O.o
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Vax45

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#68 Vax45
Member since 2005 • 4834 Posts

It looks like it has its ups and downs.

For one, I agree that the combat looks stiff, but it looks like the devs make it up for highlighting the area's you need to go rather than wasting several frustrating minutes looking for a way out.

That's my first impression.

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foxhound_fox

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#69 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts
It probably has something to do with him being the exact opposite of the type of person who the game was designed for.
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deactivated-5d6e91f5c147a

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#70 deactivated-5d6e91f5c147a
Member since 2008 • 26108 Posts

The only thing I don't understand is why the hell it's in first-person. O.oscorch-62

Because it's different? Plowing through uncharted waters?

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AvIdGaMeR444

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#71 AvIdGaMeR444
Member since 2004 • 7031 Posts

people still listen to Cliify? hes a dim wit. Really he is a total idiot.JangoWuzHere

Just like CliffyB said Dead Space is an awesome game and would be a sleeper hit. Many people laughed at that and called CliffyB an idiot assuming the game would stink. Like it or not, he was right. Also, if everyone here is going to call him a moron for what he said about Mirror's Edge, then I guess you have the exact same opinion of Jeff Gerstmann since he hates Mirror's Edge and basically said on Bonus Round he didn't get the game either. He said seeing the edges of your arms and legs is annoying while moving, and he did not understand why the game is not in 3rd person.

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Eyezonmii

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#72 Eyezonmii
Member since 2008 • 2145 Posts

[QUOTE="JangoWuzHere"]people still listen to Cliify? hes a dim wit. Really he is a total idiot.AvIdGaMeR444

Just like CliffyB said Dead Space is an awesome game and would be a sleeper hit. Many people laughed at that and called CliffyB an idiot assuming the game would stink. Like it or not, he was right. Also, if everyone here is going to call him a moron for what he said about Mirror's Edge, then I guess you have the exact same opinion of Jeff Gerstmann since he hates Mirror's Edge and basically said on Bonus Round he didn't get the game either. He said seeing the edges of your arms and legs is annoying while moving, and he did not understand why the game is not in 3rd person.

err. maybe because they want the player to feel more immersed?, 3rd person perspective can't achieve that.

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Zerual

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#73 Zerual
Member since 2008 • 379 Posts
I don't see the fun in mirrors edge.
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PS2_ROCKS

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#74 PS2_ROCKS
Member since 2003 • 4679 Posts

I don't see the fun in mirrors edge. Zerual

Have you played it?

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kemar7856

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#75 kemar7856
Member since 2004 • 11789 Posts
cliffy rep +10 for gears 2 and this article I'll make judgement when I play the full game
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WilliamRLBaker

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#76 WilliamRLBaker
Member since 2006 • 28915 Posts
I dont see the point in mirrors edge either and will say for sures its at best an AA game *gamerankings* and wont sell much at all lucky to break 1.5m units if that.
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rolo107

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#77 rolo107
Member since 2007 • 5469 Posts

Then you're brain cannot properly conprehend maybe? I'm asking since its pretty simple what the game is about. Cedmln

And you cannot properly comprehend how to spell?

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Zerual

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#78 Zerual
Member since 2008 • 379 Posts

[QUOTE="Zerual"]I don't see the fun in mirrors edge. PS2_ROCKS

Have you played it?

Not yet, but from what I've seen it doesn't look entertaining. Maybe my mind will change once I play the demo.

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Sword-Demon

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#79 Sword-Demon
Member since 2008 • 7007 Posts

[QUOTE="Cedmln"]Then you're brain cannot properly conprehend maybe? I'm asking since its pretty simple what the game is about. rolo107

And you cannot properly comprehend how to spell?

....thats a bit on the low side, dont u think?

calling out someone's typo just because you dont have a proper comeback?

... anyway, back on topic, i think it looks cool i'll probably rent it

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Leejjohno

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#80 Leejjohno
Member since 2005 • 13897 Posts

[QUOTE="-Sniper99-"]Then maybe Cliffy's an idiotC_BozkurT_C

or maybe some find Mirror's Edge dull?

everyone has opinions ya know

lol... mirrors edge dull? That's fairly ironic in my book.

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treelog82

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#81 treelog82
Member since 2008 • 608 Posts

God Cliffy B is such a MORON! I would hate to here his opinion of a game like SotC lol. "durr I just dont get it....like ...you stab giant rocks.... wheres da gunz?"

First his lame jealosy comment about MGS4 and now this :lol:

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IgGy621985

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#82 IgGy621985
Member since 2004 • 5922 Posts
Cliffy is a midget.
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Ren_eko

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#83 Ren_eko
Member since 2008 • 764 Posts

God Cliffy B is such a MORON! I would hate to here his opinion of a game like SotC lol. "durr I just dont get it....like ...you stab giant rocks.... wheres da gunz?"

First his lame jealosy comment about MGS4 and now this :lol:

treelog82

MGS4 comments? Link please...i dont remember that :P.

EDIT: I googled it... a good lol moment :D.

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NickD09

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#84 NickD09
Member since 2008 • 46 Posts
played the demo and thought nice tech demo...do not understand the appeal of this game at all
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Mystery_Writer

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#85 Mystery_Writer
Member since 2004 • 8351 Posts
i can't wait for this game. i love the white theme so much.. reminds me of some of the last levels in Riddick and the early clean levels of portal
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TreyoftheDead

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#86 TreyoftheDead
Member since 2007 • 7982 Posts

[QUOTE="JangoWuzHere"]people still listen to Cliify? hes a dim wit. Really he is a total idiot.AvIdGaMeR444

Just like CliffyB said Dead Space is an awesome game and would be a sleeper hit. Many people laughed at that and called CliffyB an idiot assuming the game would stink. Like it or not, he was right. Also, if everyone here is going to call him a moron for what he said about Mirror's Edge, then I guess you have the exact same opinion of Jeff Gerstmann since he hates Mirror's Edge and basically said on Bonus Round he didn't get the game either. He said seeing the edges of your arms and legs is annoying while moving, and he did not understand why the game is not in 3rd person.

That's because Jeff G. and Cliffy B. are interested in the same things. Have you seen the interview between the two on Giant Bomb? Have you ever heard Jeff speak about his favorite movies? You know, the big action blockbusters? Cliffy makes games like those.

I really like Jeff G., but I find that my tastes differs with him almost 90% of the time. A lot of his favorite games, I love, but there are a great number of games that I'm crazy about that he seems to hate. Mirror's Edge seems to be one of them. Jeff G. is Cliffy B. with more "culture", he can appreciate games that aren't about shooting and even love them (LittleBigPlanet), but he seems to prefer games like Gears. Which is fine. :)

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Saxsoon

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#87 Saxsoon
Member since 2007 • 1021 Posts

Cliffy B is a moron who got lucky. He doesn't understand Mirrors Edge, he doesn't understand Metal Gear Solid 4, he is the guy who you see at the mall who just talks for hours about the newest action flicks, who is in the new die hard, the new terminator, etc. but when you stop talking about those movies and ask him if he liked american history X, Crash, etc.

Cliffy B probably thinks Stephen Colbert voted for John McCain.

darth-pyschosis
Sadly there are people I know who are quite intelligent (liberals and conservatives) that think that Colbert is a Republican. I can tell he is not one and I am one.
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SpruceCaboose

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#88 SpruceCaboose
Member since 2005 • 24589 Posts
As fun as it is to whip on Cliffy B, I think he is being mis-understood.
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munu9

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#89 munu9
Member since 2004 • 11109 Posts
[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

Cliffy B is a moron who got lucky. He doesn't understand Mirrors Edge, he doesn't understand Metal Gear Solid 4, he is the guy who you see at the mall who just talks for hours about the newest action flicks, who is in the new die hard, the new terminator, etc. but when you stop talking about those movies and ask him if he liked american history X, Crash, etc.

Cliffy B probably thinks Stephen Colbert voted for John McCain.

Saxsoon

Sadly there are people I know who are quite intelligent (liberals and conservatives) that think that Colbert is a Republican. I can tell he is not one and I am one.

LMAO, the conservatives you think Steven Colbert is republican are getting self owned :lol:

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SpruceCaboose

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#90 SpruceCaboose
Member since 2005 • 24589 Posts
[QUOTE="darth-pyschosis"]

Cliffy B is a moron who got lucky. He doesn't understand Mirrors Edge, he doesn't understand Metal Gear Solid 4, he is the guy who you see at the mall who just talks for hours about the newest action flicks, who is in the new die hard, the new terminator, etc. but when you stop talking about those movies and ask him if he liked american history X, Crash, etc.

Cliffy B probably thinks Stephen Colbert voted for John McCain.

Saxsoon

Sadly there are people I know who are quite intelligent (liberals and conservatives) that think that Colbert is a Republican. I can tell he is not one and I am one.

Its called satire, and he does it dang near perfectly.

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Gh0st_Of_0nyx

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#91 Gh0st_Of_0nyx
Member since 2007 • 8992 Posts
I understand that its an amazing game and cliffy B is a typical lemming cry baby that wants guns and explosions in every game with a FP perspectives.
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IgGy621985

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#92 IgGy621985
Member since 2004 • 5922 Posts

I understand that its an amazing game and cliffy B is a typical lemming cry baby that wants guns and explosions in every game with a FP perspectives.Gh0st_Of_0nyx

Well, you just kinda described most of the Hollywood blockbuster which make insane amounts of cash.

So I guess guns and explosions = win.

Sad, but true.

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voxware00

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#93 voxware00
Member since 2004 • 5018 Posts

cliffyb is insecure of his masculinity so he is too afraid to play as a female protagonist

melee > guns

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shadow_hosi

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#94 shadow_hosi
Member since 2006 • 9543 Posts

I have come to hate cliffy B.

apparently if it dosent have tons of guns, enough blood to drown shack, and tons of badittude then he cant understand it lulz

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LordDhampire

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#95 LordDhampire
Member since 2006 • 772 Posts
I stopped reading after ......the I Agree with Cliffy B part.....
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Rockman999

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#96 Rockman999
Member since 2005 • 7507 Posts
played the demo and thought nice tech demo...do not understand the appeal of this game at allNickD09
It's a first person platformer whats not to get.
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#97 clembo1990
Member since 2005 • 9976 Posts

Its awesome. What's not to understand?

Is it me or are gamers getting dumber?

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shadow_hosi

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#98 shadow_hosi
Member since 2006 • 9543 Posts

Its awesome. What's not to understand?

Is it me or are gamers getting dumber?

clembo1990

they are, i blame ppl like CliffyB TBH

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#99 sonicmj1
Member since 2003 • 9130 Posts

As fun as it is to whip on Cliffy B, I think he is being mis-understood.SpruceCaboose

Must agree with you here. If all he had seen was the running and jumping, and he hadn't played the demo, I could understand that criticism to some extent. From what I could tell, the role the soldiers serve really isn't that different from Mario goombas, except they're more threatening. You deal with them quickly, or you avoid them, and you keep moving.

Now that the demo's out, though, I'd hope it'd be clear what the focus is. I wonder whether he still feels the same way about it.

If he does, I would certainly disagree with his views. I'm personally of the belief that most games have too MUCH combat, and that the number of encounters should be reduced for many games. Mirror's Edge is certainly not a game that would benefit from forcing the character to hunker down and take out soldiers with guns every five minutes. It would break the pacing, and it would change the nature of the character. If she could win in a five-on-one fight with the guards every time, then why is she running from things? The gameplay would cease to be internally consistent.

I sort of agree with skrat's views posted earlier, though. At the moment, at least for me as a fairly inexperienced player, disarms are pretty clunky. Perhaps this would change as the player gets more experienced, but disarming guards should be a pretty smooth process that doesn't slow you down much. And I can see how blind-firing a weapon while running would add to the frantic, being-chased feel. But 'gunplay' in the traditional sense should be something that is kept to a minimum in Mirror's Edge. Everything should compliment the core gameplay conceit, not act against it.

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#100 sonicmj1
Member since 2003 • 9130 Posts

I have come to hate cliffy B.

apparently if it dosent have tons of guns, enough blood to drown shack, and tons of badittude then he cant understand it lulz

shadow_hosi

Then why is Shigeru Miyamoto his favorite game designer?

While he certainly doesn't do much to contradict those conceptions of him, I think a lot of people misunderstand Cliffy.