I worry about the strategies of MS and Sony next gen - plz dont go casual!

MS and Sony gotta be looking at Nintendo right now and wishing they were in the same position. I mean Nintendo is making money hand over fist by rebundling old hardware with waggle at a PROFIT and winning the console war! ridiculous.

I cant bare to see MS and Sony, two good gaming companies, going down Nintendo's path and making cost effective consoles for the casuals that will not be as powerful as they could be and have some kind of junkycasual controllers. I don't really see how this wont happen next gen with all the money Wii is making and it really bugs me.

Gaming was "casual" way before the wii going by your definition the ps1/ps2 casualized gaming.

Seriously though "casual: is such an overused term, the same effectiveness it had a day ago has been reduced greatly.

MS and Sony gotta be looking at Nintendo right now and wishing they were in the same position. I mean Nintendo is making money hand over fist by rebundling old hardware with waggle at a PROFIT and winning the console war! ridiculous.

I cant bare to see MS and Sony, two good gaming companies, going down Nintendo's path and making cost effective consoles for the casuals that will not be as powerful as they could be and have some kind of junkycasual controllers. I don't really see how this wont happen next gen with all the money Wii is making and it really bugs me.

surfer_dude_

Did you just start gaming? This is the first time a Nintendo console is not better then the competition(minus x-box) and they stated next gen will be HD and up to par with the competition. you must of started gaming last gen.

[QUOTE="surfer_dude_"]

MS and Sony gotta be looking at Nintendo right now and wishing they were in the same position. I mean Nintendo is making money hand over fist by rebundling old hardware with waggle at a PROFIT and winning the console war! ridiculous.

I cant bare to see MS and Sony, two good gaming companies, going down Nintendo's path and making cost effective consoles for the casuals that will not be as powerful as they could be and have some kind of junkycasual controllers. I don't really see how this wont happen next gen with all the money Wii is making and it really bugs me.

X_Evo

Did you just start gaming? This is the first time a Nintendo console is not better then the competition(minus x-box) and they stated next gen will be HD and up to par with the competition. you must of started gaming last gen.

I think he did.

Gaming was "casual" way before the wii going by your definition the ps1/ps2 casualized gaming.

Seriously though "casual: is such an overused term, the same effectiveness it had a day ago has been reduced greatly.

Marth6781

[QUOTE="Marth6781"]

Gaming was "casual" way before the wii going by your definition the ps1/ps2 casualized gaming.

Seriously though "casual: is such an overused term, the same effectiveness it had a day ago has been reduced greatly.

WuTangG

not in the first year.

[QUOTE="WuTangG"][QUOTE="Marth6781"]

Gaming was "casual" way before the wii going by your definition the ps1/ps2 casualized gaming.

Seriously though "casual: is such an overused term, the same effectiveness it had a day ago has been reduced greatly.

Marth6781

not in the first year.

[QUOTE="Marth6781"]

Gaming was "casual" way before the wii going by your definition the ps1/ps2 casualized gaming.

Seriously though "casual: is such an overused term, the same effectiveness it had a day ago has been reduced greatly.

WuTangG

i'll agree about the ps2 but ps1?! lol NO

[QUOTE="WuTangG"][QUOTE="Marth6781"]

Gaming was "casual" way before the wii going by your definition the ps1/ps2 casualized gaming.

Seriously though "casual: is such an overused term, the same effectiveness it had a day ago has been reduced greatly.

Marth6781

not in the first year.

[QUOTE="WuTangG"][QUOTE="Marth6781"]

Gaming was "casual" way before the wii going by your definition the ps1/ps2 casualized gaming.

Seriously though "casual: is such an overused term, the same effectiveness it had a day ago has been reduced greatly.

Marth6781

not in the first year.

Bad news, gaming is mainstream now and we are the dinosaurs, don't take it so bad, it happens to every niche hobby.Riverwolf007

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

Arentlike over 90% of console gamers like casuals. I dont mind the consoles becoming more "casualised" (heh) as long as there are a few games that appeal to the more "hardcore" fanbase. But then again ive always thought consoles and their games were made for casuals. Isnt that right?

[QUOTE="Marth6781"][QUOTE="WuTangG"][QUOTE="Marth6781"]

Gaming was "casual" way before the wii going by your definition the ps1/ps2 casualized gaming.

Seriously though "casual: is such an overused term, the same effectiveness it had a day ago has been reduced greatly.

WuTangG

not in the first year.

I really wish that was true. I hate short, simple and/or easy games. However judging by the marketplace in 2007 most people wan't casual crap.Moreover if a company can sell more copies of some game that costs nothing to make on Wii. Why would they spend Millions to game that could not sell? From a business stand point it is not even a question. Hopefully enough of the people who make games will be visionariesinstead of Scrooge Mcduck swimming in their mountains of casual cash.

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

Meu2k7

What do you mean, "don't go casual". They already ARE casual. Casual gamers dominate the market and make up the vast majority of audience for ANY console.

What genres do casuals play? They play shooters, sports and arcade racers. What genres are starting to dominate the library of any console? Genres the casuals play.

What games are casuals likely to buy? The new, original, innovative title? No...they buy heavily hyped, heavily advertised games that are popular and considered cool and all their friends own. Casuals buy games like Halo or any game that is a big name sequal. Look at what is happening to game libraries for pretty much any console? the Wii is full of casual games like party games, mini-game collections and licensed cartoon games. The 360 and PS3 are heavily focused on sequals and rehashes, and the shorter the games are to make it easier to pump them out yearly, the better as far as companies are concerned.

Too late friends. The companis are already killing themselves to get more casuals.

[QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

jack_russel

Doesnt Hardcore mean that you are a gamer enthusaist that plays tons of games that rarely get much attention from the masses? Thats part of the defintion isnt it?

FPS are up there with sports now practically, I'm a huge shooter fan, played them for years ... but Im kinda hoping another genre dominates soon ... if shooters are gonna be like this for the foreseeble future then quite frankly gaming market is in trouble when it comes to innovation and interest, the market wont expand.

[QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

Meu2k7

Doesnt Hardcore mean that you are a gamer enthusaist that plays tons of games that rarely get much attention from the masses? Thats part of the defintion isnt it?

FPS are up there with sports now practically, I'm a huge shooter fan, played them for years ... but Im kinda hoping another genre dominates soon ... if shooters are gonna be like this for the foreseeble future then quite frankly gaming market is in trouble when it comes to innovation and interest, the market wont expand.

[QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

jack_russel

Casual gamers love mindless twitch games...that means EXACTLY Halo 3 and Bioshock. You don't get millions in sales because of "hardcore gamers". You get it by making a cool game with huge hype that will bring in the casual majority.

Games like cooking mama appeal to a totally different breed of casuals...the typically NON gamers like children and adults whose only gaming knowledge revolves around Tetris and Bejewelled.

What do you mean, "don't go casual". They already ARE casual. Casual gamers dominate the market and make up the vast majority of audience for ANY console.

What genres do casuals play? They play shooters, sports and arcade racers. What genres are starting to dominate the library of any console? Genres the casuals play.

What games are casuals likely to buy? The new, original, innovative title? No...they buy heavily hyped, heavily advertised games that are popular and considered cool and all their friends own. Casuals buy games like Halo or any game that is a big name sequal. Look at what is happening to game libraries for pretty much any console? the Wii is full of casual games like party games, mini-game collections and licensed cartoon games. The 360 and PS3 are heavily focused on sequals and rehashes, and the shorter the games are to make it easier to pump them out yearly, the better as far as companies are concerned.

Too late friends. The companis are already killing themselves to get more casuals.

ZIMdoom

[QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

ZIMdoom

Casual gamers love mindless twitch games...that means EXACTLY Halo 3 and Bioshock. You don't get millions in sales because of "hardcore gamers". You get it by making a cool game with huge hype that will bring in the casual majority.

Games like cooking mama appeal to a totally different breed of casuals...the typically NON gamers like children and adults whose only gaming knowledge revolves around Tetris and Bejewelled.

[QUOTE="Meu2k7"][QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

jack_russel

Doesnt Hardcore mean that you are a gamer enthusaist that plays tons of games that rarely get much attention from the masses? Thats part of the defintion isnt it?

FPS are up there with sports now practically, I'm a huge shooter fan, played them for years ... but Im kinda hoping another genre dominates soon ... if shooters are gonna be like this for the foreseeble future then quite frankly gaming market is in trouble when it comes to innovation and interest, the market wont expand.

You hit the nail on the head. There is no such thing as a hardcore game. The term "hardcore game" was invented by the new casual dominating the market who doesn't care about games or the industry but they spend a lot of money to jump on the bandwagon. They define themselve by what they buy, and so they call the games they are most likely to buy "hardcore." But really, they just bought those games because they are typically mindless games with shiny graphics and cool explosions.

I seriously cringe and a part of my soul dies when I hear the term "hardcore GAME". All I see is someone who defines themselves through their possessions and thinks because their games are violent they must be "hardcore" so they must be "hardcore" for playing them. ALl I see is a hardcore consumer.

[QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"][QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

ZIMdoom

Doesnt Hardcore mean that you are a gamer enthusaist that plays tons of games that rarely get much attention from the masses? Thats part of the defintion isnt it?

FPS are up there with sports now practically, I'm a huge shooter fan, played them for years ... but Im kinda hoping another genre dominates soon ... if shooters are gonna be like this for the foreseeble future then quite frankly gaming market is in trouble when it comes to innovation and interest, the market wont expand.

You hit the nail on the head. There is no such thing as a hardcore game. The term "hardcore game" was invented by the new casual dominating the market who doesn't care about games or the industry but they spend a lot of money to jump on the bandwagon. They define themselve by what they buy, and so they call the games they are most likely to buy "hardcore." But really, they just bought those games because they are typically mindless games with shiny graphics and cool explosions.

I seriously cringe and a part of my soul dies when I hear the term "hardcore GAME". All I see is someone who defines themselves through their possessions and thinks because their games are violent they must be "hardcore" so they must be "hardcore" for playing them. ALl I see is a hardcore consumer.

[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"][QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

jack_russel

Casual gamers love mindless twitch games...that means EXACTLY Halo 3 and Bioshock. You don't get millions in sales because of "hardcore gamers". You get it by making a cool game with huge hype that will bring in the casual majority.

Games like cooking mama appeal to a totally different breed of casuals...the typically NON gamers like children and adults whose only gaming knowledge revolves around Tetris and Bejewelled.

I consider the term "gamer" as someone who plays games enough that it becomes part of their image. Old ladies playing bejewelled for 5 minutes over their coffee break doesn't make them a gamer, any more than me watching one sporting event a year makes me a sports fan.

I am confident if you asked those people if they are gamers, they would look at you like an alien and say, "I play games sometimes". There is a difference between a "gamer" and someone who plays games. Just like there is a difference between myself watching an occassionaly football game and someone who actually CARES about sports.

[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"][QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"][QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

jack_russel

Doesnt Hardcore mean that you are a gamer enthusaist that plays tons of games that rarely get much attention from the masses? Thats part of the defintion isnt it?

FPS are up there with sports now practically, I'm a huge shooter fan, played them for years ... but Im kinda hoping another genre dominates soon ... if shooters are gonna be like this for the foreseeble future then quite frankly gaming market is in trouble when it comes to innovation and interest, the market wont expand.

You hit the nail on the head. There is no such thing as a hardcore game. The term "hardcore game" was invented by the new casual dominating the market who doesn't care about games or the industry but they spend a lot of money to jump on the bandwagon. They define themselve by what they buy, and so they call the games they are most likely to buy "hardcore." But really, they just bought those games because they are typically mindless games with shiny graphics and cool explosions.

I seriously cringe and a part of my soul dies when I hear the term "hardcore GAME". All I see is someone who defines themselves through their possessions and thinks because their games are violent they must be "hardcore" so they must be "hardcore" for playing them. ALl I see is a hardcore consumer.

I wish more people thought about stuff instead of just repeating what everyone else says.

No seriously, it's just some games. The TC was trying to say that he didn't want cooking mama and Petz too flood the next gen libraries like theyr'e doing with the wii. Thats all.jack_russel

Neither do I, I dont ind them existing, but I want gaming to appeal to the adult market ... PROPERLY ... not "Zomg guns n blood 18++" because in reality that only appeals to current gamers and teens/pre-teens.

I hope a game like Alan Wake , will give birth to a Novel-Like set of thriller games based on atmoshper and story, not how well you can shoot abunch of army men.

No seriously, it's just some games. The TC was trying to say that he didn't want cooking mama and Petz too flood the next gen libraries like theyr'e doing with the wii. Thats all.jack_russel

I agree with your exact words. I don't want that either. But as a real GAMER, I don't want ANY genre to dominate. Yet the way I see it, the real casuals are the people with an entire library made up of every crap shooter and sports sequal that comes out.

I stand by every one of my posts. MS and Sony are already casual and heavily catering to casuals. People just fail to see it because the bar for real gamers has been set so low due to casuals who think THEY hard real gamers. They have lowered the bar so low that they now callgrandma's and 5 year olds "casual" so they must be hardcore!

I think this is a very important debate that needs to be discussed. Otherwise casuals will continue to lower the bar and ALL gamers will be hurt as a result. Consoles will continue to only make sequals, rehashes and 5 hour shooters while diverse, original and innovative games die out.

[QUOTE="jack_russel"]No seriously, it's just some games. The TC was trying to say that he didn't want cooking mama and Petz too flood the next gen libraries like theyr'e doing with the wii. Thats all.ZIMdoom

I agree with your exact words. I don't want that either. But as a real GAMER, I don't want ANY genre to dominate. Yet the way I see it, the real casuals are the people with an entire library made up of every crap shooter and sports sequal that comes out.

I stand by every one of my posts. MS and Sony are already casual and heavily catering to casuals. People just fail to see it because the bar for real gamers has been set so low due to casuals who think THEY hard real gamers. They have lowered the bar so low that they now callgrandma's and 5 year olds "casual" so they must be hardcore!

I agree completely, i mean look athte consolite responses in my thread in my sig, "Keep your boring RTS/Adventure/RTS/TBS" ( even though there are more Shooters/RPG/Action ) on the list.

Yet they praise the 360s line up ... "more of the same" ... they dont open thier eyes to other genres , I know it comes down to taste but thier attitude is ridiculously casual and flawed.

[QUOTE="jack_russel"][QUOTE="Meu2k7"]

Shooter Genre is casual now, look at it, its one big massive fad that existed on the PC 5-8 years ago.

ITs gotta be the most casual genre by now, "ooo look CoD4 ... its CoD4 with new theme and graphix! Next gen yays!" ... its getting as bad as rebuying sports games every year.

Your definition of hardcore is evolving ... when games like Halo 3 & Gears of War do so well, they are not hardcore, they are being lapped up by casuals aswell.

Meu2k7

Doesnt Hardcore mean that you are a gamer enthusaist that plays tons of games that rarely get much attention from the masses? Thats part of the defintion isnt it?

FPS are up there with sports now practically, I'm a huge shooter fan, played them for years ... but Im kinda hoping another genre dominates soon ... if shooters are gonna be like this for the foreseeble future then quite frankly gaming market is in trouble when it comes to innovation and interest, the market wont expand.

Most of us have been play fps's 4 yrs and yrs that is y it is so big now. I think the TC means hardcore like ppl who have been and always will play games not ppl who only will play games no ones else plays couse 9/10 of those games suck. Gaming is mainstream so now we have a bunch of "hardcore" gamers who just want games that ppl that never play games can't just pick up and play with out months (or even yrs) of practice. Its not really harcore vs casual its more like gamer vs non gamer.

Quick Q what genre can?? other then goofy mini games??