is there any reason why microsoft would discontinue xbox 360?

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slipknot0129

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#1 slipknot0129
Member since 2008 • 5832 Posts

Is there any reason why microsoft would discontinue xbox 360? It would seem as long as xbox 360 is profitable they will continue to support xbox 360. I think they could sell it for as long as 15 more years. I think xbox 360 is in an better position than ps3 is when talking about longevity.

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KevinPlanet

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#2 KevinPlanet
Member since 2003 • 941 Posts

No. The Xbox 360 is cheap to make so they profit off of each unit sold, they make a hefty profit off of accessories (that should've been standard in the system), they profit off of software sales, licensing and first party, and they literally do nothing but make profit from XBL so...

The PS3 is actually the more future ready device. The Xbox still uses a DVD player among other things.

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arkephonic

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#3 arkephonic
Member since 2006 • 7221 Posts

Lol, sell it for 15 years? How is the 360 more suited for longevity than PS3? PS3 has more games coming out and the hardware is more future proof. If history is any indication, they'll stop selling the 360 once their next console releases and PS3 will still be available for 5+ years after PS4 releases.

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slipknot0129

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#4 slipknot0129
Member since 2008 • 5832 Posts

Lol, sell it for 15 years? How is the 360 more suited for longevity than PS3? PS3 has more games coming out and the hardware is more future proof. If history is any indication, they'll stop selling the 360 once their next console releases and PS3 will still be available for 5+ years after PS4 releases.

arkephonic

Its more profitable so they have a lot better reason to keep selling it. I think profit is the main reason to keep selling a console.

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slipknot0129

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#7 slipknot0129
Member since 2008 • 5832 Posts

I think the only thing that could cause xbox 360 to be discontinued is if the next xbox was limited by xbox live on xbox 360,then they would shut down 360 xbox live like how they did with original xbox live. But I dont think xbox 360 would limit the next xbox in anything xbox live.

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aroxx_ab

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#8 aroxx_ab
Member since 2005 • 13236 Posts

Sure if they make a Bluray version so i can watch my 3D movies so sure.

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djohnstonXCII

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#9 djohnstonXCII
Member since 2009 • 177 Posts

Once they release a new XBOX they will slowly stop production. Thats what they did with the original XBOX and they stopped supporting it no more then a year after the 360 was released

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verbtex

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#10 verbtex  Moderator
Member since 2006 • 9196 Posts

I don't see an immediate reason to give up yet. Sure they've lost momentum since the early yeasr of the genration, but hey we can't always be perfect.

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LoserMike

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#11 LoserMike
Member since 2003 • 4915 Posts

When they release a new console. So far, only Sony's shown a commitment to their old consoles after a new console is released. It already seems like Nintendo is dumping the Wii and DS after the release of the Wii-U and 3DS.

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blahsalt48

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#12 blahsalt48
Member since 2010 • 208 Posts

Lol, sell it for 15 years? How is the 360 more suited for longevity than PS3? PS3 has more games coming out and the hardware is more future proof. If history is any indication, they'll stop selling the 360 once their next console releases and PS3 will still be available for 5+ years after PS4 releases.

arkephonic

This. I was thinking the same thing when I read ark`s post. I think the 360 still has a couple years left in it, and unless the next X-box is backwards compatible, it will stick around for a little while longer. I don`t think consoles are going to be backwards compatable for much longer. When they can make more money re-releasing games for the new console. Whether it is through a disk (i.e. God of War Collection) or through download (i.e. PSOne classics) they will just make more money that way. (I know both examples are for PS3, but my 360 has been broken for a while. So it doesn`t come to mind as quick.)

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SummerHillard

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#13 SummerHillard
Member since 2011 • 414 Posts

It already seems like Nintendo is dumping the Wii and DS after the release of the Wii-U and 3DS.

LoserMike

Not until they've released all the worthwhile Wii games as $19.99 Nintendo Selects.

So far, Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess is the only one.

Then again, it's only been a little over a month since the first batch was released.

I expect several more titles to be added by the time the Wii U comes out. Then I'll play them all on the new system, and hopefully the console will be able to output video to the game pad even for Wii titles!

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BoredGames

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#14 BoredGames
Member since 2009 • 103 Posts

Other than Blu-Ray I'm not sure why people keep saying the PS3 is superior hardware-wise to the 360. The CPU is powerful but the graphics chip is inferior to the 360's. making any significant leap in processing power debatable. The most grahically impressive exclusives on the PS3 so far aren't much of a step beyond what we've seen on the 360. Hopefully Sony will re-think their approach to hardware design next generation.

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SoBaus

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#15 SoBaus
Member since 2011 • 546 Posts

When they release a new console. So far, only Sony's shown a commitment to their old consoles after a new console is released. It already seems like Nintendo is dumping the Wii and DS after the release of the Wii-U and 3DS.

LoserMike

Its smart business, imo.

helps give the old platform's install base a nudge to pickup the new system, and means you dont have to divide your resources. Its obviouslly costlier to discontinue a console you are making a hefty profit on, and encourage people to buy consoles you are taking a loss on instead... but its an investment in the future.

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darth-pyschosis

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#16 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

No. The Xbox 360 is cheap to make so they profit off of each unit sold, they make a hefty profit off of accessories (that should've been standard in the system), they profit off of software sales, licensing and first party, and they literally do nothing but make profit from XBL so...

The PS3 is actually the more future ready device. The Xbox still uses a DVD player among other things.

KevinPlanet

Typically the thing that makes a company more money is the more future ready device. Heck, most games don't use blu ray anyway. I doubt the next Xbox will either, it could simply use a Microsoft-properitary disc format like how Nintendo is using iDensity for Wii U.

It's been 5 years and I only really feel like I've gotten a handful of titles that BluRay made possible, and some of them were only due to their directors not being able to actually made a coherent, condensed package (MGS4, loved it but seriously Kojima needs to stop with 20 minute cut scenes, no longer.)

Also, with all the features and apps coming out first for XBL usually, and XBL's intergration as the main media entertainment service for Windows 8 kinda does give it more life than you would think. I mean, sure Live TV is going to be a huge thing for 360 users, especially the casual "I pick up and play Gears, COD only" users. Could you do things similar to Live TV already on other consoles? Sure, but not with this much ease for the gaming public that doesn't go onto these forums. (and not with apps designed by the big three themselves)

Xbox Live is possibly becoming the iTunes of Windows 8, so I'd say that could go a long way in extending the 360's "future" readiness.

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darth-pyschosis

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#17 darth-pyschosis
Member since 2006 • 9322 Posts

[QUOTE="LoserMike"]

When they release a new console. So far, only Sony's shown a commitment to their old consoles after a new console is released. It already seems like Nintendo is dumping the Wii and DS after the release of the Wii-U and 3DS.

SoBaus

Its smart business, imo.

helps give the old platform's install base a nudge to pickup the new system, and means you dont have to divide your resources. Its obviouslly costlier to discontinue a console you are making a hefty profit on, and encourage people to buy consoles you are taking a loss on instead... but its an investment in the future.

It's only natural.

Its about time too. The Wii is going to running on 6 years once Wii U releases, the DS was on almost 7 years. The 360 is going to be sitting at 6 years without a replacement.

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monson21502

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#18 monson21502
Member since 2009 • 8230 Posts

Lol, sell it for 15 years? How is the 360 more suited for longevity than PS3? PS3 has more games coming out and the hardware is more future proof. If history is any indication, they'll stop selling the 360 once their next console releases and PS3 will still be available for 5+ years after PS4 releases.

arkephonic
sony wont lose more fan base like they did with psp and ps3 by supporting the ps2 all these extra years. keeping the ps2 arround hurt sony or should i say ps3/psp.... ps3 will be lucky to be sold 2 years after the ps4 is launched....
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ChubbyGuy40

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#19 ChubbyGuy40
Member since 2007 • 26442 Posts

[QUOTE="arkephonic"]

Lol, sell it for 15 years? How is the 360 more suited for longevity than PS3? PS3 has more games coming out and the hardware is more future proof. If history is any indication, they'll stop selling the 360 once their next console releases and PS3 will still be available for 5+ years after PS4 releases.

slipknot0129

Its more profitable so they have a lot better reason to keep selling it. I think profit is the main reason to keep selling a console.

Just cause they keep selling it doesn't mean it'll sell. You think people would really take it over a Wii U or PS4? The PS3 is the only one that has a chance of lasting that long due to blu-ray.

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monson21502

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#20 monson21502
Member since 2009 • 8230 Posts
[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

[QUOTE="slipknot0129"]

[QUOTE="arkephonic"]

Lol, sell it for 15 years? How is the 360 more suited for longevity than PS3? PS3 has more games coming out and the hardware is more future proof. If history is any indication, they'll stop selling the 360 once their next console releases and PS3 will still be available for 5+ years after PS4 releases.

Its more profitable so they have a lot better reason to keep selling it. I think profit is the main reason to keep selling a console.

Just cause they keep selling it doesn't mean it'll sell. You think people would really take it over a Wii U or PS4? The PS3 is the only one that has a chance of lasting that long due to blu-ray.

its been 5 years.. blu ray has done almost nothing for games..... or movies either imo blu ray was all about anti pirate code room... and it why hackers attacked them....
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slvrraven9

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#21 slvrraven9
Member since 2004 • 9278 Posts
no theyre making profit on it. they just released the kinect and thats selling really well. they still have franchise games they are willing to release on the system. i see no reason other that absolute insanity that they would discontinue the xbox...
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waltefmoney

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#22 waltefmoney
Member since 2010 • 18030 Posts

Microsoft? What's that?

Oh, you mean the guyswho had absolutely nothing to showcase at E3, hardware or software? Those guys? They're still around? People are still using their machine?

Wow.

SummerHillard

You got a problem with what other people use?

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Silverbond

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#23 Silverbond
Member since 2008 • 16130 Posts

Why would Microsoft discontinue the greatest console ever?

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SoBaus

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#24 SoBaus
Member since 2011 • 546 Posts

Why would Microsoft discontinue the greatest console ever?

Silverbond

The best console ever was the dreamcast, and that was discontinued :P

Just saiyan

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Fundai

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#25 Fundai
Member since 2010 • 6120 Posts

Well its too late for wondering any way, the two companies have already broken several laws and cooperated on a 2014 or 2015 date for both their next concoles to be realeased at the same time :P

Also They can't seel it for15 years.

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Pug-Nasty

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#26 Pug-Nasty
Member since 2009 • 8508 Posts

[QUOTE="arkephonic"]

Lol, sell it for 15 years? How is the 360 more suited for longevity than PS3? PS3 has more games coming out and the hardware is more future proof. If history is any indication, they'll stop selling the 360 once their next console releases and PS3 will still be available for 5+ years after PS4 releases.

slipknot0129

Its more profitable so they have a lot better reason to keep selling it. I think profit is the main reason to keep selling a console.

The main reason to keep selling something is because demand for it still exists, and demand won't be there for the 360 for 5 more years, let alone 15.

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razgriz_101

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#28 razgriz_101
Member since 2007 • 16875 Posts

they might support it for a couple years after but i doubt it.The drop off will be considerably quick even tho the hardware will still most likely be supported, the actual hardware will be hard to buy or find in stores.

XP was phased out in stores round here pretty sharp after vista and 7.So i could see the same with 360 for some reason.

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xhawk27

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#30 xhawk27
Member since 2010 • 12194 Posts

Microsoft? What's that?

Oh, you mean the guyswho had absolutely nothing to showcase at E3, hardware or software? Those guys? They're still around? People are still using their machine?

Wow.

SummerHillard
Yeah the guys that have sold better for the last 11 months than anybody else and most likey are going to be #1 this holiday season. They are going to sell a lot of Kinects and Consoles this fall. 8)
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xhawk27

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#31 xhawk27
Member since 2010 • 12194 Posts
I'm not the only one here that remembers how quickly they dropped support for the original Xbox am I?getyeryayasout
They had to because of the contract they made with Nvidia. The cost of keeping making the Xbox was too much. This isn't a problem for the 360.
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mike_on_mic

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#32 mike_on_mic
Member since 2004 • 886 Posts
To me it would be the same reason why they discontinued the original Xbox, to push people to buy the new console. Is it good or bad, time will tell. But don't be surprised if MS do the same with the 360 when the next version comes out.
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_Cadbury_

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#33 _Cadbury_
Member since 2006 • 2936 Posts
15 years lol. More longevity than the PS3 lol. They'll discontinue it once the next xbox comes out.
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xhawk27

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#34 xhawk27
Member since 2010 • 12194 Posts
To me it would be the same reason why they discontinued the original Xbox, to push people to buy the new console. Is it good or bad, time will tell. But don't be surprised if MS do the same with the 360 when the next version comes out.mike_on_mic
I think Sony has learned that lesson this gen. You really think they are going to lose market share again to MS by allowing PS3 to drive sells away from the PS4. Think again people.
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xhawk27

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#35 xhawk27
Member since 2010 • 12194 Posts
[QUOTE="_Cadbury_"]15 years lol. More longevity than the PS3 lol. They'll discontinue it once the next xbox comes out.

Yeah and Sony is going to be in last place again next gen. :lol:
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_Cadbury_

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#36 _Cadbury_
Member since 2006 • 2936 Posts
[QUOTE="_Cadbury_"]15 years lol. More longevity than the PS3 lol. They'll discontinue it once the next xbox comes out.xhawk27
Yeah and Sony is going to be in last place again next gen. :lol:

....Not sure if serious o.o
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ChubbyGuy40

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#37 ChubbyGuy40
Member since 2007 • 26442 Posts

Why would Microsoft discontinue the greatest console ever?

Silverbond

I didn't know Microsoft produced the N64 :o

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xhawk27

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#38 xhawk27
Member since 2010 • 12194 Posts
[QUOTE="xhawk27"][QUOTE="_Cadbury_"]15 years lol. More longevity than the PS3 lol. They'll discontinue it once the next xbox comes out._Cadbury_
Yeah and Sony is going to be in last place again next gen. :lol:

....Not sure if serious o.o

You really think if Sony is still selling the PS3 that MS isn't going to be doing the same for the 360? :? You do know that is the reason they made Kinect.
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razgriz_101

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#39 razgriz_101
Member since 2007 • 16875 Posts

[QUOTE="SummerHillard"]

Microsoft? What's that?

Oh, you mean the guyswho had absolutely nothing to showcase at E3, hardware or software? Those guys? They're still around? People are still using their machine?

Wow.

xhawk27

Yeah the guys that have sold better for the last 11 months than anybody else and most likey are going to be #1 this holiday season. They are going to sell a lot of Kinects and Consoles this fall. 8)

i really feel sorry for people buying Kinect when its been shown as being a poor gaming device, the input lag is atrocious sometimes and apart from party games its throwing itself into core games with idiotic gimmicks.Not really tech for gaming either in my honest opinion it would be much better applied and has been in other sectors.

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_Cadbury_

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#40 _Cadbury_
Member since 2006 • 2936 Posts
[QUOTE="_Cadbury_"][QUOTE="xhawk27"] Yeah and Sony is going to be in last place again next gen. :lol:xhawk27
....Not sure if serious o.o

You really think if Sony is still selling the PS3 that MS isn't going to be doing the same for the 360? :? You do know that is the reason they made Kinect.

Firstly I have no idea what sony being in last place next gen has to do with what you've just said. And secondly MS won't keep a console on the market 'just cause' Sony is. Sony has always assured the PS3s longevity, MS hasn't done the same with the 360. Instead they've drastically cut down on their core gamer support lately in favour of casuals. With wii sales dying off,theres no reason to suggest Kinect will be able to prop the 360 up for very long. Just saying it how it is. And no current gen console will still be on the market in 15 years.
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xhawk27

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#41 xhawk27
Member since 2010 • 12194 Posts
[QUOTE="xhawk27"][QUOTE="_Cadbury_"] ....Not sure if serious o.o_Cadbury_
You really think if Sony is still selling the PS3 that MS isn't going to be doing the same for the 360? :? You do know that is the reason they made Kinect.

Firstly I have no idea what sony being in last place next gen has to do with what you've just said. And secondly MS won't keep a console on the market 'just cause' Sony is. Sony has always assured the PS3s longevity, MS hasn't done the same with the 360. Instead they've drastically cut down on their core gamer support lately in favour of casuals. With wii sales dying off,theres no reason to suggest Kinect will be able to prop the 360 up for very long. Just saying it how it is. And no current gen console will still be on the market in 15 years.

MS said they are going to continue supporting the 360 for a long time. Sony made the Move to do the exact same thing so I guess that isn't going prop up the PS3 up for very long either right? Also do you really think Sony is still going to be making the PS3 in 2019? :lol: All this nonsense about 360 is all about the causals now is stupid. I guess the Wii is a console only for the casuals and the Wii-U is a console only for the Hardcore gamers. The 360 is a console for everyone the hardcore and the casuals.
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xhawk27

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#42 xhawk27
Member since 2010 • 12194 Posts

[QUOTE="xhawk27"][QUOTE="SummerHillard"]

Microsoft? What's that?

Oh, you mean the guyswho had absolutely nothing to showcase at E3, hardware or software? Those guys? They're still around? People are still using their machine?

Wow.

razgriz_101

Yeah the guys that have sold better for the last 11 months than anybody else and most likey are going to be #1 this holiday season. They are going to sell a lot of Kinects and Consoles this fall. 8)

i really feel sorry for people buying Kinect when its been shown as being a poor gaming device, the input lag is atrocious sometimes and apart from party games its throwing itself into core games with idiotic gimmicks.Not really tech for gaming either in my honest opinion it would be much better applied and has been in other sectors.

I guess you said that about the Wii too in it's first year right? The kinect games are improving and are going to even more over the next couple of years. I think some of the ideas starting to come out are not gimmicks. Like the Headtracking in Forza 4 and the Gunsmith in Ghost Recon those things are pretty cool and this is only the start I bet you'll see lots of cool things in the future.
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razgriz_101

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#43 razgriz_101
Member since 2007 • 16875 Posts

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]

[QUOTE="xhawk27"] Yeah the guys that have sold better for the last 11 months than anybody else and most likey are going to be #1 this holiday season. They are going to sell a lot of Kinects and Consoles this fall. 8)xhawk27

i really feel sorry for people buying Kinect when its been shown as being a poor gaming device, the input lag is atrocious sometimes and apart from party games its throwing itself into core games with idiotic gimmicks.Not really tech for gaming either in my honest opinion it would be much better applied and has been in other sectors.

I guess you said that about the Wii too in it's first year right? The kinect games are improving and are going to even more over the next couple of years. I think some of the ideas starting to come out are not gimmicks. Like the Headtracking in Forza 4 and the Gunsmith in Ghost Recon those things are pretty cool and this is only the start I bet you'll see lots of cool things in the future.

to me the gunsmith is gimmicky unessecary and actually detracting from polishing the game to a higher shine.Most likely will be poorly implemented and cool for the first few days then just utterly boring.

Headtracking is overated tbh and i can simple move my thumb just a smidgen on my control to look to my left or right if i ever neeeded it.

The wii just gathers dust in my house its not been touched for over a year, kinect would be the same thing.Nintendo is even adopting a more conventional design and distancing itself from motion heavy gaming aswell.

Overall motion gameplay is a fad of thiss gen and going to die as hard as guitar hero.

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Lucianu

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#44 Lucianu
Member since 2007 • 10347 Posts

I guess you said that about the Wii too in it's first year right? The kinect games are improving and are going to even more over the next couple of years. I think some of the ideas starting to come out are not gimmicks. Like the Headtracking in Forza 4 and the Gunsmith in Ghost Recon those things are pretty cool and this is only the start I bet you'll see lots of cool things in the future. xhawk27

Totally different than Nintendo's motion controlls. I thought you needed a entire room clear for one to enjoy Kinect, you certainly do not need that for the Wii, that's just wasted space for tech. that's barely in its infancy, and for 'party games' that could easily be replaced with good splitscreen games instead, and save up a good deal of space in your room. God knows why people bought this. Its cheaper to go out and play football or bowling or whatever, than buy such a useless device.

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_Cadbury_

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#45 _Cadbury_
Member since 2006 • 2936 Posts
[QUOTE="_Cadbury_"][QUOTE="xhawk27"] You really think if Sony is still selling the PS3 that MS isn't going to be doing the same for the 360? :? You do know that is the reason they made Kinect. xhawk27
Firstly I have no idea what sony being in last place next gen has to do with what you've just said. And secondly MS won't keep a console on the market 'just cause' Sony is. Sony has always assured the PS3s longevity, MS hasn't done the same with the 360. Instead they've drastically cut down on their core gamer support lately in favour of casuals. With wii sales dying off,theres no reason to suggest Kinect will be able to prop the 360 up for very long. Just saying it how it is. And no current gen console will still be on the market in 15 years.

MS said they are going to continue supporting the 360 for a long time. Sony made the Move to do the exact same thing so I guess that isn't going prop up the PS3 up for very long either right? Also do you really think Sony is still going to be making the PS3 in 2019? :lol: All this nonsense about 360 is all about the causals now is stupid. I guess the Wii is a console only for the casuals and the Wii-U is a console only for the Hardcore gamers. The 360 is a console for everyone the hardcore and the casuals.

Did you even read what I said? Because I said that NO console would be around in 15 years, or in 2019, where ever you're getting that from. And who said anything about Sony and move? I'm simply talking about the thread topic which is the 360. And no, whats stupid is that MS only has Gears, Halo, and Forza now, and instead of showing new core IPs at E3, they show off Kinect Disney land, and god knows what makes them think that the audience for that game will be watcing E3. It's laughable really.
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blahsalt48

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#46 blahsalt48
Member since 2010 • 208 Posts

Other than Blu-Ray I'm not sure why people keep saying the PS3 is superior hardware-wise to the 360. The CPU is powerful but the graphics chip is inferior to the 360's. making any significant leap in processing power debatable. The most grahically impressive exclusives on the PS3 so far aren't much of a step beyond what we've seen on the 360. Hopefully Sony will re-think their approach to hardware design next generation.

BoredGames

You can talk graphics chips all you want, but you show me a 360 game that can even come close to God of War 3 or Uncharted 2 and then we will talk. Like you said, it is "technically debatable", but the PS3 can do allot more. Side by side comparisons for multiplatform games do give the edge to the 360. But there is such a small difference that it is barely noticeable. PS3 shines in its exclusives.

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sethman410

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#48 sethman410
Member since 2008 • 2967 Posts

Lol, sell it for 15 years? How is the 360 more suited for longevity than PS3? PS3 has more games coming out and the hardware is more future proof. If history is any indication, they'll stop selling the 360 once their next console releases and PS3 will still be available for 5+ years after PS4 releases.

arkephonic
This man speaks the truth.
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Shinobi120

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#49 Shinobi120
Member since 2004 • 5728 Posts

Once they release a new XBOX they will slowly stop production. Thats what they did with the original XBOX and they stopped supporting it no more then a year after the 360 was releaseddjohnstonXCII

Wrong. They only stopped production of the original Xbox because MS were having problems within Nvidia with their contracts or whatever. Plus not to mention that MS lost at least $4.2 Billion off of the original Xbox & because that they were never making money off of each Xbox system being sold.

[QUOTE="BoredGames"]

Other than Blu-Ray I'm not sure why people keep saying the PS3 is superior hardware-wise to the 360. The CPU is powerful but the graphics chip is inferior to the 360's. making any significant leap in processing power debatable. The most grahically impressive exclusives on the PS3 so far aren't much of a step beyond what we've seen on the 360. Hopefully Sony will re-think their approach to hardware design next generation.

blahsalt48

You can talk graphics chips all you want, but you show me a 360 game that can even come close to God of War 3 or Uncharted 2 and then we will talk. Like you said, it is "technically debatable", but the PS3 can do allot more. Side by side comparisons for multiplatform games do give the edge to the 360. But there is such a small difference that it is barely noticeable. PS3 shines in its exclusives.

Exclusives doesn't exactly reveal which console is more powerful. Only reason why PS3 exclusives look much better than 360 games is because of talent & experience of Sony's developers within their hardware, unlike MS's developers within their hardware & their games.

Plus Crysis 2 & Gears of War 3 would like to say hello to you.

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xhawk27

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#50 xhawk27
Member since 2010 • 12194 Posts

[QUOTE="BoredGames"]

Other than Blu-Ray I'm not sure why people keep saying the PS3 is superior hardware-wise to the 360. The CPU is powerful but the graphics chip is inferior to the 360's. making any significant leap in processing power debatable. The most grahically impressive exclusives on the PS3 so far aren't much of a step beyond what we've seen on the 360. Hopefully Sony will re-think their approach to hardware design next generation.

blahsalt48

You can talk graphics chips all you want, but you show me a 360 game that can even come close to God of War 3 or Uncharted 2 and then we will talk. Like you said, it is "technically debatable", but the PS3 can do allot more. Side by side comparisons for multiplatform games do give the edge to the 360. But there is such a small difference that it is barely noticeable. PS3 shines in its exclusives.

It is called Gears 3. Also I'll bet that Halo 4 is going to be pushing the 360 very hard and be as good as Killzone 3. I said it, I hope I don't regret it.