lets discuss nintendo's approach

Is it possible to actually have a discussion in system wars and not have a couple of fanboys screaming "ur console is teh suxxors!!"

Im curious as to why many owners of the 360 and/or ps3's seem to hate the wii so much. I for one agree with the approach nintendo is taking with the wii in that it provides us with new gameplay opportunities. I also dont really have a problem  with the fact that the wii is very underpowered compared to its "rivals" the ps3 and 360. the one thing that concerns me about the approach with the wii is the fact that nintendo seem to be aiming for the casual crowd and so far they seem to be gaining ground in that area. What im saying is that i think if nintendos plan of getting casuals into gaming is a huge success it might lead developers into they same mindset. Now while that may not be a bad thing introducing new people to gaming it makes me think that soon most developers will concentrate on getting games to draw in casuals and forget about us hardcore gamers who wait months sometimes years for the epic games that we love so much. I would like the opinions of the rest of you guys on whether you think its possible that soon developers may cater to the casuals and that blockbuster games like GOW, HAlO, ZELDA may be put on the back of the line?

It's a hard balance for Nintendo... everything they advertise about it, the fun factor, the easy to pick up, the intuitiveness, the "wife-o-meter", all points to very simple gameplay that anyone can get into. Mind you, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but like you said in your post, this approach will start alienating the hardcore gamers.

If they start making more complex games, do you think casuals will go for it? It'll look too complex, too much time to learn, which is why casuals never picked up gaming in the first place. The reason they got the Wii was for what it was advertised to be. Most 3rd party games are not that great, and a lot of people (not all yet) have been getting bored with the Wii already. Casual games get boring fast.

Also, the Wiimote. To make the Wii "innovative", almost all games will aspire to use the Wiimote. If not, it's just a game with traditional controls, and how would it make it different from the PS3 or XBOX360? It won't, it would make for an inferior experience in comparison (I'm talking about if the game for example was multiplat and the Wii version had no motion controls).

Also, I don't really understand why ppl automatically assume that everything Nintendo does is "fun". It's as if the XBOX360 or PS3 was incapable of fun games, or rather, less fun than the Wii. A lot of people have been tricked into the church of Nintendo (Wii only has fun games, Wii is the most innovative, etc).

lol, even though I say all this, I will eventually get a Wii to replace my Gamecube. I'm just not that impressed with it overall, the only games that appeal to me right now are Zelda and Super Paper Mario. People usually buy Nintendo consoles for Nintendo games, and so far for the Wii, it seems to be no different. What games are ppl looking forward to the most? Super Mario Galaxy? Super Smash Bros? Metroid?

we were all casuals and non gamers once. it's not like use tastes stay that way forever. devs know this too. 

To Lasden 

i understand what you are saying but thats just my point...my thought is that hardcore games will be pushed back and we will see more games like wii sports and guitar hero not that those arent good games but look at the wii's line up. i mean sure there are good games in there metroid, smg, ssbb, but compared to the 360 or ps3 lineup we can see where the developer attention is going to...

Nintendo's approach;

NES - GC = teh kiddie

Wii = teh casual (If you are over the age of 60 and can't control your own bowels, this system is for you).

"Wii is even better than bingo night!" - Mildred age 80

"Wii's simplicity gives our senior's that moment of enjoyment before they bought the farm" - Stephen manager of St. Paul's retirement home.

 Wii recommended by 9 out of 10 retirement homes!

we were all casuals and non gamers once. it's not like use tastes stay that way forever. devs know this too. 

Ontain

true we may have been casuals at ome point but none of the games...at least in my gen which is the nes gen...were like wii sports or big brain academy and games of that nature. it was mario and zelda, sonic final fantasy...and because of that i am a hardcore gamer today. but casual gamers of this gen are going to continue to want games like wii sports simple and fun. while i would enjoy that once in a while its not enough to hold my attention. theres no drive to make me want to play wii sports for a whole night whereas a game like say God of War or Halo will keep me wanting to push throught the story.

thier approach was good from thier prospective,

 bad from the gamers prospective. 

To Consoletant

i dont think the NES...SNES or N64 were kiddy...if anything they were the ones that brought us the basis for games like Final Fantasy...Grand theft Auto, MAdden, Halo etc not that GTA or Halo was developed on any of those systems but the fact that games like Ocarina of time introduced the targetin system and the open worlds or how goldeneye or perfect dark brought innovation to the fps genre on consoles. i think those platforms play a big role in the success of todays blockbuster games

Nintendo's approach is not going to benefit the industry,I want them to succeed to a certain extent,but if casual gaming is given more importance than hardcore gaming,us gamers will have alot of mini-games in the future.Dualshockin

Enough with the Mini game arguement!!! When was the last time Nintendo release another mini game other than Wii play??? Sure Mario Party 8 is releasing next month but where in its timeline will they release another first party minigames??? They haven't made one for the DS as well!!!

To Lasden 

i understand what you are saying but thats just my point...my thought is that hardcore games will be pushed back and we will see more games like wii sports and guitar hero not that those arent good games but look at the wii's line up. i mean sure there are good games in there metroid, smg, ssbb, but compared to the 360 or ps3 lineup we can see where the developer attention is going to...

kamuix

The hardcore games wont be pushed back.The same amount of hardcore games will remain. It might even grow. With the influx of casuals to the industry Companies will be wanting to make more games to make more money. This means more video game developers will be hired. With more staff they will be able to shift extra focus to these casual games while still keeping others to make the hardcore games.Companies are about making money after all and will continue making games for a market that will make them money.

I hate that mini game thing, seriously, what wii mini games are there, WarioWare?hyruledweller

It is becoming an annoyance proving that MS and PS fans have nothing to attack on the Wii about!!!!

[QUOTE="kamuix"]

To Lasden 

i understand what you are saying but thats just my point...my thought is that hardcore games will be pushed back and we will see more games like wii sports and guitar hero not that those arent good games but look at the wii's line up. i mean sure there are good games in there metroid, smg, ssbb, but compared to the 360 or ps3 lineup we can see where the developer attention is going to...

Lasden

The hardcore games wont be pushed back.The same amount of hardcore games will remain. It might even grow. With the influx of casuals to the industry Companies will be wanting to make more games to make more money. This means more video game developers will be hired. With more staff they will be able to shift extra focus to these casual games while still keeping others to make the hardcore games.Companies are about making money after all and will continue making games for a market that will make them money.

Once again i agree with some of your statement but there is a flaw...maybe not a flaw but there is some bad to come if what you say is true. Think about this...this gen we have seen game prices raised from $49.99 to $59.99. I believe development will only be more expensive and hiring more workers  will lead to more use of company resources and more workers to be paid. Development costs may be higher because of the new technology which will be used and game prices will rise. I guess what im trying to say is that in the end i think us hardcore gamers will be taking some hits whether it be financially or entertainment wise.

I got the wii, in fact ive had every nintendo system so far. I'm 26 years old and i gotta say wii has been a great party system, great for when my younger cousins come over or even some of my friends with there girlfriends, other then that with holding a few jobs and still a avid Starcraft player i gotta say the Wii collects dust for me. Its not a bad system at all, in fact i like it, its just for my own personal taste and the fact im not in high school anymore, it just bores me for single player. I rather play a few rpg's on the PS2, or Nhl on thr 360. Nintendo is nintendo, to me i always will feel there big days were the Nes and Super Nes, im glad to say i got to grow up as a kid during the whole Super Nes vs. Sega Genesis days and i think it spoiled me as a hardcore gamer, cause games since have never been as productive. But i won't know it, i got all the systems, ill always love being a gamer, fanboys are useless waste of sperm. Those are the kids who sit in Gamestop and think they know what there talking about. A fanboy will say Final Fantasy 7 is the greatest rpg, while a real rpg fan will laugh and say haha 6 > 7.

Games i look foward to playing

Halo 3, StarCraft 2, HellGate, God of War 2, Smash Bros. On the Wii. Mark of the Wolves on the VC

[QUOTE="Dualshockin"]Nintendo's approach is not going to benefit the industry,I want them to succeed to a certain extent,but if casual gaming is given more importance than hardcore gaming,us gamers will have alot of mini-games in the future.FireEmblem_Man

Enough with the Mini game arguement!!! When was the last time Nintendo release another mini game other than Wii play??? Sure Mario Party 8 is releasing next month but where in its timeline will they release another first party minigames??? They haven't made one for the DS as well!!!

[QUOTE="hyruledweller"]I hate that mini game thing, seriously, what wii mini games are there, WarioWare?FireEmblem_Man

It is becoming an annoyance proving that MS and PS fans have nothing to attack on the Wii about!!!!

 then you've got "half-games" like trauma center, super monkey ball etc which may not be exact mini games per-say, but they arent far from it. 

then you've got the last gen ports which spak for themselves, and all togetherm they make up a significant portion of the wii library unfortunately.  

I hate that mini game thing, seriously, what wii mini games are there, WarioWare?hyruledweller

[QUOTE="FireEmblem_Man"]

[QUOTE="hyruledweller"]I hate that mini game thing, seriously, what wii mini games are there, WarioWare?JPOBS

It is becoming an annoyance proving that MS and PS fans have nothing to attack on the Wii about!!!!

then you've got "half-games" like trauma center, super monkey ball etc which may not be exact mini games per-say, but they arent far from it.

then you've got the last gen ports which spak for themselves, and all togetherm they make up a significant portion of the wii library unfortunately.

Is it possible to actually have a discussion in system wars and not have a couple of fanboys screaming "ur console is teh suxxors!!"

Im curious as to why many owners of the 360 and/or ps3's seem to hate the wii so much. I for one agree with the approach nintendo is taking with the wii in that it provides us with new gameplay opportunities. I also dont really have a problem with the fact that the wii is very underpowered compared to its "rivals" the ps3 and 360. the one thing that concerns me about the approach with the wii is the fact that nintendo seem to be aiming for the casual crowd and so far they seem to be gaining ground in that area. What im saying is that i think if nintendos plan of getting casuals into gaming is a huge success it might lead developers into they same mindset. Now while that may not be a bad thing introducing new people to gaming it makes me think that soon most developers will concentrate on getting games to draw in casuals and forget about us hardcore gamers who wait months sometimes years for the epic games that we love so much. I would like the opinions of the rest of you guys on whether you think its possible that soon developers may cater to the casuals and that blockbuster games like GOW, HAlO, ZELDA may be put on the back of the line?

kamuix

for one I doin't dislike the wii but I think it's overrated I amy purchase one in the future. I think games such as GOW will be dumbed down for the casuals...rather than put on hold...

[QUOTE="Ontain"]

we were all casuals and non gamers once. it's not like use tastes stay that way forever. devs know this too. 

kamuix

true we may have been casuals at ome point but none of the games...at least in my gen which is the nes gen...were like wii sports or big brain academy and games of that nature. it was mario and zelda, sonic final fantasy...and because of that i am a hardcore gamer today. but casual gamers of this gen are going to continue to want games like wii sports simple and fun. while i would enjoy that once in a while its not enough to hold my attention. theres no drive to make me want to play wii sports for a whole night whereas a game like say God of War or Halo will keep me wanting to push throught the story.

Did you read what your wrote? Back in the NES days all games were "simple and fun". And you are saying you became a hardcore gamer because of that. Nintendo is now returning to the "simple and fun" days. The Nes is Nintendo's highest selling console and one of the main reasons is because it was "simple and fun" and they are attempting to emulate the NES's success witha similar approach. You can't claim that what they are doing is bad then say they should be doing the exact same thing you are saying is bad.

The games like Mario Zelda and Final Fantasy evolved into hardcore games through each generation and you followed them. A lot of people didnt follow them though. That is why console sales have been steadily decreasing. Nintendo may be going back to the simple days and catering for the casuals but they are certainly not going to abandon their loyal hardcore fanbase and neither will Microsoft or Sony.

[QUOTE="JPOBS"][QUOTE="FireEmblem_Man"]

[QUOTE="hyruledweller"]I hate that mini game thing, seriously, what wii mini games are there, WarioWare?Dualshockin

It is becoming an annoyance proving that MS and PS fans have nothing to attack on the Wii about!!!!

then you've got "half-games" like trauma center, super monkey ball etc which may not be exact mini games per-say, but they arent far from it.

then you've got the last gen ports which spak for themselves, and all togetherm they make up a significant portion of the wii library unfortunately.

agreed wii might be could if it wasn't littered with half assed mini-games and ports 

[QUOTE="kamuix"][QUOTE="Ontain"]

we were all casuals and non gamers once. it's not like use tastes stay that way forever. devs know this too. 

Lasden

true we may have been casuals at ome point but none of the games...at least in my gen which is the nes gen...were like wii sports or big brain academy and games of that nature. it was mario and zelda, sonic final fantasy...and because of that i am a hardcore gamer today. but casual gamers of this gen are going to continue to want games like wii sports simple and fun. while i would enjoy that once in a while its not enough to hold my attention. theres no drive to make me want to play wii sports for a whole night whereas a game like say God of War or Halo will keep me wanting to push throught the story.

Did you read what your wrote? Back in the NES days all games were "simple and fun". And you are saying you became a hardcore gamer because of that. Nintendo is now returning to the "simple and fun" days. The Nes is Nintendo's highest selling console and one of the main reasons is because it was "simple and fun" and they are attempting to emulate the NES's success witha similar approach. You can't claim that what they are doing is bad then say they should be doing the exact same thing you are saying is bad.

The games like Mario Zelda and Final Fantasy evolved into hardcore games through each generation and you followed them. A lot of people didnt follow them though. That is why console sales have been steadily decreasing. Nintendo may be going back to the simple days and catering for the casuals but they are certainly not going to abandon their loyal hardcore fanbase and neither will Microsoft or Sony.

Re-read my statement i said wii games are simple and fun...whereas games like super mario were fun games but they werent games like wii sports which are very simple

[QUOTE="JPOBS"][QUOTE="FireEmblem_Man"]

[QUOTE="hyruledweller"]I hate that mini game thing, seriously, what wii mini games are there, WarioWare?Dualshockin

It is becoming an annoyance proving that MS and PS fans have nothing to attack on the Wii about!!!!

then you've got "half-games" like trauma center, super monkey ball etc which may not be exact mini games per-say, but they arent far from it.

then you've got the last gen ports which spak for themselves, and all togetherm they make up a significant portion of the wii library unfortunately.

Agree. Funny how most of these types of games score relatively well. I guess we're going to see a trend?

Mario Party 8
Tamagotchi Party On!
Cosmic Family
Big Brain Academy: Wii Degeree (is this considered like to be a game of minigames? Since you know, it challenges you with a bunch of short "tests"? The preview says it also has multiplayer minigames challenges)
Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games (probably a bunch of mini half games with olympic-type of scenarios)

Well, my only concern with Nintendo's approach is their online infrastructure.  I hate friend codes.

The lack of graphics does not bother me.  I've been playing GeoW for a while now (granted, it's on an SDTV), and it looks amazing, but I'm far more interested in how it plays as apposed to how it looks.  It just happens to play excellently.

What I don't understand is why every is assuming that, just because Wii caters to a casual crowd as much as the hardcore crowd, all future games for it are going to be simple minigame compilations.  The philosophy driving the Wii is the same as that driving the DS, and the DS has no shortage of games catering towards the hardcore crowd. 

[QUOTE="Lasden"][QUOTE="kamuix"][QUOTE="Ontain"]

we were all casuals and non gamers once. it's not like use tastes stay that way forever. devs know this too. 

kamuix

true we may have been casuals at ome point but none of the games...at least in my gen which is the nes gen...were like wii sports or big brain academy and games of that nature. it was mario and zelda, sonic final fantasy...and because of that i am a hardcore gamer today. but casual gamers of this gen are going to continue to want games like wii sports simple and fun. while i would enjoy that once in a while its not enough to hold my attention. theres no drive to make me want to play wii sports for a whole night whereas a game like say God of War or Halo will keep me wanting to push throught the story.

Did you read what your wrote? Back in the NES days all games were "simple and fun". And you are saying you became a hardcore gamer because of that. Nintendo is now returning to the "simple and fun" days. The Nes is Nintendo's highest selling console and one of the main reasons is because it was "simple and fun" and they are attempting to emulate the NES's success witha similar approach. You can't claim that what they are doing is bad then say they should be doing the exact same thing you are saying is bad.

The games like Mario Zelda and Final Fantasy evolved into hardcore games through each generation and you followed them. A lot of people didnt follow them though. That is why console sales have been steadily decreasing. Nintendo may be going back to the simple days and catering for the casuals but they are certainly not going to abandon their loyal hardcore fanbase and neither will Microsoft or Sony.

Re-read my statement i said wii games are simple and fun...whereas games like super mario were fun games but they werent games like wii sports which are very simple

Games dont get much more simple than NES games im affraid. So what you are saying is blatantly wrong. You must have a very obscure view on the matter if you find games like Wii sports and say for example Elebits are simple compared to games like the original Mario.

[QUOTE="kamuix"][QUOTE="Lasden"][QUOTE="kamuix"][QUOTE="Ontain"]

we were all casuals and non gamers once. it's not like use tastes stay that way forever. devs know this too. 

Lasden

true we may have been casuals at ome point but none of the games...at least in my gen which is the nes gen...were like wii sports or big brain academy and games of that nature. it was mario and zelda, sonic final fantasy...and because of that i am a hardcore gamer today. but casual gamers of this gen are going to continue to want games like wii sports simple and fun. while i would enjoy that once in a while its not enough to hold my attention. theres no drive to make me want to play wii sports for a whole night whereas a game like say God of War or Halo will keep me wanting to push throught the story.

Did you read what your wrote? Back in the NES days all games were "simple and fun". And you are saying you became a hardcore gamer because of that. Nintendo is now returning to the "simple and fun" days. The Nes is Nintendo's highest selling console and one of the main reasons is because it was "simple and fun" and they are attempting to emulate the NES's success witha similar approach. You can't claim that what they are doing is bad then say they should be doing the exact same thing you are saying is bad.

The games like Mario Zelda and Final Fantasy evolved into hardcore games through each generation and you followed them. A lot of people didnt follow them though. That is why console sales have been steadily decreasing. Nintendo may be going back to the simple days and catering for the casuals but they are certainly not going to abandon their loyal hardcore fanbase and neither will Microsoft or Sony.

Re-read my statement i said wii games are simple and fun...whereas games like super mario were fun games but they werent games like wii sports which are very simple

Games dont get much more simple than NES games im affraid. So what you are saying is blatantly wrong. You must have a very obscure view on the matter if you find games like Wii sports and say for example Elebits are simple compared to games like the original Mario.

you misunderstand what im saying...im not comparing them directly as in saying halo is better than goldeneye or like saying the ps3 is better than the snes.

"Re-read my statement i said wii games are simple and fun...whereas games like super mario were fun games but they werent games like wii sports which are very simpl"

Sounds like a comparison to me.

"Re-read my statement i said wii games are simple and fun...whereas games like super mario were fun games but they werent games like wii sports which are very simpl"

Sounds like a comparison to me.

Lasden

[QUOTE="FireEmblem_Man"]

[QUOTE="Dualshockin"]Nintendo's approach is not going to benefit the industry,I want them to succeed to a certain extent,but if casual gaming is given more importance than hardcore gaming,us gamers will have alot of mini-games in the future.Dualshockin

Enough with the Mini game arguement!!! When was the last time Nintendo release another mini game other than Wii play??? Sure Mario Party 8 is releasing next month but where in its timeline will they release another first party minigames??? They haven't made one for the DS as well!!!

Corruption, Galaxy, Disaster, Hammer, you fail 

Here is something for you to think about. As you said the Wii has been out for less than a year. When is one of the best times to release a game for a console? At launch of course. Now when did developers first gain interest in the Wii? That would be E3 06. Not a year even before the launch of the Wii. Now what takes longer to develope? An incredibly deep game with an epicstory? Or a small simple game which is easy to pick up? The hardcore games a coming give them time to be released. Companies are not going to abandon their current majority of the industry which is the hardcore gamers.Lasden

See but thats exactly my point...like i said in my first post there will be epic games on the wii but the majority of companies just seem to be releasing ports on the system. its true most developers didnt have interest in the wii b4 E3 but one of nintendo's selling points for the wii was that developers will have an easy time developing for it compared to the 360 and ps3 because its architecture is close to the gamecubes. games on the 360 or ps3 for that matter should take more time to develop but look at GRAW 2, its released less than a year from the original. my point is while there will be hardcore games...compare the ratio of hardcore games on the wii and those being realeased in the coming months to the number of casual games on it and being released in the coming months

Well, my only concern with Nintendo's approach is their online infrastructure.  I hate friend codes.

The lack of graphics does not bother me.  I've been playing GeoW for a while now (granted, it's on an SDTV), and it looks amazing, but I'm far more interested in how it plays as apposed to how it looks.  It just happens to play excellently.

What I don't understand is why every is assuming that, just because Wii caters to a casual crowd as much as the hardcore crowd, all future games for it are going to be simple minigame compilations.  The philosophy driving the Wii is the same as that driving the DS, and the DS has no shortage of games catering towards the hardcore crowd. 

Michael85

I've gotten bored with my Wii. Lately I've been playing much more of my DS and Dreamcast. PS2 as well since GOW2 came out.AnimeHendrix

[QUOTE="Lasden"]Here is something for you to think about. As you said the Wii has been out for less than a year. When is one of the best times to release a game for a console? At launch of course. Now when did developers first gain interest in the Wii? That would be E3 06. Not a year even before the launch of the Wii. Now what takes longer to develope? An incredibly deep game with an epicstory? Or a small simple game which is easy to pick up? The hardcore games a coming give them time to be released. Companies are not going to abandon their current majority of the industry which is the hardcore gamers.kamuix

See but thats exactly my point...like i said in my first post there will be epic games on the wii but the majority of companies just seem to be releasing ports on the system. its true most developers didnt have interest in the wii b4 E3 but one of nintendo's selling points for the wii was that developers will have an easy time developing for it compared to the 360 and ps3 because its architecture is close to the gamecubes. games on the 360 or ps3 for that matter should take more time to develop but look at GRAW 2, its released less than a year from the original. my point is while there will be hardcore games...compare the ratio of hardcore games on the wii and those being realeased in the coming months to the number of casual games on it and being released in the coming months

[QUOTE="Lasden"]Here is something for you to think about. As you said the Wii has been out for less than a year. When is one of the best times to release a game for a console? At launch of course. Now when did developers first gain interest in the Wii? That would be E3 06. Not a year even before the launch of the Wii. Now what takes longer to develope? An incredibly deep game with an epicstory? Or a small simple game which is easy to pick up? The hardcore games a coming give them time to be released. Companies are not going to abandon their current majority of the industry which is the hardcore gamers.kamuix

See but thats exactly my point...like i said in my first post there will be epic games on the wii but the majority of companies just seem to be releasing ports on the system. its true most developers didnt have interest in the wii b4 E3 but one of nintendo's selling points for the wii was that developers will have an easy time developing for it compared to the 360 and ps3 because its architecture is close to the gamecubes. games on the 360 or ps3 for that matter should take more time to develop but look at GRAW 2, its released less than a year from the original. my point is while there will be hardcore games...compare the ratio of hardcore games on the wii and those being realeased in the coming months to the number of casual games on it and being released in the coming months

Umm then why are you complaining. You lose nothing from there being more casual orientated games. In fact at this rate you will probably get more hardcore games too. Some of those casuals are bound to become hardcore which means more of a market for such games. Which means more of those games. There is absoloutly nothing bad happening here.

"Re-read my statement i said wii games are simple and fun...whereas games like super mario were fun games but they werent games like wii sports which are very simpl"

Sounds like a comparison to me.

Lasden

im not doing a direct comparison...lets say the snes was $600 when it was released and today the ps3 is $600. the way ur reading it is like saying by todays standards if i go buy an snes now it will be $600. a game like final fantasy 3 was more complex for its time than a game like wii sports today

people exaggerate the effect that casuals have on the games. take ps2's example. i'd guess (yes, i realise I'm pulling numbers out of nowhere) that maybe 50-60million of the people who bought a ps2 were casuals. Probably more than that. this is why games like 50cent whateveritis were made. doesn't make the rest of the games any worse though, does it?

[QUOTE="kamuix"]

[QUOTE="Lasden"]Here is something for you to think about. As you said the Wii has been out for less than a year. When is one of the best times to release a game for a console? At launch of course. Now when did developers first gain interest in the Wii? That would be E3 06. Not a year even before the launch of the Wii. Now what takes longer to develope? An incredibly deep game with an epicstory? Or a small simple game which is easy to pick up? The hardcore games a coming give them time to be released. Companies are not going to abandon their current majority of the industry which is the hardcore gamers.Lasden

See but thats exactly my point...like i said in my first post there will be epic games on the wii but the majority of companies just seem to be releasing ports on the system. its true most developers didnt have interest in the wii b4 E3 but one of nintendo's selling points for the wii was that developers will have an easy time developing for it compared to the 360 and ps3 because its architecture is close to the gamecubes. games on the 360 or ps3 for that matter should take more time to develop but look at GRAW 2, its released less than a year from the original. my point is while there will be hardcore games...compare the ratio of hardcore games on the wii and those being realeased in the coming months to the number of casual games on it and being released in the coming months

Umm then why are you complaining. You lose nothing from there being more casual orientated games. In fact at this rate you will probably get more hardcore games too. Some of those casuals are bound to become hardcore which means more of a market for such games. Which means more of those games. There is absoloutly nothing bad happening here.

casual gamers will want more casual games...they dont want complex games like God of War...while u may say GOW is not complex they may think so. i cant figure how else to explain it to u. back in the snes days there was nothing like a hardcore game or a casual game. either u were a gamer or you were not. but games have gotten so much more complex now that "casual gamers" are casual because they dont want or have time to play hardcore games". and playing wii sports will not transition a casual gamer to suddenly playing a game like halo 3. they will want more wii sports like games.

people exaggerate the effect that casuals have on the games. take ps2's example. i'd guess (yes, i realise I'm pulling numbers out of nowhere) that maybe 50-60million of the people who bought a ps2 were casuals. Probably more than that. this is why games like 50cent whateveritis were made. doesn't make the rest of the games any worse though, does it?

Mr_sprinkles

ok what you're saying is partially true. now go ahead and compare the number of casual games and their sales on the ps2 to the number of hardcore games and their sales on that console...the wii on the other hand is the oppsoite it has more casual than hardcore...the ps2 had more hardcore games than casual...which is the reason why the gamecube was called "teh kiddie" by fanboys.

[QUOTE="Lasden"][QUOTE="kamuix"]

[QUOTE="Lasden"]Here is something for you to think about. As you said the Wii has been out for less than a year. When is one of the best times to release a game for a console? At launch of course. Now when did developers first gain interest in the Wii? That would be E3 06. Not a year even before the launch of the Wii. Now what takes longer to develope? An incredibly deep game with an epicstory? Or a small simple game which is easy to pick up? The hardcore games a coming give them time to be released. Companies are not going to abandon their current majority of the industry which is the hardcore gamers.kamuix

See but thats exactly my point...like i said in my first post there will be epic games on the wii but the majority of companies just seem to be releasing ports on the system. its true most developers didnt have interest in the wii b4 E3 but one of nintendo's selling points for the wii was that developers will have an easy time developing for it compared to the 360 and ps3 because its architecture is close to the gamecubes. games on the 360 or ps3 for that matter should take more time to develop but look at GRAW 2, its released less than a year from the original. my point is while there will be hardcore games...compare the ratio of hardcore games on the wii and those being realeased in the coming months to the number of casual games on it and being released in the coming months

Umm then why are you complaining. You lose nothing from there being more casual orientated games. In fact at this rate you will probably get more hardcore games too. Some of those casuals are bound to become hardcore which means more of a market for such games. Which means more of those games. There is absoloutly nothing bad happening here.

casual gamers will want more casual games...they dont want complex games like God of War...while u may say GOW is not complex they may think so. i cant figure how else to explain it to u. back in the snes days there was nothing like a hardcore game or a casual game. either u were a gamer or you were not. but games have gotten so much more complex now that "casual gamers" are casual because they dont want or have time to play hardcore games". and playing wii sports will not transition a casual gamer to suddenly playing a game like halo 3. they will want more wii sports like games.

Ill put it into a nice simple statement for you.
More casuals DOES NOT equal less hardcore gamers!

Some of those casuals will become hardcore gamers.
So
More Casuals would equal more hardcore gamers.
That would mean more of both types of games.
Also is your shift key broken or something? Try using it once in awhile.

[QUOTE="kamuix"][QUOTE="Lasden"][QUOTE="kamuix"]

[QUOTE="Lasden"]Here is something for you to think about. As you said the Wii has been out for less than a year. When is one of the best times to release a game for a console? At launch of course. Now when did developers first gain interest in the Wii? That would be E3 06. Not a year even before the launch of the Wii. Now what takes longer to develope? An incredibly deep game with an epicstory? Or a small simple game which is easy to pick up? The hardcore games a coming give them time to be released. Companies are not going to abandon their current majority of the industry which is the hardcore gamers.Lasden

See but thats exactly my point...like i said in my first post there will be epic games on the wii but the majority of companies just seem to be releasing ports on the system. its true most developers didnt have interest in the wii b4 E3 but one of nintendo's selling points for the wii was that developers will have an easy time developing for it compared to the 360 and ps3 because its architecture is close to the gamecubes. games on the 360 or ps3 for that matter should take more time to develop but look at GRAW 2, its released less than a year from the original. my point is while there will be hardcore games...compare the ratio of hardcore games on the wii and those being realeased in the coming months to the number of casual games on it and being released in the coming months

Umm then why are you complaining. You lose nothing from there being more casual orientated games. In fact at this rate you will probably get more hardcore games too. Some of those casuals are bound to become hardcore which means more of a market for such games. Which means more of those games. There is absoloutly nothing bad happening here.

casual gamers will want more casual games...they dont want complex games like God of War...while u may say GOW is not complex they may think so. i cant figure how else to explain it to u. back in the snes days there was nothing like a hardcore game or a casual game. either u were a gamer or you were not. but games have gotten so much more complex now that "casual gamers" are casual because they dont want or have time to play hardcore games". and playing wii sports will not transition a casual gamer to suddenly playing a game like halo 3. they will want more wii sports like games.

Ill put it into a nice simple statement for you.
More casuals DOES NOT equal less hardcore gamers!

Some of those casuals will become hardcore gamers.
So
More Casuals would equal more hardcore gamers.
That would mean more of both types of games.
Also is your shift key broken or something? Try using it once in awhile.

But if the market becomes flooded with casuals there will be no motivation for non casual games to be made

If that occurs then the market would be flooded with casual games. People would get sick of them all before long and hardcore games would re-emerge not long after. During this time though Hardcore games will still be produced. Nintendo would not let their hardcore franchises die and they would not let down their hardcore fanbase.

But if the market becomes flooded with casuals there will be no motivation for non casual games to be made

If that occurs then the market would be flooded with casual games. People would get sick of them all before long and hardcore games would re-emerge not long after. During this time though Hardcore games will still be produced. Nintendo would not let their hardcore franchises die and they would not let down their hardcore fanbase.

Lasden

Yup anyone who Thinks Ninty is going to stop making its hardcore games is crazy 

[QUOTE="hyruledweller"]I hate that mini game thing, seriously, what wii mini games are there, WarioWare?Dualshockin