Mature games need to be redefined

I see alot of people now saying the wii finally has a mature game because of madworld and i can't help but think WTF? i know a lot of people think games with alot of swearing, blood & guts, sex & nudity, and drugs means it's mature but honestly i don't. madworld imo is actually kind of the opposite of a mature game anyone can make some extremely gruesome game but games with mature topics that are done well i much harder and has much more depth. MGS4 is great example with alot of insight into human behavior such as our expanding war economy and whether we are dependent on war, will current advancements in technology lead to increased control and start making A.I's make decisions that used to be made by humans. Mass Effect is just as good example because it really comes shins where you least expect it. Like the prejudice some humans howed to different alien races and how is relates our current times and hsitory of discrimination man has always shown. Even games like shadow of the colossus have much more mature content and really get you thinking. mature content isn't just what the back of the box says with the rating but how it has ideas's and lessons that go well above normal morals and thingking. but thats just my 2 cents

just as a note this might come off as me saying madworld is a bad game which is not what i'm trying to say. Infact i'm really looking forward to madworld but personally games like MGS4, Mass Effect, and shadow of the colossus are alot more mature than madworld. Mature content isn't just something conservative moms or religious groups don't condone but content that gets you to think about issues that aren't simple yes's or no's or even issues that have no answer at all. There is a place for games like madworld which is for pure enjoyment but don't confuse it with other mature games

I see alot of people now saying the wii finally has a mature game because of madworld and i can't help but think WTF? i know a lot of people think games with alot of swearing, blood & guts, sex & nudity, and drugs means it's mature but honestly i don't. Ragashahs

[QUOTE="Ragashahs"]I see alot of people now saying the wii finally has a mature game because of madworld and i can't help but think WTF? i know a lot of people think games with alot of swearing, blood & guts, sex & nudity, and drugs means it's mature but honestly i don't. SpruceCaboose

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"][QUOTE="Ragashahs"]I see alot of people now saying the wii finally has a mature game because of madworld and i can't help but think WTF? i know a lot of people think games with alot of swearing, blood & guts, sex & nudity, and drugs means it's mature but honestly i don't. Ragashahs

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"][QUOTE="Ragashahs"]I see alot of people now saying the wii finally has a mature game because of madworld and i can't help but think WTF? i know a lot of people think games with alot of swearing, blood & guts, sex & nudity, and drugs means it's mature but honestly i don't. Ragashahs

So what do define mature as because I will put money down that not everyone will agree. If not everyone can agree on the concrete meaning, there is nothing to argue about. The game deals with matre elements, it has mature written on the box, its mature.

okay i guess i need to clear this up cuase i'm not at all talking about the literal defintion of what is defined at a mature game by the ESRB or anyting more so the way you view that said content and if it really is mature as in for mature audience i'm saying mature games should be judged diifferently by gamers and the rating plays no factor into that

mature games these day's should be rated e for everyone.

Where's the actual games that deserve mature rating?

It's not that the game is mature, but it's for mature audience's. That's the purpose of the rating. It's not telling you that the game is highly sophisticated or something like that :?

okay i guess i need to clear this up cuase i'm not at all talking about the literal defintion of what is defined at a mature game by the ESRB or anyting more so the way you view that said content and if it really is mature as in for mature audience i'm saying mature games should be judged diifferently by gamers and the rating plays no factor into that

Ragashahs

Isn't the word "mature" referring to the people who play it? The ESRB rating addresses that only "mature" people should be playing it, so instead of addressing the games may as well address the audiences. Thats what all those pathetic game bills where no one gives a crap are for.

okay i guess i need to clear this up cuase i'm not at all talking about the literal defintion of what is defined at a mature game by the ESRB or anyting more so the way you view that said content and if it really is mature as in for mature audience i'm saying mature games should be judged diifferently by gamers and the rating plays no factor into that

Ragashahs

Still gets us no where. Telling me Madworld isn't mature won't fly since not everyone shares the same view of mature as you. You call MGS4 mature, is giant robots, mech enhancedpeople, and an age increasng disease really mature? Sure you may think so but I don't have to and that is where this argument of yours falls apart. You don't equal everyones definition ofmature thus you don't get to decide what is mature and what isn't for the rest of us.

jeez forget what said people here can't think outside the boxi'mnot talking about what mature games are rated by this has nothing to do whether it suitable for kids and what noti'mtalking about how games with extreme gore and violence are more immature in the way they used things like sex or gore while games that use those things to make thought provoking ideas. personally games that use alot violence and sex are more often then not immature. it's like a 7 year old discover swear words and adding a swear every other world. just becuase you can use a swear doesn't mean you know how to swear. some with mature content. just becuase you add it violence or sex doesn't mean it's mature

Actually, people are too light on games these days. MadWorld looks like an AO game that needs to be toned down to get an M rating. Just like Halo 3, an M rated game that should be a T.If you're going to make a rating, USE IT! Otherwise, just make the M rating the final one.

jeez forget what said people here can't think outside the boxi'mnot talking about what mature games are rated by this has nothing to do whether it suitable for kids and what noti'mtalking about how games with extreme gore and violence are more immature in the way they used things like sex or gore while games that use those things to make thought provoking ideas. personally games that use alot violence and sex are more often then not immature. it's like a 7 year old discover swear words and adding a swear every other world. just becuase you can use a swear doesn't mean you know how to swear. some with mature content. just becuase you add it violence or sex doesn't mean it's mature

Ragashahs

[QUOTE="Ragashahs"]

jeez forget what said people here can't think outside the boxi'mnot talking about what mature games are rated by this has nothing to do whether it suitable for kids and what noti'mtalking about how games with extreme gore and violence are more immature in the way they used things like sex or gore while games that use those things to make thought provoking ideas. personally games that use alot violence and sex are more often then not immature. it's like a 7 year old discover swear words and adding a swear every other world. just becuase you can use a swear doesn't mean you know how to swear. some with mature content. just becuase you add it violence or sex doesn't mean it's mature

SpruceCaboose

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"][QUOTE="Ragashahs"]

jeez forget what said people here can't think outside the boxi'mnot talking about what mature games are rated by this has nothing to do whether it suitable for kids and what noti'mtalking about how games with extreme gore and violence are more immature in the way they used things like sex or gore while games that use those things to make thought provoking ideas. personally games that use alot violence and sex are more often then not immature. it's like a 7 year old discover swear words and adding a swear every other world. just becuase you can use a swear doesn't mean you know how to swear. some with mature content. just becuase you add it violence or sex doesn't mean it's mature

Ragashahs

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"][QUOTE="Ragashahs"]

jeez forget what said people here can't think outside the boxi'mnot talking about what mature games are rated by this has nothing to do whether it suitable for kids and what noti'mtalking about how games with extreme gore and violence are more immature in the way they used things like sex or gore while games that use those things to make thought provoking ideas. personally games that use alot violence and sex are more often then not immature. it's like a 7 year old discover swear words and adding a swear every other world. just becuase you can use a swear doesn't mean you know how to swear. some with mature content. just becuase you add it violence or sex doesn't mean it's mature

[QUOTE="Ragashahs"]

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"] How is that immature? Expression in however its done is fine. Is there something less mature about Silence of the Lambs than Philadelphia since one uses gore and shock and the other uses emotion to convey its message? ArisShadows

[QUOTE="ArisShadows"][QUOTE="Ragashahs"]there is a big difference in video games alot go video games just use violence as a filler to make it look cool cause infact many games don't have much depth and just add in violence or sex to make it better

Ragashahs

OP is talking about mature themed games with mature stories. For example The Godfather (mature) vs some horror movie (imature, although it has more blood). Madworld is no godfather.

OP is talking about mature themed games with mature stories. For example The Godfather (mature) vs some horror movie (imature, although it has more blood). Madworld is no godfather.

delaystation3

finally people have seen the light

OP is talking about mature themed games with mature stories. For example The Godfather (mature) vs some horror movie (imature, although it has more blood). Madworld is no godfather.

delaystation3

The opening point and our point really mean nothing in the confines of videogames unless they are based on hyper realism. He used MGS4, I could easily argue the fact that the supposed mature themes that are handled are quite immature when you have giant robots that walk around, half machine/cyborg like characters that can do insane acrobatics, several different character that are clones/mutations of someone and an age enhancing disease. Is that a mature theme that is any more mature than saving the princess from bowser again because when you break it down it sounds just as ridiculous.

[QUOTE="LittleHands134"]Wow, you guys are sensitive. I completely understood OP's post right after reading it. Mad World is good old fashion fun in the form of chainsawing your enemies, but it hardly has mature (Mentally mature) content in it. To me, a 'mature' game is one where the contents of it would fly over the head of most younger people, for example MGS4 or any other game with a long, political storyline. That's not the case for Mad World, any 12 year old would squeal in joy if they saw some of the violence in that game. You need to get past this "I can only play mature games for mature gamers such as myself" attitude that half of you seem to have.SpruceCaboose

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"][QUOTE="LittleHands134"]Wow, you guys are sensitive. I completely understood OP's post right after reading it. Mad World is good old fashion fun in the form of chainsawing your enemies, but it hardly has mature (Mentally mature) content in it. To me, a 'mature' game is one where the contents of it would fly over the head of most younger people, for example MGS4 or any other game with a long, political storyline. That's not the case for Mad World, any 12 year old would squeal in joy if they saw some of the violence in that game. You need to get past this "I can only play mature games for mature gamers such as myself" attitude that half of you seem to have.Ragashahs

I couldn't agree more. If people really think that Wii is now a Mature console thanks to one short game then people just need to learn how to use the word right.gunswordfist

[QUOTE="delaystation3"]

OP is talking about mature themed games with mature stories. For example The Godfather (mature) vs some horror movie (imature, although it has more blood). Madworld is no godfather.

ActicEdge

The opening point and our point really mean nothing in the confines of video games unless they are based on hyper realism. He used MGS4, I could easily argue the fact that supposed the mature themes that are handled are quite immaturewhen you have giant robots that walk around, half machine/cyborg like characters that can do insane acrobatics,severalfifferent character that are clones/mutations of someoneand an age enhancing disease. Is that a mature theme that is any more mature than saving the princess form bowser again because when you break it down it sounds ridiculous.

[QUOTE="Ragashahs"]

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"] I am arguing against this self-declared definition of what is and is not mature.SpruceCaboose

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]

[QUOTE="delaystation3"]

OP is talking about mature themed games with mature stories. For example The Godfather (mature) vs some horror movie (imature, although it has more blood). Madworld is no godfather.

delaystation3

The opening point and our point really mean nothing in the confines of video games unless they are based on hyper realism. He used MGS4, I could easily argue the fact that supposed the mature themes that are handled are quite immaturewhen you have giant robots that walk around, half machine/cyborg like characters that can do insane acrobatics,severalfifferent character that are clones/mutations of someoneand an age enhancing disease. Is that a mature theme that is any more mature than saving the princess form bowser again because when you break it down it sounds ridiculous.

Sure, and when you break a GAME (yes we are talking games not movies) down, you can make the deepest plot ever seem rediculous and not mature just by the element s that make them up. The problem is you are insisting that the mature beyond sex, drugs, violence etc can be defined for every person to agree. It can't so there isn't a point in talking about, what I see as mature may not be the same as you and since neither you or I can expect our definition to be accepted by all there is not point in the labels of "real mature" vs "content mature".

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"][QUOTE="Ragashahs"]thinking like that isn't exactly good either just becuase people share different opinoins doens't mean it good or okay to think like that. by your logic anything can be define as good or bad if the defintion of good and bad can be changed around.

Ragashahs

I couldn't agree more. If people really think that Wii is now a Mature console thanks to one short game then people just need to learn how to use the word right.gunswordfist

Teh Wii can't havez matrue gmaez cuz it's teh kiddies :cry: Grow up.

I see alot of people now saying the wii finally has a mature game because of madworld and i can't help but think WTF? i know a lot of people think games with alot of swearing, blood & guts, sex & nudity, and drugs means it's mature but honestly i don't. madworld imo is actually kind of the opposite of a mature game anyone can make some extremely gruesome game but games with mature topics that are done well i much harder and has much more depth. MGS4 is great example with alot of insight into human behavior such as our expanding war economy and whether we are dependent on war, will current advancements in technology lead to increased control and start making A.I's make decisions that used to be made by humans. Mass Effect is just as good example because it really comes shins where you least expect it. Like the prejudice some humans howed to different alien races and how is relates our current times and hsitory of discrimination man has always shown. Even games like shadow of the colossus have much more mature content and really get you thinking. mature content isn't just what the back of the box says with the rating but how it has ideas's and lessons that go well above normal morals and thingking. but thats just my 2 cents

just as a note this might come off as me saying madworld is a bad game which is not what i'm trying to say. Infact i'm really looking forward to madworld but personally games like MGS4, Mass Effect, and shadow of the colossus are alot more mature than madworld. Mature content isn't just something conservative moms or religious groups don't condone but content that gets you to think about issues that aren't simple yes's or no's or even issues that have no answer at all. There is a place for games like madworld which is for pure enjoyment but don't confuse it with other mature games

Ragashahs

All the M means is that you need to be +17 years of age to buy it. End of story.

[QUOTE="Ragashahs"]

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"] Yes it can. That is why people themselves need to define what is good and bad for them. I don't want anyone, not a government, not a person, not a friend, not a religion, not anything to think or decide what is best for me. I want that to be my decision. Anything else is, IMO, an attempt to get censorship wedged into place.SpruceCaboose

edit: i'm not saying any game that uses violence or sex in immature it's how they use it that makes a difference

[QUOTE="LittleHands134"] You're pointlessly arguing for the mature content in a video game. For some reason, you took offense from OP's first post about how gratuitous violence, gore, and swearing doesn't make a game mature. Now you seem fairly upset. Did I miss anything?SpruceCaboose

Making the arbitrary declaration that something is immature is usually just someone saying that something was tasteless to them. It has nothing to do with what the term means in context of entertainment. And no, a 12 year old should not be exposed to Madworld to where they shout with glee or however you put it. I am mature enough to know that. But I think individuals have the final say on what is mature enough for them (talking about adults, or at the very least someone old enough to be able to cognitively know what they can and cannot understand/stomach).

Starting off with the first part of your post, when did I ever say that I'm against artistic expression in video games? There's two different things that people seem to be talking about in this thread.

There's adult content, and then there's mature (Mentally mature, like I mentioned in a previous post) content. Adult content is what you find on the rating on the back of your game box, it tells you all of the content that parents should look out for. Mature content is what you would find in any serious movie or serious game.

For example, try to show your average 7 year old the movie Titanic, he's just going to get bored and leave because half of the content flew right over his head. As for the second part of your post, I never said that I don't like Mad World. There are no immature games, there's mature games, but there's no immature ones. For example, I still play Pokemon and most people would probably consider it an immature game. As long as it's still fun, I see no reason why an age stereotype should stop me from playing it.

I'm not arguing for Mad World being 'immature', I'm arguing against the idea that covering your game in blood, cursing, and sex suddenly makes it one of the "Mature games for mature gamers such as myself" titles.

Edit: Forgot a word.

[...] but personally games like MGS4, Mass Effect, and shadow of the colossus are alot more mature than madworld. Mature content isn't just something conservative moms or religious groups don't condone but content that gets you to think about issues that aren't simple yes's or no's or even issues that have no answer at all. There is a place for games like madworld which is for pure enjoyment but don't confuse it with other mature games

Ragashahs

[QUOTE="Ragashahs"][...] but personally games like MGS4, Mass Effect, and shadow of the colossus are alot more mature than madworld. Mature content isn't just something conservative moms or religious groups don't condone but content that gets you to think about issues that aren't simple yes's or no's or even issues that have no answer at all. There is a place for games like madworld which is for pure enjoyment but don't confuse it with other mature games

foxhound_fox

I cna't tell if your mocking my or complementing meRagashahs

MadWorld is a satire of violent gaming, and as it's based on "mature" gaming, it should be defined as mature.hiphops_savior

More people should acknowledge this.