More ownage for the 360

Look at it this way. Braid scored AAA, therefore its a superb game right? Halo 3 scored AAA, its also a superb game, right? Yeah. Now even if these two games are incomparable. Even if the thought of comparing these games disgusts you, its really doesnt change the fact they are both superb games, regardless of which standards they are marked against.

If your thread had been about comparing certain games, genres or something like that, you know this whole thing wouldnt have started. But you wanted to show which console had the better year, and so you must include all games, else the thread is biased and incomplete.

Look at it this way. Braid scored AAA, therefore its a superb game right? Halo 3 scored AAA, its also a superb game, right? Yeah. Now even if these two games are incomparable. Even if the thought of comparing these games disgusts you, its really doesnt change the fact they are both superb games, regardless of which standards they are marked against.

If your thread had been about comparing certain games, genres or something like that, you know this whole thing wouldnt have started. But you wanted to show which console had the better year, and so you must include all games, else the thread is biased and incomplete.

-DrRobotnik-

[QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

Look at it this way. Braid scored AAA, therefore its a superb game right? Halo 3 scored AAA, its also a superb game, right? Yeah. Now even if these two games are incomparable. Even if the thought of comparing these games disgusts you, its really doesnt change the fact they are both superb games, regardless of which standards they are marked against.

If your thread had been about comparing certain games, genres or something like that, you know this whole thing wouldnt have started. But you wanted to show which console had the better year, and so you must include all games, else the thread is biased and incomplete.

jonnyt61

But im not!!! Thats what im trying to get across!! Ugh. Seriously, that other thread is irrelevant.

Its Serptember 2008. We want to know if the PS3 or the 360 has had the better year in terms of games. Is Halo 3 a game? Yes. Is Braid also a game? Yes. Therefore both shall be included. 2 lists will be devised that include evey game released, and then we'll see which console has had more quality titles. The only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end. There is no comparing within titles. That is what should happen, what exactly dont you understand!?

[QUOTE="jonnyt61"][QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

Look at it this way. Braid scored AAA, therefore its a superb game right? Halo 3 scored AAA, its also a superb game, right? Yeah. Now even if these two games are incomparable. Even if the thought of comparing these games disgusts you, its really doesnt change the fact they are both superb games, regardless of which standards they are marked against.

If your thread had been about comparing certain games, genres or something like that, you know this whole thing wouldnt have started. But you wanted to show which console had the better year, and so you must include all games, else the thread is biased and incomplete.

-DrRobotnik-

But im not!!! Thats what im trying to get across!! Ugh. Seriously, that other thread is irrelevant.

Its Serptember 2008. We want to know if the PS3 or the 360 has had the better year in terms of games. Is Halo 3 a game? Yes. Is Braid also a game? Yes. Therefore both shall be included. 2 lists will be devised that include evey game released, and then we'll see which console has had more quality titles. The only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end. There is no comparing within titles. That is what should happen, what exactly dont you understand!?

You don't realise, you are. You are asking me to list those games, and the only way I can list them, is by putting them up against retail titles, and that isn't fair.

You're still doing it, even now. Read on from "the only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end"
That works, for one standard, but as that thread you deemed as irrelevant shows, most people agree there is a different standard, so they can't be compared in that manner.

I'd have to compare two seperate sections of games, and to be completely honest, I can't be bothered. Especially since they'll be people such as yourself, who will blanket every game into one catgory, when they -shouldn't- be.

Lets not forget Viva Pineta!!!

The next AA super title :roll:

You don't realise, you are. You are asking me to list those games, and the only way I can list them, is by putting them up against retail titles, and that isn't fair.

You're still doing it, even now. Read on from "the only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end"
That works, for one standard, but as that thread you deemed as irrelevant shows, most people agree there is a different standard, so they can't be compared in that manner.

I'd have to compare two seperate sections of games, and to be completely honest, I can't be bothered. Especially since they'll be people such as yourself, who will blanket every game into one catgory, when they -shouldn't- be.

jonnyt61

But even if they are marked to a different standard, they are still high quality games that should be included. Your thread was incomplete. It wasnt a fair representation of both console's line-ups for 2008. I honestly dont think i can make this point any simpler.

[QUOTE="jonnyt61"]

You don't realise, you are. You are asking me to list those games, and the only way I can list them, is by putting them up against retail titles, and that isn't fair.

You're still doing it, even now. Read on from "the only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end"
That works, for one standard, but as that thread you deemed as irrelevant shows, most people agree there is a different standard, so they can't be compared in that manner.

I'd have to compare two seperate sections of games, and to be completely honest, I can't be bothered. Especially since they'll be people such as yourself, who will blanket every game into one catgory, when they -shouldn't- be.

-DrRobotnik-

But even if they are marked to a different standard, they are still high quality games that should be included. Your thread was incomplete. It wasnt a fair representation of both console's line-ups for 2008. I honestly dont think i can make this point any simpler.

[QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

Look at it this way. Braid scored AAA, therefore its a superb game right? Halo 3 scored AAA, its also a superb game, right? Yeah. Now even if these two games are incomparable. Even if the thought of comparing these games disgusts you, its really doesnt change the fact they are both superb games, regardless of which standards they are marked against.

If your thread had been about comparing certain games, genres or something like that, you know this whole thing wouldnt have started. But you wanted to show which console had the better year, and so you must include all games, else the thread is biased and incomplete.

jonnyt61

No he's not asking that. You asked who had the better year. Arcade games are on the system. They should count. in fact, since they are cheaper to buy that does make them comparable to the big budget games. I bought GRID. It was cool and all, but not as fun as Geometry wars 2...especially when I add in how much each costs.

Does warhawk downloads count in making PS3 a great system? It should.

[QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"][QUOTE="jonnyt61"]

You don't realise, you are. You are asking me to list those games, and the only way I can list them, is by putting them up against retail titles, and that isn't fair.

You're still doing it, even now. Read on from "the only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end"
That works, for one standard, but as that thread you deemed as irrelevant shows, most people agree there is a different standard, so they can't be compared in that manner.

I'd have to compare two seperate sections of games, and to be completely honest, I can't be bothered. Especially since they'll be people such as yourself, who will blanket every game into one catgory, when they -shouldn't- be.

jonnyt61

But even if they are marked to a different standard, they are still high quality games that should be included. Your thread was incomplete. It wasnt a fair representation of both console's line-ups for 2008. I honestly dont think i can make this point any simpler.

No one said it would score 9.5 at $60. And no one said Heavely Sword would score A or AA at $10. I'm sure HS would have been 9.5 if it was only $10.

[QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"][QUOTE="jonnyt61"][QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

Look at it this way. Braid scored AAA, therefore its a superb game right? Halo 3 scored AAA, its also a superb game, right? Yeah. Now even if these two games are incomparable. Even if the thought of comparing these games disgusts you, its really doesnt change the fact they are both superb games, regardless of which standards they are marked against.

If your thread had been about comparing certain games, genres or something like that, you know this whole thing wouldnt have started. But you wanted to show which console had the better year, and so you must include all games, else the thread is biased and incomplete.

jonnyt61

But im not!!! Thats what im trying to get across!! Ugh. Seriously, that other thread is irrelevant.

Its Serptember 2008. We want to know if the PS3 or the 360 has had the better year in terms of games. Is Halo 3 a game? Yes. Is Braid also a game? Yes. Therefore both shall be included. 2 lists will be devised that include evey game released, and then we'll see which console has had more quality titles. The only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end. There is no comparing within titles. That is what should happen, what exactly dont you understand!?

You don't realise, you are. You are asking me to list those games, and the only way I can list them, is by putting them up against retail titles, and that isn't fair.

You're still doing it, even now. Read on from "the only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end"
That works, for one standard, but as that thread you deemed as irrelevant shows, most people agree there is a different standard, so they can't be compared in that manner.

I'd have to compare two seperate sections of games, and to be completely honest, I can't be bothered. Especially since they'll be people such as yourself, who will blanket every game into one catgory, when they -shouldn't- be.

How do you compare full retail games at $60 vs. full retail games that sell for $39? I guess we can only count games that sell for the full $60 and no gimmick sales (like pre-order today and get a free download from PSN or XBL).

[QUOTE="jonnyt61"][QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

Look at it this way. Braid scored AAA, therefore its a superb game right? Halo 3 scored AAA, its also a superb game, right? Yeah. Now even if these two games are incomparable. Even if the thought of comparing these games disgusts you, its really doesnt change the fact they are both superb games, regardless of which standards they are marked against.

If your thread had been about comparing certain games, genres or something like that, you know this whole thing wouldnt have started. But you wanted to show which console had the better year, and so you must include all games, else the thread is biased and incomplete.

stiltzsy

No he's not asking that. You asked who had the better year. Arcade games are on the system. They should count. in fact, since they are cheaper to buy that does make them comparable to the big budget games. I bought GRID. It was cool and all, but not as fun as Geometry wars 2...especially when I add in how much each costs.

Does warhawk downloads count in making PS3 a great system? It should.

[QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"][QUOTE="jonnyt61"]

You don't realise, you are. You are asking me to list those games, and the only way I can list them, is by putting them up against retail titles, and that isn't fair.

You're still doing it, even now. Read on from "the only comparison there is the number of quality titles at the end"
That works, for one standard, but as that thread you deemed as irrelevant shows, most people agree there is a different standard, so they can't be compared in that manner.

I'd have to compare two seperate sections of games, and to be completely honest, I can't be bothered. Especially since they'll be people such as yourself, who will blanket every game into one catgory, when they -shouldn't- be.

jonnyt61

But even if they are marked to a different standard, they are still high quality games that should be included. Your thread was incomplete. It wasnt a fair representation of both console's line-ups for 2008. I honestly dont think i can make this point any simpler.

Hence why Braid was not released at $60, but in fact $15 resulting in its 9.5 score. Its an AAA game, get over it dude.

I just readthis thread and figured i would put in my two cents.

now then i will list what exclusives have come out for the PS3 and the 360 that are rated over 7 out of 10 on gamespot. i will have multiple catagories, games out, games coming out this year, and arcade. i will inlude games that are on the PC as well as the system.

these rules should make it easy to look and tali at which one has the better line up i neach of those catagories, and it will keep things very civil.

we will start with the 360 games that are out and exclusive.

-Ninja gaiden 2 score 8/10

-Viva Pinata: trouble in paradise 8.5/10

-Tales of Visapria 8.5/10

-Lost Planet: Extreme Condition Colonies Edition 7.5/10

-Lost odyssey 7.5/10

-Comand counquer 3: kane's wrath 7.5/10

-Frontlines: Fuel of war 7.5/10

Now for the exclusives that are coming out.

-Left 4 Dead

-Gears of War 2

-Rock Band 2 (timed exclusive)

-Infinity undescovered

Xbox 360 arcade

-Castle crashers 8.5/10

-Geometery wars 2 9/10

-Braid 9.5/10

-Galaga leigions 9/10

-Ikaruga 8.5/10

-Penny Arcade Adventures: On the Rain-Slick Precipice of Darkness 7.5/10

Continuing with PS3 exclusives

-Disgea 3: Absence of justice 7.5/10

-Metal gear Solid 4 guns of the patriot 10/10

-Buzz! Quiz TV 7.5/10

-Singstar 7.5/10

-Grand tarismo 5 Prolog 7.5/10

-MLB 08 the show 8.5/10

Now to the PS3 upcoming exclusives.

-Little big planet

-Resistance 2

-Naruto Ultamate Ninja storm

PS3 network exlusives

-Pixel Junk Eden 7/10

-siren: bloody curse 7/10

-the Last Guy (Unscored yet)

-Ratchet and Clank Future: Quest for booty 7.5/10

That is the list showing all the games that i could find in the halfhour-hour i looked with the game score from gamespot.

360 has 7 exclusives that were scored above 7 released in 2008 so far. It has 4 more exclusives that are coming out in 2008.

that is a total of 11 exclusives slated for this year.

the Xbox live arcade has 6 exclusives out (i am not looking at ones coming out casue that would have taken more time then i have at the moment to find.)

the PS3 has 6 exclusives that were scored bove 7 released so far in 2008. I could find about 3 more exclusives slated to come out before the end of 2008.

The PS3 network has 4 exlusive games on it that came out in 2008.

Taking a look at this data i would conclude that the xbox 360 is still in the lead as far as exclusivity of good games in 2008.

now then i am personally out of all the games coming out this year looking forward to Left 4 Dead, either on the PC or on the 360 which ever one i choose to get it for.

dargonsheinto

In Reality, 360 only has 3 exclusives, NG2, VP, and ToV.

-Lost Planet: Extreme Condition Colonies Edition(I don't count expansions or sort of stuff like that as an exclusive full game)

-Comand counquer 3: kane's wrath 7.5/10 (How's this exclusive to the 360? It's also on PC)

-Left 4 Dead (Not exclusive either)

-Frontlines: Fuel of war 7.5/10 (Not exclusive, also on PC)

-Rock Band 2 (timed exclusive) (Timed Exclusive as you said)

[QUOTE="jonnyt61"][QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

But even if they are marked to a different standard, they are still high quality games that should be included. Your thread was incomplete. It wasnt a fair representation of both console's line-ups for 2008. I honestly dont think i can make this point any simpler.

-DrRobotnik-

Hence why Braid was not released at $60, but in fact $15 resulting in its 9.5 score. Its an AAA game, get over it dude.

[QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"][QUOTE="jonnyt61"][QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

But even if they are marked to a different standard, they are still high quality games that should be included. Your thread was incomplete. It wasnt a fair representation of both console's line-ups for 2008. I honestly dont think i can make this point any simpler.

jonnyt61

Hence why Braid was not released at $60, but in fact $15 resulting in its 9.5 score. Its an AAA game, get over it dude.

Whats with all the "what ifs". Who cares what would have happened had it released at $60? Its just a waste of time trying to speculate. In reality, Braid released at $15, and scored 9.5. Another AAA game available to people who own a 360, and another game to add to the list of 360 2008 releases:)

[QUOTE="stiltzsy"][QUOTE="jonnyt61"][QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

Look at it this way. Braid scored AAA, therefore its a superb game right? Halo 3 scored AAA, its also a superb game, right? Yeah. Now even if these two games are incomparable. Even if the thought of comparing these games disgusts you, its really doesnt change the fact they are both superb games, regardless of which standards they are marked against.

If your thread had been about comparing certain games, genres or something like that, you know this whole thing wouldnt have started. But you wanted to show which console had the better year, and so you must include all games, else the thread is biased and incomplete.

jonnyt61

No he's not asking that. You asked who had the better year. Arcade games are on the system. They should count. in fact, since they are cheaper to buy that does make them comparable to the big budget games. I bought GRID. It was cool and all, but not as fun as Geometry wars 2...especially when I add in how much each costs.

Does warhawk downloads count in making PS3 a great system? It should.

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

why do people count the downloaded games? I thought it was kind of empty ownage when you say "hey look I have a AAA $10 game".

why do people count the downloaded games? I thought it was kind of empty ownage when you say "hey look I have a AAA $10 game".

darthogre

Why shouldn't they count? Some of them are better than DS/PSP games. :?

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

stiltzsy

$39.99 I think is the retail version. HOnestly I put Warhawk in with Viva Pinata 2. There is a reason why they games are sold at a cheaper price. They shouldnt be compared to the big titles even though some games like Lair or Too Human may make you think twice.....for the most part these cheap games are not compareable to big budget games.

why do people count the downloaded games? I thought it was kind of empty ownage when you say "hey look I have a AAA $10 game".

darthogre

Well the arcade games recently got really really good so now there is some ownage there. And yes paying $10 for an awesome game is ownage.

Whats with all the "what ifs". Who cares what would have happened had it released at $60? Its just a waste of time trying to speculate. In reality, Braid released at $15, and scored 9.5. Another AAA game available to people who own a 360, and another game to add to the list of 360 2008 releases:)

-DrRobotnik-

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

stiltzsy

Now you're just being pig headed, and a troll, goodbye :)

[QUOTE="stiltzsy"]

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

darthogre

$39.99 I think is the retail version. HOnestly I put Warhawk in with Viva Pinata 2. There is a reason why they games are sold at a cheaper price. They shouldnt be compared to the big titles even though some games like Lair or Too Human may make you think twice.....for the most part these cheap games are not compareable to big budget games.

Ok, so now we need topic creator to take those games out of the running. Oh wait, he already said Viva Pinata 2 counts. What about Banjo kazooie? It's going to retail for less than $60 and if you pre-order you get BK2 download for free and early. So I guess BK can't count for a 360 exclusive also.

But wait warhawk a downloadable game counts and you can get it for $29 at walmart, and it counts to the TC. So I'm so confused. $15 games don't count, but $30 games do count.

[QUOTE="darthogre"]

why do people count the downloaded games? I thought it was kind of empty ownage when you say "hey look I have a AAA $10 game".

xsubtownerx

Why shouldn't they count? Some of them are better than DS/PSP games. :?

and your point is? You want to compare them to DS/PSP games, be my guess. Actually you could be right, some of the downloaded games are probably better than a lot of the PSP and DS games. It's more compareable because the prices are closer. You have $20-$30 handheld games.....but sorry it's a HUGE leap to say you should compare AAA games that have the full retail price......that being $49.99 for the Wii and $59.99 for the PS3/X360.

No, price does not equal quality but it's impossible to compare the two because they are rated MUCH different based on their cost. When the cost is the one of the biggest reasons why it's getting AAA, no I don't think it should be compareable to the highpriced games.

Well, you can have your standards, I'll stick to mine. It's just a nice plus for me, that a lot of System Wars agrees with me too.

[QUOTE="stiltzsy"]

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

jonnyt61

Now you're just being pig headed, and a troll, goodbye :)

How is it pigheaded? You're the one saying download games down count because they are cheaper. but somehow warhawk counts because it's cheaper than the $60 retail point you keep talking about and you can download it.

Oh I got it...what was said earilier is true....you're just trying to make the PS3 year look better than the 360 and forcing it to work. At least admit it or just say PS3 has a better $60 game lineup vs. 360's $60 game lineup.

[QUOTE="darthogre"][QUOTE="stiltzsy"]

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

stiltzsy

$39.99 I think is the retail version. HOnestly I put Warhawk in with Viva Pinata 2. There is a reason why they games are sold at a cheaper price. They shouldnt be compared to the big titles even though some games like Lair or Too Human may make you think twice.....for the most part these cheap games are not compareable to big budget games.

Ok, so now we need topic creator to take those games out of the running. Oh wait, he already said Viva Pinata 2 counts. What about Banjo kazooie? It's going to retail for less than $60 and if you pre-order you get BK2 download for free and early. So I guess BK can't count for a 360 exclusive also.

But wait warhawk a downloadable game counts and you can get it for $29 at walmart, and it counts to the TC. So I'm so confused. $15 games don't count, but $30 games do count.

I said IN MY OPINION. I'm not going to speak for anyone else. My opinion is if the game is rated different just because it's priced cheaper, then NO I don't think it should be compareable to the full retail games. Sorry.

[QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

Whats with all the "what ifs". Who cares what would have happened had it released at $60? Its just a waste of time trying to speculate. In reality, Braid released at $15, and scored 9.5. Another AAA game available to people who own a 360, and another game to add to the list of 360 2008 releases:)

jonnyt61

And im sure the System Wars population would agree that oxygen is very important and that Uwe Boll sucks at making movies. Doesnt change the fact that all games should be included when listing a console line-up:)

[QUOTE="jonnyt61"]
Well, you can have your standards, I'll stick to mine. It's just a nice plus for me, that a lot of System Wars agrees with me too.

[QUOTE="stiltzsy"]

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

stiltzsy

Now you're just being pig headed, and a troll, goodbye :)

How is it pigheaded? You're the one saying download games down count because they are cheaper. but somehow warhawk counts because it's cheaper than the $60 retail point you keep talking about and you can download it.

Oh I got it...what was said earilier is true....you're just trying to make the PS3 year look better than the 360 and forcing it to work. At least admit it or just say PS3 has a better $60 game lineup vs. 360's $60 game lineup.

Because, if you actually read the thread this is about, there's already a rule stating they need to be available at retail. Because there's a difference between retail and downloadable games.

[QUOTE="xsubtownerx"][QUOTE="darthogre"]

why do people count the downloaded games? I thought it was kind of empty ownage when you say "hey look I have a AAA $10 game".

darthogre

Why shouldn't they count? Some of them are better than DS/PSP games. :?

and your point is? You want to compare them to DS/PSP games, be my guess. Actually you could be right, some of the downloaded games are probably better than a lot of the PSP and DS games. It's more compareable because the prices are closer. You have $20-$30 handheld games.....but sorry it's a HUGE leap to say you should compare AAA games that have the full retail price......that being $49.99 for the Wii and $59.99 for the PS3/X360.

No, price does not equal quality but it's impossible to compare the two because they are rated MUCH different based on their cost. When the cost is the one of the biggest reasons why it's getting AAA, no I don't think it should be compareable to the highpriced games.

I agree with you. Maybe someday someone will make a list of the A+ 360/PS3 arcade games.

[QUOTE="stiltzsy"][QUOTE="jonnyt61"]
Well, you can have your standards, I'll stick to mine. It's just a nice plus for me, that a lot of System Wars agrees with me too.

[QUOTE="stiltzsy"]

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

jonnyt61

Now you're just being pig headed, and a troll, goodbye :)

How is it pigheaded? You're the one saying download games down count because they are cheaper. but somehow warhawk counts because it's cheaper than the $60 retail point you keep talking about and you can download it.

Oh I got it...what was said earilier is true....you're just trying to make the PS3 year look better than the 360 and forcing it to work. At least admit it or just say PS3 has a better $60 game lineup vs. 360's $60 game lineup.

Because, if you actually read the thread this is about, there's already a rule stating they need to be available at retail. Because there's a difference between retail and downloadable games.

So a $30 retail game is comparable to a $60 retail game? How so? One costs twice as much. What makes retail purchase > online purchase?

[QUOTE="jonnyt61"]

[QUOTE="-DrRobotnik-"]

Whats with all the "what ifs". Who cares what would have happened had it released at $60? Its just a waste of time trying to speculate. In reality, Braid released at $15, and scored 9.5. Another AAA game available to people who own a 360, and another game to add to the list of 360 2008 releases:)

-DrRobotnik-

And im sure the System Wars population would agree that oxygen is very important and that Uwe Boll sucks at making movies. Doesnt change the fact that all games should be included when listing a console line-up:)

[QUOTE="jonnyt61"][QUOTE="stiltzsy"][QUOTE="jonnyt61"]
Well, you can have your standards, I'll stick to mine. It's just a nice plus for me, that a lot of System Wars agrees with me too.

[QUOTE="stiltzsy"]

How much does the retail version of Warhawk cost? Also I can go to a store buy an XBL Points card and play XBL games....so does that count now?

stiltzsy

Now you're just being pig headed, and a troll, goodbye :)

How is it pigheaded? You're the one saying download games down count because they are cheaper. but somehow warhawk counts because it's cheaper than the $60 retail point you keep talking about and you can download it.

Oh I got it...what was said earilier is true....you're just trying to make the PS3 year look better than the 360 and forcing it to work. At least admit it or just say PS3 has a better $60 game lineup vs. 360's $60 game lineup.

Because, if you actually read the thread this is about, there's already a rule stating they need to be available at retail. Because there's a difference between retail and downloadable games.

So a $30 retail game is comparable to a $60 retail game? How so? One costs twice as much. What makes retail purchase > online purchase?

Go read all of the original thread, and all the replies to Dr Robotnik. That'll answer it. I'm not going to repeat everything.