Most dreadful game design you've experienced?

Cloister of Trials in Final Fantasy X

The Library in Halo 1

Gears of War Judgement for me. Thank **** Gears 4 is more like Gears 3

"Open World" games with Zero interactivity and overreliance on mundane Fetchquests as side mission

Those trials are so weak. It's like they left their computers on over the weekend and the cleaning staff had a go at game development.

Unskippable cut scenes for sure, although I also get that sometimes those cutscenes are a way of disguising load times. Although it's not a deal breaker, cut scenes should also be pausable.

Checkpoint systems where the checkpoints are poorly placed. Worst yet, a combination of both like you had in Max Payne 3 where a checkpoint might take you back to -before- and unskippable cut scene.

Manual saves can be similarly problematic depending on how they are implemented. Alien Isolation had issues with this, where you might have a really long stretch that you have to replay over and over because there's no way to record your progress unless you get further into the game.

If I quit a game without beating it, it's usually because of poorly spaced save opportunity or checkpoints that force me to replay tedious sections over and over.

-Byshop

Castlevania lords of shadow 2 stealth parts...

Gonna keep it to 'most recent' rather than the worst.

But having to play the tutorial/opening sequence MGSV the second time with no variation comes to mind. The opening itself was already arduous and goes a step further with cinematic walking with cinematic crawling.

Telltale's Game of Thrones. It's hard to really describe this one without spoiling it, but about everything about episode 5-6. It just doesnt go anywhere and doesnt even properly conclude. The game spends 4 episodes and leads to nothing. Alot of this Adventure was fucking dumb, actually. I can spoil one at least, the game gives you an illusion of choice that points to 'killing Ramsay Bolton'. The game occurs between the Red Wedding and Stannis still hasnt reached Castle Black.

Before that, probably Dragon Age: Inquisition's wartable. It was a stupid way to gate things with time and needing to do side content.

Recently Beyond 2 Souls. Piece of crap

@thepclovingguy: Yeah I dig ND games but stay away from having an AI buddy if you want stealth in the game. My dog gets spotted and fights in Fallout4. Here's one of my Uncharted 4 captures

Metal Gear Solid 4, and if any game deserves being called a movie game it's this, nothing but back to back endurance contests of poorly written and seemingly neverending cutscene to ever grace the earth. If anything, what little gameplay did make it into the game only serves as an intermission to all the cutscenes. A Telltale game is more deserving of being called a game. But equally offensive was the blanket praise it got. It was the worst case of Emperor's New Clothes phenomena in effect. Not since Jonestown has so much Kool-Aid been consumed.

All other answers are wrong answers.

I despise online Co-op games that allow anyone to skip a cutscene. This action should be reserved for the host of the match only.

@Seabas989: damn that's like my two favorite parts of the game.

MGS V: the whole leveling up the base and getting resources could have been done way better

@cainetao11: I was glad that they couldn't aggro enemies.

Kinda breaks immersion for me when the brother I think I need to save has stealth camo and can run in front of enemies like that

DRIV3R takes the cake for games I've experienced.

I grew up with Driver and Driver 2, and while the performance issues in the latter were downright awful, they were tolerable considering the rest of the game was spot on (I haven't returned either in probably a good 8 years at this point so that may change). I got GTA III instead of the third Driver back in the day, and only got DRIV3R in 2010-ish.

And my god did I dodge a bullet. Dear fvck it's awful. Even the driving isn't fun.

EDIT: And fvck Gamespot's word filter. I can write fucking, fucker and fuckhead, but not ****.

forced insta fail stealth sections,especially when the mechanics suck.Oh and cutscene QTEs

I'm also going to add the control scheme of Red Steel 2. Who thought it was a good idea to map camera controls to the same motion control device that you use to swing your sword? The game is horribly disorienting 90% of the time.

"Upstream" in uncharted 1 always pops in my mind first when someone mentions "worst designed levels". That level somehow made it through QC and I have no idea how. Terribad.

I noticed in Uncharted 4 they kind of did a little Easter egg with the Jeep driving upstream in an early segment. I figured ND was trolling us.

Figured I'd chime in again: I enjoyed Halo 5 a lot, but there was some crap design in that. Most people who have played the game will admit that one boss fight with three Wardens is the biggest pain in the arse and is not at all fun.

Shadow of Mordor has a game design quirk that most people may not be bothered with, but I was and it greatly affected my enjoyment of the game. So I was trying to clear out the first area of all the orcs, but I didn't realize there was a whole second area and that once you get to the second area you gain more powers to make fighting the orcs easier and more enjoyable. I had literally spent the first half of the game doing monotonous garbage due to one hand being tied behind my back, for none of it to matter in this second area.

I did not think Shadow of Mordor was a Game of the Year type of game like Gamespot did.

@lamprey263:

Mgs4 plays when it plays though. Lots of cutscenes but they are more in the vein of old school ninja Gaiden. Mgs4 at its core is still a level based game.

Dark Souls 3 can suck my butt

@Pikminmaniac: huh? i thought the controls in RS2 were excellent. the game had a pretty clear definition between a sword swipe and moving the camera (i.e. you had to make the extra effort to swing the sword). its been an age since i played it but i dont remember having control issues.

another couple of examples just popped into my head.

enemy level scaling (e.g. oblivion). awful idea...a lazy hack that makes not levelling up beneficial for the player. it was fundimentally broken.

kinda related: difficulty adjustment based on the player struggeling (e.g. max payne). talk about patronising. your struggeling to beat a challenge so the game automatically makes things easier. its like the designer just saying "oh you finally managed to beat this bit..arent you great...heres a lollipop you little scamp". there is no sense of accomplishment when a game does this. nintendo had a far better way to deal with this. if the player is struggeling then add something they player can use, if they wish, to make the challenge easier. but let them ignore it and beat it themsleves if they want. or, of course, just allow the player to change difficulty if they have had enough.

i have also seen that the homeworld games have a system where the number of enemies in each level depends on the size of your fleet when you start the level. this just encourages players to dump their ships before ending the level...i.e. its broken and needs a rethink. its not a game breaking design decision but its a bit sloppy.

Not the worst ever, but I dislike half baked stealth gameplay in games like Tomb Raider or Uncharted. Too arcadey.

I remember though that there was this accomplishment system in New Super Mario Bros. Where when you selected your file, there would be stars on it, you got a star for beating the game, star for getting all the star coins, star for beating all the levels, star for unlocking everything, stuff like that. And there was a final star for doing all that stuff without the help button ever appearing. I remember I was struggling to get a star coin on one level and the help button appeared. Now I couldn't get that last star. Hours and hours wasted. Atleast that's my memory.

Nexon

All things Nexon

Been playing a lot of salt and sanctuary recently and I have to say whomever designed the pinewoods level needs to be fired. Oh and ng+ sucks major balls.

Also the first phase of the final boss in Shovel Knight. Brilliant level design Yacht Club Games. -_-

Alan Wake. Having to aim at the enemy for 5 seconds before your bullets do any damage just draws out combat like having bullet sponge enemies only without the minor satisfaction of emptying clip after clip.. Added to that, you have to reload batteries constantly and combat just becomes tedious.

Tera another: Tve Action combat

In combat mode walk slower than a grandma trying to cross a street

Pretty much the entirety of FROM Software's catalog. Can't stand their games.

I thought you did like Bloodborne, however? Or am I mistaken in that?

At first, but not after trying to get through more of it. I suck at those games, therefor they're terribly designed. Works for me.

Haha, fair enough.

If you ever need help getting through Bloodborne, hit me up on PSN, and maybe we can co-op it :)

Dead Space - The turret section. Rogue Leader had a better designed turret level.

@MirkoS77: i think, for what the developer set out to do, the souls games are well designed. the games are supposed to be a harsh, punishing, grueling and unfair slaughtering of the player...the idea being that the player can finally say "screw you From software...i just overcame everything you could throw at me".

you die...you try to learn something from it and try again with a new plan....fail again and new plan until you win. then rinse and repeat. it's a very old school approach to game design and i can see the appeal. i just disagree with it on a philosophical level.

the only criticism i have of the actual gameplay is that i think the RPG mechanics actually do the combat system (which is quite good) no favours. in what is supposed to be a game based on player skill, the RPG side just makes things a bit sloppy. if the game took a few leaves from the book of zelda (mainly around having clearer defined states of the player character) it would allow the developer to make even more interesting enemies with more intricate behaviour and push the combat system a bit further.

its current character development system is more suited to a character skill based game (e.g. morrowind) rather than a player skill based game.

@Pikminmaniac: Blue shells in general are cheap in Mario Kart games. You can't punish someone for being first. With weopons, I think the first one, Super Mario Kart had the best balance.

Agreed.

• For the person in first, it randomly punishes them for playing the game well.
• For the person in the last few places, it doesn't help them get ahead.

What defense is there for this item? They made it even worse in Mario Kart 8 because 1st place people get Coin items more often than not. This leaves them vulnerable to every other item in addition to the blue shell.

Would take you up on that, but I've neither the game nor PSN+. Will pick it up on the budget, though with PSN+ I don't know. I'll keep your offer in mind though, I suck at that game...

@osan0: I don't necessarily disagree with the philosophy of FROM's games, just the execution. At least from what I remember, I'd have to boot their games up again to be able to better articulate. From what I recall, much of what I played struck me as incredible unfair and unbalanced.

@MirkoS77: but that is the philosophy of it....initially it is unfair and punishes the player because they dont know what they are doing. the idea is that you learn and, through defeat, you get better.

to an experienced souls player the games are not unbalanced. they have learned the behaviour of their own character and the attacks of their enemies. and by knowing these things they can beat the next challenge. the enemies they struggled with at the start become disposable cannon fodder because they know how to deal with them through experience.

so in that sense the game does work and it works well imho (well from what i played of DS2 and demon souls anyway). its just an exercise in learning through getting your backside handed to you again and again....and again....and ag....ah you get the idea :P.

NG Sigma ( and I assume Black ) - demon piranha's towards the end of the game are annoying as shit , whoever came up with that should be fed to piranhas if you ask me.

The spinning blades in God of War 1 are pretty annoying

The beginning of the Big Shell in MGS2 - not having a silenced weapon is god damn miserable

That's my problem with it right there, you reminded me of what I hate about them.

I don't enjoy trial and error in games, much less when it's combined with punishing difficulty. I adore skill-based games (Galak-Z is a prime example of one) where initially, you are given the rule-set and told you need to up your game. It took me weeks before I grasped Galak-Z's and became proficient at its controls so as to be second nature. FROM's games do not do this from what I've played. They say, "Here's the rules, now go and encounter enemies over and over ad nauseum, and die again and again so you won't be ignorant of their attacks on the next run". That's not skill to me, it's artificial and unfair difficulty predicated upon being completely ignorant of what you're dealing with.

If I grasped and excelled in Galak-Z's physics based engine and controls from the get-go, I could defeat the game in my very first play-through. If I grasped Demon/Dark Soul's/Bloodborne's mechanics, I would still get hammered and killed by many enemies along the way by no fault of my own, simply because I couldn't have known better beforehand. That is poor design, and while some may enjoy it, I don't find it enjoyable at all.

Mass Effect 2 planet scanning (been mentioned multiple times already, but truly the WOAT).

Mass Effect 3 "galactic readiness," forcing you to play a boring coop horde mode with ME's mediocre shooting mechanics for hours in order to get the "good" (lol) ending.

More recently, Bloodborne frequently slows to a grind by forcing you to farm essential consumables that would replenish automatically in prior souls games. Having to always go back to the hub world to fast travel somewhere else is also egregiously stupid, and doubles the time you spend loading.

Escort missions in which the character/thing you're escorting travels forward automatically, impervious to its own safety. I recently replayed ODST, and in one of the final segments you're escorting this garbage truck thing that just immediately charges past you into legions of Covenant tanks, ghosts, flyers, cannons, turrets, etc., despite being equipped with no offensive weaponry.

@MirkoS77: oh i agree with you which is why i dont get along with souls games either. im just saying the game, for what it sets out to do, is not badly designed. it does what it sets out to do well.

but you do bring up a good point about the rules. i think the souls games would be better if they dropped the levelling system. levelling systems introduce fuzzyness. its not a game breaking level of fuzziness (i get the impression that 1 challenge people set themselves is to beat game game without levelling up) but its there. i think the games would be better if they dropped the levelling system, clearly defined the behaviour of each weapon, piece of armor and the player character themselves and just let the player off to explore. having a clearly defined player state would also allow the developer to play around with what they throw at you even more because they dont have to worry about having the player in an unwinnable condition (not that FROM give a crap about that :P).

Meh, it happens rarely and every once in awhile they manage to actually help.