MS manages to turn 40$ reductions into 200$ profits.

[QUOTE="delta3074"][QUOTE="Eddie-Vedder"] What world do you live in? How does every company do this? MS is in a league of it's own when it comes to ripping off it's customers, lems need to stop spewing this nonsense that all corporations are the same. Theres a diference between looking for a fair/smart profit and ripping your customers off. All companies do not rip off their customers.micky4889

The PS3 launched at £500?? Because i have a link that saysotherwise. And the PS1 launched at £400 ?? Was it not £299 just like the PS2 ??I'm sorry but i can't take you seriously, someone who has to inflate costs and skew facts in order to make a point, is not a person worth debating with.

Edit: That last part is my opinion on people in general and is not directed at anyone in particular.

[QUOTE="delta3074"][QUOTE="Eddie-Vedder"] What world do you live in? How does every company do this? MS is in a league of it's own when it comes to ripping off it's customers, lems need to stop spewing this nonsense that all corporations are the same. Theres a diference between looking for a fair/smart profit and ripping your customers off. All companies do not rip off their customers.Eddie-Vedder

[QUOTE="Eddie-Vedder"]

[QUOTE="delta3074"]i live in the wold where i did a BTEC national diploma in business and finance, including marketing and consumer legislation, during my spare time in the army, i am 35 years old and i have seen many company's 'rip off' there customers, the PS1 was 400 quid when it first released here and the dream cast was actually cheaper than the ps1, the PS2 was 400 quid when it first released here, the PS3 was 500 quid when it first released here, the 360 was 280 quid when it first released here, who's ripping off who?, if it wasn't for MS i wouldn't have been able to afford a next gen console, i live in a world where business means to make money, you live in a world where MS is bad because SONY apparently does charity instead of good business, and to quote an old english saying ' you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off' even after reading this, i don't feel ripped offdelta3074

[QUOTE="delta3074"][QUOTE="Eddie-Vedder"] What world do you live in? How does every company do this? MS is in a league of it's own when it comes to ripping off it's customers, lems need to stop spewing this nonsense that all corporations are the same. Theres a diference between looking for a fair/smart profit and ripping your customers off. All companies do not rip off their customers.Eddie-Vedder

All businesses operate on the same principles. What a product sells for has nothing to do with the cost of making it. The only exceptions to this are regulated monopolies where the price is set by the regulator. If you don't understand this, you don't understand the world you live in.

Sony sold memory cards last gen for how much? EmpCom

[QUOTE="MortalDecay"][QUOTE="Gxgear"]

That's how M$ gets you, with the hidden costs.

Odrec

[QUOTE="EmpCom"]Sony sold memory cards last gen for how much? hot114

Unlike Sony and the monopoly standard that is BD, amirite? LMAO.

Unlike Sony and the monopoly standard that is BD, amirite? LMAO.

SUD123456

[QUOTE="hot114"][QUOTE="EmpCom"]Sony sold memory cards last gen for how much? SUD123456

Unlike Sony and the monopoly standard that is BD, amirite? LMAO.

[QUOTE="SUD123456"]Unlike Sony and the monopoly standard that is BD, amirite? LMAO.

hot114

So what your saying is that Sony had no interest in ensuring that the monopoly standard that is BluRay defeated HD-DVD? So Sony just sat on the sidelines and didn't lift a finger to help its own standard win? And they don't get any BD royalties, amirite?

So let me get this right. MS is teh evil because if you manufacture add-on products for the 360 without being licensed by MS you get the lawyer letter.

But Sony is teh angel because you can manufacture products without license by the BDA and without paying them royalties.....ugh....wait....where was I going with that.....damn sounds like the same principle.

[QUOTE="SUD123456"]

[QUOTE="hot114"]last gen indeed was when a 265MB flash card for your digital camera could run you up to 40$ ontop of that sony has always allowed 3d partys to make memorycards and HDD etc unlike microsoft who enforces a monopoly hence the heavily inflated pricing.delta3074

Unlike Sony and the monopoly standard that is BD, amirite? LMAO.

I didn't say they did. I implied that they have an interest in the monopoly standard that is BD succeeding, for the obvious reason that they gain financially because of it.

Total gain 240$, so every console is worth 2 now?
Thats awesome for just wifi and a HDD, playing theyr consumers like marionettes
While sony is losing on every PS3 sold every 360 gets to count for 2 XDXDXD.

hot114

[QUOTE="micky4889"]

[QUOTE="delta3074"]i live in the wold where i did a BTEC national diploma in business and finance, including marketing and consumer legislation, during my spare time in the army, i am 35 years old and i have seen many company's 'rip off' there customers, the PS1 was 400 quid when it first released here and the dream cast was actually cheaper than the ps1, the PS2 was 400 quid when it first released here, the PS3 was 500 quid when it first released here, the 360 was 280 quid when it first released here, who's ripping off who?, if it wasn't for MS i wouldn't have been able to afford a next gen console, i live in a world where business means to make money, you live in a world where MS is bad because SONY apparently does charity instead of good business, and to quote an old english saying ' you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off' even after reading this, i don't feel ripped offdelta3074

The PS3 launched at £500?? Because i have a link that saysotherwise. And the PS1 launched at £400 ?? Was it not £299 just like the PS2 ??I'm sorry but i can't take you seriously, someone who has to inflate costs and skew facts in order to make a point, is not a person worth debating with.

Edit: That last part is my opinion on people in general and is not directed at anyone in particular.

You were replying to this "There's a difference between looking for a fair/smart profit and ripping your customers off. All companies do not rip off their customers." with made up PS launch prices and then comparing them to the factual 360 price, there is no "maybe"

All PS consoles to date were sold at a loss (correct me if I'm wrong) and came with the 'next best thing' storage wise. PS1 has CD, which was cutting edge at the time, PS2 had DVD and the PS3 came with Blu Ray. The 360 came out when DVD which was already well established so of course it is going to cost less, and i fail to see what this has to do with a $99 WiFi adapter that probable costs Microsoft $20 tops to make.

"you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off"

Yup there's a lot of misinformed people out there, try doing this this. Tell said person that the HDD they are about to spend $120 on really only cost $40~.

Will they feel ripped off now?

"you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off"

Yup there's a lot of misinformed people out there, try doing this this. Tell said person that the HDD they are about to speed $120 on really only cost $40~.

Will they feel ripped off now?

micky4889

It costs about 20 cents to make a tube of lipstick.Many retail easily over $10. Some retail over $25. There is no material difference between the manufacturing cost.

It costs about half a cent a pill to make most pharaceutical products in large quantities. They can retail any where from 10 cents to $10 per pill. There is no material difference between the manufacturing cost.

It costs $5-$10 to make a pair of jeans. Some retail for $25. Many retail easily for $100+. There is no material difference between the manufacturing costs.

Tell a person how much ANYTHING costs vs what they are paying for it and the vast majority of people will feel ripped off. This is because the vast majority of people don't think the rules of capitalism should apply to them.

[QUOTE="micky4889"]

"you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off"

Yup there's a lot of misinformed people out there, try doing this this. Tell said person that the HDD they are about to speed $120 on really only cost $40~.

Will they feel ripped off now?

SUD123456

It costs about 20 cents to make a tube of lipstick.Many retail easily over $10. Some retail over $25. There is no material difference between the manufacturing cost.

It costs about half a cent a pill to make most pharaceutical products in large quantities. They can retail any where from 10 cents to $10 per pill. There is no material difference between the manufacturing cost.

It costs $5-$10 to make a pair of jeans. Some retail for $25. Many retail easily for $100+. There is no material difference between the manufacturing costs.

Tell a person how much ANYTHING costs vs what they are paying for it and the vast majority of people will feel ripped off. This is because the vast majority of people don't think the rules of capitalism should apply to them.

Ya that a good point but there is competition in those markets you listed, so if the consumer doesn't like the price, they have plenty of alternatives. Whats the alternative to Microsofts HDDs? There is none, because Microsoft know no one would touch their HDD/Wifi at that price if there was a more reasonably priced option.

[QUOTE="delta3074"][QUOTE="micky4889"]

The PS3 launched at £500?? Because i have a link that saysotherwise. And the PS1 launched at £400 ?? Was it not £299 just like the PS2 ??I'm sorry but i can't take you seriously, someone who has to inflate costs and skew facts in order to make a point, is not a person worth debating with.

Edit: That last part is my opinion on people in general and is not directed at anyone in particular.

micky4889

You were replying to this "There's a difference between looking for a fair/smart profit and ripping your customers off. All companies do not rip off their customers." with made up PS launch prices and then comparing them to the factual 360 price, there is no "maybe"

All PS consoles to date were sold at a loss (correct me if I'm wrong) and came with the 'next best thing' storage wise. PS1 has CD, which was cutting edge at the time, PS2 had DVD and the PS3 came with Blu Ray. The 360 came out when DVD which was already well established so of course it is going to cost less, and i fail to see what this has to do with a $99 WiFi adapter that probable costs Microsoft $20 tops to make.

"you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off"

Yup there's a lot of misinformed people out there, try doing this this. Tell said person that the HDD they are about to spend $120 on really only cost $40~.

Will they feel ripped off now?

[QUOTE="SUD123456"]

[QUOTE="micky4889"]

"you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off"

Yup there's a lot of misinformed people out there, try doing this this. Tell said person that the HDD they are about to speed $120 on really only cost $40~.

Will they feel ripped off now?

micky4889

It costs about 20 cents to make a tube of lipstick.Many retail easily over $10. Some retail over $25. There is no material difference between the manufacturing cost.

It costs about half a cent a pill to make most pharaceutical products in large quantities. They can retail any where from 10 cents to $10 per pill. There is no material difference between the manufacturing cost.

It costs $5-$10 to make a pair of jeans. Some retail for $25. Many retail easily for $100+. There is no material difference between the manufacturing costs.

Tell a person how much ANYTHING costs vs what they are paying for it and the vast majority of people will feel ripped off. This is because the vast majority of people don't think the rules of capitalism should apply to them.

Ya that a good point but there is competition in those markets you listed, so if the consumer doesn't like the price, they have plenty of alternatives. Whats the alternative to Microsofts HDDs? There is none, because Microsoft know no one would touch their HDD/Wifi at that price if there was a more reasonably priced option.

:roll: Don't you understand the difference between charging what's a fair amount to make a profit and ripping off people? By your view selling a glass of milk for $1000 is the idea of good business and should be desired. Gosh you would think people could grasp simple concepts like this easily but it's minblowing to the lenghts they go to justify their purchase.Odrec

Do you buy every product you see an infomercial for? If not, you made a decision with your money, showing the roll consumers are supposed to play in capitalism.

[QUOTE="micky4889"]

[QUOTE="delta3074"]maybe my figure's where inflated, but thanks for adding facts to my initial point, every playstation released at a higher price point than the 360, it was 280 quid for the 20gb premium model, the core system was only 200delta3074

You were replying to this "There's a difference between looking for a fair/smart profit and ripping your customers off. All companies do not rip off their customers." with made up PS launch prices and then comparing them to the factual 360 price, there is no "maybe"

All PS consoles to date were sold at a loss (correct me if I'm wrong) and came with the 'next best thing' storage wise. PS1 has CD, which was cutting edge at the time, PS2 had DVD and the PS3 came with Blu Ray. The 360 came out when DVD which was already well established so of course it is going to cost less, and i fail to see what this has to do with a $99 WiFi adapter that probable costs Microsoft $20 tops to make.

"you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off"

Yup there's a lot of misinformed people out there, try doing this this. Tell said person that the HDD they are about to spend $120 on really only cost $40~.

Will they feel ripped off now?

You were the one who brought up the price of a console at launch, not me. And ya "cutting edge" wasn't the words i should have used, but none the less CD was pretty new back in the PS1 days and thus the price, also i never said DVD wasn't around before the PS2. The technology was relatively new back then so it cost far, far more to put a DVD in the PS2(Don't recall the stand alone £200 DVD players?) then it was for the 360, given the time they released in. Also i'm pretty sure the Dreamcast didn't use DVDs it used some other disc based media (?)

And your point about trainers doesn't apply here, you're comparing an open market to a closed one.

Is there trainers that cost £100? yea i'm pretty there is.

Is there trainers that cost £10? yup

[QUOTE="micky4889"]

[QUOTE="SUD123456"]

It costs about 20 cents to make a tube of lipstick.Many retail easily over $10. Some retail over $25. There is no material difference between the manufacturing cost.

It costs about half a cent a pill to make most pharaceutical products in large quantities. They can retail any where from 10 cents to $10 per pill. There is no material difference between the manufacturing cost.

It costs $5-$10 to make a pair of jeans. Some retail for $25. Many retail easily for $100+. There is no material difference between the manufacturing costs.

Tell a person how much ANYTHING costs vs what they are paying for it and the vast majority of people will feel ripped off. This is because the vast majority of people don't think the rules of capitalism should apply to them.

delta3074

Ya that a good point but there is competition in those markets you listed, so if the consumer doesn't like the price, they have plenty of alternatives. Whats the alternative to Microsofts HDDs? There is none, because Microsoft know no one would touch their HDD/Wifi at that price if there was a more reasonably priced option.

Sorry but the old "so don't buy it" argument is weak. imo

What if you already have a 360? Are you meant to sell it along with all your games? Lose all the friends you've made on live, etc. Just because you don't agree with the price of Microsofts add-ons ?

Sorry but the old "so don't buy it" argument is weak. imo

micky4889

[QUOTE="micky4889"]What if you already have a 360? Are you meant to sell it along with all your games? Lose all the friends you've made on live, etc. Just because you don't agree with the price of Microsofts add-ons ?

Sorry but the old "so don't buy it" argument is weak. imo

SpruceCaboose

So you would blame all the mums that bought a 360 for their children, all the grand parents who bought a 360 for their loved ones for birthdays, Christmas etc. for not breaking out a laptop and researching every little detail about the product before they purchase it? You wouldn't blame Microsoft at all?

Nobody would mind if they made $10-$20 profit, every company has to profit in some way, but we're talking about buying in a 3rd party HDD slapping an MS sticker on it, and selling it for over 3-4 times it's worth. If it was an open market, it wouldn't matter but it's the fact that the consumers who own a 360 don't have a choice, it's either spend that absurd amount of money on an MS HDD, or you can't have one at all.

[QUOTE="delta3074"][QUOTE="micky4889"]

You were replying to this "There's a difference between looking for a fair/smart profit and ripping your customers off. All companies do not rip off their customers." with made up PS launch prices and then comparing them to the factual 360 price, there is no "maybe"

All PS consoles to date were sold at a loss (correct me if I'm wrong) and came with the 'next best thing' storage wise. PS1 has CD, which was cutting edge at the time, PS2 had DVD and the PS3 came with Blu Ray. The 360 came out when DVD which was already well established so of course it is going to cost less, and i fail to see what this has to do with a $99 WiFi adapter that probable costs Microsoft $20 tops to make.

"you have only been ripped off if you feel you have been ripped off"

Yup there's a lot of misinformed people out there, try doing this this. Tell said person that the HDD they are about to spend $120 on really only cost $40~.

Will they feel ripped off now?

You were the one who brought up the price of a console at launch, not me. And ya "cutting edge" wasn't the words i should have used, but none the less CD was pretty new back in the PS1 days and thus the price, also i never said DVD wasn't around before the PS2. The technology was relatively new back then so it cost far, far more to put a DVD in the PS2(Don't recall the stand alone £200 DVD players?) then it was for the 360, given the time they released in. Also i'm pretty sure the Dreamcast didn't use DVDs it used some other disc based media (?)

And your point about trainers doesn't apply here, you're comparing an open market to a closed one.

Is there trainers that cost £100? yea i'm pretty there is.

Is there trainers that cost £10? yup

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"]

[QUOTE="micky4889"]What if you already have a 360? Are you meant to sell it along with all your games? Lose all the friends you've made on live, etc. Just because you don't agree with the price of Microsofts add-ons ?

Sorry but the old "so don't buy it" argument is weak. imo

micky4889

So you would blame all the mums that bought a 360 for their children, all the grand parents who bought a 360 for their loved ones for birthdays, Christmas etc. for not breaking out a laptop and researching every little detail about the product before they purchase it? You wouldn't blame Microsoft at all?

Nobody would mind if they made $10-$20 profit, every company has to profit in some way, but we're talking about buying in a 3rd party HDD slapping an MS sticker on it, and selling it for over 3-4 times it's worth. If it was an open market, it wouldn't matter but it's the fact that the consumers who own a 360 don't have a choice, it's either spend that absurd amount of money on an MS HDD, or you can't have one at all.