Proof Nintendo is ruining gaming.

[QUOTE="ChaneyR91"]

It really is sad to see such poorly made games sell better then games that developers really put a lot in to... But, we can hope that if a lot of new people start playing because of the games on the Wii they may keep playing and soon after help Real games sell...

Tylendal

And besides, who's to say that a lot of time and effort wasn't put into Wii Fit?

Really though, what you say is what most people fail to realize. That everyone started casual, and gaming is starting to abandon the sorts of games that bring the most casuals up to hardcore level. Only Nintendo is trying to keep that going.

I just wish people would stop thinking in the short term.

Good post, and something thats rarely brought up in these anti-Wii threads...

While I would like Nintendo to make more "hardcore"games, it's not as if I can't find those games from other companies on the Wii, PS3, PC or 360. I just need more money... :P

[QUOTE="789shadow"]

[QUOTE="Solidyeas"]I just saw the top 5 selling games this year MGS4 wasn't in them but mario kart and Wii fit were. I dont know about you but I think that is just a disgrace to gaming that a game 10 years in the making that cost 10s of millions to make sold less then a gimmick and a family orientated and basic racer possible on N64. Why should companies bother making hardcore gaming pushing technology when they can sell more making a casual game the whole family will play and spend a tenth of the price developing it. Casual gaming sucks and so does Nintendo.Zhengi

Ever noticed how the Academy Award nominees for Best Picture make less at the box office than most of the crap that comes out?Casual stuff will always,always,outsell the hardcore.That's the way it is with every medium.

It didn't have to be this way. If Konami puts MGS4 on the Wii, it would have sold a lot more than what the PS3 has sold.

It would also be a horrible game and not have gotten a 10 here. We're playing MGS4, not MGS2.

[QUOTE="CreasianDevaili"][QUOTE="Ryoco"]

1. MGS4 = best game ever

2. Ur totally right, Sony has done much much more for gaming than Nintendo ever has or ever will

angry_fork

What has sony done that nintendo hasnt?

Sell over 100 million consoles for 2 seperate systems, in back to back generations.

He meant for gaming.

Sony also has sold way more laptops then Nintendo.

[QUOTE="Zhengi"][QUOTE="789shadow"]

[QUOTE="Solidyeas"]I just saw the top 5 selling games this year MGS4 wasn't in them but mario kart and Wii fit were. I dont know about you but I think that is just a disgrace to gaming that a game 10 years in the making that cost 10s of millions to make sold less then a gimmick and a family orientated and basic racer possible on N64. Why should companies bother making hardcore gaming pushing technology when they can sell more making a casual game the whole family will play and spend a tenth of the price developing it. Casual gaming sucks and so does Nintendo.angry_fork

Ever noticed how the Academy Award nominees for Best Picture make less at the box office than most of the crap that comes out?Casual stuff will always,always,outsell the hardcore.That's the way it is with every medium.

It didn't have to be this way. If Konami puts MGS4 on the Wii, it would have sold a lot more than what the PS3 has sold.

It would also be a horrible game and not have gotten a 10 here. We're playing MGS4, not MGS2.

You think MGS2 is a horrible game?

What about Snake Eater?

[QUOTE="angry_fork"][QUOTE="Zhengi"][QUOTE="789shadow"]

[QUOTE="Solidyeas"]I just saw the top 5 selling games this year MGS4 wasn't in them but mario kart and Wii fit were. I dont know about you but I think that is just a disgrace to gaming that a game 10 years in the making that cost 10s of millions to make sold less then a gimmick and a family orientated and basic racer possible on N64. Why should companies bother making hardcore gaming pushing technology when they can sell more making a casual game the whole family will play and spend a tenth of the price developing it. Casual gaming sucks and so does Nintendo.BubbyJello

Ever noticed how the Academy Award nominees for Best Picture make less at the box office than most of the crap that comes out?Casual stuff will always,always,outsell the hardcore.That's the way it is with every medium.

It didn't have to be this way. If Konami puts MGS4 on the Wii, it would have sold a lot more than what the PS3 has sold.

It would also be a horrible game and not have gotten a 10 here. We're playing MGS4, not MGS2.

You think MGS3 is a horrible game?

What about Snake Eater?

Huh? Ofcourse not MGS3 is amazing.

What I meant was the Wii has last-gen technology, graphics-wise, power-wise in general, and if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4.

[QUOTE="nVidiaGaMer"]

[QUOTE="HarlockJC"]Own both MGS4 and Mario Kart....I am glad to see Mario kart sold better. It is a funner game to play. Gh0st_Of_0nyx

No its not ... the only people who would think its more fun are the younger gamers.

Its for youngsters. I rest my case. The PS3 the real deal.

[QUOTE="Zhengi"][QUOTE="789shadow"]

[QUOTE="Solidyeas"]I just saw the top 5 selling games this year MGS4 wasn't in them but mario kart and Wii fit were. I dont know about you but I think that is just a disgrace to gaming that a game 10 years in the making that cost 10s of millions to make sold less then a gimmick and a family orientated and basic racer possible on N64. Why should companies bother making hardcore gaming pushing technology when they can sell more making a casual game the whole family will play and spend a tenth of the price developing it. Casual gaming sucks and so does Nintendo.angry_fork

Ever noticed how the Academy Award nominees for Best Picture make less at the box office than most of the crap that comes out?Casual stuff will always,always,outsell the hardcore.That's the way it is with every medium.

It didn't have to be this way. If Konami puts MGS4 on the Wii, it would have sold a lot more than what the PS3 has sold.

It would also be a horrible game and not have gotten a 10 here. We're playing MGS4, not MGS2.

Because MGS2 is a bad game? :lol:

Some of you haters are amazing.

Huh? Ofcourse not MGS3 is amazing.

What I meant was the Wii has last-gen technology, graphics-wise, power-wise in general, and if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4.

angry_fork

I meant MGS2, not 3 :oops:

And you said if MGS4 was on Wii it would be horrible, and now you just said,"if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4".

Which would lead one to believe you think MGS2 is horrible.

[QUOTE="CreasianDevaili"][QUOTE="Ryoco"]

1. MGS4 = best game ever

2. Ur totally right, Sony has done much much more for gaming than Nintendo ever has or ever will

angry_fork

What has sony done that nintendo hasnt?

Sell over 100 million consoles for 2 seperate systems, in back to back generations.

thats just how good nintendo is....

they can make a fun game even without good graphics or putting lots of time into it and still make it far better than all games that come out that gen...

i bet the makers of metal gear cant do that with theyre games

i bet no other devolpers can even come close to what nintendo does

[QUOTE="CreasianDevaili"][QUOTE="Ryoco"]

1. MGS4 = best game ever

2. Ur totally right, Sony has done much much more for gaming than Nintendo ever has or ever will

angry_fork

What has sony done that nintendo hasnt?

Sell over 100 million consoles for 2 seperate systems, in back to back generations.

Yep thats something that Nintendo and Microsoft will never do.

[QUOTE="angry_fork"]

Huh? Ofcourse not MGS3 is amazing.

What I meant was the Wii has last-gen technology, graphics-wise, power-wise in general, and if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4.

BubbyJello

I meant MGS2, not 3 :oops:

And you said if MGS4 was on Wii it would be horrible, and now you just said,"if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4".

Which would lead one to believe you think MGS2 is horrible.

oooh I see what you mean, lmao my bad yea I worded that wrong, I love the entire MGS series including part 2.

What I mean is it would be horrible compared to the PS3 version, due to limitations.

[QUOTE="angry_fork"][QUOTE="CreasianDevaili"][QUOTE="Ryoco"]

1. MGS4 = best game ever

2. Ur totally right, Sony has done much much more for gaming than Nintendo ever has or ever will

Spartan070

What has sony done that nintendo hasnt?

Sell over 100 million consoles for 2 seperate systems, in back to back generations.

I know, Nintendo has obviously done more for gaming, i was just being a smart ass.

It would be more productive to expell thread making in its entiretyFancyKetchup25

sig worthy

[QUOTE="Ryoco"]

1. MGS4 = best game ever

2. Ur totally right, Sony has done much much more for gaming than Nintendo ever has or ever will

Spartan070

I have a wii and think its the worst console this gen, but nin has done more for gaming than any company ever will. It made it what it is today. If there was no Nintendo the would have never been a playstation. Gaming has seemed to reach a peak. Until they master a new control method all we can expect is the same games with better graphics. Thats fine with me for now. It seems better than bad graphics with crappy controls.

[QUOTE="Solidyeas"]I just saw the top 5 selling games this year MGS4 wasn't in them but mario kart and Wii fit were. I dont know about you but I think that is just a disgrace to gaming that a game 10 years in the making that cost 10s of millions to make sold less then a gimmick and a family orientated and basic racer possible on N64. Why should companies bother making hardcore gaming pushing technology when they can sell more making a casual game the whole family will play and spend a tenth of the price developing it. Casual gaming sucks and so does Nintendo.Lord_Deos

I gotta agree with ya, its rather embarassing to true gamers, that games that have tons of time, energy, and effort put into them are being overshadowed by gimmicks and N64 games...

[QUOTE="BubbyJello"][QUOTE="angry_fork"]

Huh? Ofcourse not MGS3 is amazing.

What I meant was the Wii has last-gen technology, graphics-wise, power-wise in general, and if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4.

angry_fork

I meant MGS2, not 3 :oops:

And you said if MGS4 was on Wii it would be horrible, and now you just said,"if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4".

Which would lead one to believe you think MGS2 is horrible.

oooh I see what you mean, lmao my bad yea I worded that wrong, I love the entire MGS series including part 2.

What I mean is it would be horrible compared to the PS3 version, due to limitations.

How do you know it would be worse? Is that some kind of psychic ability that leads you see into different dimensions including the "What if" dimension?

[QUOTE="angry_fork"][QUOTE="BubbyJello"][QUOTE="angry_fork"]

Huh? Ofcourse not MGS3 is amazing.

What I meant was the Wii has last-gen technology, graphics-wise, power-wise in general, and if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4.

Zhengi

I meant MGS2, not 3 :oops:

And you said if MGS4 was on Wii it would be horrible, and now you just said,"if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4".

Which would lead one to believe you think MGS2 is horrible.

oooh I see what you mean, lmao my bad yea I worded that wrong, I love the entire MGS series including part 2.

What I mean is it would be horrible compared to the PS3 version, due to limitations.

How do you know it would be worse? Is that some kind of psychic ability that leads you see into different dimensions including the "What if" dimension?

Well, lets see:

Wii doesn't have as good a graphics card as PS3, worse graphics? check.

Wii doesn't have a processor like PS3's, worse A.I., Physics, and all the stuff that needs number crunching? check

Wii doesn't have the disc capacity like PS3's, shorter game or multiple discs? check.

Wii doesn't do HD, none of the cool live-action CGI cutscenes that were in MGS4? check.

There's no way you could possibly under any circumstance act like a Wii version wouldnt be worse then the PS3 version.

Well, lets see:

Wii doesn't have as good a graphics card as PS3, worse graphics? check.

Wii doesn't have a processor like PS3's, worse A.I., Physics, and all the stuff that needs number crunching? check

Wii doesn't have the disc capacity like PS3's, shorter game or multiple discs? check.

Wii doesn't do HD, none of the cool live-action CGI cutscenes that were in MGS4? check.

There's no way you could possibly under any circumstance act like a Wii version wouldnt be worse then the PS3 version.

angry_fork

Well, lets see:

Wii doesn't have as good a graphics card as PS3, worse graphics? check.

Wii doesn't have a processor like PS3's, worse A.I., Physics, and all the stuff that needs number crunching? check

Wii doesn't have the disc capacity like PS3's, shorter game or multiple discs? check.

Wii doesn't do HD, none of the cool live-action CGI cutscenes that were in MGS4? check.

There's no way you could possibly under any circumstance act like a Wii version wouldnt be worse then the PS3 version.

angry_fork

Kojima would have figured out the best advantages of the Wii and made an awesome game. Motion controls that could have innovated the game play for MGS4. Definitely.

Plus, Konami has made great innovations with control schemes. The 2008 version of Pro Evo Soccer was the best on the Wii because of the controls. That includes the 360, PS3, and PC versions. So it's not as clear cut as you want to believe it is.

And if it's anything like MGS2, it's already a win in a lot of people's books. Plus, there's the added benefit that it would have outsold the current version of MGS4 since there is a bigger audience on the Wii.

[QUOTE="angry_fork"]

Well, lets see:

Wii doesn't have as good a graphics card as PS3, worse graphics? check.

Wii doesn't have a processor like PS3's, worse A.I., Physics, and all the stuff that needs number crunching? check

Wii doesn't have the disc capacity like PS3's, shorter game or multiple discs? check.

Wii doesn't do HD, none of the cool live-action CGI cutscenes that were in MGS4? check.

There's no way you could possibly under any circumstance act like a Wii version wouldnt be worse then the PS3 version.

FirstDiscovery

But did MGS2 flop because it was on UNDERPOWERED HARDWARE?

And I thought Fable flopped because it was just a game that underachived in relation to what was promised by the dev.

But did MGS2 flop because it was on UNDERPOWERED HARDWARE?

And I thought Fable flopped because it was just a game that underachived in relation to what was promised by the dev.

Zhengi

[QUOTE="angry_fork"]

Well, lets see:

Wii doesn't have as good a graphics card as PS3, worse graphics? check.

Wii doesn't have a processor like PS3's, worse A.I., Physics, and all the stuff that needs number crunching? check

Wii doesn't have the disc capacity like PS3's, shorter game or multiple discs? check.

Wii doesn't do HD, none of the cool live-action CGI cutscenes that were in MGS4? check.

There's no way you could possibly under any circumstance act like a Wii version wouldnt be worse then the PS3 version.

Zhengi

Kojima would have figured out the best advantages of the Wii and made an awesome game. Motion controls that could have innovated the game play for MGS4. Definitely.

Plus, Konami has made great innovations with control schemes. The 2008 version of Pro Evo Soccer was the best on the Wii because of the controls. That includes the 360, PS3, and PC versions. So it's not as clear cut as you want to believe it is.

And if it's anything like MGS2, it's already a win in a lot of people's books. Plus, there's the added benefit that it would have outsold the current version of MGS4 since there is a bigger audience on the Wii.

There is no reason to add a motion control gimmick to gameplay. Unless it drastically changes the way gameplay works, the wii would just be slowing the game down.

What I meant was the Wii has last-gen technology, graphics-wise, power-wise in general, and if MGS4 were on the Wii we'd be seeing MGS2 not MGS4.

angry_fork

I take it you're not that excited for Megaman 9?

dont play the games.and in ten years what games will real gamers remember Wii Fit or Mgs4,Bioshock,GTA,God Of War,RE5,Gears of war Fallout 3.and I think every Gen theirs always a mainstream marketable console everybody has

dont play the games.and in ten years what games will real gamers remember Wii Fit or Mgs4,Bioshock,GTA,God Of War,RE5,Gears of war Fallout 3.and I think every Gen theirs always a mainstream marketable console everybody has

Zeppy007

I don't know, Duck Hunt and Super Mario Bros. are pretty fondly remembered. As for the games for the gaming computers that were hardcore at the time? Darned if I can name any.

1. MGS4 = best game ever

2. Ur totally right, Sony has done much much more for gaming than Nintendo ever has or ever will

Ryoco

The NES and rebirth of gaming says hi. :)

[QUOTE="WAIW"]

What's wrong with Mario Kart?

And -- Possible on the N64? What?

Lord_Deos

Nothings wrong with it, per say. Just, What do you do in Mario Kart? Race. What do you do in Mario Kart 64? Race. What do you do in Mario Kart Wii? Race.

Ok, new abilities and tracks and graphics, but, its essentially the same game re-released with new content.

Well, we better stop making all Forza, GT, and Burnout games. Add to those all sports games. What do you do in most FPS games? Shoot things. They're all the same core game with different content. Shall we continue?

dont play the games.and in ten years what games will real gamers remember Wii Fit or Mgs4,Bioshock,GTA,God Of War,RE5,Gears of war Fallout 3.and I think every Gen theirs always a mainstream marketable console everybody has

Zeppy007

[QUOTE="Spartan070"][QUOTE="Ryoco"]

1. MGS4 = best game ever

2. Ur totally right, Sony has done much much more for gaming than Nintendo ever has or ever will

lolkie_81

I have a wii and think its the worst console this gen, but nin has done more for gaming than any company ever will. It made it what it is today. If there was no Nintendo the would have never been a playstation. Gaming has seemed to reach a peak. Until they master a new control method all we can expect is the same games with better graphics. Thats fine with me for now. It seems better than bad graphics with crappy controls.

[QUOTE="WAIW"]

What's wrong with Mario Kart?

And -- Possible on the N64? What?

Lord_Deos

Nothings wrong with it, per say. Just, What do you do in Mario Kart? Race. What do you do in Mario Kart 64? Race. What do you do in Mario Kart Wii? Race.

Ok, new abilities and tracks and graphics, but, its essentially the same game re-released with new content.

Under that logic, Metal Gear Solid is the same game year after year too. What does Metal Gear Solide have? Stealth. What does Metal Gear Solid 2 have? Stealth. What does Metal Gear Solid 3 have? Stealth. And I betchu that you don't even know that there's two Metal Gear games before Metal Gear Solid came in.

Get real. Nintendo isn't ruining gaming, there are more "hardcore" games now than ever. Mario Kart Wii is an awesome game and a classic. Wii Fit is a mini-game/trainer packaged with a peripheral. It gets old people complaining about the sales of Wii Fit and Wii Play. I bought Wii Fit for the balance board and games like Skate It and Shaun White Snowboarding. I like the VR stuff Nintendo produces.

If you don't like Nintendo good for you, but don't make extreme claims like they're ruining gaming, when in fact they are saving gaming and making it bigger than ever.

Who here is with me: no threadmaking until level ten! how bout it?TAKE_IT_BACK

I'm still surprised there is no thread-creation restriction. I am HIGHLY in favor of this. ESPECIALLY when there are TONS of spoiler threads in here around the times when highly-anticipated games come out.

Get real. Nintendo isn't ruining gaming, there are more "hardcore" games now than ever. Mario Kart Wii is an awesome game and a classic. Wii Fit is a mini-game/trainer packaged with a peripheral. It gets old people complaining about the sales of Wii Fit and Wii Play. I bought Wii Fit for the balance board and games like Skate It and Shaun White Snowboarding. I like the VR stuff Nintendo produces.

If you don't like Nintendo good for you, but don't make extreme claims like they're ruining gaming, when in fact they are saving gaming and making it bigger than ever.

gamecubepad

Okay, whoa there. They may not be ruining gaming, but they're certainly not saving it either. What they are doing is expanding it. However, what remains to be seen is, will the expansion of the videogame industry remain that way, or will the new section (casuals) completely dominate the industry, and thus eventually lead to "hardcore" gamers being a mostly ignored minority? The Wii certainly has potential, but so far the most ground-breaking games seem to be aimed more at casuals than at the typical gamer, which doesn't particularly seem like a win to me.

[QUOTE="gamecubepad"]

Get real. Nintendo isn't ruining gaming, there are more "hardcore" games now than ever. Mario Kart Wii is an awesome game and a classic. Wii Fit is a mini-game/trainer packaged with a peripheral. It gets old people complaining about the sales of Wii Fit and Wii Play. I bought Wii Fit for the balance board and games like Skate It and Shaun White Snowboarding. I like the VR stuff Nintendo produces.

If you don't like Nintendo good for you, but don't make extreme claims like they're ruining gaming, when in fact they are saving gaming and making it bigger than ever.

SeanBond

Okay, whoa there. They may not be ruining gaming, but they're certainly not saving it either. What they are doing is expanding it. However, what remains to be seen is, will the expansion of the videogame industry remain that way, or will the new section (casuals) completely dominate the industry, and thus eventually lead to "hardcore" gamers being a mostly ignored minority? The Wii certainly has potential, but so far the most ground-breaking games seem to be aimed more at casuals than at the typical gamer, which doesn't particularly seem like a win to me.

They expanded it before back in the eighties, and the casual players seemed to have moved up the ladder pretty well then. Many casual often don't stay casual for long.

Okay, whoa there. They may not be ruining gaming, but they're certainly not saving it either. What they are doing is expanding it. However, what remains to be seen is, will the expansion of the videogame industry remain that way, or will the new section (casuals) completely dominate the industry, and thus eventually lead to "hardcore" gamers being a mostly ignored minority?

SeanBond

Mario Kart has always sold really well ever since the original came out. Wii Fit is a peripheral. So because Mario Kart is selling good gaming is being ruined? Last time I checked GTA and CoD were setting all kinds of records, so where do people get the idea Nintendo is killing gaming? When Boom Blox sells 450k and GTA IV sells 10m copies I wonder what these self-proclaimed "hardcore" gamers are smoking to have such strong delusions.

Nintendo is saving gaming from being bloated and repetitive. They are saving gaming from becoming brown and boring. You have a right to your opinion and I have mine. I don't mind that a lot of "wannabe" hardcore types just can't comprehend the impact Nintendo has had on the gaming world in the past 3yrs. Oh well. Nintendo is saving gaming, not ruining it.

Who here is with me: no threadmaking until level ten! how bout it?TAKE_IT_BACK

i'm on board

[QUOTE="gamecubepad"]

Get real. Nintendo isn't ruining gaming, there are more "hardcore" games now than ever. Mario Kart Wii is an awesome game and a classic. Wii Fit is a mini-game/trainer packaged with a peripheral. It gets old people complaining about the sales of Wii Fit and Wii Play. I bought Wii Fit for the balance board and games like Skate It and Shaun White Snowboarding. I like the VR stuff Nintendo produces.

If you don't like Nintendo good for you, but don't make extreme claims like they're ruining gaming, when in fact they are saving gaming and making it bigger than ever.

SeanBond

Okay, whoa there. They may not be ruining gaming, but they're certainly not saving it either. What they are doing is expanding it. However, what remains to be seen is, will the expansion of the videogame industry remain that way, or will the new section (casuals) completely dominate the industry, and thus eventually lead to "hardcore" gamers being a mostly ignored minority? The Wii certainly has potential, but so far the most ground-breaking games seem to be aimed more at casuals than at the typical gamer, which doesn't particularly seem like a win to me.

here is a link

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/54128