"But teh physics! Teh AI!" Oh Please...

Those defending Gears....

Those devs at EA who are making BF: Bad Company for the 360/PS3 even said that Gears could probably have been done on the Xbox with a massive downgrade in visuals. Everything else would essentially be intact.

I'm inclined to agree with them. Static but beautiful environments did not fool me.

Buh buh the wii can't do no phsx!!! I DARE YOU TO CLICK THE LINK!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=U8JkWBDKgKs

The physics are one of the most impressice I've seen on all the new consoles to say the least!

[QUOTE="SergeantSnitch"][QUOTE="Michael85"]

Anyone who bashes the Wii keeps screaming "bu bu it's not just teh grafix, it's teh physics and teh AI too!"

Can any of you name a current-gen game that has either that's not possible on a last-gen console? 'Cause I can't. Gears of War? Easily could've been done on xbox with dumbed-down graphics. Heavenly Sword? Ninja Gaiden's enemies are smarter than those. And physics? I've yet to see anything that comes close to what Half-Life achieved on the xbox.

And I know some of you are going to say "bu bu teh crysis if it comes to consoles!!!" Yeah, and at that point, you'll have one example. ONE. And even then, I wouldn't say the A.I., from what I've seen, is necessarily smarter than that found in the original Half-Life, a game that released a DECADE ago.

Where's this revolutionary jump in physics and AI? I haven't seen it, and I know you haven't either.

Michael85

Stop making crap up and give me ONE example of something Gears did that couldn't be done on an xbox with a downgrade. Go on, I'm waiting.

EDIT: Clarification: graphical downgrade.

You're talking about current technology...saying WITH a DOWNGRADE completely discredits your first argument. you are losing more and more credibility by the sentence.

C'mon guys, you know he's right. I mean, just look at these bridge physics. They're so good that Wii doesn't even bother to show them. The human mind wouldn't be able to comprehend it.

C'mon guys, you know he's right. I mean, just look at these bridge physics. They're so good that Wii doesn't even bother to show them. The human mind wouldn't be able to comprehend it.

whoisryanmack

Your mind doesn't seem to comprehend the difference between graphics and physics. Or maybe it does, and you're just a troll. Either way, it don't look good for you.

Those defending Gears....

Those devs at EA who are making BF: Bad Company for the 360/PS3 even said that Gears could probably have been done on the Xbox with a massive downgrade in visuals. Everything else would essentially be intact.

I'm inclined to agree with them. Static but beautiful environments did not fool me.

FrozenLiquid

but then it wouldn't be the real gears...It'd be some ugly game with good gameplay... does no one else get this?! It's not a valid argument because it isn't the true game.

"Psh Crysis could be on the ps1 with an amazingly huge devastating graphical downgrade"

[QUOTE="whoisryanmack"]

C'mon guys, you know he's right. I mean, just look at these bridge physics. They're so good that Wii doesn't even bother to show them. The human mind wouldn't be able to comprehend it.

Arsuz

Your mind doesn't seem to comprehend the difference between graphics and physics. Or maybe it does, and you're just a troll. Either way, it don't look good for you.

wow, sarcasm police.

Forza 2??? Could the physics there be done on the Wii??? I very well doubt it. 360 fps baby, sorry but the Wii wouldnt be able to do it.Zandeus

Physics has nothing to do with FRAMES PER SECOND.

[QUOTE="TrueReligion_"]This thread is filled with ignorance and blindness. Michael85

I can tell you what it's not filled with: games that prove me wrong.

GTA4's physics and AI are supposed to be pretty freaking awesome. Kicking in a door and having the wood in the frame splinter off, WHILE keeping the graphics as far up as they are is pretty technologically well done. Then there's the AI. You'll notice in the new trailer that the last scene showing Niko with walking with changing backgrounds ends with a random person beating up someone else on the street. Random AI that has it's own personality. Oblivion's about to get eaten for breakfast.

wow, sarcasm police.

whoisryanmack

How would one know it was sarcasm when all this time you've neem bashing the TC. By the time I got to page six I didn't expect anything better from you.

But this is turning into something ugly. To stay on topic, watch the video of ellebits I posted. If those physics ain't impressive I don't know what is.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=U8JkWBDKgKs

[QUOTE="whoisryanmack"]

wow, sarcasm police.

Arsuz

How would one know it was sarcasm when all this time you've neem bashing the TC. By the time I got to page six I didn't expect anything better from you.

All this time? I've made 2 previous posts, both of which were on page 1, one of which was in response to the TC bashing ME. Secondly, most people would have picked up on the sarcasm through the wording I used, but apparently I wasn't quite ridiculous enough. Lastly, lighten up. We wouldn't want to have a laugh in SW would we?

[QUOTE="whoisryanmack"]

wow, sarcasm police.

Arsuz

How would one know it was sarcasm when all this time you've neem bashing the TC. By the time I got to page six I didn't expect anything better from you.

But this is turning into something ugly. To stay on topic, watch the video of ellebits I posted. If those physics ain't impressive I don't know what is.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=U8JkWBDKgKs

Wow.... That is impressive.

[QUOTE="Arsuz"]
[QUOTE="whoisryanmack"]

wow, sarcasm police.

whoisryanmack

How would one know it was sarcasm when all this time you've neem bashing the TC. By the time I got to page six I didn't expect anything better from you.

All this time? I've made 2 previous posts, both of which were on page 1, one of which was in response to the TC bashing ME. Secondly, most people would have picked up on the sarcasm through the wording I used, but apparently I wasn't quite ridiculous enough. Lastly, lighten up. We wouldn't want to have a laugh in SW would we?

Maybe you should lighten up ;) Just having some fun here too. I don't think you're a bad person :P

[QUOTE="whoisryanmack"][QUOTE="Arsuz"]
[QUOTE="whoisryanmack"]

wow, sarcasm police.

Arsuz

How would one know it was sarcasm when all this time you've neem bashing the TC. By the time I got to page six I didn't expect anything better from you.

All this time? I've made 2 previous posts, both of which were on page 1, one of which was in response to the TC bashing ME. Secondly, most people would have picked up on the sarcasm through the wording I used, but apparently I wasn't quite ridiculous enough. Lastly, lighten up. We wouldn't want to have a laugh in SW would we?

Maybe you should lighten up ;) Just having some fun here too. I don't think you're a bad person :P

Ah ha, so the problem with wording was on your end! I was definitely not picking up on the sarcasm in your posts. Oh well, I'm druink so who knows?

My how time flies!!! We're already in the 3rd year of this generation. /sarcasm

You need to learn some patience.

You know what.. I don't give a damn if PS3/360 games can be dumbed down to play on the wii(I'm not a graphics whore). As long as there are quality games being made, i'll buy which ever system it's on to get hold of that game... Wii is failing in the quality games department.. solely because nintendo and their "appeal to none gamers stratagy", and if games like MGS4 and Gears ever did get dumbed down for the wii.. I'd buy the PS3 and 360 version anyway.. because ultimately they are the BETTER versions of the game even if it is cheaper to buy a wii(which that is what it's selling off now, it's cheap price)

So answer me this would you rather play COD3 on the Wii, or for the 360 or PS3?

Bah, people missed my post.

The WII cannot do Havoc Physics and large open enviroments combined, no matter how much of a downgrade. Saints Row and Oblivion could never be done on the Wii. And that doesn't even factor in simple AI. Hell, even the 360/PS3 struggle to handle all the things combined in Oblivion.

The End.

Bah, people missed my post.

The WII cannot do Havoc Physics and large open enviroments combined, no matter how much of a downgrade. Saints Row and Oblivion could never be done on the Wii. And that doesn't even factor in simple AI. Hell, even the 360/PS3 struggle to handle all the things combined in Oblivion.

The End.

CassiusGaius

And you know this because? What's so special about physics in Oblivion? Played the game for hours, and not one did I stop to think to myself: "Wow those are some great physics!"

And don't get me started about AI. I don't know how many times I just stood there on top of some stairs shooting one arrow at a time at an enemy while he just ran in circles unable to reach me.

[QUOTE="CassiusGaius"]

Bah, people missed my post.

The WII cannot do Havoc Physics and large open enviroments combined, no matter how much of a downgrade. Saints Row and Oblivion could never be done on the Wii. And that doesn't even factor in simple AI. Hell, even the 360/PS3 struggle to handle all the things combined in Oblivion.

The End.

Arsuz

What's so special about physics in Oblivion? Played the game for hours, and not one did I stop to think to myself: "Wow those are some great physics!"

[QUOTE="CassiusGaius"]

Bah, people missed my post.

The WII cannot do Havoc Physics and large open enviroments combined, no matter how much of a downgrade. Saints Row and Oblivion could never be done on the Wii. And that doesn't even factor in simple AI. Hell, even the 360/PS3 struggle to handle all the things combined in Oblivion.

The End.

Arsuz

And you know this because? What's so special about physics in Oblivion? Played the game for hours, and not one did I stop to think to myself: "Wow those are some great physics!"

And don't get me started about AI. I don't know how many times I just stood there on top of some stairs shooting one arrow at a time at an enemy while he just ran in circles unable to reach me.

Because its HAVOC physics. Does noone know what that is? For now, it is the best and has been the best for years. Games like Max Payne and Half Life 2 used it. Oblivion and Saints Row used it. Though the use of the physics in oblivion were meh. The game still has to calculate so many objects rolling down hills and enemies when the drop on objects.. So they don't clip through, but react properly to the enviroment. Trust me the Wii can not do that and handle large enviroments.

It would appear the Wii can't even handle HL2.

Because its HAVOC physics. Does noone know what that is? For now, it is the best and has been the best for years. Games like Max Payne and Half Life 2 used it. Oblivion and Saints Row used it. Though the use of the physics in oblivion were meh. The game still has to calculate so many objects rolling down hills and enemies when the drop on objects.. So they don't clip through, but react properly to the enviroment. Trust me the Wii can not do that and handle large enviroments.

It would appear the Wii can't even handle HL2.

Hl2 can run on integrated GPUs, and the Wii's GPU is way stronger than them.

Then I would say the physics succeeded. If they are so natural you don't even notice them I'd say thats excellent.Corvin

No I would say, it was the total lack of physics that made them go unnoticed,

Because its HAVOC physics. Does noone know what that is? For now, it is the best and has been the best for years. Games like Max Payne and Half Life 2 used it. Oblivion and Saints Row used it. Though the use of the physics in oblivion were meh. The game still has to calculate so many objects rolling down hills and enemies when the drop on objects.. So they don't clip through, but react properly to the enviroment. Trust me the Wii can not do that and handle large enviroments.

It would appear the Wii can't even handle HL2.

CassiusGaius

I know what the havoc engine is. I also happen to know MAx Payne got released in 2001. Once again, I urge you to watch the youtube movie of Elebits I posted. About HL2. If they could make HL2 run on Xbox, I'm sure they can also make it run on the Wii.

And you know this because? What's so special about physics in Oblivion? Played the game for hours, and not one did I stop to think to myself: "Wow those are some great physics!"

You will when you use dead people as door stops. :P

[QUOTE="Arsuz"][QUOTE="CassiusGaius"]

Bah, people missed my post.

The WII cannot do Havoc Physics and large open enviroments combined, no matter how much of a downgrade. Saints Row and Oblivion could never be done on the Wii. And that doesn't even factor in simple AI. Hell, even the 360/PS3 struggle to handle all the things combined in Oblivion.

The End.

CassiusGaius

And you know this because? What's so special about physics in Oblivion? Played the game for hours, and not one did I stop to think to myself: "Wow those are some great physics!"

And don't get me started about AI. I don't know how many times I just stood there on top of some stairs shooting one arrow at a time at an enemy while he just ran in circles unable to reach me.

Because its HAVOC physics. Does noone know what that is? For now, it is the best and has been the best for years. Games like Max Payne and Half Life 2 used it. Oblivion and Saints Row used it. Though the use of the physics in oblivion were meh. The game still has to calculate so many objects rolling down hills and enemies when the drop on objects.. So they don't clip through, but react properly to the enviroment. Trust me the Wii can not do that and handle large enviroments.

It would appear the Wii can't even handle HL2.

Finally, thank you good sire :)

[QUOTE="Corvin"]

Then I would say the physics succeeded. If they are so natural you don't even notice them I'd say thats excellent.Arsuz

No I would say, it was the total lack of physics that made them go unnoticed,

Because its HAVOC physics. Does noone know what that is? For now, it is the best and has been the best for years. Games like Max Payne and Half Life 2 used it. Oblivion and Saints Row used it. Though the use of the physics in oblivion were meh. The game still has to calculate so many objects rolling down hills and enemies when the drop on objects.. So they don't clip through, but react properly to the enviroment. Trust me the Wii can not do that and handle large enviroments.

It would appear the Wii can't even handle HL2.

CassiusGaius

I know what the havoc engine is. I also happen to know MAx Payne got released in 2001. Once again, I urge you to watch the youtube movie of Elebits I posted. About HL2. If they could make HL2 run on Xbox, I'm sure they can also make it run on the Wii.

you like oblivion has a total lack of physics ...every think you say from now on is now discredited and it is also retro active.

wow. sig worthy i think

you like oblivion has a total lack of physics ...every think you say from now on is now discredited and it is also retro active.

wow. sig worthy i think

KAS3Y_JAM3Z

Please, my good man. Give me an example of Oblivion physics that wowed you. Not talking ragdoll physics here, those have become a standard, and ever since I saw them in DoD: S , no other games rag dolls impressed me anymore.

[QUOTE="KAS3Y_JAM3Z"]

you like oblivion has a total lack of physics ...every think you say from now on is now discredited and it is also retro active.

wow. sig worthy i think

Arsuz

Please, my good man. Give me an example of Oblivion physics that wowed you. Not talking ragdoll physics here, those have become a standard, and ever since I saw them in DoD: S , no other games rag dolls impressed me anymore.

Oblivion's physics are really natural, not over the top.

Hell, watch that video of the beginning of Oblivion when the dev messes around with the chain hanging off the wall. That was utterly amazing. And watch how skeletons collapse and get blown away by magic. Oblivion physics are great.

But I agree. Half Life 2 can be done on Wii. It's idiotic to say it can't.

[QUOTE="KAS3Y_JAM3Z"]

you like oblivion has a total lack of physics ...every think you say from now on is now discredited and it is also retro active.

wow. sig worthy i think

Arsuz

Please, my good man. Give me an example of Oblivion physics that wowed you. Not talking ragdoll physics here, those have become a standard, and ever since I saw them in DoD: S , no other games rag dolls impressed me anymore.

I'll jump in. Like I said, the utilization of the physics in Oblivion are meh, but they are there. Go ahead a dupe 50 apples and watch them roll down a hill, nothing impressive, but still takes a huge amount of calculation to do so. Its just because there isn't a damn gravity gunesque item/ability. They seriously should have had "force choke" move in the game.

Also, DOD: S.. Uses Havoc.

Edit: And fine, I retract my statement about HL2 and the wii. I forgot about the xbox version.

Half-life 2 could be done on Wii, of course it would look like crap, which would effectively destroy the incredible immersion of this game, but it could be done. Supreme Commander and SPORE on the other hand would never run on Wii, no matter how downraged the graphics would be.,

Heck there are couple of pc games with medicore or horrible graphics that wouldn't be able to run on Wii, so it's not only about "teh preety graphics"

This thread is filled with ignorance and blindness. TrueReligion_

Here are some games that I think would have to have their GAMEPLAY downgraded if ported to wii...

Pain (apparently a huge city with plenty of physics)

Uncharted (in the first trailer he drives a truck through some boxes...it's freakin sweet)

Stuntman Ignition (no info yet, I assume though)

Star Wars: Force Unleashed (physics and material systems are unparalleled except maybe in Crysis)

Indiana Jones 2007 (same engines as force unleashed so ditto)

Crysis (no need to say anything about this one)

Heavenly Sword (OK so maybe the enemies are dumber than Ninja Gaiden but Ninja Gaiden doesn't render thousands of them at once)

So although I love my wii I certainly think that its low processing power will rob it of not just great graphics but also some great gameplay too.

just to further destroy the "it's only graphics" nonsense.

Here's Point of Attack 2.

Awful graphics and yet there's no way in hell Wii could ever handle it, as it requires 2500MHZ processor to handle all the calculations in bigger missions.

F.E.A.R

Play it on 360, no last gen game comes close to having A.I like that. Seriously if some of these things could have all been done at the same time, the physics, the A.I etc then they would have all been done last gen.

And as others have said, don't judge the A.I of games before you play them :|

F.E.A.R

Play it on 360, no last gen game comes close to having A.I like that. Seriously if some of these things could have all been done at the same time, the physics, the A.I etc then they would have all been done last gen.

-Xeno-

Which runs fine on a 1.7 Ghertz CPU.

[QUOTE="-Xeno-"]

F.E.A.R

Play it on 360, no last gen game comes close to having A.I like that. Seriously if some of these things could have all been done at the same time, the physics, the A.I etc then they would have all been done last gen.

Stabby2486

Which runs fine on a 1.7 Ghertz CPU.

Wii's CPU isn't 1.7 Ghz, granted consoles generally don't require specs as high as PC's to run games, but NO GAME last gen had A.I as good as F.E.A.R. If it could have been done then someone would have done it.

This thread is filled with ignorance and blindness. TrueReligion_

Agreed.

digital molecular matter and the Euphoria Engine will be in games by Lucas arts and will be on the market next year.

there is a scene in the upcoming HL2: Episode 2 in which a Strider blows a farm house to bits right in front of you. The action of destroying the house is scripted, but there are dozens and dozens (maybe a hundred+)of individual pieces of wood flying dynamically with true physics once hit with the explosion. Does that count? it's coming out in october, and will be on the consoles.

FEAR, which came out in 05, had some pretty smart AI. I have not yet seen any nextgen console game with better AI.

Mordred19

Exactly. Crysis too has incredible physics, but that can't even run on the consoles.

This thread is filled with ignorance and blindness. TrueReligion_

Agreed.

F.E.A.R

Play it on 360, no last gen game comes close to having A.I like that. Seriously if some of these things could have all been done at the same time, the physics, the A.I etc then they would have all been done last gen.

And as others have said, don't judge the A.I of games before you play them :|

-Xeno-

[QUOTE="-Xeno-"]

F.E.A.R

Play it on 360, no last gen game comes close to having A.I like that. Seriously if some of these things could have all been done at the same time, the physics, the A.I etc then they would have all been done last gen.

And as others have said, don't judge the A.I of games before you play them :|

ninjaxams

nah...the combat was the best ever in FPS. THe AI,the weapons, the kicking, slo mo..everything about the combat was incredible. And the graphics rocked. The only thing lacking in FEAR was better and more varied level design

The only thing lacking in FEAR was better and more varied level design

AdrianWerner

Wat? FEAR had levels? I thought it only had one level: "Office space". I still get nightmares from playing FEAR. Not because of Alma, but because of the endless chain of the same frickin envrionment.

[QUOTE="KAS3Y_JAM3Z"]

you like oblivion has a total lack of physics ...every think you say from now on is now discredited and it is also retro active.

wow. sig worthy i think

Arsuz

Please, my good man. Give me an example of Oblivion physics that wowed you. Not talking ragdoll physics here, those have become a standard, and ever since I saw them in DoD: S , no other games rag dolls impressed me anymore.

shooting the hanging bucket with arrows, their is weight distribution and and the force of an arrow being it forceful or weak the bucket will sway with the force of the bucket. every single movable item has it's own physical properties and acts to the world around it.

[QUOTE="Arsuz"][QUOTE="KAS3Y_JAM3Z"]

you like oblivion has a total lack of physics ...every think you say from now on is now discredited and it is also retro active.

wow. sig worthy i think

KAS3Y_JAM3Z

Please, my good man. Give me an example of Oblivion physics that wowed you. Not talking ragdoll physics here, those have become a standard, and ever since I saw them in DoD: S , no other games rag dolls impressed me anymore.

shooting the hanging bucket with arrows, their is weight distribution and and the force of an arrow being it forceful or weak the bucket will sway with the force of the bucket. every single movable item has it's own physical properties and acts to the world around it.

Now please explain to me..How is this beneficial to gameplay?