Rage might need 3 discs on 360 version due to Multiplayer

THis game looks good and I'm gunna keep my eye on this one.

Is it safe to say since this isn't the first game for the 360 to go multi disc's that Blu-ray and its extra storage is a good thing?!

[QUOTE="ps3199now"][QUOTE="ps3199now"] How's multiple disk any different now? lol there will be a time when multiple blu ray is required.RTUUMM

You bring a good point. I acually see that happening to tell you the truth. I never jumped into the "Blu-Ray is the future" wagon. I like that the PS3 uses Blu-Ray for its games becuz the have more space and have protective layers so that the dont get scratch, but Blu-Rays are not going to over take DVDs, Digital download has a better chance.

Why do cows make a huge deal about swapping discs, when huge games usually come with installs, or heavy caches to the hard drive (temporary installations)?? KZ2, and Uncharted uses duplicate data, AND heavy cache to the hard drive, and KZ2 has MID LEVEL LOADING because of it (dont lie, i played it) and Uncharted has a long initial load while it caches data. All of this is because of the slow bluray speeds. this method is expensive because the RIGHT data has to be placed in the RIGHT places because bluray reads differently than DVD. 1st party (or sony funded) games can afford it, but 3rd parties cant.............so they use the cheaper method.........installs. All this makes all that extra space redundant. Swapping discs is easier, faster, and cheaper than using a 2x bluray player. You can bet that rage will have an install as well. Why do cows think more space = uncompressed data = better graphics?? truth is uncompressed data = more space used = longer load times/or install/heavy cache. Had the PS3 used a 6x or higher drive, then all that space would be usefull. But, as it stands, data on bluray is compressed just as it is on 360, and duplicated over the disc. this is why killzone 2 has "2gb per level" that GG was shouting during development. Data is compressed to shorten load times. Compressed data loads faster than uncompressed data.

navyguy21

[QUOTE="Blue-Sky"]

To be honest, how many discs it comes on is irrelevant and the people that make a deal out of it, are only doing so to stir something up.

zero_snake99

EDIT: 2 discs not 1 lol. (thanks camer)

Whichever version has the best framerate will be the one I pick up. I'm assuming the PS3 version will be at 60 by release, but will it be stable? 3 disks is annoying, so I really hope the PS3 version will hold up.

[QUOTE="navyguy21"]

Why do cows make a huge deal about swapping discs, when huge games usually come with installs, or heavy caches to the hard drive (temporary installations)?? KZ2, and Uncharted uses duplicate data, AND heavy cache to the hard drive, and KZ2 has MID LEVEL LOADING because of it (dont lie, i played it) and Uncharted has a long initial load while it caches data. All of this is because of the slow bluray speeds. this method is expensive because the RIGHT data has to be placed in the RIGHT places because bluray reads differently than DVD. 1st party (or sony funded) games can afford it, but 3rd parties cant.............so they use the cheaper method.........installs. All this makes all that extra space redundant. Swapping discs is easier, faster, and cheaper than using a 2x bluray player. You can bet that rage will have an install as well. Why do cows think more space = uncompressed data = better graphics?? truth is uncompressed data = more space used = longer load times/or install/heavy cache. Had the PS3 used a 6x or higher drive, then all that space would be usefull. But, as it stands, data on bluray is compressed just as it is on 360, and duplicated over the disc. this is why killzone 2 has "2gb per level" that GG was shouting during development. Data is compressed to shorten load times. Compressed data loads faster than uncompressed data.

zero_snake99

[QUOTE="The__Havoc"]

[QUOTE="thelastguy"]

There has been a long standing argument between lems and cows that games will not surpass 9GBs and that blu-ray was completely unnecessary

Now that this game could possibly ship on 3 DVDs, the whole "blu-ray is not needed" argument can be finally put to rest

zero_snake99

Um games have been passing 9gbs on my PC for a while now. And PC games don't come on Blu-Ray.

PC isn't a different beast at all. All PS3's come with HDD's just like PC's.

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"][QUOTE="The__Havoc"]

Um games have been passing 9gbs on my PC for a while now. And PC games don't come on Blu-Ray.

The__Havoc

PC isn't a different beast at all. All PS3's come with HDD's just like PC's.

And the people who are going to buy Rage probably have a Xbox 360 with a HDD.

I didn't mind the multiple disks when it came to FF7, so then I won't mind them now.

[QUOTE="navyguy21"][QUOTE="RedruM_I"]The same could be said that DVDs were not necessary since we had cds back then. Imagine the games now on cds, easily we could be playing games coming on 10 discs! the hell why not stick with floppys? :P :lol: BD will eventually become a must and this gen is starting to show it with games like Rage and MGS4.zero_snake99

[QUOTE="navyguy21"][QUOTE="RedruM_I"]The same could be said that DVDs were not necessary since we had cds back then. Imagine the games now on cds, easily we could be playing games coming on 10 discs! the hell why not stick with floppys? :P :lol: BD will eventually become a must and this gen is starting to show it with games like Rage and MGS4.zero_snake99

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"][QUOTE="navyguy21"] MGS4 is a poor example, as it had MULTIPLE installs, that took WAY longer than a simple disc swap. How is space an advantage when you have to take data OFF THE DISC and put it on the hard drive?? 6x bluray?? Yes, thats an advantage, but the PS3 has a 2x player, much too slow to make use of the space without installs making it irrelevant.DarkGamer007

[QUOTE="AdoringFan_"]

[QUOTE="thelastguy"]

:lol:

Blu-ray isn't necessary huh?

ps3199now

Bu bu bu itz N0thingS!! I r Seri0uz :evil:

[QUOTE="DarkGamer007"]

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"] You know what it had installs? Because BD wasn't large enough. That's why Kojima was saying "Bluray isn't large enough." He kept the 7.1 sound lossless and uncompressed, but all graphical assets were compressed to fit the BD. If the BD isn't big enough, how is DVD going to fair?zero_snake99

Do you only use consoles to game? mgs_freak91

[QUOTE="DarkGamer007"]

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"] You know what it had installs? Because BD wasn't large enough. That's why Kojima was saying "Bluray isn't large enough." He kept the 7.1 sound lossless and uncompressed, but all graphical assets were compressed to fit the BD. If the BD isn't big enough, how is DVD going to fair?zero_snake99

Also it costs a lot more money to have multiple disks since you have to buy a licence per disk

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"][QUOTE="DarkGamer007"] How about not using 71. sound lossless and uncompressed and instead compress it?

MetalGearSolidZ

Also it costs a lot more money to have multiple disks since you have to buy a licence per disk

[QUOTE="MetalGearSolidZ"]

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"] He didn't want to? Also, audio compression is more detrimental than graphical (textural) compression. Also, compressing audio takes a lot longer.navyguy21

Also it costs a lot more money to have multiple disks since you have to buy a licence per disk

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/01/carmack-rage-to-look-worse-on-360-if-limited-to-two-dvds/

Not a problem. I don't mind multiple discs.

[QUOTE="navyguy21"][QUOTE="MetalGearSolidZ"]

Also it costs a lot more money to have multiple disks since you have to buy a licence per disk

zero_snake99

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/01/carmack-rage-to-look-worse-on-360-if-limited-to-two-dvds/

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"]

[QUOTE="navyguy21"]lol, you have no idea what youre talking about lol, id like to see you provide a link to prove that :Pnavyguy21

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/01/carmack-rage-to-look-worse-on-360-if-limited-to-two-dvds/

I heard a different story on the same topic a while ago. ID had claimed that the 360 wouldn't have graphics as good as the ps3 graphics because they didn't want to use more than one disk and bluray gave them that advantage to use the extra space.

[QUOTE="navyguy21"][QUOTE="zero_snake99"]

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/01/carmack-rage-to-look-worse-on-360-if-limited-to-two-dvds/

zero_snake99

Even if the bluray had 100gb storage, the PS3 would need installs because the drive is too slow to load all that data in a reasonable amount of time. Had Kojima comressed the sound, MGS4 probably wouldnt have needed the multiple installs. the MORE data you have, the MORE that has to be read off the disc, so MORE space makes the problem WORSE............not better unless your drive speed is fast enough to compensate..............which bluray in PS3 isnt. Next gen, PS3 will probably have 6x bluray, so all that space will be of some use, WITHOUT the installs

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"][QUOTE="navyguy21"]lol, the fee is AFTER 2 DISCS, not PER DISC dude :P..................as in the first 2 disc come with the same price tag......................and the THIRD will have an additional fee. Now, how about you provide a link to the whole "MGS had installs because bluray was too small" comment navyguy21

Even if the bluray had 100gb storage, the PS3 would need installs because the drive is too slow to load all that data in a reasonable amount of time. Had Kojima comressed the sound, MGS4 probably wouldnt have needed the multiple installs. the MORE data you have, the MORE that has to be read off the disc, so MORE space makes the problem WORSE............not better unless your drive speed is fast enough to compensate..............which bluray in PS3 isnt. Next gen, PS3 will probably have 6x bluray, so all that space will be of some use, WITHOUT the installs

[QUOTE="navyguy21"]

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"] I don't need to, he (Kojima) said several times. BD is too small for what they were doing. Considering they claim the audio is raw and uncompressed that means that non sound assets must have been compressed. MUST HAVE BEEN. I bought a FLAC (uncompressed) version of Dark Side of the Moon and and The Wall and both of those ALONE took about 4 gigs.zero_snake99

Even if the bluray had 100gb storage, the PS3 would need installs because the drive is too slow to load all that data in a reasonable amount of time. Had Kojima comressed the sound, MGS4 probably wouldnt have needed the multiple installs. the MORE data you have, the MORE that has to be read off the disc, so MORE space makes the problem WORSE............not better unless your drive speed is fast enough to compensate..............which bluray in PS3 isnt. Next gen, PS3 will probably have 6x bluray, so all that space will be of some use, WITHOUT the installs

I'd rather prefer to switch disks than having to wait 10 minutes for act 4 of MGS4 to install

ever since Microsoft gave Xbox users the option to install games the whole multi-disk/disk swapping argument is now kind of irrelevant. as long as i have the HDD space i won't be swapping disks.

To be honest, how many discs it comes on is irrelevant and the people that make a deal out of it, are only doing so to stir something up.

Blue-Sky

ever since Microsoft gave Xbox users the option to install games the whole multi-disk/disk swapping argument is now kind of irrelevant. as long as i have the HDD space i won't be swapping disks.

2scoopsofempty

[QUOTE="zero_snake99"][QUOTE="navyguy21"]But that has nothing to do with installs...................:|

Even if the bluray had 100gb storage, the PS3 would need installs because the drive is too slow to load all that data in a reasonable amount of time. Had Kojima comressed the sound, MGS4 probably wouldnt have needed the multiple installs. the MORE data you have, the MORE that has to be read off the disc, so MORE space makes the problem WORSE............not better unless your drive speed is fast enough to compensate..............which bluray in PS3 isnt. Next gen, PS3 will probably have 6x bluray, so all that space will be of some use, WITHOUT the installs

navyguy21

Think of it this way. A program Installer (or a game installer) is like a giant Zip file... That is what it essentially is. Data didn't fit on the BD, so they compressed it to high levels, put in chapter specific data and made you install every chapter. The reason why you installed every chapter (overwriting the previous one) is because if you were to install all the compressed files it would be clear over 10 gigs, and they don't want to do that. Until you can debunk that they didn't have compressed files on there, then my explanation is valid. I already gave the reasons why I said it, including Kojima complaining about BD limiting the game, the multiple installs, and the fact that they claim "uncompressed audio". All my statements stand true. Try to prove me wrong, because I know i'm right about this. MGS4 has nothing to do with BD read speeds but only with compression factors.

ever since Microsoft gave Xbox users the option to install games the whole multi-disk/disk swapping argument is now kind of irrelevant. as long as i have the HDD space i won't be swapping disks.

2scoopsofempty

Once again Blu-ray does not matter :roll:

I'm gonna make a petition to bring back the cartridge.

:lol:

Blu-ray isn't necessary huh?

Even though I'll most likely get Rage for my PC, I wouldn't have a problem with swapping discs.

I'd rather prefer to switch disks than having to wait 10 minutes for act 4 of MGS4 to install

DoomZaW

lol acts only take like max 5 min i was just playing act 4 this morning, the initial installof MGS4 takes 10min but it gives me time to go for a slash or get a drink or even make myself something to eat i actually dont mind them.I loathe disk switching as im a bit of an untidy person and have atendency to loose disks like my recenty bought Anti-Flag CD.

But 3 disks in this day and age imo is a bit much.

.... SSHD really make all this dvd/blu-ray look ****

Bluray Ultra high capacity, ultra high quality, unscratchable and games cost no more to buy on it than on 360. Ya, I think Bluray wins hands down.

patriots7672

BDs can scratch, they're just resistant.