So who here thinks Fallout NV > ME2?

if you said Fallout 3 is equal to ME2 i may say they are, but NV feels unpolished and not as sophisticated as 3, but that's my opinion

NV all the way...

Oh GOD yes! ME2 is a shooter masquerading as a role-playing game. I got more "role-playing" from the first couple hours of New Vegas than the entire Mass Effect series so far. I loved the first Mass Effect (not sure how I feel about it now, its been a while and I hated ME2) but being forced to play BioWare's "Shepard," to me, was exactly the opposite of what I've always known "role-playing" to be about. People who defend ME2 as a RPG are just like the people who defend Final Fantasy games as RPG's. Sure, they arecalled RPG's, but that doesn't make them about role-playing (and "playing a role" isn't role-playing). You don't get to make your own character and push them through the world at your own pace in your own way. Everything is scripted and designed in a way how the developers feel you should experience their story.

What I find most hilarious, is how BioWare has talked smack about JRPG's lately, and they basically made the ME series into a JRPG. Sure, you can go out on various dialogue branches... but that makes it more of an interactive film than it does role-playing game. Speech is 10% talking and 90% body language. One is not defined by what they say, but what they DO. Actions are what separate an interactive movie from a role-playing game. You can't alter your actions in ME/ME2, you are playing the story BioWare wants you to play. You can't go around undermining the whole world and building your character around your own intentions.

I'd say the simplest way to define a true "role-playing game" is one question: "Can I kill quest-important NPC's and have them die permanently?" All the "role-playing games" that have closely matched the PnP styIe (D&D, World of Darkness, etc), to me, have always given the player the ability to do WHATEVER they want in the world, with no restrictions, which allows them to approach any given situation in many ways the developer may not have even intended.

Mass Effect 2 is a substantially well-made game... but it is one of the worst examples of what I feel "role-playing" is about. And to define it as one, and give it the RPG of the Year award, basically s***s in the face of all the hard work REAL role-playing developers have done over the past few decades. The fact New Vegas didn't win RPG of the Year makes me wonder if Gamespot even is trying to remain impartial about their system. Or are they appealing to the mainstream bro-gamer market that populates a lot of their site?

[QUOTE="psn8214"]

I'm enjoying New Vegas, but Mass Effect just clicked with me - I really got into the series. New Vegas is great, but there are some things I don't like - for example the zooming in on characters when they're talking. I hope there's a mod to remove that. :P I do love how moddable it is - first playthrough and I'm running like six mods already. It's awesome.

heretrix

From here. Plenty of amazing mods. I took many from this list, and this one as well.

Make sure to get MTUI and the color correction mod. Both are borderline essential.

glad im not the only one, its true ME2 feels more of a shooter masquerading as an rpg.

Oh GOD yes! ME2 is a shooter masquerading as a role-playing game. I got more "role-playing" from the first couple hours of New Vegas than the entire Mass Effect series so far. I loved the first Mass Effect (not sure how I feel about it now, its been a while and I hated ME2) but being forced to play BioWare's "Shepard," to me, was exactly the opposite of what I've always known "role-playing" to be about. People who defend ME2 as a RPG are just like the people who defend Final Fantasy games as RPG's. Sure, they arecalled RPG's, but that doesn't make them about role-playing (and "playing a role" isn't role-playing). You don't get to make your own character and push them through the world at your own pace in your own way. Everything is scripted and designed in a way how the developers feel you should experience their story.

What I find most hilarious, is how BioWare has talked smack about JRPG's lately, and they basically made the ME series into a JRPG. Sure, you can go out on various dialogue branches... but that makes it more of an interactive film than it does role-playing game. Speech is 10% talking and 90% body language. One is not defined by what they say, but what they DO. Actions are what separate an interactive movie from a role-playing game. You can't alter your actions in ME/ME2, you are playing the story BioWare wants you to play. You can't go around undermining the whole world and building your character around your own intentions.

I'd say the simplest way to define a true "role-playing game" is one question: "Can I kill quest-important NPC's and have them die permanently?" All the "role-playing games" that have closely matched the PnP styIe (D&D, World of Darkness, etc), to me, have always given the player the ability to do WHATEVER they want in the world, with no restrictions, which allows them to approach any given situation in many ways the developer may not have even intended.

Mass Effect 2 is a substantially well-made game... but it is one of the worst examples of what I feel "role-playing" is about. And to define it as one, and give it the RPG of the Year award, basically s***s in the face of all the hard work REAL role-playing developers have done over the past few decades. The fact New Vegas didn't win RPG of the Year makes me wonder if Gamespot even is trying to remain impartial about their system. Or are they appealing to the mainstream bro-gamer market that populates a lot of their site?

foxhound_fox

i dont think GS is trying to appeal to the bro-market mainstream crowd because last year demons souls won goty, but GS did take alot of heat for that even though i felt it was well deserved.

New Vegas isn't even as good as Fallout 3, let alone ME2.

Ziek-AAT

Mass Effect 2 is a slick, well-produced game. It's very pretty, and quite fun for a bit, but it's also rather shallow, and unbearably stupid (if you've made it to the final boss then I don't see how you could possibly argue against that last point).

New Vegas, on the other hand, is an incredibly deep, well-designed role playing game, with superb quest design, great writing, excellent choice and consequence, and the best faction system I've ever seen.

In each of the above areas it absolutely slaughters ME2; that's undeniable, really.

SO, BASICALLY:

pretty colors and wild space opera ****

VS.

quest design, depth of content, etc.

-

It's all preference, see.

NV isn't even in the same league with ME2.

I only played the demo of mass effect 2 and i enjoyed it more than new vegas..

i dont think GS is trying to appeal to the bro-market mainstream crowd because last year demons souls won goty, but GS did take alot of heat for that even though i felt it was well deserved.

right4dead

[QUOTE="heretrix"]

Where did you get your mods. I'm probably going to do some tomorrow.

psn8214

From here. Plenty of amazing mods. I took many from this list, and this one as well.

Make sure to get MTUI and the color correction mod. Both are borderline essential.

Dont forget planetfallout :) What is MTUI? And by colour correction I take it you mean Fellout: New Vegas.

Edit: NVM, I found it, it is a nice UI mod.

If the combat in New Vegas was more satisfying I'd pick it. I really would. Not that ME2s combat is great(plenty of shooters play better than it), but it was at least more serviceable. For all the awesome choice/consequence moments. For all the robust role playing experience the game can lay claim to I'm literally close to falling a sleep half the time. Oh and the lack o polish is the single most annoying thing ever. ME2 to its credit kept me hooked for whatever reason. That said there are countless areas where New Vegas just flat out spanks it. Give that game a battle system I like, and some polish I'd probably praise the game as the 2nd coming. jg4xchamp

The combat in NV is more staisfying because of the slow mo, blood sprays, and limbs flying everywhere :P

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]If the combat in New Vegas was more satisfying I'd pick it. I really would. Not that ME2s combat is great(plenty of shooters play better than it), but it was at least more serviceable. For all the awesome choice/consequence moments. For all the robust role playing experience the game can lay claim to I'm literally close to falling a sleep half the time. Oh and the lack o polish is the single most annoying thing ever. ME2 to its credit kept me hooked for whatever reason. That said there are countless areas where New Vegas just flat out spanks it. Give that game a battle system I like, and some polish I'd probably praise the game as the 2nd coming. Jack-o-Thompson

The combat in NV is more staisfying because of the slow mo, blood sprays, and limbs flying everywhere :P

It's certainly funny, but eh. It's trying to be a nice mix of your western RPG combat that focuses on strategy/micromanagement/stat building with a real time shooting mechanic going on, and to me it just does neither correctly. I never really felt like I had to do more than the basic, and using any of the weapons in that game was rather dull outside of the "oooo he broke into a million pieces". jg4xchamp

NV is the better RPG. ME2 polish adds nothing for me, because I prefer actual gameplay above Cinematics. ME2 is still a good game , but it misses being above average in both genres it supposedly belongs to.

I like the both a lot.But the bugs and performance issues I ran into on the 360 version of New Vegas, really annoyed me. I picked up the PC version yesterday from the Steam sale, hopefully that will turnout alot better.

Anybody know of some good mods?

heretrix

Is NV even playable yet? I really want to try the game out as I loved Fallout 3, but I am not going to put with an extremely buggy game. (I'd say FO3 was only moderately buggy:P)

I know its not a popular opinion but i enjoyed NV allot more than mass effect 2, i just wish they could incorporate a little more cinmatic elements into it.

Oh GOD yes! ME2 is a shooter masquerading as a role-playing game. I got more "role-playing" from the first couple hours of New Vegas than the entire Mass Effect series so far. I loved the first Mass Effect (not sure how I feel about it now, its been a while and I hated ME2) but being forced to play BioWare's "Shepard," to me, was exactly the opposite of what I've always known "role-playing" to be about. People who defend ME2 as a RPG are just like the people who defend Final Fantasy games as RPG's. Sure, they arecalled RPG's, but that doesn't make them about role-playing (and "playing a role" isn't role-playing). You don't get to make your own character and push them through the world at your own pace in your own way. Everything is scripted and designed in a way how the developers feel you should experience their story.

What I find most hilarious, is how BioWare has talked smack about JRPG's lately, and they basically made the ME series into a JRPG. Sure, you can go out on various dialogue branches... but that makes it more of an interactive film than it does role-playing game. Speech is 10% talking and 90% body language. One is not defined by what they say, but what they DO. Actions are what separate an interactive movie from a role-playing game. You can't alter your actions in ME/ME2, you are playing the story BioWare wants you to play. You can't go around undermining the whole world and building your character around your own intentions.

I'd say the simplest way to define a true "role-playing game" is one question: "Can I kill quest-important NPC's and have them die permanently?" All the "role-playing games" that have closely matched the PnP styIe (D&D, World of Darkness, etc), to me, have always given the player the ability to do WHATEVER they want in the world, with no restrictions, which allows them to approach any given situation in many ways the developer may not have even intended.

Mass Effect 2 is a substantially well-made game... but it is one of the worst examples of what I feel "role-playing" is about. And to define it as one, and give it the RPG of the Year award, basically s***s in the face of all the hard work REAL role-playing developers have done over the past few decades. The fact New Vegas didn't win RPG of the Year makes me wonder if Gamespot even is trying to remain impartial about their system. Or are they appealing to the mainstream bro-gamer market that populates a lot of their site?

foxhound_fox

Wait, so you can kill a key NPC and continue in these game? That sounds really good. Not actually killing the NPC but having a game that can change so much.

The only WRPGs ive played are ME (1&2) and Jade Empire. Ill start with Elder Scrolls and go from there.

Is NV even playable yet? I really want to try the game out as I loved Fallout 3, but I am not going to put with an extremely buggy game. (I'd say FO3 was only moderately buggy:P)

Giant_Panda

Wait, so you can kill a key NPC and continue in these game? That sounds really good. Not actually killing the NPC but having a game that can change so much.

The only WRPGs ive played are ME (1&2) and Jade Empire. Ill start with Elder Scrolls and go from there.

shutdown_202

[QUOTE="heretrix"]

[QUOTE="psn8214"]

I'm enjoying New Vegas, but Mass Effect just clicked with me - I really got into the series. New Vegas is great, but there are some things I don't like - for example the zooming in on characters when they're talking. I hope there's a mod to remove that. :P I do love how moddable it is - first playthrough and I'm running like six mods already. It's awesome.

psn8214

From here. Plenty of amazing mods. I took many from this list, and this one as well.

Make sure to get MTUI and the color correction mod. Both are borderline essential.

Dude. You rock. Thanks a bunch.

heretrix

No problem man, happy to help! :)

[QUOTE="heretrix"]

Dude. You rock. Thanks a bunch.

psn8214

No problem man, happy to help! :)

The New Vegas mods are really cool. I'm having more fun seeing what people can come up with than the actual game.

FOV 90...........:D

It's on.