So why doesn't the PC need Blu-Ray?

Okay, so apparently the Xbox 360 is doomed because it's using "last-gen" hardware, such as DVD-9's. And of course, the cow's must argue that Blu-Ray is necessary if you want the "real next-gen experience," because developers are running out of room on DVD-9's. Okay, sure. So then I ask you, why don't PC's need Blu-Ray Disc players to play the latest and greatest? Why is it that Crysis didn't need a Blu-Ray Disc? Besides, of course, to win the format war.Screamteam411

because some peoples' iq is too low to click "next"...

Because our games are installed onto a hard drive.

Besides, even if a game does need multiple DVDs, its alright. Multiple disk installations were rather common before DVD became the standard. You just need to use multiple disks for the install, and one play disk. No disk switching reqired. So, we won't need BluRay for a while.

if you feel like the PC needs a bluray drive for whatever reason, there are already drives available for only 200$

dont expect any pc games to use the format anytime soon.

PC games can come on multiple disks, but only require one for play. Blu-ray is needed for consoles, but nowadays the disc is only needed for authentication for PC games.

Hard Disk drives can read many times faster than any optical media. Oh wait... Which console has a HDD built into every machine? Hmm...

PC games can come on multiple disks, but only require one for play. Blu-ray is needed for consoles, but nowadays the disc is only needed for authentication for PC games.

Hard Disk drives can read many times faster than any optical media. Oh wait... Which console has a HDD built into every machine? Hmm...

vitz3

Many PC games now don't require the discs after installation - and thanks to digital distribution, many games don't require discs at all, period. Of course, as already pointed out, PCs already support Blu-Ray. You can buy Blu-Ray drives on Newegg, and an increasing number of high-end laptops come with Blu-Ray drives already.

Its simple the ps3 is VASTLY more powerful then the PC in every single way.Gh0st_Of_0nyx

Churning out sig material?

[QUOTE="vitz3"]

PC games can come on multiple disks, but only require one for play. Blu-ray is needed for consoles, but nowadays the disc is only needed for authentication for PC games.

Hard Disk drives can read many times faster than any optical media. Oh wait... Which console has a HDD built into every machine? Hmm...

subrosian

Many PC games now don't require the discs after installation - and thanks to digital distribution, many games don't require discs at all, period. Of course, as already pointed out, PCs already support Blu-Ray. You can buy Blu-Ray drives on Newegg, and an increasing number of high-end laptops come with Blu-Ray drives already.

Yeah. I did notice that SupCom doesn't ask for a disk to be in the drive when I play it after updating. But man the Witcher is hell BRUTAL with it's anti-piracy paranoia. I could NOT run that game out of the box no matter how hard I tried. I had to look at an alternative .exe to even be able to start the game that I paid for.

[QUOTE="Gh0st_Of_0nyx"]Its simple the ps3 is VASTLY more powerful then the PC in every single way.True_Gamer_

Churning out sig material?

Okay, so apparently the Xbox 360 is doomed because it's using "last-gen" hardware, such as DVD-9's. And of course, the cow's must argue that Blu-Ray is necessary if you want the "real next-gen experience," because developers are running out of room on DVD-9's. Okay, sure. So then I ask you, why don't PC's need Blu-Ray Disc players to play the latest and greatest? Why is it that Crysis didn't need a Blu-Ray Disc? Besides, of course, to win the format war.Screamteam411

Maybe because a lot of people don't have a blu-ray drive in their computer and games will no because of lack of haveing one (same with hd-dvd drive). So games would not sell. Plus you have digital-distribution.

:|

Uh multiple DVD installations if games get that big.

Which they are not

Okay, so apparently the Xbox 360 is doomed because it's using "last-gen" hardware, such as DVD-9's. And of course, the cow's must argue that Blu-Ray is necessary if you want the "real next-gen experience," because developers are running out of room on DVD-9's. Okay, sure. So then I ask you, why don't PC's need Blu-Ray Disc players to play the latest and greatest? Why is it that Crysis didn't need a Blu-Ray Disc? Besides, of course, to win the format war.Screamteam411

Crysis is only 5.5 gigs for the installation. It can easily fit on a DVD-9.

TC, you know that PC was the SLOWEST to adopt the DVD format for gaming as a standard, RIGHT?

TC, you realize less and less prominent developer make games for PC first or at all, right?

Your question's foundation is lacking, there is no reason to continue this thread, regardless of how I feel about Blu-Ray's lack of usefulness so far.

TC, you realize less and less prominent developer make games for PC first or at all, right

SolidTy

Pc will always be the more important gaming platform for the good developers that are using it. PC is the top brand in Europe, we all have PCs, PCs are far more plentiful than all consoles put together, there are more gamers playing at any one time on PCs than consoles.

TC, you know that PC was the SLOWEST to adopt the DVD format for gaming as a standard, RIGHT?

TC, you realize less and less prominent developer make games for PC first or at all, right?

Your question's foundation is lacking, there is no reason to continue this thread, regardless of how I feel about Blu-Ray's lack of usefulness so far.

SolidTy

Wow, elitist and ignorant?

Almost all big developers use the PC as it's main form of development.

And I think the fact that the PC has the most AAAE's and AAE's speaks for itself.

Okay, so apparently the Xbox 360 is doomed because it's using "last-gen" hardware, such as DVD-9's. And of course, the cow's must argue that Blu-Ray is necessary if you want the "real next-gen experience," because developers are running out of room on DVD-9's. Okay, sure. So then I ask you, why don't PC's need Blu-Ray Disc players to play the latest and greatest? Why is it that Crysis didn't need a Blu-Ray Disc? Besides, of course, to win the format war.Screamteam411

Well, this wasn't very well thought through.

You do realise that there are just a few pc gamers who has a HDD that is less then 320gig right? I have a total of 660gig on my hdd. Now for the realy good part. Crysis on a DVD is compressed and if you where to play it right of the dvd and have the CPU extract alll the data you would need a seperat CPU just to do that and a DVD that could match that extraction speed. if you take a look at how mutch space it takes up on your HDD you'll find that with all the needed files(even those that isn't in the game dir) it takes up 12 gig, and that game has alot of repetative Meshes and textures.
Then you have games like Vanguard that takes up 20 gig and don't look great.

Because Blu-ray hasn't proven that it's truly needed yet.

That, and PC games usually use an older format (hell, some are still using CD's)

if you feel like the PC needs a bluray drive for whatever reason, there are already drives available for only 200$

dont expect any pc games to use the format anytime soon.

WARxSnake

Please send me down one to New Zealand, they cost like 500 bucks here.

[QUOTE="Screamteam411"]Okay, so apparently the Xbox 360 is doomed because it's using "last-gen" hardware, such as DVD-9's. And of course, the cow's must argue that Blu-Ray is necessary if you want the "real next-gen experience," because developers are running out of room on DVD-9's. Okay, sure. So then I ask you, why don't PC's need Blu-Ray Disc players to play the latest and greatest? Why is it that Crysis didn't need a Blu-Ray Disc? Besides, of course, to win the format war.trasherhead

Well, this wasn't very well thought through.

You do realise that there are just a few pc gamers who has a HDD that is less then 320gig right? I have a total of 660gig on my hdd. Now for the realy good part. Crysis on a DVD is compressed and if you where to play it right of the dvd and have the CPU extract alll the data you would need a seperat CPU just to do that and a DVD that could match that extraction speed. if you take a look at how mutch space it takes up on your HDD you'll find that with all the needed files(even those that isn't in the game dir) it takes up 12 gig, and that game has alot of repetative Meshes and textures.
Then you have games like Vanguard that takes up 20 gig and don't look great.

My Crysis only takes up around 6 gigs, not sure what Crysis you have.

BR isn't needed but it does allow 1080p cutscenes and high quality lossless audio.

No one needs HD but it sure is nice to have.

[QUOTE="True_Gamer_"]

[QUOTE="Gh0st_Of_0nyx"]Its simple the ps3 is VASTLY more powerful then the PC in every single way.Dante2710

Churning out sig material?

Hey, this is system wars. You can never know :P

BR isn't needed but it does allow 1080p cutscenes and high quality lossless audio.

No one needs HD but it sure is nice to have.

lordxymor

For games its not needed - why not just have in engine cutscenes, rather than 1080p video ones?

However for movies on an optical disk - different story.

The files are compressed some on PCs, which is why they require installation. However, cows are full of crap, Blu-Ray is not needed regardless.mis3ry

:|

Uh multiple DVD installations if games get that big.

Which they are not

skrat_01

[QUOTE="lordxymor"]

BR isn't needed but it does allow 1080p cutscenes and high quality lossless audio.

No one needs HD but it sure is nice to have.

skrat_01

For games its not needed - why not just have in engine cutscenes, rather than 1080p video ones?

However for movies on an optical disk - different story.

I know this isn't PC-related, but a member of the FF13 team put it well. The models they use for the realtime portions of the game will be on the order of thousands of polygons each, but the models they use for the prerendered portions will be on the order of millions.

[QUOTE="skrat_01"]

:|

Uh multiple DVD installations if games get that big.

Which they are not

HuusAsking

Its not 20gb+ big like - ahem - PS3 Blu Ray games (which are chock full of file padding).

[QUOTE="skrat_01"][QUOTE="lordxymor"]

BR isn't needed but it does allow 1080p cutscenes and high quality lossless audio.

No one needs HD but it sure is nice to have.

HuusAsking

For games its not needed - why not just have in engine cutscenes, rather than 1080p video ones?

However for movies on an optical disk - different story.

I know this isn't PC-related, but a member of the FF13 team put it well. The models they use for the realtime portions of the game will be on the order of thousands of polygons each, but the models they use for the prerendered portions will be on the order of millions.

But even Stalker had in engine cutscenes.

In engine cutscenes are no biggie - its impossible to have games have the same level of detail as them during gameplay, but seriously - video cutscenes in this day and age seem like somthing limited to the campy C&C FMV cutscenes.

However - contracting all this - Crysis's in engine cutscenes were identical to gameplay visual - the only difference was the cutscenes were scripted.

edit*

Oh wait I see what you mean. Yes the hardware of consoles in this day and age - or even the PC to a degree cannot render such complex scenes realtime.

Its simple the ps3 is VASTLY more powerful then the PC in every single way.Gh0st_Of_0nyx

Blu-ray is only needed to play Blu-Ray movies

/argument

It won't be gaming that drives the adoption of Blu Ray on PCs. DVD drives were standard on PCs long before it became the standard format for packaging games. It will be driven by affordable (eventually) burners and the ever increasing need for more storage for media. Also, many will eventually want to be able to burn their high def videos for viewing on their HDTVs. Only when it is common on PCs will PC games be released on it. Developers would rather release multiple DVDs than limit their market to the earlier adopters.

This prediction is based on what happened with DVDs. Most PC games game on CD until a year or two ago. The media is not limiting factor because of HD installs, and multidisk publications reppresent only a one-time inconvenience.

[QUOTE="HuusAsking"][QUOTE="skrat_01"][QUOTE="lordxymor"]

BR isn't needed but it does allow 1080p cutscenes and high quality lossless audio.

No one needs HD but it sure is nice to have.

skrat_01

For games its not needed - why not just have in engine cutscenes, rather than 1080p video ones?

However for movies on an optical disk - different story.

I know this isn't PC-related, but a member of the FF13 team put it well. The models they use for the realtime portions of the game will be on the order of thousands of polygons each, but the models they use for the prerendered portions will be on the order of millions.

But even Stalker had in engine cutscenes.

In engine cutscenes are no biggie - its impossible to have games have the same level of detail as them during gameplay, but seriously - video cutscenes in this day and age seem like somthing limited to the campy C&C FMV cutscenes.

However - contracting all this - Crysis's in engine cutscenes were identical to gameplay visual - the only difference was the cutscenes were scripted.

edit*

Oh wait I see what you mean. Yes the hardware of consoles in this day and age - or even the PC to a degree cannot render such complex scenes realtime.

Okay, so apparently the Xbox 360 is doomed because it's using "last-gen" hardware, such as DVD-9's. And of course, the cow's must argue that Blu-Ray is necessary if you want the "real next-gen experience," because developers are running out of room on DVD-9's. Okay, sure. So then I ask you, why don't PC's need Blu-Ray Disc players to play the latest and greatest? Why is it that Crysis didn't need a Blu-Ray Disc? Besides, of course, to win the format war.Screamteam411

First of all, PC games are heavily compressed and they are uncompressed when you install them. The whole point with consoles is how you don't have to install them. Installing games sucks and I would probably still game on my PC if I could just pop in a disk and play. And if the PS3 can run Uncharted without loading, I don't see why PC's aren't being designed for rapid streaming off disks instead of relying on install. Maybe because installing massive games encourages people to buy more RAM and HDD upgrades. I don't know.

Second, PC was way late at even adopting DVD. Even when every console had gone to DVD and the whole world owned DVD players and movie stores stopped stocking VHS...PCs still didn't have DVD. So you may want to think about that before acting as if PC is the machine that sets the trend for media storage. They were late to the game for DVDs and they will be late to the game if the media switches to BR or HD-DVD.

. Installing games sucks and I would probably still game on my PC if I could just pop in a disk and play. And if the PS3 can run Uncharted without loading, I don't see why PC's aren't being designed for rapid streaming off disks instead of relying on install. Maybe because installing massive games encourages people to buy more RAM and HDD upgrades. I don't know.ZIMdoom

People don't congregate around PCs to watch movies. (At least not people with a decent sized HDTV)long_dong_goo

[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"]. Installing games sucks and I would probably still game on my PC if I could just pop in a disk and play. And if the PS3 can run Uncharted without loading, I don't see why PC's aren't being designed for rapid streaming off disks instead of relying on install. Maybe because installing massive games encourages people to buy more RAM and HDD upgrades. I don't know.Vandalvideo

While you math is technically logical, I have my doubts for a few reasons.

1) The time arguement would only apply if you play way more consoles games than PC games. If you only play a few PC games but have a ton of consoles games, then sure, the install times would in the long-term be less than the disk swapping times. If you have equal games for both, I doubt that you swap disks more time for your console than you spend installing the same number of games on PC. If you have more console games or play more console games, then what does that say about consoles vs PC gaming?

2) I doubt it takes 1:20 to switch disks. I've never timed it, but that seems like a long time to eject one disk and slide in another. Maybe you are right, I don't know. Just seems long to me.

3) You should include the amount of time spent on PC downloading and installing patches, since that is required to make your PC games run properly.

4) Most importantly, I can't speak for everyone. But for myself...I don't swap disks when I play. I typically play one game at a time and it sits in my console until I beat it. So that negates your whole rebuttal since the time swapping disks for me is practically zero.

Well aside from switching discs it's faster to read data off a hard drive than to load off a dvd or blu-ray....Xbox 360 and PS3 both read the games off the disc and have loading times between areas to give the system time to load off the disc...With PC even if you have a game that supposedly makes you run off the disc you can patch it to put it on your hard-drive or just make a virtual drive. Point is the disc format doesn't matter as much to a PC becuase it's really only using it to get the data onto the harddrive and then the game never touches the disc again except maybe to make sure you have it....having 25gigs on a disc doesn't matter that much to a PC when you will end up loading it all on your harddrive in one shot when installing it.Ilikemyname420

which is why there are more and more games coming out where you can partially install the game to reduce load times, a middle ground if you will

[QUOTE="Ilikemyname420"]Well aside from switching discs it's faster to read data off a hard drive than to load off a dvd or blu-ray....Xbox 360 and PS3 both read the games off the disc and have loading times between areas to give the system time to load off the disc...With PC even if you have a game that supposedly makes you run off the disc you can patch it to put it on your hard-drive or just make a virtual drive. Point is the disc format doesn't matter as much to a PC becuase it's really only using it to get the data onto the harddrive and then the game never touches the disc again except maybe to make sure you have it....having 25gigs on a disc doesn't matter that much to a PC when you will end up loading it all on your harddrive in one shot when installing it.hyperboy152000

which is why there are more and more games coming out where you can partially install the game to reduce load times, a middle ground if you will

Uncharted has no loading when you play the game. If more developers used the PS3 hardware properly, then there would be no loading or installing. It would all be streamed off the disc.

[QUOTE="Ilikemyname420"]Well aside from switching discs it's faster to read data off a hard drive than to load off a dvd or blu-ray....Xbox 360 and PS3 both read the games off the disc and have loading times between areas to give the system time to load off the disc...With PC even if you have a game that supposedly makes you run off the disc you can patch it to put it on your hard-drive or just make a virtual drive. Point is the disc format doesn't matter as much to a PC becuase it's really only using it to get the data onto the harddrive and then the game never touches the disc again except maybe to make sure you have it....having 25gigs on a disc doesn't matter that much to a PC when you will end up loading it all on your harddrive in one shot when installing it.hyperboy152000

which is why there are more and more games coming out where you can partially install the game to reduce load times, a middle ground if you will

You can install any game entirely to your hard-drive. Just get a burning program like 'Alcohol %120' burn the Disc onto the harddrive as a virtual drive and point the game to the virtual drive's letter ie "E:" and it will load it off the harddrive like it was the disc.