"Sony is making the same mistakes that hobbled Microsoft and almost killed the Xbox"- BusinessInsider.com

Source

Sony is more arrogant than ever, similar to after PS2. It's a long article so I am including the main stuff. Feel free to read the original linked above. This should be fun discussion. Let's discuss.

"With the PlayStation 2 in 2000, Sony dominated the video game market; Microsoft's original Xbox was barely a competitor. But with the PlayStation 3 in 2006, Sony lost its dominance in the video game market. Microsoft's Xbox 360 became the standard-bearer for video game consoles of its generation, and it remained that way until 2013 when Sony and Microsoft launched the PlayStation 4 and Xbox One, respectively.

With the PlayStation 4, Sony is back on top.

Microsoft's Xbox One is doing fine, just like the PlayStation 3 did, but it's a distant second place to Sony's PS4. And now, the game of musical chairs has begun once again, with rumors swirling and even some outright official talk from both Sony and Microsoft about their next generation of game consoles."

"With such a huge lead, it's Sony's game to lose — and there are some worrying signs that Sony's repeating the same mistakes Microsoft did when it introduced the Xbox One."

Regarding Cross Play: "

After months of back and forth, with Sony repeatedly offering bad excuses to fans for not allowing cross-play, the company finally relented in September 2018.

More than just upsetting fans, Sony's refusal to allow cross-play sparked some major game publishers to speak out. Sony — a company that enjoyed years of good will with gamers following the launch of the PS4 — started looking like the arrogant one.

It was reminiscent of Microsoft's messaging around the launch of the Xbox One, which often felt like Microsoft wasn't listening to its most loyal fans."

"Microsoft introduced a video game console that wasn't focused on video games. The company demonstrated repeatedly that it wasn't listening to its most core consumers, and in doing so lost a lot of early momentum.

"And now Sony is showing early signs of making those same mistakes."

"In a New York Times interview ahead of the Consumer Electronics Show in early January, Sony Corporation CEO Kenichiro Yoshida laid out his plans for integrating the enormously popular PlayStation Network — the digital backbone of the PlayStation consoles — with Sony's music and movie businesses."

"While PlayStation Network could be expanded into an "entertainment" service, it shouldn't be. Core gaming audiences have repeatedly demonstrated their lack of interest in gaming platforms being broadened.

Look no further than Microsoft's announcement of the Xbox One — the focus on television, sports, and "smart" functionality was a perfect trifecta of bad press for the console."

Some of that had to do with Microsoft's Xbox leadership at the time, which was going through a lot of changes. Sony is seemingly going through the same thing, with execs being swapped all over the place. Former PlayStation CEO Shawn Layden is no longer in charge of PlayStation — now it's John Kodera. The company's latest CEO, Kenichiro Yoshida, is the man quoted above speaking about PlayStation Network; he became CEO in April 2018, and he replaced former PlayStation leader-turned-CEO Kaz Hirai. Yoshida's background is in finance.

"Sony is far from the position that Microsoft was in during that first year of the Xbox One's life, but recent signs point to exactly the type of shift we saw at Microsoft before the launch of the Xbox One."

I did not know a lot of that information and even though they are cocky as all hell I think they will be just fine next gen. If they dominate again remains to be seen.

Interesting blurb. Thanks for this.

I agree with really all the points outlined in the article. Microsoft lost a lot of early hype in 2013. Sony has focused on games and has been great this gen. But they gotta stay on top of it and keep being pro-gamer.

So Microsoft is sending checks to publications to write shine prices for them. All we’ve heard the past handful of months is how well Microsoft is doing and now we are hearing that Sony is doomed. So why isn’t any of this reflected in the real world?

So their example is just crossplay? I know they allowed it for pc games and rocket league, any other titles? I don't see how integrating ps network with other digital media will hinder anything unless Sony slows down on games developing.

Damn, the hate for Sony is pathetic. Your favourite brand is such a failure you try and find dirt on their competitor.

I feel people are really exaggerating this.

As long as Sony keeps putting out AAA exclusives, then they will probably be fine. Xbox started on a bad note saying it wasn't just a "gaming" console, and then exacerbated that by losing all of its exclusives, and even the ones it shares with PC are largely mediocre exclusives.

Disagree with a lot of what's written in the blurb. I'll address it all in order of what's in the blurb.

1) PS3 overtook Xbox 360 in the latter part of the generation, so the claim that Xbox 360 was the standard until PS4 is just incorrect.

2) The platform that's in the lead naturally is the one most hesitant of cross play. This is because of the sales advantage. Microsoft was hesitant of cross play last generation because they were ahead for most of it. This generation is different because there is a much greater emphasis on multiplayer/social experiences than before. I agree that it looks bad Sony wouldn't incorporate cross play, but to call it arrogance is a huge reach. They're competing businesses and they'll take what advantages they can get. This is why it's important for consumers to demand a service like cross play and force them to incorporate it (which is good).

3) The blurb assumes that gamers have a problem with gaming services expanding to involve non-gaming services and brings up Xbox One as an example. This isn't the case. If the games are there and the service doesn't incorporate anti-consumer policies then there is no reason why more wouldn't be better. Xbox One did so poorly because they tried to force Kinect (making the console more expensive despite being weaker than the competition) and their "always online"/"no game sharing" policies.

Sony is more likely to have the gaming aspect of consoles down for next gen because of their already established first party. That's also partly what saved them for PS3. Consoles have been turning into entertainment centers for a long time now and they need to evolve in order to grow. I don't think we should be shunning innovation. Microsoft is doing an excellent job innovating and Sony isn't showing any signs of slowing down. If all goes well, next gen could be even better than the current one.

So... Cross play, which Sony has been doing for more than 15 years now, and... adding music to PSN? These are the horrible mistakes that Sony is mimicking from Microsoft?

1. The PS3 was never 40 million units behind the Xbox 360. It even outsold the 360 by the end of the gen.

2. Crossplay is nothing new on Sony platforms. In fact, Microsoft's own policies with XBox Live are why XI came to the 360 but XIV isn't on the Bone.

3. There has always been movies and other media on PSN. Sony could add more content and no one would blink.

4. This article does not connect nearly enough points of data to draw the conclusion that it does.

I don't see Sony as arrogant but maybe it is becoming too casual as it hasn't had any serious competition in the last few years with the xbox one lagging too far behind to really worry Sony. The next generation will certainly provide harder competition for Sony, unless Microsoft is stupid enough to shoot itself in the foot again with crap like DRM and kinect. Which I highly doubt.

Sony's doomed. It's all over I tells ya.

AAA exclusive content.

Period.

Garbage article.

TLHBO

Did you just ignore all the bad press Sony got all year like you did this article?

-Censorship

-Crossplay

-Stripping PS Now from all their devices

-Continued lack of adding features

-Continual network issues and hacking problems

-Killed Vita

-General lack of listening to fans and not giving a **** what people think

-Only doing things after hand is forced, etc.

If anyone is acting like launch PS3 or launch Xbox One, its Sony.

LOL at all the paid articles by Microsoft to make Sony look bad.

Sony isn’t being “arrogant”. They are releasing tons of great games, updates and enjoying the non-stop mega sales.

Want the truth? Game Pass is losing to PS Now which Lemmings like to pretend doesn’t exist. PS Now dominates in sales against Game Pass.

But that’s all Microsoft seems to be able to talk about. $10 a month to play trash games! Viva piñata, indies, jet pack jumper and Recore! Oh wow! Such value!

lololololololololol

Releasing and underpowered console with no backwards compatibility is about the only way they will **** this up. Hopefully it doesn't happen.

@the-a-baum:

But with the PlayStation 3 in 2006, Sony lost its dominance in the video game market. Microsoft's Xbox 360 became the standard-bearer for video game consoles of its generation, and it remained that way until 2013 when Sony and Microsoft launched the PlayStation 4 and Xbox One, respectively.

First stop.

MS loss that generation as well in fact they ended 3RD not second 3rd,but lets not even argue 3rd place,lets argue FIRST place who sold more platforms and officially won the generation.

Yeah the wii did not the 360 not the PS3 just like the PS2 won its generation.

Microsoft's Xbox One is doing fine, just like the PlayStation 3 did, but it's a distant second place to Sony's PS4.

Hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa....

The xbox one doesn't have the quantity or quality of exclusives the PS3 had back on January 2012 going into its 6th year.

And factually speaking it was ahead as well in sales compare to the xbox one.

Until recently, there was just one major exception: PlayStation 4 players were siloed off from Microsoft's Xbox One and Nintendo's Switch. Worse, if you bought stuff in "Fortnite" on PlayStation 4, none of it would show up if you played the game with the same account on another platform. Bummer!

Is not the case anymore so this ^^ is irrelevant,but is great to see the article fails to point out that the game is actually free to play on PS4 but not so on xbox one. Bummer!

It was reminiscent of Microsoft's messaging around the launch of the Xbox One, which often felt like Microsoft wasn't listening to its most loyal fans.

Bullshit considering that cross play is not a feature in all games,in fact the vast majority don't have cross play,and it wasn't like the PS4 didn't have cross play to begin with and MS was on the same spot on 2013 in fact Rocketleague wasn't cross play with anything on xbox period until MS changed.

So how is ok that MS change but if sony does is not?

Sony trying to convert its very popular gaming service into an "entertainment" service demonstrates a lack of understanding about why people love PlayStation. It handles gaming very well, and attempts to broaden that are likely to be balked at by its most loyal users.

Couple that with the cross-play situation, and you've got two clear signs of Sony demonstrating hubris — similar to how Microsoft acted before and after introducing a console that many people didn't want.

Ding ding ding ding.

And here we have arrive at the real point MS paying sites to make shit up about the playstation and give awards to its shitty division manager who has single handed manage to destroy the xbox image as a platform with at least some games to play that you could not find anywhere else,to a even shittier mary go round of gears,halo Forza with Forza been spin into 2 series while the quality of 3 of its main series have drop compare to last gen,and has left a console without its own soul.

The xbox use to be the console to play Halo,now is the console where you can play multiplatform that can't even reach quality wise the status they once had.

Basically the point of this click hunter article is based on sony supposedly expanding its service (a bad thing some how) and sony refusal of cross play which already has been fix.

I saw that earlier. Pretty stupid and poorly substantiated article, TBH. They draw parallels between unequivalent things. We literally have no idea what Sony will do with the PS5. The only thing Sony is clearly screwing up is the cross-platform play battle. BC - if it's gone - will be another screw up. But I'd bet it will be there.

Honestly, the stream of articles like this from BusinessInsider and Forbes lately is kinda ridiculous. The games industry has unbridled enthusiasm for tue PS brand right now. Suits who don't game making poorly substantiated dhoom predictions... where are they getting this stuff?

Sony might f*ck up (they have before), but let's maybe have them announce the thing first yeah?

What a joke article. Hope that author gets called out on it and the OP for wasting my time reading it. I'd highlight all the mistakes in the article but others already have. One complaint that's legit that I didn't see was the name change ability. But that'll be fixed soon supposedly.

The article ends with this line and link:

"Get the latest Microsoft stock price here."

Equating crossplay to the PS3's mistakes is pure nonsense. They aren't even in the same league.

Also, PlayStation Network is ALREADY Sony's entertainment network whether you like it, or not. Why wouldn't Sony (Entertainment) not want to leverage their parent companies most popular platform for their own content? This isn't comparable to Microsoft (Xbox) trying to make the Xbox One an entertainment machine because Microsoft simply isn't an entertainment company. PlayStation just needs to do PlayStation things, and open up the platform to other parts of Sony. I.e. PlayStation works on gaming while Sony Entertainment works on Music, Movies etc.

Not even gonna bother reading the article. Sony is the only company actually doing things right. MS hasn't had a noteworthy exclusive in years. Nintendo gave us portability and Nintendo games, but they lack in so many things.

They sensor a damn game where woman looked like pre-teen girls ,i don't know what kind of fetish crap most gamers have,but i for one don't like the portrait of what appear to be young girls in games.

Get this into your skull dynamitecop cross play has been part of the Playstation since 2002,on xbox one there wasn't even cross play to begin with the same crap you are complaining about sony fits perfectly to MS,which didn't allow cross play on xbox one,and factually rocketleague came without cross play on xbox when the PS4 supported it from launch,just like since launch free to play games had been free on PS4 but on xbox one still are lock under live paywall which make them not FREE period.

I don't see you crying about that.

PS now was shutdown in many devices because the number of people playing was to small to warranty support for future revisions,do you actually believe that if 5 million were using PS now on tablets or TV sony would have drop them? Really?

What more features you want? hell the PS4 has feature the xbox one doesn't again you can't even freaking play free to play games on xbox online without paying how is that for feature that need some matching on the xbox side.

No i don't care about pizza hut app on xbox.

Yes and is dead just like nintendo killed the wii u it sold poorly.

General lack of listening to fans.Hahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Man you can't be this blind,oh wait you can NyaDC,that is the most pathetic shit i have read in a while here,is basically some blackace level shit..Hahahhaaa

How about MS general lack of making great exclusives?

Only doing things after hand is forced, etc.

Sorry but i even have to quote this one again,is too good.

You know what a 180 turn means?

Are you familiarise with the term ""switch flip""

https://www.dualshockers.com/major-nelson-rebrands-himself-as-switch-flipper-after-xbox-one-drm-about-face/

Sometimes fanboys such as yourself need a reality check,to be reminded of how history went please to talk about companies doing things after their hand is forced.

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/x1-rocket-league-wont-have-crossplay-because-micro-32818580/

This article truly triggered some folks. Look at exhibit A above me.???

Sony has enough Blind Fanboys that they'll get another Free Pass like they did in 2006 if need be.

As Long as Sony doesn't try to release $800 HW and sell it for $600 Sony will be fine and most likely have the most World Wide Market Penetration. Sony has too much Mind Share especially with illogical Fanboy types.

I read that article this morning and it is pretty poor. In glancing at the title I thought they had the inside track on some of the proposed specs/features of the PS5.

"The Cross-Play Debacle" - already happened and did not have a significant impact on the brand over all. Sony has also already been involved with cross-play but was reluctant to with certain games. Additionally the article claims they are making the same mistakes but then goes on to say that Sony has already rectified the most "damning" cross-play instance in Fortnite. "After months of back and forth, with Sony repeatedly offering bad excuses to fans for not allowing cross-play, the company finally relented in September 2018."It is now almost 4 months later and they are still bringing up a situation which was addressed. The author completely failed to bring up newer instances where Sony is not participating in cross-play: Paladins/Wargrove and failed to show any negative results as part of Sony not participating in full cross-play.

"What's up at Sony?" - A thriving gaming platform that ended the year grabbing game of the year and offering users a consisten flow of high rated exclusives. "Core gaming audiences have repeatedly demonstrated their lack of interest in gaming platforms being broadened. Look no further than Microsoft's announcement of the Xbox One — the focus on television, sports, and "smart" functionality was a perfect trifecta of bad press for the console."Yes, core gamers may lack an interest in gaming platforms being broadened but only if that expansion comes at the price of the gaming platform itself. Core gamers are interested in games that provide great experiences and easy access to those games. The problem with the Xbox One launch was not that it broadened the gaming platform but that the focus was on that expansion.

This same author also wrote Playstaton predictions for 2019 and started that article off with : "For the 91-plus million PlayStation 4 owners, 2019 is going to be another big year." Does he honestly expect the points mentioned in his new hit piece to trump any of the gaming experiences that Sony will provide in 2019?

The article reads as if it is written by someone who doesn't really play games but just followed the most buzzworthy news articles related to gaming. Nothing in this article supported his stance. At the end it was really just a prime example of why you shouldn't go to businessinsider for your gaming news.

It doesn't trigger anyone this is the way i post always dude,but i am sure if it was about the xbox one you would be knee deep in tears by now. :)

What did sony did wrong in 2006?

Other that reaching to high tech wise with the PS3.

The PS3 value wise chew and spit the xbox 360,both machines weren't even close value wise when you compared the tech inside both,and while sony started slow by 2009 it was already scorching MS with incredible exclusives.

Something the xbox one hasn't done and will not do on what it has left of its life.

By the way they didn't get a free pass they loss a huge chunk of its user base to nintendo and ms back then but were able to stand up and come back from a place no other competitor has ever came,the PS3 basically ended like 16 million units away from the most sold platform last gen,even with its fu** ups,no other platform has done that.

@tormentos: I don't spend time writing essays getting upset about articles like you. Now, go search.?

Actually some post of you with a few words speak way more than any essays i could write. :)

A lot of Swiss cheese in here!

lmfao what a garbage article written by someone who knows nothing about the industry clearly. Xbox one isn't in no way comparable to PS3, as PS3 actually had games for a start. For the entire second half of last gen PS3 was the best console for exclusives and sony built a lot of momentum, microsoft has had the absolute WORST years of any major console ever since 2015 and has done nothing but lose whatever little momentum they had.

Seecondly, Sony is in no way becoming microsoft. microsoft shuttered all their studios and left gamers with little more than endless halo, gears, forza rehashes while they chased the kinect gamer. Sony has pumped out SOTC, GOW, Spider-man, detroit, and they have TLOU2, Ghosts of....whatever it is etc still on the way.

This guy is trying to spin for the sake of spinning. It's fake news.

@saltslasher: Sony’s bad press hurt them how in sales? The Xbox One, despite their overwhelming positive press finished in last. Again...

Read this article when it popped up on my google news app earlier today..

its poppycock

Nintendo was more arrogant with the success the Wii. They thought the WiiU can maintain the momentum but at the end it was a massive failure.

It has some valid points but I don't see the connection. Xbox's decline starts during the 360 era with the decline of investment in core 1st party games and aiming for the casual market. They failed to acknowledge the reasons why the Wii died quickly while the PS3 was catching them in sales.

It appears to me that Sony is far from doing this. At least they still have a very strong line-up that will carry them into the next gen. And the 360 was already a media center and no one had issues with that. It had more to do with the messaging than the facts. Added with Sony (inadvertently or not) using the toxicity of the medium to punish Xbox. And then on top of that MS basically spent most of this gen reconstructing the brand, it took them time to get the messaging right and the rest it is still ongoing.

So, while it's a nice click bait I don't see Sony repeating the same mistakes. They might make new ones but while PS is my least favourite console brand I feel they have a pretty solid foundation and contrary to this gen I'm pretty sure they will start strong with games next gen.

@ajstyles: PS Now should be beating Game Pass. There are a ton more PS4's in circulation worldwide.

If Xbox had any decent exclusives, Game Pass would be the better service because it offers 1st party exclusives on day 1 for Game Pass.

PS Now seems to focus more on older games, while Game Pass focuses more on this gen's games. You wouldn't see God of War or Spiderman on PS Now on day 1.

@phbz: I guess the connection would be that Sony just put a finance exec in charge of PlayStation. Somebody with a thought pattern of monetization. Hopefully he doesn't exploit gamers like EA and Activision, but the PS4 has not had a real system update in a long time. Where MS keeps improving the XB1's feature set.

Sony also has a customer service problem with psn. My ps3 was hacked and when I called them to issue a complaint, they refunded my account, but advised me it was a one time issue. Meaning if I get hacked again beyond my control, they wouldn’t refund me again. I never gave away my password so from my perspective, this is an issue.

Fake news! So much wrong with this article and bad facts that others have already pointed out.

Welcome to modern "Journalism". After two weeks of fake stories and bullshit from msm, do you expect games and other industry journalism to have any ethics anymore? Sad state for sure.

Yep, that backwards compatibility with PS4 is key. As long as it has that and a few exclusives, plus a competitive price they will be fine.

Wow, I didn’t know sony’s fan base was this rabid. Looking at some of these fanboys defending poor customer service is just hilarious!

It’s just an article kids. No one’s gonna take away your precious playstations. You’ll have plenty more b-movies and qte’s to ‘play’ in the future!

I agree with most of the retorts against this article.

The writer of this Op-Ed is really reaching here.

Only things I am really seeing is Yes Sony is Very Arrogant going into next Gen, But why shouldn't they be? PS4 is printing money for all of Sony.

The Exec change up can be concerning because that did not go work out well for Xbox in the past, but Sony knows how much they need to lean on PS4, 10 billion a year to former MicroSoft Execs from Xbox was chump change.

With the Sony's current install base and depending on them supporting those that bought Digital games being able to take it to PS5 with BC, will be a big hurdle for MS Gaming winning back PS4 only gamers.

Totally agree with others, as long as Sony puts out a great console that can do 4k 60fps and has BC(Funny how Cows are demanding this now) they should be more than fine.

Wild card if PSVR is built in to the console and has reserved space like Kinnect that can't be used for traditional games.

Don't think they're arrogant, just don't have the resources like MS to be tackling multiple fronts. It was apparent after Ps3 data breach, Sony scaled back. PSN wasn't supported much with 1st Party Support and PS Now is somewhat serviceable.

Sony kept it simple, the strength is with its 1st party studios and banging out great singleplayer experiences. After DriveClub, no other game really tackled online gaming.

I dont think Sony is being arrogant and stuff like crossplay is a small issue and overall think Sony is just regrouping by focusing on the basics. With PS5 coming, we're hearing about Sony boosting up PSN/PSNow features and seems like Sony will be expanding with more features after bank rolling with PS4.

I was going to post this article this morning as a thread and I didn't... I read it through and realized it is literally the dumbest, most nonsensical, non points being made and I didn't think the buzzy title would be enough to let it gain traction.

I was wrong... Its the #1 article on N4G right now.

I love taking shots at Sony, but Sony is going to be just fine going into next generation. They have more bullets In their chamber than they know what to do with and Microsoft is the company that has to deliver something that can compete with that. They know it, we know it... I fully expect them to, but it's laughable to think Sony is bloated and resting on their laurels or tanking their business over cross play and entertainment services.... This article reads like the bizarro WORLD. It's Mod approved Fake News.

if we just remind ourselves what those mistakes were -

• mandatory kinect usage that's always listening
• $100 more than the ps4
• an unlock fee to pay used games
• always online requirement
• promoted as an all round entertainment box - watch tv, skype, sports alerts, read your heartbeat whilst exercising

trying to pass off

• initially holding back on cross play
• the intention to make video and music content from their respective sony divisions available through psn

as comparable is difficult to do with a straight face

In before the paid for by Microsoft false narrative drivel fanboys use when they don't have an argument.

**** to late.

I agree with you 100% and Sony is doing better then awesome this generation, but find it hilarious how it triggers fanboys. Just take the responses in this thread. Sony defense force out full bore. PRICELESS!

@Xabiss: I always chuckle at how far people will go when revealing their silly loyalties to a plastic box, but in this case it's shocking just how out of touch the author of the article is.

Yeah I read that article linked through some other news source the other day. Seemed like it was entirely based on assumptions. There's no way to know if Sony is "repeating mistakes" until they actually reveal their next console. The guy also doesn't seem to understand the weight of the different mistakes MS made.

He does recognize that part of it was pricing the system $100 more and doing the whole "preventing used game" shenanigans. Sony might want to leverage their movies and music catalogs, doesn't mean they are going to stupidly go the same route MS did for the rest of the console design and reveal stage. But we will need to see when it's all actually unveilled. I.e. there hasn't even been a "TV, TV, TV" moment which was really only the 3rd or 4th dumbest thing MS did with the Xbox One launch.

Presumably MS will have learned from their mistakes. But they've been talking for years now and this gen really hasn't changed all that much, if anything their "exclusive game" positioning has gotten worse for the XB1. Now,with their acquisition activity they should at least have some cards to play for next gen, but it remains to be seen if that will bear any actual fruit.

Is this some kind of joke or something???