Sony's philosophy on BC is deeply concerning for PS5, exposes their short terming thinking

1. Always with the techno bable for no reason....

2. As you asked maybe look on YouTube

3. Yes it does

4. As above

5. Can you please go in to the other thread and adjust your tflops to bandwidth numbers to a more accurate number.

The console industry is not concerned. BC has always been a cherry on top and of no concern to consoles.

That said. There will be very little problem running PS4 games on the PS5. AT WORST, they have to do a a bit of work on some software that helps but nothing significant. Think about the PC. It doesn't have problems playing games through many generations. If it's really old, there can be some.

The PS4 is not like the PS3 with obscure architecture. AMD would fail hard if Ryzen had problems with previous software for example. It would literally be dead on arrival, no matter how good it could be. On the PC, people want to run what they have better, not start again with something new.

And Playstation doesn't have a problem with BC. You can still play PS One games. If it's easy, they'll put the effort in. And Running PS4 games on a future console won't be hard. Not saying it'll be simple 1:1. Just saying at worst it could take a little work.

But isn't this the nature of consoles now? New iterations every few years.

Just asking your opinion. I'm definitely not into this myself. Loved last gen from beginning to end, one console. I don't mind with the PC to upgrade parts, but I loved the nature of how consoles were. Simpler, one per gen.

@HalcyonScarlet:

Agreed. This is where consoles are moving towards. Iterative upgrades every 3 years make sense.

It's foolish to think that PS5 need BC, none of us know that. I won't be surprised if Sony were scrutinised for not having BC with PS4 games.

Just like they're being scrutinised by not having cross play.

If adding BC takes away from other things Sony should focus on, then I'm totally against it. I don't care that Scorpio has limited BC. And I certainly wouldn't want them to make the PS5 more expensive just to please a select few. If you want to play your old games, keep your old system. Simple!

1. If you want to engage in this debate. You must know your subject matter.

It's simple, the translated binary is saved on disk for later retrieval. IBM deemed Apple's Rosetta technology creator Transitive Corporation as a threat and has purchased Transitive Corporation and shut down PPC-to-X86 translator offerings.

2. Running recent PS2 emulator builds, it's fine. Remember, the open source programmers has problems accessing NDA protected hardware docs.

3. It doesn't. Sony already has PS2 emulator on PS4 and Sony is making PS4 owners to pay for it.

4 As above.

5. My post are in-line with Sony's right most bar graph. X1X has smashed RX-580 in Arc Survival and Forza wet track.

GTA5 is on xbox 360 why can't you play it on xbox one without double dipping? Hahahaha

Again you can play 300 games were most are shitty old arcade games,games from old ass platforms like Sonic games or indies.

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/backward-compatibility/available-games

Abysmal what you can play.. The PS3 on day 1 had backward compatibility with PS1 and PS2 basically the biggest backward compatibility outside PC,and non of you cared..lol

Is a nice feature to some but is not a feature I care about. I have the original PS2 and PS3. I use the BBC once just to test it and that it. With my limited time I rather play new games than old one.

@tormentos:yes like FFXII HD, FFX HD, SOTC HD, God of War HD, TLOU remater, Gravity Rush remaster, Legend of Kay Anniversary, Uncharted remaster and MORE!

@tormentos: *had

Thanks for using a last gen example to support your brainlessness.

@reduc_ab_: "In all fairness, Sony is more concerned with making new games, and not just relying on old ones like some companies we know..."

How much did Sony invest in PSNow. How many so called remastered version of old games did they release?

Sony stance on BC is quite clear and lol at people who can't see that. And lol@ people who will sell their PS4 when PS5 comes out.

Keep your old systems people.

So you can't answer my question..hahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

You can't even play freaking Forza 3 and 4 on xbox one but hey you can play pacman double dragon and sonic from the genesis..lol

Yes but unlike you people i am not pretending is a MS thing alone,which you people are doing with sony,so if you slam sony for re makes remember you can't play Halo 1,2,3,4 on xbox one because MS want you to buy Halo MCC.

Yeah but the difference is that Halo MCC along the others titles are going to be BC in the future and Sony should follow and do the same already.

I'm hopeful that since the architecture of their systems moving forward will be x86 based, they will have bc with the PS5. The issue they have with the ps3 is that the cell is hard to emulate with success.

BC would be great in the next PlayStation and I believe I read a while back that Sony is planning more of an ecosystem similar to smart phones. Thus, games released on PS4 and up would work on the following hardware iteration(s).

Frankly, I'm not worried. If the next PlayStation isn't backwards compatible, I'll just keep my PS4.

To note, Microsofts X-1 BC is not 100% BC, since only a selected games can be played. Not all 360 can be played on the X-1, while the library is growing, its not going to be all. And for the original XBOX system, Microsoft had stated that the library wont be big like the 360 due to rights to the games and technical difficulties (SOURCE) Now if you are talking about the X-1X with the X-1 games, well that's because the X-1X is, first and foremost, an Xbox One that was powered up. MS has stated that any game made for the X-1X has to be playable with the OG X-1 and X-1S and there will be no games exclusive just to the X-1X (like what Nintendo did with the DSi to the DS and N3DS to the 3DS)

PS: Let me also add that the 360 wasnt also 100% BC with the OG XBOX

Another thing, Microsoft may be the one doing a semi BC currently, but Nintendo has been doing it longer and were 100% BC. While the Switch is not BC, due to using a different game media (cartridges), their 3DS is fully compatible with DS games. BC has been there for a long time, and people didn't care about it then.

Now we don't know if Sony is making a PS5 yet, they may or may not. But if they do, not having BC for PS4 games is not going to be anything concerning. It may be for a few, but as I've been repeatedly saying, the main reason people buy the next generation console is to play the next generation games, being able to play older games is just a bonus.

I'm not saying BC is useless, I truly think its a nice feature, but its not something of a deal breaker for those looking into purchasing a next gen console. If the next gen console does not have BC, they can use their older console to play those.

I have my old consoles for old games. I don't need a new console to be BC. Unnecessary. But after reading some replies I found this for all of you....

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/06/backward-compatible-xbox-360-games-are-less-than-2-of-xbox-one-usage-time/

I'm fairly certain Sony will either include BC on the PS5 OR implement it in some way through PSNOW. Ex. If you own your PS4 games digitally, you can play them through PS NOW for free / part of PSN+.

@tormentos: it is business. That is why Microsoft has billions and Sony is always in the bread line.

NOW why can't those be played NOW when Halo spartan and reach can be played..

Profits yeah that is the answer.

NO MS has billions because it has a monopoly over the PC industry with windows,if it was for the xbox brand MS would be dead and bury like sega on the hardware market.

Wasn't the WiiU backwards compatible?

It was/is. Switch isn't, yet it sells better than the Wiiu. What does that tell us?

@Ant_17:

Everything :)

PS5 will use Zen or Zen2, both are x86-64 architecture, and so is Jaguar. It's not going to be much of a problem at all for PS5 to run all PS4 games.

Agreed. I don't particularly care for their stance on backwards compatibility.

What Nintendo is doing is irrelevant, they're still running obscure hardware architectures that put them on the outsets of what is being discussed here, whereas what Sony and Microsoft are doing now is running a ubiquitous architecture which has no reason to be replaced or not used going forward.

People will not see a PlayStation 5 or an Xbox 4 as something entirely new, it will be seen as an extension of what is currently going on regardless of branding and moniker. It's 100% inexcusable for the games of today to not work on another x86 successor platform. Take the Xbox One X for example, this console architecturally is the same as the Xbox One and the PlayStation 4, however the internals share absolutely nothing with the Xbox One yet it runs all of its games not only flawlessly, it runs them better.

The Xbox One X is the model of what a next-generation system should be even though this one is still classified as a part of this generation, the design ideology must carry over, anything less is completely unacceptable.

Why bother? They know that they can just rehash, sorry remaster. and sell the same games again as launch titles for a new console.

That is not a good thing, no matter how you spin it.

These consoles are using standard PC components now, there is no excuse for not having backwards compatibility moving forwards.

says s*it like this... probably clueless as to why PC is so dominant.

Ah yes... in the age of minimalism and ever growing limited space.... and the digital age, lets keep generations of old consoles on display like sad little collectors...

This is so dull, this is 2017 where all technology is moving towards smart/conveniant while leaving very little footprint in every aspect.

Meanwhile, Sony Morons "I still have my PS1/PS2/PS3/PS4/PS5 around if I want to play those games!

absolute cancerous mindset

No that's not the anwser because one of them has the BC while the other one don't and more games are being brought to it while the others don't so you're wrong and you're wrong about Microsoft too with your statement over windows: http://www.businessinsider.fr/us/how-google-apple-facebook-amazon-microsoft-make-money-chart-2017-5/

Microsoft isn't only about windows.

Lol PS5 won't have bc because most of the games on PS5 and the next Xbox will once again be Cross gen much like the three years now so ya

@freedom01: Part of the issue with me is how good my older games hold up. PS4 is at the level where the games will hold up well for awhile. BC is a must for me next gen.

1. I do know my subject matter, I've shown in other threads that you do not.

2. Most games are fine and perform just fine but since when did most = all?

3. Limited game availability, probably not enough power there for all games as the ones that are available aren't exactly known for pushing PS2.

4. Moot

5. Sony's graph does not apply to Microsofts hardware and you're a fool for thinking it does, you've also given XBX's GPU more bandwidth then it will get so you numbers are not accurate, if you want to engage then you must know your subject matter.

1. You don't. There's a difference with best known open source PS3 emulation methods (dynamic re-compiler) vs Apple's Rosetta with static translation and dynamic re-compiler technology.

2. Again, name a problematic example.

3. Again, name a problematic example.

4. Both SPE and PPE has 128 bit SIMD and 128 registers, the main difference is the number of SIMD units to emulate e.g. 3 vs 6 + 1 from PS3 PPE.

5. My views matches with MS's first party source claim.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2017-the-scorpio-engine-in-depth

"For 4K assets, textures get larger and render targets get larger as well. This means a couple of things - you need more space, you need more bandwidth," explains Nick Baker. "The question though was how much? We'd hate to build this GPU and then end up having to be memory-starved. All the analysis that Andrew was talking about, we were able to look at the effect of different memory bandwidths, and it quickly led us to needing more than 300GB/s memory bandwidth. In the end we ended up choosing 326GB/s. On Scorpio we are using a 384-bit GDDR5 interface - that is 12 channels. Each channel is 32 bits, and then 6.8GHz on the signalling so you multiply those up and you get the 326GB/s."

I'm not saying MS have no games but I would like them to put more effort into their 1st party games. That NFL deal they made could have funded an exclusive or two. My biggest issue with MS is too much reliance on 3rd party games and not enough investment in themselves.

TBH I see no reason why they need to invest themselves. If the 36 million Xbox One consoles sold is true then maybe they'll become the Valve of the console industry.

Well exclusives are enticing, if your system has games that aren't available elsewhere it'll draw people in. 360 got me into games I still like today Fable, Tropico, Mass effect and more. MS should invest in new studios so you get more games. 36 million nice number but think why is ps4 double that it aint magic and wishful thinking, Sony has a lot of studios all working on games with a serving of multiplats and a side order of indies.

@reduc_ab_: Perfectly said spot on. ?

"rather have new games."

Because you can't be BC AND make new games at the same time, right?

Just an excuse. BC is always preferred. I adored my fat PS3 that had a ps1, ps2, and ps3 in it. No wonder it was so damn fat.

I love that my Wii U plays Wii games and that gamey Wii plays gamecube games. Saves space on my tv stand when I want to play some classic games again without having to plug in an old system.

And yes, the BC on my brand new xbox one S is pretty damn cool. Meanwhile..shocking enough..it also plays new games. Crazy. How do they do it?

I never play old games.

Have heaps of BC games on my Xboner that I always plan to get around to playing, but the truth is I never do.

Doesn't bother me if PS5 has no BC, I won't be buying it to play old games.

@Bread_or_Decide: "Because you can't be BC AND make new games at the same time, right?"

With MS it's apparently either or lol

Did I imagine gears of war 4 coming out? Just because you don't like the games doesn't mean the games cease to exist.

And as for 2017, I think the scalebound cancellation gave them a big hit for the year. There will be crackdown 3 and forza this fall. Keep in mind Sony blew their load early this year so this fall it's all multiplats for them.

If sony brought in BC for ps5, everyone here who is against it would be changing their tunes. Like Sony making it mandatory to charge a yearly fee just to play online games.

I don't know.. I think when I buy a new system I will like to have new games instead of old ones.

I do know, offering more gaming options and for free is a no brainer, eh, I suppose that's not true for SW, we hate more options, well, when they're not on our system of choice that is. lol. :P

That's because the Xbox One does have games, maybe you should check. In fact I have more games pre-ordered for my Xbox One than my PS4.

I know several people that purchased a first run PS3 just so they could play PS1 and PS2 games! I even traded my PS3 for a newer one just so my friend could have BC. Seems some people want BC on there playstation.

Sure the halogearsforza tripplet is still there but not much else and quality-wise most of MS exclusives leave much to be desired next to the competition. Have you really seen Crackdown? looks like a 360 game visually and gameplay-wise. The PS4 has 10+ more exclusives over the Xbox this month alone. Granted mostly indie exclusives but exclusives nonetheless, the Xbox is not even getting many indie exclusives, they have 2 this month in comparison to the 10+ the PS4 is getting and that is so each month. So no, the PS4 has plenty over the the X1 still for the rest of the year, they already had their biggest announcement this year but there's much more still and probably better quality than the X1 lineup if things continue as they are.

ah come, the buildings and the city look far better than on the xbox 360.

I'm not arguing that the xbox isn't have a bad year. Hopefully things will pick up for them in 2018. Nintendo suffered with the Wii U and then came back on the Switch. It's always a good thing when all three are doing well. Don't forget it took the ps4 four years to get to this amazing 2017 that they had. Before that it was one exclusive a year and just multiplats.