iOS because I own it and have many games I enjoy for it.
SWM Fall Issue 2011 is coming soon - SWM
This topic is locked from further discussion.
[QUOTE="catfishmoon23"]What is the ios..??iOS because I own it and have many games I enjoy for it.
AtariKidX
iPhone/iPod Touch/iPad OS
[QUOTE="AtariKidX"]
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
The Vita fails to impress. It wows its fans with flashy graphics, but does not impress.
mmmwksil
And that is why the PSVita pre-order sales is rank No. 1 at Amazon........:roll:
And this proves my opinion wrong how, Atari?
You say that PSVita fails to impress.......but that is just your opinion.lol[QUOTE="mmmwksil"][QUOTE="AtariKidX"]
And that is why the PSVita pre-order sales is rank No. 1 at Amazon........:roll:
AtariKidX
And this proves my opinion wrong how, Atari?
You say that PSVita fails to impress.......but that is just your opinion.lolExactly my point :o My opinion cannot be proven wrong! :P
I don't see any games for the vita yet that really excite me.
If this year's PSP lineup is any indication, developers will release information of Vita releases independently of TGS.
You say that PSVita fails to impress.......but that is just your opinion.lol[QUOTE="AtariKidX"][QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
And this proves my opinion wrong how, Atari?
mmmwksil
Exactly my point :o My opinion cannot be proven wrong! :P
Opinions can be wrong.
[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
Exactly my point :o My opinion cannot be proven wrong! :P
mmmwksil
Opinions can be wrong.
Not according to their definition. :o
Sure they can. Beliefs can be wrong. Convictions can be wrong. Personal views can even be "wrong" in the sense that they are based on highly inaccurate information and faulty logic and reasoning.
Ex: "Imo, the earth is flat." "Imo, Japan is the poorest country in the world."
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
Opinions can be wrong.
hakanakumono
Not according to their definition. :o
Sure they can. Beliefs can be wrong. Convictions can be wrong. Personal views can even be "wrong" in the sense that they are based on highly inaccurate information and faulty logic and reasoning.
Ex: "Imo, the earth is flat."
Opinions are views that are not necessarily dependant on fact or knowledge.
The opinion that the Earth is flat can never BE wrong. The idea can be proven false, but the opinion itself isn't wrong.
The Vita is an AMAZING hardware device, but the library is...well....might as well get an iPad.Willy105
Ouch...it's not that bad.
[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
Not according to their definition. :o
mmmwksil
Sure they can. Beliefs can be wrong. Convictions can be wrong. Personal views can even be "wrong" in the sense that they are based on highly inaccurate information and faulty logic and reasoning.
Ex: "Imo, the earth is flat."
Opinions are views that are not necessarily dependant on fact or knowledge.
The opinion that the Earth is flat can never BE wrong. The idea can be proven false, but the opinion itself isn't wrong.
Not necessarily, but they can be wrong when they are.
Yes it can. It's wrong. Beliefs can be wrong. Opinions can be wrong too.
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
Sure they can. Beliefs can be wrong. Convictions can be wrong. Personal views can even be "wrong" in the sense that they are based on highly inaccurate information and faulty logic and reasoning.
Ex: "Imo, the earth is flat."
hakanakumono
Opinions are views that are not necessarily dependant on fact or knowledge.
The opinion that the Earth is flat can never BE wrong. The idea can be proven false, but the opinion itself isn't wrong.
Not necessarily, but they can be wrong when they are.
Yes it can. It's wrong. Beliefs can be wrong. Opinions can be wrong too.
They can be wrong when they ARE based on fact or knowledge. Otherwise, they can't be wrong. One could argue they hold less credibility, but they can't be wrong if not based on fact or knowledge.
[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
Opinions are views that are not necessarily dependant on fact or knowledge.
The opinion that the Earth is flat can never BE wrong. The idea can be proven false, but the opinion itself isn't wrong.
mmmwksil
Not necessarily, but they can be wrong when they are.
Yes it can. It's wrong. Beliefs can be wrong. Opinions can be wrong too.
They can be wrong when they ARE based on fact or knowledge. Otherwise, they can't be wrong. One could argue they hold less credibility, but they can't be wrong if not based on fact or knowledge.
I think both "opinions" I gave can be qualified as "wrong."
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
Not necessarily, but they can be wrong when they are.
Yes it can. It's wrong. Beliefs can be wrong. Opinions can be wrong too.
hakanakumono
They can be wrong when they ARE based on fact or knowledge. Otherwise, they can't be wrong. One could argue they hold less credibility, but they can't be wrong if not based on fact or knowledge.
I think both "opinions" I gave can be qualified as "wrong."
Only if we know if the person who expressed them has prior knowledge relating to the opinions formed. :P
But I will concede; some opinions can be proven wrong. Which ones, however, is a debate for the ages.
[QUOTE="Willy105"]The Vita is an AMAZING hardware device, but the library is...well....might as well get an iPad.Cherokee_Jack
Ouch...it's not that bad.
I fail to see how its bad at all. There's a decent amount of announced rhythm games (DJ Max Technika and Lumines), platformers (LBP and Sound Shapes), racers (Ridge Racer and Modnation), action-adventure games (Gravity Rush, Golden Abyss, and AC), RPGs (Tales, Ys, FF, Persona, LKS), hunting games (Lord of Apocalypse and Ragnorak), fighters (Blazblue, Mortal Kombat, Street Fighter, and UMvsC), FPSs (Resistance, KZ, Bioshock, Dust 514, CoD), and visual novels (Chunsoft's two games) for a system that hasn't even launched yet. It's far from bad.
[QUOTE="Cherokee_Jack"]
[QUOTE="Willy105"]The Vita is an AMAZING hardware device, but the library is...well....might as well get an iPad.minh800
Ouch...it's not that bad.
I fail to see how its bad at all. There's a decent amount of announced rhythm games (DJ Max Technika and Lumines), platformers (LBP and Sound Shapes), racers (Ridge Racer and Modnation), action-adventure games (Gravity Rush, Golden Abyss, and AC), RPGs (Tales, Ys, FF, Persona, LKS), hunting games (Lord of Apocalypse and Ragnorak), fighters (Blazblue, Mortal Kombat, Street Fighter, and UMvsC), FPSs (Resistance, KZ, Bioshock, Dust 514, CoD), and visual novels (Chunsoft's two games) for a system that hasn't even launched yet. It's far from bad.
Yes, the Vita has a library spanning many genres. But so does the 3DS, and unlike those for Vita, they are big name games (compare DJ Max Technika with Theatrhythm: Final Fantasy, or LBP with a new canon Mario, and more (including fighters like Tekken and Smash Bros). Even Sony's Uncharted, Modnation, KZ, and Resistance games are most likely from other developers, and not the same ones that did the console games (just like what happened with Sony's PSP games).[QUOTE="minh800"][QUOTE="Cherokee_Jack"]
Ouch...it's not that bad.
Willy105
I fail to see how its bad at all. There's a decent amount of announced rhythm games (DJ Max Technika and Lumines), platformers (LBP and Sound Shapes), racers (Ridge Racer and Modnation), action-adventure games (Gravity Rush, Golden Abyss, and AC), RPGs (Tales, Ys, FF, Persona, LKS), hunting games (Lord of Apocalypse and Ragnorak), fighters (Blazblue, Mortal Kombat, Street Fighter, and UMvsC), FPSs (Resistance, KZ, Bioshock, Dust 514, CoD), and visual novels (Chunsoft's two games) for a system that hasn't even launched yet. It's far from bad.
Yes, the Vita has a library spanning many genres. But so does the 3DS, and unlike those for Vita, they are big name games (compare DJ Max Technika with Theatrhythm: Final Fantasy, or LBP with a new canon Mario, and more (including fighters like Tekken and Smash Bros). Even Sony's Uncharted, Modnation, KZ, and Resistance games are most likely from other developers, and not the same ones that did the console games (just like what happened with Sony's PSP games).Irrelevant. First of all, we were talking about the quality of the library not whether or not the systems has entries in milked, I'm sorry, big name franchises. And which do you honestly think will be the better rhythm game? DJ Max or Theatrhythm? Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat aren't big names? Final Fantasy Tales, and Bioshock aren't big names? Luigi's Mansion 2 isn't from the same developers that did the first, MK7 isn't from the same developer as the DS version, so what's your point? If Golden Abyss is a quality game, does it matter whom it came from?
Yes, the Vita has a library spanning many genres. But so does the 3DS, and unlike those for Vita, they are big name games (compare DJ Max Technika with Theatrhythm: Final Fantasy, or LBP with a new canon Mario, and more (including fighters like Tekken and Smash Bros). Even Sony's Uncharted, Modnation, KZ, and Resistance games are most likely from other developers, and not the same ones that did the console games (just like what happened with Sony's PSP games).[QUOTE="Willy105"][QUOTE="minh800"]
I fail to see how its bad at all. There's a decent amount of announced rhythm games (DJ Max Technika and Lumines), platformers (LBP and Sound Shapes), racers (Ridge Racer and Modnation), action-adventure games (Gravity Rush, Golden Abyss, and AC), RPGs (Tales, Ys, FF, Persona, LKS), hunting games (Lord of Apocalypse and Ragnorak), fighters (Blazblue, Mortal Kombat, Street Fighter, and UMvsC), FPSs (Resistance, KZ, Bioshock, Dust 514, CoD), and visual novels (Chunsoft's two games) for a system that hasn't even launched yet. It's far from bad.
minh800
Irrelevant. First of all, we were talking about the quality of the library not whether or not the systems has entries in milked, I'm sorry, big name franchises. And which do you honestly think will be the better rhythm game? DJ Max or Theatrhythm? Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat aren't big names? Final Fantasy Tales, and Bioshock aren't big names? Luigi's Mansion 2 isn't from the same developers that did the first, MK7 isn't from the same developer as the DS version, so what's your point? If Golden Abyss is a quality game, does it matter whom it came from?
Sure it's relevant. For example, the PS1 had platformers, decent ones too, but they were not the ones everyone wanted to play and the ones everyone was talking about.
Also, you are incorrect with a few claims. MK7 has the same developer as MKDS (and MKWii): Nintendo EAD Software Development Group 1. You may be referring to Retro Studios also being attached to the project, but as an addition, not a replacement.
Golden Abyss can be a quality game, but would it be as good as a Naughty Dog game? A Mario game without Miyamoto, essentially. Sure, Mario Land was a great game, but if the competition had it's big name games also be made by the same people (instead of being passed to a B-team while the A-team works on 'big boy consoles'), they would seem of much higher value and more likely to be worth it.
While Bend Studios is making Uncharted GA, the same team that did SMG2 is doing 3D Land. If first parties are doing this, then what is to say of the rest of the library?
[QUOTE="minh800"]
[QUOTE="Willy105"] Yes, the Vita has a library spanning many genres. But so does the 3DS, and unlike those for Vita, they are big name games (compare DJ Max Technika with Theatrhythm: Final Fantasy, or LBP with a new canon Mario, and more (including fighters like Tekken and Smash Bros). Even Sony's Uncharted, Modnation, KZ, and Resistance games are most likely from other developers, and not the same ones that did the console games (just like what happened with Sony's PSP games).Willy105
Irrelevant. First of all, we were talking about the quality of the library not whether or not the systems has entries in milked, I'm sorry, big name franchises. And which do you honestly think will be the better rhythm game? DJ Max or Theatrhythm? Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat aren't big names? Final Fantasy Tales, and Bioshock aren't big names? Luigi's Mansion 2 isn't from the same developers that did the first, MK7 isn't from the same developer as the DS version, so what's your point? If Golden Abyss is a quality game, does it matter whom it came from?
Sure it's relevant. For example, the PS1 had platformers, decent ones too, but they were not the ones everyone wanted to play and the ones everyone was talking about.
Also, you are incorrect with a few claims. MK7 has the same developer as MKDS (and MKWii): Nintendo EAD Software Development Group 1. You may be referring to Retro Studios also being attached to the project, but as an addition, not a replacement.
Golden Abyss can be a quality game, but would it be as good as a Naughty Dog game? A Mario game without Miyamoto, essentially. Sure, Mario Land was a great game, but if the competition had it's big name games also be made by the same people (instead of being passed to a B-team while the A-team works on 'big boy consoles'), they would seem of much higher value and more likely to be worth it.
While Bend Studios is making Uncharted GA, the same team that did SMG2 is doing 3D Land. If first parties are doing this, then what is to say of the rest of the library?
Haha, who cares? It still had good/great platformers which is all that matters. We were NEVER discussing how many milked (read: big named) games each system had which is why what you said was COMPLETELY irrelevant.
Fine, co-devs, whatever - they are still developing tracks for the game. How about this: Super Circuit's developer was Intelligent not Nintendo EAD 1. And you only mentioned one incorrection. If you're going to say that I'm incorrect on a few claims (which implies more than one) then please point them out.
Does it matter? Will MK7 be as good as MK on the DS? Is MKWii as good as MKDS? No. Is NSMB as good as previous 2D Mario games (here's a hint: no!). Is Radiant Dawn as good as Path of Radiance? No. Is Brawl as good as Melee? No. Is Spirit Tracks as good as Minish Cap? No. Who's developing it does matter but in NO way does it mean the same developers will make better games than the outsourced devs. Case and point: handheld Zelda games. Capcom's Zelda titles pretty much blew away the craptastic titles known as Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks. Wow, you're calling Bend a B-team? They're far from it. They have a great track record with TPSs.
I already showed you how Nintendo does the SAME thing with their own first party games. Everyone does it. It's nothing new. To criticize Sony for doing an industry norm is ridiculous and plain bias.
[QUOTE="Willy105"]
[QUOTE="minh800"]
Irrelevant. First of all, we were talking about the quality of the library not whether or not the systems has entries in milked, I'm sorry, big name franchises. And which do you honestly think will be the better rhythm game? DJ Max or Theatrhythm? Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat aren't big names? Final Fantasy Tales, and Bioshock aren't big names? Luigi's Mansion 2 isn't from the same developers that did the first, MK7 isn't from the same developer as the DS version, so what's your point? If Golden Abyss is a quality game, does it matter whom it came from?
minh800
Sure it's relevant. For example, the PS1 had platformers, decent ones too, but they were not the ones everyone wanted to play and the ones everyone was talking about.
Also, you are incorrect with a few claims. MK7 has the same developer as MKDS (and MKWii): Nintendo EAD Software Development Group 1. You may be referring to Retro Studios also being attached to the project, but as an addition, not a replacement.
Golden Abyss can be a quality game, but would it be as good as a Naughty Dog game? A Mario game without Miyamoto, essentially. Sure, Mario Land was a great game, but if the competition had it's big name games also be made by the same people (instead of being passed to a B-team while the A-team works on 'big boy consoles'), they would seem of much higher value and more likely to be worth it.
While Bend Studios is making Uncharted GA, the same team that did SMG2 is doing 3D Land. If first parties are doing this, then what is to say of the rest of the library?
Haha, who cares? It still had good/great platformers which is all that matters. We were NEVER discussing how many milked (read: big named) games each system had which is why what you said was COMPLETELY irrelevant.
Fine, co-devs, whatever - they are still developing tracks for the game. How about this: Super Circuit's developer was Intelligent not Nintendo EAD 1. And you only mentioned one incorrection. If you're going to say that I'm incorrect on a few claims (which implies more than one) then please point them out.
Does it matter? Will MK7 be as good as MK on the DS? Is MKWii as good as MKDS? No. Is NSMB as good as previous 2D Mario games (here's a hint: no!). Is Radiant Dawn as good as Path of Radiance? No. Is Brawl as good as Melee? No. Is Spirit Tracks as good as Minish Cap? No. Who's developing it does matter but in NO way does it mean the same developers will make better games than the outsourced devs. Case and point: handheld Zelda games. Capcom's Zelda titles pretty much blew away the craptastic titles known as Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks. Wow, you're calling Bend a B-team? They're far from it. They have a great track record with TPSs.
I already showed you how Nintendo does the SAME thing with their own first party games. Everyone does it. It's nothing new. To criticize Sony for doing an industry norm is ridiculous and plain bias.
Nice effort, but I'm afraid it is ineffective. Telling me your idea of saying big name games are the same as milked ones was but your first mistake. It's a ridiculous notion in itself.
Your second mistake: saying we were never discussing big name games, and then saying it's why I said it was completely irrelevant, which is wrong in both fronts. We were discussing big name games (as seen four posts above this one), and I was the one saying it was relevant (as seen two posts above, with you yourself saying it was irrelevant three posts above).
So there, you wanted mistakes corrected, and you got it.
Anyway, yes, Intelligent Systems developed Super Circuit. And? A 10 year old example is pushing it, especially when we are talking about consoles coming out this year.
Although the same teams can do ups and downs per installment, you also have to point out that Brawl was better than Melee (yes it was, the world don't stop for Melee leftovers), Spirit Tracks was better than Phantom Hourglass, Mario Kart DS was better than Double Dash, SMG2 was better than SMG1 (depending which type of overworld you prefer), TP was better than Wind Waker (despite many having nostalgic feelings for the story and art of the latter), Days of Ruin was better than Dual Strike, and many more pointless examples (another mistake: you compared Spirit Tracks with Minish Cap, which was done by Capcom). Just because sometimes a sequel isn't as good as the pevious one, it's just as likely (read: much more likely, there's a reason fans freak out if this happens) it will be better.
And, despite mixed feelings for the Zelda DS games, they were innovative and set a control standard for touch based games involving moving a character around a world.Sure, to some it's annoying how they would rather release a remake at launch rather than have an outside team make a new game for them, but to others it means they care (or are hopelessly possesive).
If you say so. Its like watching a UFC bout between two little kids. It's a fight, but is it really a entertaining one?Aah, I'm just picking, don't want to hate on the portable gaming community. It's just that I don't really know anyone that I game with that actually spends time gaming on handhelds. I got rid of my DS and PSP. I figured If I had the spare time to game it would be done on my 360/PS3/Wii, and I don't commute, I'm usually driving, so that cancels the need to game while traveling.
[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
Not according to their definition. :o
mmmwksil
Sure they can. Beliefs can be wrong. Convictions can be wrong. Personal views can even be "wrong" in the sense that they are based on highly inaccurate information and faulty logic and reasoning.
Ex: "Imo, the earth is flat."
Opinions are views that are not necessarily dependant on fact or knowledge.
The opinion that the Earth is flat can never BE wrong. The idea can be proven false, but the opinion itself isn't wrong.
OMG the almighty opinions strike again!!!111!!!! :shock:
How often does this update? September 4th was a long time ago. :|
[QUOTE="minh800"]
[QUOTE="Willy105"]
Sure it's relevant. For example, the PS1 had platformers, decent ones too, but they were not the ones everyone wanted to play and the ones everyone was talking about.
Also, you are incorrect with a few claims. MK7 has the same developer as MKDS (and MKWii): Nintendo EAD Software Development Group 1. You may be referring to Retro Studios also being attached to the project, but as an addition, not a replacement.
Golden Abyss can be a quality game, but would it be as good as a Naughty Dog game? A Mario game without Miyamoto, essentially. Sure, Mario Land was a great game, but if the competition had it's big name games also be made by the same people (instead of being passed to a B-team while the A-team works on 'big boy consoles'), they would seem of much higher value and more likely to be worth it.
While Bend Studios is making Uncharted GA, the same team that did SMG2 is doing 3D Land. If first parties are doing this, then what is to say of the rest of the library?
Willy105
Haha, who cares? It still had good/great platformers which is all that matters. We were NEVER discussing how many milked (read: big named) games each system had which is why what you said was COMPLETELY irrelevant.
Fine, co-devs, whatever - they are still developing tracks for the game. How about this: Super Circuit's developer was Intelligent not Nintendo EAD 1. And you only mentioned one incorrection. If you're going to say that I'm incorrect on a few claims (which implies more than one) then please point them out.
Does it matter? Will MK7 be as good as MK on the DS? Is MKWii as good as MKDS? No. Is NSMB as good as previous 2D Mario games (here's a hint: no!). Is Radiant Dawn as good as Path of Radiance? No. Is Brawl as good as Melee? No. Is Spirit Tracks as good as Minish Cap? No. Who's developing it does matter but in NO way does it mean the same developers will make better games than the outsourced devs. Case and point: handheld Zelda games. Capcom's Zelda titles pretty much blew away the craptastic titles known as Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks. Wow, you're calling Bend a B-team? They're far from it. They have a great track record with TPSs.
I already showed you how Nintendo does the SAME thing with their own first party games. Everyone does it. It's nothing new. To criticize Sony for doing an industry norm is ridiculous and plain bias.
Nice effort, but I'm afraid it is ineffective. Telling me your idea of saying big name games are the same as milked ones was but your first mistake. It's a ridiculous notion in itself.
Your second mistake: saying we were never discussing big name games, and then saying it's why I said it was completely irrelevant, which is wrong in both fronts. We were discussing big name games (as seen four posts above this one), and I was the one saying it was relevant (as seen two posts above, with you yourself saying it was irrelevant three posts above).
So there, you wanted mistakes corrected, and you got it.
Anyway, yes, Intelligent Systems developed Super Circuit. And? A 10 year old example is pushing it, especially when we are talking about consoles coming out this year.
Although the same teams can do ups and downs per installment, you also have to point out that Brawl was better than Melee (yes it was, the world don't stop for Melee leftovers), Spirit Tracks was better than Phantom Hourglass, Mario Kart DS was better than Double Dash, SMG2 was better than SMG1 (depending which type of overworld you prefer), TP was better than Wind Waker (despite many having nostalgic feelings for the story and art of the latter), Days of Ruin was better than Dual Strike, and many more pointless examples (another mistake: you compared Spirit Tracks with Minish Cap, which was done by Capcom). Just because sometimes a sequel isn't as good as the pevious one, it's just as likely (read: much more likely, there's a reason fans freak out if this happens) it will be better.
And, despite mixed feelings for the Zelda DS games, they were innovative and set a control standard for touch based games involving moving a character around a world.Sure, to some it's annoying how they would rather release a remake at launch rather than have an outside team make a new game for them, but to others it means they care (or are hopelessly possesive).
Haha, really now? You're telling me that having the words "Final Fantasy" to sell a rhythm game doesn't make it milking? You're calling that a "big name" (which you did, I can quote you on that). Haha, stop kidding yourself. It is milking, it was always milking, and it will always be milking.
No, sir, you were talking about the LIBRARY pretty much calling it complete s*** by saying that you're better off buying an iPad. We were NOT discussing big named games. Just because you suddenly decided to bring up big named games AFTER I showed you that you were wrong in implying the library is terrible does not mean we were discussing big named games no matter how much you think we were.
Then we still have Luigi's Mansion 2. Face it, you're biased because this is an INDUSTRY STANDARD.
Brawl's jumping mechanics were poor, the characters - unbalanced, and what they added to the game (story mode and a level editor) sucked. Spirit Tracks was NOT better than Phantom Hourglass. It was way more tedious and boring, the last boss fight was a complete ripoff of TP's, and not even reviewers agree with you since the Metacritic score for ST is lower than PH. I compared ST with MC BECAUSE I wanted to show you that outsiders can make better games than the original developers. I would have thought you'd understand that after I said that Capcom's titles blew away the craptastic Nintendo Zelda games. Yikes.
Haha, really now? You're telling me that having the words "Final Fantasy" to sell a rhythm game doesn't make it milking? You're calling that a "big name" (which you did, I can quote you on that). Haha, stop kidding yourself. It is milking, it was always milking, and it will always be milking.
No, sir, you were talking about the LIBRARY pretty much calling it complete s*** by saying that you're better off buying an iPad. We were NOT discussing big named games. Just because you suddenly decided to bring up big named games AFTER I showed you that you were wrong in implying the library is terrible does not mean we were discussing big named games no matter how much you think we were.
Then we still have Luigi's Mansion 2. Face it, you're biased because this is an INDUSTRY STANDARD.
Brawl's jumping mechanics were poor, the characters - unbalanced, and what they added to the game (story mode and a level editor) sucked. Spirit Tracks was NOT better than Phantom Hourglass. It was way more tedious and boring, the last boss fight was a complete ripoff of TP's, and not even reviewers agree with you since the Metacritic score for ST is lower than PH. I compared ST with MC BECAUSE I wanted to show you that outsiders can make better games than the original developers. I would have thought you'd understand that after I said that Capcom's titles blew away the craptastic Nintendo Zelda games. Yikes.
minh800
Yes, I am calling Final Fantasy a big name. There is no reason to call it otherwise. However, it's obviously not a Final Fantasy RPG, just as Mario Tennis isn't a Mario platformer. There hasn't been a new Mario Tennis in two generations, and before this previous one, Mario platformers came only once each generation. I don't consider that milking. I do consider Madden and what happened to Guitar Hero to be milkage, though.
If you think the iOS library is bad, then I can see why would be mad. But I don't. I just said the iPad is much more appealing than the Vita right now, especially because of cheaper games (which both the 3DS and Vita are failing at).
It's not an industry standard. Having a Start screen is an industry standard, but outsourcing games is not. If it was an industry standard, I wouldn't be able to name examples that contradict it.
Also, guh? Everything you said about Brawl is demonstrably wrong. Unlike Melee, Brawl had a jumping mechanic that wasn't a joke, the character's were much more balanced than they were before, and despite your feelings for the Story Mode and Level Editor, they were superior to what Melee had. Also, remember that MC's scores have time as a variable: If PH and ST came out at the same time, which one would be better? It would be obvious. A game that came out years after the original having a lower score than the original doesn't mean it was inferior (unless it is outright said so), it just means it wasn't as new.
Sure, outsiders can make better games than original developers, but time has shown demonstrably (using your logic) that it's not the industry standard.
[QUOTE="minh800"]
Haha, really now? You're telling me that having the words "Final Fantasy" to sell a rhythm game doesn't make it milking? You're calling that a "big name" (which you did, I can quote you on that). Haha, stop kidding yourself. It is milking, it was always milking, and it will always be milking.
No, sir, you were talking about the LIBRARY pretty much calling it complete s*** by saying that you're better off buying an iPad. We were NOT discussing big named games. Just because you suddenly decided to bring up big named games AFTER I showed you that you were wrong in implying the library is terrible does not mean we were discussing big named games no matter how much you think we were.
Then we still have Luigi's Mansion 2. Face it, you're biased because this is an INDUSTRY STANDARD.
Brawl's jumping mechanics were poor, the characters - unbalanced, and what they added to the game (story mode and a level editor) sucked. Spirit Tracks was NOT better than Phantom Hourglass. It was way more tedious and boring, the last boss fight was a complete ripoff of TP's, and not even reviewers agree with you since the Metacritic score for ST is lower than PH. I compared ST with MC BECAUSE I wanted to show you that outsiders can make better games than the original developers. I would have thought you'd understand that after I said that Capcom's titles blew away the craptastic Nintendo Zelda games. Yikes.
Willy105
Yes, I am calling Final Fantasy a big name. There is no reason to call it otherwise. However, it's obviously not a Final Fantasy RPG, just as Mario Tennis isn't a Mario platformer. There hasn't been a new Mario Tennis in two generations, and before this previous one, Mario platformers came only once each generation. I don't consider that milking. I do consider Madden and what happened to Guitar Hero to be milkage, though.
If you think the iOS library is bad, then I can see why would be mad. But I don't. I just said the iPad is much more appealing than the Vita right now, especially because of cheaper games (which both the 3DS and Vita are failing at).
It's not an industry standard. Having a Start screen is an industry standard, but outsourcing games is not. If it was an industry standard, I wouldn't be able to name examples that contradict it.
Also, guh? Everything you said about Brawl is demonstrably wrong. Unlike Melee, Brawl had a jumping mechanic that wasn't a joke, the character's were much more balanced than they were before, and despite your feelings for the Story Mode and Level Editor, they were superior to what Melee had. Also, remember that MC's scores have time as a variable: If PH and ST came out at the same time, which one would be better? It would be obvious. A game that came out years after the original having a lower score than the original doesn't mean it was inferior (unless it is outright said so), it just means it wasn't as new.
Sure, outsiders can make better games than original developers, but time has shown demonstrably (using your logic) that it's not the industry standard.
Haha, it's milking and there's NO way around that. Square is simply using the FF name and universe to SELL a Rhythm game just like Nintendo used the Mario name to SELL that abomination known as DDR - it is milking.
LOL. No, you were implying about the quality of the libraries - you made zero mention about cheaper games, and if you did then you should probably take a closer look at the Vita - iOS games are coming to it, and many expect most iOS games to be made available on PSN.
Fine then, let's call it an industry norm instead. It is normal for a company to outsource a game for various reasons. Square outsourced their FF IP, Namco outsourced their Tales IP and RR IP, Capcom outsourced their DMC IP, Falcom outsourced the Ys IP, Nintendo outsourced their Zelda IP. Dude, it's a norm, get over it.
From IGN: A big discussion point amongst IGN staff, as well as readers, is the balance of characters. Some, like Meta Knight, seem incredibly overpowered compared to others. Sakurai noted in his discussion with Iwata that in the past he has done all of the balancing personally. He plans to involve his staff much more for these future installments. Yeah, even the director had a problem with the character balance. Hahahahahaha. Did you even PLAY Melee? The Story Mode and Level Editor in Brawl were superior to what Melee had? Melee didn't even have either! Haha, so when game critics agree that PH is the superior game, you don't concede? ST was a boring, tedious mess with trains. Woohoo.
It's a norm to outsource the IPs. Outsourced developers can make better games than the original developers (as seen with Capcom's Zelda games). You are clearly biased.
Haha, really now? You're telling me that having the words "Final Fantasy" to sell a rhythm game doesn't make it milking? You're calling that a "big name" (which you did, I can quote you on that). Haha, stop kidding yourself. It is milking, it was always milking, and it will always be milking.
minh800
Well, to be fair, minh, who wouldn't want to play a rhythm game revolving around the music of the Final Fantasy series? It is home to some of the greatest tunes in VG history, the majority of which composed by the genius Uematsu. :P
I know I'll be picking that baby up on release.
[QUOTE="minh800"]
Haha, really now? You're telling me that having the words "Final Fantasy" to sell a rhythm game doesn't make it milking? You're calling that a "big name" (which you did, I can quote you on that). Haha, stop kidding yourself. It is milking, it was always milking, and it will always be milking.
mmmwksil
Well, to be fair, minh, who wouldn't want to play a rhythm game revolving around the music of the Final Fantasy series? It is home to some of the greatest tunes in VG history, the majority of which composed by the genius Uematsu. :P
I know I'll be picking that baby up on release.
Haha, well, FF does have some of the best music out there (the Persona games and Ys games are also up there). Have you heard some tracks from Type-0? Ishimoto's really talented.
[QUOTE="mmmwksil"]
[QUOTE="minh800"]
Haha, really now? You're telling me that having the words "Final Fantasy" to sell a rhythm game doesn't make it milking? You're calling that a "big name" (which you did, I can quote you on that). Haha, stop kidding yourself. It is milking, it was always milking, and it will always be milking.
minh800
Well, to be fair, minh, who wouldn't want to play a rhythm game revolving around the music of the Final Fantasy series? It is home to some of the greatest tunes in VG history, the majority of which composed by the genius Uematsu. :P
I know I'll be picking that baby up on release.
Haha, well, FF does have some of the best music out there (the Persona games and Ys games are also up there). Have you heard some tracks from Type-0? Ishimoto's really talented.
No can do, minh. I have a strcit music policy: only listen to it while I play the game. Otherwise the music loses its impact for me :P
Haha, it's milking and there's NO way around that. Square is simply using the FF name and universe to SELL a Rhythm game just like Nintendo used the Mario name to SELL that abomination known as DDR - it is milking.
LOL. No, you were implying about the quality of the libraries - you made zero mention about cheaper games, and if you did then you should probably take a closer look at the Vita - iOS games are coming to it, and many expect most iOS games to be made available on PSN.
Fine then, let's call it an industry norm instead. It is normal for a company to outsource a game for various reasons. Square outsourced their FF IP, Namco outsourced their Tales IP and RR IP, Capcom outsourced their DMC IP, Falcom outsourced the Ys IP, Nintendo outsourced their Zelda IP. Dude, it's a norm, get over it.
From IGN: A big discussion point amongst IGN staff, as well as readers, is the balance of characters. Some, like Meta Knight, seem incredibly overpowered compared to others. Sakurai noted in his discussion with Iwata that in the past he has done all of the balancing personally. He plans to involve his staff much more for these future installments. Yeah, even the director had a problem with the character balance. Hahahahahaha. Did you even PLAY Melee? The Story Mode and Level Editor in Brawl were superior to what Melee had? Melee didn't even have either! Haha, so when game critics agree that PH is the superior game, you don't concede? ST was a boring, tedious mess with trains. Woohoo.
It's a norm to outsource the IPs. Outsourced developers can make better games than the original developers (as seen with Capcom's Zelda games). You are clearly biased.
minh800
Biased towards what exactly? The iOS? Nintendo? Cheaper games?
Milking isn't even a real term outside of that used to describe getting milk from a mammary gland. It can be given any definition, and I choose to define it by "making more of the same to take advantage of all it's worth, while it still has it". Obviously, Luigi's Mansion 2 is not milkage, since being a sequel to a game that came out a decade ago really shows how little Nintendo has taken advantage of the series. TheatrRhythm is a new series (assuming it becomes a series), so saying it is milked just because it uses the Final Fantasy name is just wrong.
Also, remember just because we are talking about price doesn't mean we are no longer talking about quality. A good $5 game is indeed more valuable than a slightly better $40 one. Sure, some games that appeared on the iOS might be available on the Vita, but it would be pointless if you already had an iPhone. Are you going to carry two hardware devices at all times (one a phone, the other a game system), when one device can do two things while the other, bigger device can only do one? Of course not; even if you can tolarate it, it won't be convenient to you.
Also, sorry I had to correct you with industry standard thing. No hard feelings, right?
Anyway, for the Smash Bros. thing, I will quote Game Informer: "finely tuned balance, core fighting mechanics, and local multiplayer modes" when referring to Smash Bros. Brawl. Where does Sakurai said he thought Brawl was unbalanced? All you say he said was that he wanted some more help for the next game, so that he doesn't do it alone. It doesn't mean he thought he did a bad job with it.
Also, yes, I did play Melee, for many years. Yes, there was no level editor (which is a plus for Brawl, not Melee), and there was indeed a Story Mode (it's the Adventure Mode). Also, if critics did concede that ST was worse than PH, I would take their word for it, since I did not like PH. But when they say that it fixed some of the notabke problems of the original, then obviously that is not the case (even if it's not big enough an upgrade to award it an equal score to PH, since it came out like two years later).
And yes, people have outsourced games before, but to say that it is better or the same as one made from the original guys, or if it doesn't in some way say something about the effort being given to a platform, then you are obviously damage controlling.
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