True Power of Cell

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sulimanhustler

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#1 sulimanhustler
Member since 2007 • 108 Posts

The Cell Broadband Engine in a simple analysis the Cell processor can be split into four components: external input and output structures, the main processor called the Power Processing Element (PPE) SMT eight fully-functional co-processors called the Synergistic Processing Elements or SPEs and a specialised high-bandwidth circular data bus connecting the PPE, input/output elements and the SPEs, called the Element Interconnect Bus or EIB.

The poweris achieved the high performance needed for mathematically intensive tasks, such as decoding/encoding MPEG streams, generating or transforming three dimensional data, or undertaking Fourier analysis of data, the Cell processor simply marries the SPEs and the PPE via the EIB to give both access to main memory or other external data storage. The PPE which is capable of running a conventional operating system has control over the SPEs and can start, stop, interrupt and schedule processes running on the SPEs. To this end the PPE has additional instructions relating to control of the SPEs. Despite having Turing complete architectures the SPEs are not fully autonomous and require the PPE to initiate them before they can do any useful work. Most of the "horsepower" of the system comes from the synergistic processing elements.

The PPE and bus architecture includes various modes of operation giving different levels of memory protection allowing areas of memory to be protected from access by specific processes running on the SPEs or PPE.

Both the PPE and SPE are RISC architectures with a fixed-width 32-bit instruction format. The PPE contains a 64-bit general purpose register set (GPR), a 64-bit floating point register set (FPR), and a 128-bit Altivec register set. The SPE contains 128-bit registers only. These can be used for scalar data types ranging from 8-bits to 128-bits in size or for SIMD computations on a variety of integer and floating point formats. System memory addresses for both the PPE and SPE are expressed as 64-bit values for a theoretic address range of 264 bytes. In practice, not all of these bits are implemented in hardware; the address space is extremely large nevertheless. Local store addresses internal to the SPU processor are expressed as a 32-bit word. In documentation relating to Cell a word is always taken to mean 32 bits, a doubleword means 64 bits, and a quadword means 128 bits.DMA MMU, and bus interface). An SPE is a RISC processor with 128-bit SIMD organization for single and double precision instructions. With the current generation of the Cell, each SPE contains a 256 KiB instruction and data local memory area (called "local store") which is visible to the PPE and can be addressed directly by software. Each SPE can support up to 4 GB of local store memory. The local store does not operate like a conventional CPU cache since it is neither transparent to software nor does it contain hardware structures that predict which data to load. The SPEs contain a 128 × 128 register file and measure 14.5 mm² on a 90 nm process. An SPE can operate on 16 8-bit integers, 8 16-bit integers, 4 32-bit integers, or 4 single precision floating-point numbers in a single clock cycle. It can also do a memory operation in the same clock cycle. Note that the SPU processor can not directly access system memory; the 64-bit memory addresses formed by the SPU must be passed from the SPU processor to the SPE memory flow controller (MFC) to set up a DMA operation within the system address space.set-top box might load programs for reading a DVD, video and audio decoding, and display, and the data would be passed off from SPE to SPE until finally ending up on the TV. Another possibility is to partition the input data set and have several SPEs performing the same kind of operation in parallel. At 3.2 GHz, each SPU gives a theoretical 25.6 GFLOPS of single precision performance.personal computer, the relatively high overall floating point performance of a Cell processor seemingly dwarfs the abilities of the SIMD unit in desktop CPUs like the Pentium 4 and the Athlon 64. However, comparing only floating point abilities of a system is a one-dimensional and application-specific metric. Unlike a Cell processor, such desktop CPUs are more suited to the general purpose software usually run on personal computers. In addition to executing multiple instructions per clock, processors from Intel and AMD feature branch predictors The Cell is designed to compensate for this with compiler assistance, in which prepare-to-branch instructions are created. For double-precision, as used in personal computers, Cell performance drops by an order of magnitude, but still reaches 14 GFLOPS.

 

Each SPE is composed of a "Synergistic Processing Unit", SPU, and a "Memory Flow Controller", MFC (

In one typical usage scenario, the system will load the SPEs with small programs chaining the SPEs together to handle each step in a complex operation. For instance, a

Compared to a modern

What does this all mean. The cell is made for multimedia the Spe's can be used for alot.

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Stabby2486

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#2 Stabby2486
Member since 2006 • 6688 Posts

Why the heck is the text all black?

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Hammerofjustice

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#3 Hammerofjustice
Member since 2006 • 2685 Posts
nice
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sulimanhustler

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#4 sulimanhustler
Member since 2007 • 108 Posts
 

The Cell Broadband Engine in a simple analysis the Cell processor can be split into four components: external input and output structures, the main processor called the Power Processing Element (PPE) SMT eight fully-functional co-processors called the Synergistic Processing Elements or SPEs and a specialised high-bandwidth circular data bus connecting the PPE, input/output elements and the SPEs, called the Element Interconnect Bus or EIB.

The poweris achieved the high performance needed for mathematically intensive tasks, such as decoding/encoding MPEG streams, generating or transforming three dimensional data, or undertaking Fourier analysis of data, the Cell processor simply marries the SPEs and the PPE via the EIB to give both access to main memory or other external data storage. The PPE which is capable of running a conventional operating system has control over the SPEs and can start, stop, interrupt and schedule processes running on the SPEs. To this end the PPE has additional instructions relating to control of the SPEs. Despite having Turing complete architectures the SPEs are not fully autonomous and require the PPE to initiate them before they can do any useful work. Most of the "horsepower" of the system comes from the synergistic processing elements.

The PPE and bus architecture includes various modes of operation giving different levels of memory protection allowing areas of memory to be protected from access by specific processes running on the SPEs or PPE.

Both the PPE and SPE are RISC architectures with a fixed-width 32-bit instruction format. The PPE contains a 64-bit general purpose register set (GPR), a 64-bit floating point register set (FPR), and a 128-bit Altivec register set. The SPE contains 128-bit registers only. These can be used for scalar data types ranging from 8-bits to 128-bits in size or for SIMD computations on a variety of integer and floating point formats. System memory addresses for both the PPE and SPE are expressed as 64-bit values for a theoretic address range of 264 bytes. In practice, not all of these bits are implemented in hardware; the address space is extremely large nevertheless. Local store addresses internal to the SPU processor are expressed as a 32-bit word. In documentation relating to Cell a word is always taken to mean 32 bits, a doubleword means 64 bits, and a quadword means 128 bits.DMA MMU, and bus interface). An SPE is a RISC processor with 128-bit SIMD organization for single and double precision instructions. With the current generation of the Cell, each SPE contains a 256 KiB instruction and data local memory area (called "local store") which is visible to the PPE and can be addressed directly by software. Each SPE can support up to 4 GB of local store memory. The local store does not operate like a conventional CPU cache since it is neither transparent to software nor does it contain hardware structures that predict which data to load. The SPEs contain a 128 × 128 register file and measure 14.5 mm² on a 90 nm process. An SPE can operate on 16 8-bit integers, 8 16-bit integers, 4 32-bit integers, or 4 single precision floating-point numbers in a single clock cycle. It can also do a memory operation in the same clock cycle. Note that the SPU processor can not directly access system memory; the 64-bit memory addresses formed by the SPU must be passed from the SPU processor to the SPE memory flow controller (MFC) to set up a DMA operation within the system address space.set-top box might load programs for reading a DVD, video and audio decoding, and display, and the data would be passed off from SPE to SPE until finally ending up on the TV. Another possibility is to partition the input data set and have several SPEs performing the same kind of operation in parallel. At 3.2 GHz, each SPU gives a theoretical 25.6 GFLOPS of single precision performance.personal computer, the relatively high overall floating point performance of a Cell processor seemingly dwarfs the abilities of the SIMD unit in desktop CPUs like the Pentium 4 and the Athlon 64. However, comparing only floating point abilities of a system is a one-dimensional and application-specific metric. Unlike a Cell processor, such desktop CPUs are more suited to the general purpose software usually run on personal computers. In addition to executing multiple instructions per clock, processors from Intel and AMD feature branch predictors The Cell is designed to compensate for this with compiler assistance, in which prepare-to-branch instructions are created. For double-precision, as used in personal computers, Cell performance drops by an order of magnitude, but still reaches 14 GFLOPS.

 

Each SPE is composed of a "Synergistic Processing Unit", SPU, and a "Memory Flow Controller", MFC (

In one typical usage scenario, the system will load the SPEs with small programs chaining the SPEs together to handle each step in a complex operation. For instance, a

Compared to a modern

What does this all mean. The cell is made for multimedia the Spe's can be used for alot.

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Bansheesdie

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#5 Bansheesdie
Member since 2004 • 15057 Posts
I'm not going blind attempting to read that, summary with regular color text.
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palaric8

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#6 palaric8
Member since 2006 • 2246 Posts
english please
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SkateGame

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#7 SkateGame
Member since 2005 • 893 Posts
Since I don't understand all that tech crap... I'll just say "cool. I never knew that." How's that?
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-KinGz-

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#8 -KinGz-
Member since 2006 • 5232 Posts
OH NOEZZ WE NEED GOHAN! IT's Teh CeLL KAMEHAMEHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.
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Copy_Snake

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#9 Copy_Snake
Member since 2006 • 335 Posts
I'm sure no one on GS can understand that.

I'm sure you don't even know what it is. Just copy & paste.
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#10 -KinGz-
Member since 2006 • 5232 Posts
His chi is way too high T.T
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sulimanhustler

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#11 sulimanhustler
Member since 2007 • 108 Posts
No I know tecnology big expert. I know the power of the 360 wii and PS3. I just know because......
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palaric8

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#12 palaric8
Member since 2006 • 2246 Posts
cool. I never knew that lol
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Bansheesdie

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#13 Bansheesdie
Member since 2004 • 15057 Posts
I'm sure no one on GS can understand that.

I'm sure you don't even know what it is. Just copy & paste.
Copy_Snake
Give it to someone in the PC boards, they'll know what it says.
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audioaxes

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#14 audioaxes
Member since 2004 • 1570 Posts
wow so you just copy/paste a write up on the cell architecture? this says absolutely nothing 
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Journey89

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#15 Journey89
Member since 2005 • 1743 Posts
the cell is more powerful. but you have to understand. PROGRAMMING. it depends on the devs. programming language style that will determine if they will use all that power.
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pop7934

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#16 pop7934
Member since 2006 • 651 Posts
No I know tecnology big expert. I know the power of the 360 wii and PS3. I just know because......sulimanhustler
So then you know that the cell doesn't really matter cause of the small ram right? I mean, you COULD run all these nice things with the cell, but with that little ram, it doesn't matter cause it'd looks like a picture, not a game, soooo, yup, that's all. IMHO of course.
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#17 Copy_Snake
Member since 2006 • 335 Posts
[QUOTE="Copy_Snake"]I'm sure no one on GS can understand that.

I'm sure you don't even know what it is. Just copy & paste.
Bansheesdie
Give it to someone in the PC boards, they'll know what it says.


I'm sorry. I ment no one in SW could.
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air0123

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#18 air0123
Member since 2006 • 1411 Posts
Please a cliff notes version.
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Tony_aaaa

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#19 Tony_aaaa
Member since 2007 • 475 Posts
english pleasepalaric8
OK it's an article about the Cell, it describes some of the chips shortcomings and strengths. It says nothing new. Towards the end it states that a "desktop" cpu is better for general computing tasks. (gaming?).
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#20 sulimanhustler
Member since 2007 • 108 Posts
No the power to make graphics better the ram the hardrive is a subsitute. The cell is better than intel core duo. Look the Spe's on the gPU and the graphics chip will increse the rates and frames. With all this power it can defeat the 360. But you people only care about games not power. POWERRRRRRRR
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da1on2

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#21 da1on2
Member since 2006 • 4885 Posts
umm... no habla espanol?
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Journey89

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#22 Journey89
Member since 2005 • 1743 Posts
umm... no hablo espanol?da1on2
fixed
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Hammerofjustice

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#23 Hammerofjustice
Member since 2006 • 2685 Posts
No the power to make graphics better the ram the hardrive is a subsitute. The cell is better than intel core duo. Look the Spe's on the gPU and the graphics chip will increse the rates and frames. With all this power it can defeat the 360. But you people only care about games not power. POWERRRRRRRRsulimanhustler


:lol:
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#24 Dreams-Visions
Member since 2006 • 26578 Posts
more posts on the Cell's "Hidden powaaz"? will Cows ever give these stupid delusions up? :roll:
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Tony_aaaa

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#25 Tony_aaaa
Member since 2007 • 475 Posts
No the power to make graphics better the ram the hardrive is a subsitute. The cell is better than intel core duo. Look the Spe's on the gPU and the graphics chip will increse the rates and frames. With all this power it can defeat the 360. But you people only care about games not power. POWERRRRRRRRsulimanhustler
The Cell is most certainly NOT better than a Core Duo at any gaming or home computing task. Unless cheaper=better. That's like stating a 50 cent razor blade makes a better kitchen knife than Henkels because a razor blade is so sharp. There's alot to a good CPU that Cell doesn't have. Some of it was even covered in the article.
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#26 highlander0659
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[QUOTE="sulimanhustler"]No the power to make graphics better the ram the hardrive is a subsitute. The cell is better than intel core duo. Look the Spe's on the gPU and the graphics chip will increse the rates and frames. With all this power it can defeat the 360. But you people only care about games not power. POWERRRRRRRRTony_aaaa
The Cell is most certainly NOT better than a Core Duo at any gaming or home computing task. Unless cheaper=better. That's like stating a 50 cent razor blade makes a better kitchen knife than Henkels because a razor blade is so sharp. There's alot to a good CPU that Cell doesn't have. Some of it was even covered in the article.

Don't be foolish. Theres not a personal computer on the planet that can touch Cell in any area. Be it memory management, parallel computing, downright speed, whatever. Even the new, highly generic and underwhelming multi-core Intel and AMD processors pale in comparison to Cells capabilities. Now that the final devkits are out and Cell / RSX are working through the incredibly fast and efficient FlexIO from Rambus those PC's they are using, no matter what they are, aren't going to be able to duplicate what a PS3 will be capable of. This is why I've been saying for awhile that the PS3 will be able to keep pace with the PC's for years to come without problem. Its just superior in speed, precision, cycle losses being minimized, mathematic processing, physics, geometry, shaders, whatever. Maybe in 4 or 5 years a PC will exist that will make the PS3 port have to be downgraded in a way, but until then its highly doubtful. When you add the system bandwidth, memory bandwidth, SPE local storage cycles being so incredibly low per miss, the highly parallized structure of Cell itself, the RSX's shader capabilities, Cells shader capabilities and rendering capabilities, Blu-Ray and the standard HDD .... well .... lemme just put it this way. The games showcased for the PS3 right now probably aren't even really using 5% of the systems resources or potential. In general processing the PS3's CELL murders all PC processors..............if you have read IBM's official documentation............it clearly said that all SPEs could be tweaked to run general purpose applications when necessary. the PPE is general core and as sated by CRYTEK is much more efficient and powerful compared to both 360's XENON and dual core pc processors. powerpc 6 architecture is around 35% more powerful than power5......how do you expect it to outgun CELL.... Furthermore, the core 2 duo extreme is 20-40% more powerful than fx62................it is not even a match for CELL. for the benchmarks go to www.anandtech.com the itanium was beaten by CELL by a minimum margin of 10:1 in all server based applications it might take years for both intel and AMD to build something as powerful as the CELL wait we might have the priviledge to see CELL 2 if CELL becomes successful..........since the architecture is already unveiled we might be seeing a much refined CELL 2 with 100 general cores SPEs. the core 2 duo extreme is 20-40% more powerful than fx62................it is not even a match for CELL. for the benchmarks go to www.anandtech.com The itanium was beaten by CELL by a minimum margin of 10:1 in all server based applications it might take years for both intel and AMD to build something as powerful as the CELL wait we might have the priviledge to see CELL 2 if CELL becomes successful..........since the architecture is already unveiled we might be seeing a much refined CELL 2 with 100 general cores SPEs THE MOST ADVANCED CPU FOR YEARS TO COME IS THE CELL. NOTHING WILL TOUCH IT FOR AT LEAST FIVE YEARS BESIDES THE CELL2 OR SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES!!!!!!!!!! THE PS3's PROCESSOR IS THE CELL PROCESSOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THE PS3 IS BETTER THAN YOUR COMPUTER AS WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Tony_aaaa

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#27 Tony_aaaa
Member since 2007 • 475 Posts

[QUOTE="Tony_aaaa"][QUOTE="sulimanhustler"]No the power to make graphics better the ram the hardrive is a subsitute. The cell is better than intel core duo. Look the Spe's on the gPU and the graphics chip will increse the rates and frames. With all this power it can defeat the 360. But you people only care about games not power. POWERRRRRRRRhighlander0659
The Cell is most certainly NOT better than a Core Duo at any gaming or home computing task. Unless cheaper=better. That's like stating a 50 cent razor blade makes a better kitchen knife than Henkels because a razor blade is so sharp. There's alot to a good CPU that Cell doesn't have. Some of it was even covered in the article.

Don't be foolish. Theres not a personal computer on the planet that can touch Cell in any area. Be it memory management, parallel computing, downright speed, whatever. Even the new, highly generic and underwhelming multi-core Intel and AMD processors pale in comparison to Cells capabilities. Now that the final devkits are out and Cell / RSX are working through the incredibly fast and efficient FlexIO from Rambus those PC's they are using, no matter what they are, aren't going to be able to duplicate what a PS3 will be capable of. This is why I've been saying for awhile that the PS3 will be able to keep pace with the PC's for years to come without problem. Its just superior in speed, precision, cycle losses being minimized, mathematic processing, physics, geometry, shaders, whatever. Maybe in 4 or 5 years a PC will exist that will make the PS3 port have to be downgraded in a way, but until then its highly doubtful. When you add the system bandwidth, memory bandwidth, SPE local storage cycles being so incredibly low per miss, the highly parallized structure of Cell itself, the RSX's shader capabilities, Cells shader capabilities and rendering capabilities, Blu-Ray and the standard HDD .... well .... lemme just put it this way. The games showcased for the PS3 right now probably aren't even really using 5% of the systems resources or potential. In general processing the PS3's CELL murders all PC processors..............if you have read IBM's official documentation............it clearly said that all SPEs could be tweaked to run general purpose applications when necessary. the PPE is general core and as sated by CRYTEK is much more efficient and powerful compared to both 360's XENON and dual core pc processors. powerpc 6 architecture is around 35% more powerful than power5......how do you expect it to outgun CELL.... Furthermore, the core 2 duo extreme is 20-40% more powerful than fx62................it is not even a match for CELL. for the benchmarks go to www.anandtech.com the itanium was beaten by CELL by a minimum margin of 10:1 in all server based applications it might take years for both intel and AMD to build something as powerful as the CELL wait we might have the priviledge to see CELL 2 if CELL becomes successful..........since the architecture is already unveiled we might be seeing a much refined CELL 2 with 100 general cores SPEs. the core 2 duo extreme is 20-40% more powerful than fx62................it is not even a match for CELL. for the benchmarks go to www.anandtech.com The itanium was beaten by CELL by a minimum margin of 10:1 in all server based applications it might take years for both intel and AMD to build something as powerful as the CELL wait we might have the priviledge to see CELL 2 if CELL becomes successful..........since the architecture is already unveiled we might be seeing a much refined CELL 2 with 100 general cores SPEs THE MOST ADVANCED CPU FOR YEARS TO COME IS THE CELL. NOTHING WILL TOUCH IT FOR AT LEAST FIVE YEARS BESIDES THE CELL2 OR SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES!!!!!!!!!! THE PS3's PROCESSOR IS THE CELL PROCESSOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THE PS3 IS BETTER THAN YOUR COMPUTER AS WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You don't know what you are talking about. Yes, I've seen those sites, I'm not impressed. A crippled in-order processor that sucks at anything branchy. SPEs that have a puny 256k each and can't even access main memory. Cell NEEDS that super bandwidth to make up for its shortcomings. Cell is a MEDIA processor with a future in huge blade servers, not a general purpose CPU.  Part of the AnandTech Cell summary (the source you mentioned):

As a potential contender in the PC market, Cell has a very tall ladder to climb before even remotely appearing on the AMD/Intel radars. The biggest strength that the x86 market has is backwards compatibility, which is the main thing that has kept alternative ISAs out of the PC business. Regardless of how much hype is drummed up around Cell, the processor is not immune to the same laws of other contenders in the x86 market - a compatible ISA is a must. And as Intel’s Justin Rattner put it, “if there are good ideas in that architecture, PC architecture is very valuable and it will move to incorporate those ideas.” Once again, what’s most intriguing is the similarity, at a high level, of Intel’s far future multi-core designs to Cell today. The main difference is that while Intel’s Cell-like designs will be built on 32nm or smaller processes, Cell is being introduced at 90nm - meaning that Intel is envisioning many more complex cores on a single die than Cell. Intel can make that kind of migration to a Cell-like design because their microprocessors already have a very large user base. IBM, Sony and Toshiba can’t however - Cell must achieve a very large user base initially in order to be competitive down the road. Unfortunately, seeing a future for Cell far outside of Playstation 3 and Sony/Toshiba CE devices is difficult at best. The first thing you have to keep in mind is that Cell’s architecture is nothing revolutionary, it’s been done before.

Not a very flattering summary for the Cell "supercomputer"

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Tony_aaaa

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#28 Tony_aaaa
Member since 2007 • 475 Posts

Here's a link to a PS3 (Cell) benchmarked against a 1.6 Ghz G5 Mac:  http://www.geekpatrol.ca/2006/11/playstation-3-performance/  

It's a good indication of a real world benchmark as all the IBM,Sony, etc ones use code optimized for Cell (they certainly don't Show Cell running out-of-order branchy code). This uses code unoptomized for either platform. Note--- the SPEs aren't being utilized for this test, just the core. However, SPEs are most certainly inferior to real cores at general computing.

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genfuyung

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#29 genfuyung
Member since 2005 • 2189 Posts
seriously...i have no idea what most of that means
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#30 chubz256
Member since 2005 • 171 Posts
No the power to make graphics better the ram the hardrive is a subsitute. The cell is better than intel core duo. Look the Spe's on the gPU and the graphics chip will increse the rates and frames. With all this power it can defeat the 360. But you people only care about games not power. POWERRRRRRRRsulimanhustler
Wow, first, I think u can get in trouble for plagerism because u clearly copy&pasted that. And u are wrong in soo many ways on your statement. Sigh, okay, first off, the most important part of gaming machines are the graphics processors. Example: pc can have weaker cpu(lets say dual 2.4 GHZ) compared to Xenon or Cell, but if the pc has a Nvidia Geforce 8800, ya, of course the pc would pwn. Same thing goes here. Yes, Cell can be more powerful(well, that's a complicated arguement but I'm not there yet) but the 360's GPU pwns the crap out of RSX. Ya, 48 shader pipelines, 10mb eDRAM, unified shaders, and 256 GB/s internal bandwith on daughter chip for frame buffer all pwn RSX. The clear winner is the 360. As for the CPU, that's complicated. The Cell is basically a single core cpu with 8 hardware threads(yes, those SPEs are threads, not cores for all ignorance out there). Is an 8 threaded cpu single core really more powerful than Xenon(3 cores all with 2 threads)? Someone mentioned earlier, "We all know power means squat. PS2, anyone?" This makes sense. PS2 back then had a single core with a co-processor(SPE) and xbox cpu only had a single core. This doesn't mean that the PS2 cpu was better. We all knew from the start the xbox cpu kicked the ps2's in the balls. Hell, the emotion engine(ps2 cpu) was soo overhyped that they claimed that it could launch nukes around the world. So, I won't make any conclusions but Xenon can actually be more powerful or vise-versa. As for RAM, unified RAM(360) is better than discrete RAM(ps3). This is because in the 360 the cpu and gpu can access the total 512 megs of RAM any way possible(cpu can access more or gpu can access more). This causes max performance(alot like the max performance you get from 48 unified pipelines instead of seperated pipelines). So the RAM part actually wins with the 360. Plus the 360 GPU has that 10mb eDRAM that I already explained. Yes, how do u like them pwnwitches ;)
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deactivated-61ff675e61178

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#31 deactivated-61ff675e61178
Member since 2004 • 12558 Posts

Here's a link to a PS3 (Cell) benchmarked against a 1.6 Ghz G5 Mac:  http://www.geekpatrol.ca/2006/11/playstation-3-performance/  

It's a good indication of a real world benchmark as all the IBM,Sony, etc ones use code optimized for Cell (they certainly don't Show Cell running out-of-order branchy code). This uses code unoptomized for either platform. Note--- the SPEs aren't being utilized for this test, just the core. However, SPEs are most certainly inferior to real cores at general computing.

Tony_aaaa
The SPES account for most of the power in the Cell, so to test the Cell using out-of-order general purpose code (when the Cell is an In-order processor) and using code that doesn't utilize the 7 spes is meaningless. If the code was optimized for the cell (which it would be for any ps3 games) the Cell's performance in that comparison would've increased exponentially.
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Hammerofjustice

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#32 Hammerofjustice
Member since 2006 • 2685 Posts
more posts on the Cell's "Hidden powaaz"? will Cows ever give these stupid delusions up? :roll:Dreams-Visions
obviously a fakeboy. lemming troll disguised as a cow .
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Smakkjoo

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#33 Smakkjoo
Member since 2006 • 1801 Posts
Love the PS3, but whattt??? Wall of text dude =/ Simplify!!!
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imprezawrx500

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#34 imprezawrx500
Member since 2004 • 19187 Posts

Why the heck is the text all black?

Stabby2486
I see no problem with black on grey what wrong?
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TNT_Slug

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#35 TNT_Slug
Member since 2007 • 1735 Posts
OH NOEZZ WE NEED GOHAN! IT's Teh CeLL KAMEHAMEHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.-KinGz-
Lol, this reply is on par for what this thread is saying.
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Fusible

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#36 Fusible
Member since 2005 • 2828 Posts
This is such old news. This is more than a couple of years old.
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shishkabob_6

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#37 shishkabob_6
Member since 2004 • 1196 Posts
Im going through all the things to reply with in my head its soooo cool
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LoganZRun

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#38 LoganZRun
Member since 2006 • 307 Posts

Gosh the fire, My brain is on FIRE!!!

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onedarkjedi

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#39 onedarkjedi
Member since 2003 • 25 Posts
It's like dropping a high performance drag engine in a wheelchair..:P
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daveg1

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#40 daveg1
Member since 2005 • 20405 Posts

why use black text on a black background!??

and your thread may have had some good points too:(

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bluebrad1974

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#41 bluebrad1974
Member since 2005 • 5162 Posts
 

The Cell Broadband Engine in a simple analysis the Cell processor can be split into four components: external input and output structures, the main processor called the Power Processing Element (PPE) SMT eight fully-functional co-processors called the Synergistic Processing Elements or SPEs and a specialised high-bandwidth circular data bus connecting the PPE, input/output elements and the SPEs, called the Element Interconnect Bus or EIB.

The poweris achieved the high performance needed for mathematically intensive tasks, such as decoding/encoding MPEG streams, generating or transforming three dimensional data, or undertaking Fourier analysis of data, the Cell processor simply marries the SPEs and the PPE via the EIB to give both access to main memory or other external data storage. The PPE which is capable of running a conventional operating system has control over the SPEs and can start, stop, interrupt and schedule processes running on the SPEs. To this end the PPE has additional instructions relating to control of the SPEs. Despite having Turing complete architectures the SPEs are not fully autonomous and require the PPE to initiate them before they can do any useful work. Most of the "horsepower" of the system comes from the synergistic processing elements.

The PPE and bus architecture includes various modes of operation giving different levels of memory protection allowing areas of memory to be protected from access by specific processes running on the SPEs or PPE.

Both the PPE and SPE are RISC architectures with a fixed-width 32-bit instruction format. The PPE contains a 64-bit general purpose register set (GPR), a 64-bit floating point register set (FPR), and a 128-bit Altivec register set. The SPE contains 128-bit registers only. These can be used for scalar data types ranging from 8-bits to 128-bits in size or for SIMD computations on a variety of integer and floating point formats. System memory addresses for both the PPE and SPE are expressed as 64-bit values for a theoretic address range of 264 bytes. In practice, not all of these bits are implemented in hardware; the address space is extremely large nevertheless. Local store addresses internal to the SPU processor are expressed as a 32-bit word. In documentation relating to Cell a word is always taken to mean 32 bits, a doubleword means 64 bits, and a quadword means 128 bits.DMA MMU, and bus interface). An SPE is a RISC processor with 128-bit SIMD organization for single and double precision instructions. With the current generation of the Cell, each SPE contains a 256 KiB instruction and data local memory area (called "local store") which is visible to the PPE and can be addressed directly by software. Each SPE can support up to 4 GB of local store memory. The local store does not operate like a conventional CPU cache since it is neither transparent to software nor does it contain hardware structures that predict which data to load. The SPEs contain a 128 × 128 register file and measure 14.5 mm² on a 90 nm process. An SPE can operate on 16 8-bit integers, 8 16-bit integers, 4 32-bit integers, or 4 single precision floating-point numbers in a single clock cycle. It can also do a memory operation in the same clock cycle. Note that the SPU processor can not directly access system memory; the 64-bit memory addresses formed by the SPU must be passed from the SPU processor to the SPE memory flow controller (MFC) to set up a DMA operation within the system address space.set-top box might load programs for reading a DVD, video and audio decoding, and display, and the data would be passed off from SPE to SPE until finally ending up on the TV. Another possibility is to partition the input data set and have several SPEs performing the same kind of operation in parallel. At 3.2 GHz, each SPU gives a theoretical 25.6 GFLOPS of single precision performance.personal computer, the relatively high overall floating point performance of a Cell processor seemingly dwarfs the abilities of the SIMD unit in desktop CPUs like the Pentium 4 and the Athlon 64. However, comparing only floating point abilities of a system is a one-dimensional and application-specific metric. Unlike a Cell processor, such desktop CPUs are more suited to the general purpose software usually run on personal computers. In addition to executing multiple instructions per clock, processors from Intel and AMD feature branch predictors The Cell is designed to compensate for this with compiler assistance, in which prepare-to-branch instructions are created. For double-precision, as used in personal computers, Cell performance drops by an order of magnitude, but still reaches 14 GFLOPS.

 

Each SPE is composed of a "Synergistic Processing Unit", SPU, and a "Memory Flow Controller", MFC (

In one typical usage scenario, the system will load the SPEs with small programs chaining the SPEs together to handle each step in a complex operation. For instance, a

Compared to a modern

What does this all mean. The cell is made for multimedia the Spe's can be used for alot.

sulimanhustler
This simply proves that the PS3 was designed around selling blu-ray. The Cell is garbage for gaming solutions.
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Grodus5

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#42 Grodus5
Member since 2006 • 7934 Posts
Since I don't understand all that tech crap... I'll just say "cool. I never knew that." How's that?SkateGame
Same
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trasherhead

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#43 trasherhead
Member since 2005 • 3058 Posts
Read the link in my sig for better understanding of the cell.
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jrhawk42

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#44 jrhawk42
Member since 2003 • 12764 Posts
the cell is basically the emotion engine 2.0, 

It sounds like it's the future of cpu's and can do awesome stuff, but in reality it's power is fairly limited to certain processes.
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Me_Ur_Daddy

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#45 Me_Ur_Daddy
Member since 2007 • 155 Posts
[QUOTE="sulimanhustler"]No I know tecnology big expert. I know the power of the 360 wii and PS3. I just know because......pop7934
So then you know that the cell doesn't really matter cause of the small ram right? I mean, you COULD run all these nice things with the cell, but with that little ram, it doesn't matter cause it'd looks like a picture, not a game, soooo, yup, that's all. IMHO of course.

dont speak about something you know nothing about plz, you are obviously just repeating what you heard from fanboys in SW, that ram rumor about oblivion was already debunked. cell spe's have no problem working with both GPU and main CPU.
[QUOTE="palaric8"]english pleaseTony_aaaa
OK it's an article about the Cell, it describes some of the chips shortcomings and strengths. It says nothing new. Towards the end it states that a "desktop" cpu is better for general computing tasks. (gaming?).

general desktop stuff like MS paint and word thats about it lol. cell was built for gaming in mind, and then they thought it would be great as a super computer processor, this is why IBM is using a buttload of cells for their new super computer, its probably gonna be named skynet ;) lol j/k
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Me_Ur_Daddy

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#46 Me_Ur_Daddy
Member since 2007 • 155 Posts

Here's a link to a PS3 (Cell) benchmarked against a 1.6 Ghz G5 Mac:  http://www.geekpatrol.ca/2006/11/playstation-3-performance/  

It's a good indication of a real world benchmark as all the IBM,Sony, etc ones use code optimized for Cell (they certainly don't Show Cell running out-of-order branchy code). This uses code unoptomized for either platform. Note--- the SPEs aren't being utilized for this test, just the core. However, SPEs are most certainly inferior to real cores at general computing.

Tony_aaaa
wow if it isnt using any spe's then its pointless to even look at it, cus this is a main feature of cell
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walter09

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#47 walter09
Member since 2005 • 289 Posts

the cell is more powerful.Journey89

more powerful than what? he is not saying that due to the fact that he's not comparing the system against any other one ... he's just giving us some facts in a very very high language that only people from the field would understand ... oh well...

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TheSystemLord1

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#48 TheSystemLord1
Member since 2006 • 7786 Posts

Vegeta...you can't possibly defeat him...Teh Cell is just too powerful in his perfect form...

No kakarot...the xbot/sayain race depends on me...I must defeat him...I'm the price of ALL xbots/saiyans...

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Me_Ur_Daddy

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#49 Me_Ur_Daddy
Member since 2007 • 155 Posts
[QUOTE="sulimanhustler"]No the power to make graphics better the ram the hardrive is a subsitute. The cell is better than intel core duo. Look the Spe's on the gPU and the graphics chip will increse the rates and frames. With all this power it can defeat the 360. But you people only care about games not power. POWERRRRRRRRchubz256
Wow, first, I think u can get in trouble for plagerism because u clearly copy&pasted that. And u are wrong in soo many ways on your statement. Sigh, okay, first off, the most important part of gaming machines are the graphics processors. Example: pc can have weaker cpu(lets say dual 2.4 GHZ) compared to Xenon or Cell, but if the pc has a Nvidia Geforce 8800, ya, of course the pc would pwn. Same thing goes here. Yes, Cell can be more powerful(well, that's a complicated arguement but I'm not there yet) but the 360's GPU pwns the crap out of RSX. Ya, 48 shader pipelines, 10mb eDRAM, unified shaders, and 256 GB/s internal bandwith on daughter chip for frame buffer all pwn RSX. The clear winner is the 360. As for the CPU, that's complicated. The Cell is basically a single core cpu with 8 hardware threads(yes, those SPEs are threads, not cores for all ignorance out there). Is an 8 threaded cpu single core really more powerful than Xenon(3 cores all with 2 threads)? Someone mentioned earlier, "We all know power means squat. PS2, anyone?" This makes sense. PS2 back then had a single core with a co-processor(SPE) and xbox cpu only had a single core. This doesn't mean that the PS2 cpu was better. We all knew from the start the xbox cpu kicked the ps2's in the balls. Hell, the emotion engine(ps2 cpu) was soo overhyped that they claimed that it could launch nukes around the world. So, I won't make any conclusions but Xenon can actually be more powerful or vise-versa. As for RAM, unified RAM(360) is better than discrete RAM(ps3). This is because in the 360 the cpu and gpu can access the total 512 megs of RAM any way possible(cpu can access more or gpu can access more). This causes max performance(alot like the max performance you get from 48 unified pipelines instead of seperated pipelines). So the RAM part actually wins with the 360. Plus the 360 GPU has that 10mb eDRAM that I already explained. Yes, how do u like them pwnwitches ;)

dont answer this guy its so biased its sad, i feel sorry for him, maybe ill edit this and bother to correct him, just maybe. the spe's are threads :lol:
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muscleserge

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#50 muscleserge
Member since 2005 • 3307 Posts
A Core 2 Duo is much faster at gaming code that eiter the cell or Xenon and doesn't require optimization that much. The cell has very few instruction sets, and is an in order CPU, Cell is much better at graphics than any other code. In General purpose tasks C2D runs circles around the cell. Intel is the worlds largest and surely wealthiest CPU manufacturer, they spend a lot of money on R&D, if cell arcitechture would be that good it would be in PCs right now. x86>>>>PowerPC even Mac is abandoning PowerPC.