What defines an RPG?

I'm curious as to why people think certain games are RPGs or not. Answer away :)

[QUOTE="Jandurin"]mass effect - rpg mass effect 2 - notlocopatho

Number 1, 3 and 4 choices

[QUOTE="locopatho"][QUOTE="Jandurin"]mass effect - rpg mass effect 2 - notJandurin

For me, rpgs are fundamentally about CHOICE. When a game forces you to only use a certain item, wear a certain gear, do a certain thing, walk down a certain path, be a certain person...from start till finish, then the game is not an rpg by my standards

where's the "all of the above" option?

I think if you have attributes that are upgradable.Heil68

[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="locopatho"] But why? I be a curious boy :)locopatho

it need more...good tactics...the game is all need action its doesnt have preference of RPG...its just Action with interactive movie sense with 15% customizing on gameplay

I think if you have attributes that are upgradable.Heil68

Choices that effect the story and different classes/skills

Fallout 1/2 and Arcanum are good examples of an RPG

[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="locopatho"] But why? I be a curious boy :)locopatho

all of the above

The world molds around your character, not your character molds to the world.

The world molds around your character, not your character molds to the world.

foxhound_fox

There have been countless flamewars about definitions of RPGs on this forum, none ended with any sort of consensus :) So I will just present my view and be done with it.

To me RPG is a game where stats what the primarly element that determines the outcome (failure or success) of character actions. Some player's input is of course needed, but the moment player's own skills become more important to the outcome than the skills of character is the moment the game stops being RPG to me

Interesting one... Could you provide an example?locopatho

Imo it´s skills, stats and equipment.

As expected, the answer seems to change depending on the user background, amusing.

As for me, a RPG game should give you the chance to play a character in the roll you desire, that includes Character aptitudes, responses, attitudes and choices. But first and foremost making a clear difference between you AS a player and the Character, the roll you're playing. And here is where usually people miss the point, sadly, because is the very essence of a RPG

Basically all VG are rpg's since even in a game like Halo, you play the role of Master Chief. :P

Seriously, I picked the last option in the poll and would say looking at the poll answers, I would have picked one that said:

All the above. 8)

Basically all VG are rpg's since even in a game like Halo, you play the role of Master Chief. :P

Seriously, I picked the last option in the poll and would say looking at the poll answers, I would have picked one that said:

All the above. 8)

SecretPolice

Yeah it's weird. Heavy Rain has a storyline, Zelda has new equipment, Red Dead Redemption has choices and freedom, Dead Rising has stats and upgrades, yet no one considers those games RPGs... Confusing to get a real definition :Plocopatho

[QUOTE="SecretPolice"]

Basically all VG are rpg's since even in a game like Halo, you play the role of Master Chief. :P

Seriously, I picked the last option in the poll and would say looking at the poll answers, I would have picked one that said:

All the above. 8)

locopatho

Here's hoping ME3 finaly unseats Kotor as king. :P

I belive the main one is that combat succes is based on the points you attrubute to your character eg. more strength/higher damage , more luck/higher chance to have a critical hit. so tactics matter more then having a crosshair over someones head and firing.

But RP stands for RolePlaying, so it means that you choose what and how you play.

The actual role playing. In creating a character and tale defined and personalized by yourself - the player.skrat_01

Exactly. Character creation lets the player take ownership of the character.

But I think stats and leveling play a huge part in that also. It's just an extension of character creation in that it gives you the tools to craft your player in the way you think is right for the role.

Dialogue and plot choice as well. Choose conversation responses and actions that at least give the illusion that you're affecting the plot. In this way, you continue to mold the character.

Final Fantasy, 'nuff said.

[QUOTE="locopatho"] Interesting one... Could you provide an example?foxhound_fox

Wouldn't that make games like inFamous RPGs? They hit you with stones if you are evil, and hit the enemies when you are good. :P

Wouldn't that make games like inFamous RPGs? They hit you with stones if you are evil, and hit the enemies when you are good. :Psvenus97

Dynamic character and story development. If your decisions and interactions with other characters aren't shaping your character's personality and the direction of the story, then it's not an RPG.

Everything else is optional, yet very much possible. The RPG genre has the potential to be the most complex and varied genre available. You could hypothetically incorporate aspects from virtually any other genre into a single RPG, but I imagine it would be one hell of an expensive game to develop.

Ginosaji

-Choices and consequences across the spectrum

-Customization and personalization

-interaction with the world and NPCs

-A well balanced sense of rewarding progression

-Of course the story itself

[QUOTE="svenus97"]Wouldn't that make games like inFamous RPGs? They hit you with stones if you are evil, and hit the enemies when you are good. :Pfoxhound_fox

Hehehe no :P

So Final Fantasy X or Oblivion wouldn't be RPGs? locopatho

People crucify Oblivion and Fallout 3 as RPGs despite me being able to do that tho...locopatho

My problem is that with Oblivion, it streamlines these game systems to an extent where individuality and personalisation is almost null for accessability, and gibing the player diversity from the go. You can be a proficent caster, thief, archer and swordsman, join every guild etc. and many character builds are useless, which ruins the personalisation. Things like dialouge options and speech are also redundant.

Compared to, lets say Fallout 1, where your character build effects the gameplay immensley. Putting all your points into strength and none into intelligence based skills for instance, results in a character who literraly talks in grunts, which changes the game dramatically compared to an intelligent character. Not just in playing **** but in the way the world reacts - NPCs in particular. This makes the role playing a whole lot more dense, personal and tangible, despite the enviroment having knowhere near as much detail and interactivity as Fallout 3.

Keeping in mind Fallout 3 its almost a blend of Oblivion's and Fallout 1/2's formula; my problem being it waters down much of the originals dense character systems and reactive world, in favour of a world filled with detail that is heavily exploration based - which of course is still good, and still role playing.

Just more of an action role playing game. Now the interesting thing is so many genres are blending RPG tropes, I think the genre will start to become more defined, or totally blended. Look at Mass Effect 2 as a sign of growing trends; or almost every game having a sort of upgrade system and / or currency.

Exactly. Character creation lets the player take ownership of the character.

But I think stats and leveling play a huge part in that also. It's just an extension of character creation in that it gives you the tools to craft your player in the way you think is right for the role.

Dialogue and plot choice as well. Choose conversation responses and actions that at least give the illusion that you're affecting the plot. In this way, you continue to mold the character.

VoodooHak

What is interesting is games that essentially make these systems hidden.

Bioshock for instance tried to, and failed miserably (and succeeded in other areas) in my opinion, though other games like The Void which makes things make sense of the context of the game - the points you put into skills is your health and currency; which all works with the universe in context. You don't realise you are really stat grinding (even when you have actions which seem passive, only to be effecting npcs).

I would say that in other games, you become the character. In RPGs, the character becomes you. So the level of customisation, the level of choice and the level of decisions you get to make is crucial. If you are implanting your will on the game, if the character is doing things the way you want them, its either an RPG or a game with RPG elements.

All about storyline, I'm taking a character through a story so I expect a fully detailed storyline to follow as I go along it. Choices are just a tool some developers use to add to the story.Pearwood

A lot of games have a story. An FPS can have a rich story. Some driving games have a story. This is not role playing. There's more to it.

Airships.

If it doesn't have an airship, it's not an RPG.

None of the games you mentioned fall into the genre of RPG's because you are not creating a character and having the world change around you, in any of the cases, your are merely adapting to the world and playing by its rules.

foxhound_fox

your are merely adapting to the world and playing by its rules.

foxhound_fox

I'd say that the choices and stats system have equal importance. Some games have stats and levels, but no dynamic player choice mechanic, so in essense they aren't really role playing. Other games have many choices the player can take, like GTA games, but lacks any character building, customizing, and evolving, so isn't categorized as an RPG.

You need both the character building and evolving, as well as a gameplay experience that is centered around role playing, where the player defines the characters behavior and attitudes through his/her choices and tailored experiences.

After all, these were the two key component of the original PnP RPGs.