Why can't SquareEnix learn from FFVI?

You know that FFVI has western RPG elements, right?

And Baldur's Gate II character quests remind me of what FFVI accomplished in regards to RPG characterization.

LOL, a Vaasman/Musalala idiot reply

MMO.

No need to get butthurt bra.

I was delighted to have a conversation about Final Fantasy, but after seeing you stomp your feet around and yelling, "you just don't get it." It simply isn't worth my time. All I see you posting is your opinion and saying that is how it is. I wasn't aware your opinions dictate how things are for everyone. Stop living in the 90's.

why?

@Gue1: How does the simplicity of FFVI detract from it? You HAVE played it, right? Then you'd know that it easily has one of the best second halves of any RPG ever. It's truly well done.

design, story and graphics, I don't think so. In particular graphics and story because jrpg's always excel at unique art-styles and stories. Jrpg's have stories about evolution (EVO snes), time travel (Chrono Trigger), giant robots made to kill gods (Xenogears), training cute animals to fight (Pokemon), hunt demons and even satan himself (shin megami tensei), aliens that eat planets (FFVII), etc. The variety in jrpg stories is just unmatched. And about writing? Having the best writing doesn't mean that the story itself will be enjoyable.

But I do believe that wrpg's excel at making believable worlds, technical graphics, scale and even content. But to me this is not enough to make up for its lack of charm that jrpg's are so full with. I sometimes enjoy a wrpg here and there but they would never replace jrpg's just like jrpg's coul never replace wrpg's because both styles are so very different. It's just preference.

Classic TGR response, you threads are so predictable, they fall in the following categories

Dick ride Bioware threads

SE bashing threads

and recently Bioshock bashing threads

And they always end with you being buthurt .

Same sh*t Differnt Day

I like FFVIII the best.

It has the most memorable moments for me.

Don't get all bent out of shape just because he nailed you down to a tee.

You are still underestimating the variety of WRPGs. WRPGs have stories about becoming an Avatar of Virtue (Ultima IV), a immortals quest to die (Planescape Torment), a wuxia story (Jade Empire), stories about conspiracies mixed with trans humanism (Deus Ex series), post apocalyptic survival (Fallout), a space opera revival (Mass Effect), vampires (Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines), a monster slayer trying to find his place in the world (The Witcher), and more. Now we have Cyberpunk 2077 coming, nevermind what will Bioware's new IP be? And JRPGs many times, fall back on clichés.

@Vaasman said:

@texasgoldrush said:

@musalala said:

@texasgoldrush said:

@musalala said:

@Vaasman said:

Lol TGR thread.

My sentiments exactly

LOL, a Vaasman/Musalala idiot reply

Classic TGR response, you threads are so predictable, they fall in the following categories

Dick ride Bioware threads

SE bashing threads

and recently Bioshock bashing threads

And they always end with you being buthurt .

Same sh*t Differnt Day

Wow, you are a complete moron, you really do not understand the positions on which I post.

"Dragon Age is overrated", remember that, but I guess you are too stupid. Go play in traffic

Don't get all bent out of shape just because he nailed you down to a tee.

Obviously he didn't. How do you nail me down when you don't know what I even argue or believe?

@texasgoldrush said:

@Vaasman said:

@texasgoldrush said:

@musalala said:

@texasgoldrush said:

@musalala said:

@Vaasman said:

Lol TGR thread.

My sentiments exactly

LOL, a Vaasman/Musalala idiot reply

Classic TGR response, you threads are so predictable, they fall in the following categories

Dick ride Bioware threads

SE bashing threads

and recently Bioshock bashing threads

And they always end with you being buthurt .

Same sh*t Differnt Day

Wow, you are a complete moron, you really do not understand the positions on which I post.

"Dragon Age is overrated", remember that, but I guess you are too stupid. Go play in traffic

Don't get all bent out of shape just because he nailed you down to a tee.

Obviously he didn't. How do you nail me down when you don't know what I even argue or believe?

lol. Anyone who's ever attempted to post in the same thread as you knows exactly how you post, this isn't rocket science. Your modus operandi hasn't change once. Only real question is how bad you gonna get devastated over this fact?

I find FF7 fanboys to be really annoying when they try and shit on FF6 when it's obvious they never played FF6(3) on SNES.

The sad thing is I like FF7 a lot. It's tied for second best in my book with FF4; but it urks me that these fools have no idea that most of the things that made FF7 awesome were the elements that it inherited from FF6. Some guy in this thread tried to say that FF6 didn't have side quests, I mean wtf. I don't know why everyone on this forum is so extremely polarized with their opinions and are willingly ignorant.

On topic. I guess S-E is tone-deaf. They need new writers apparently because the biggest issue with FF as of late has been generic/convoluted/boring story lines and characters. Horrible.

@Vaasman said:

@texasgoldrush said:

@Vaasman said:

@texasgoldrush said:

@musalala said:

@texasgoldrush said:

@musalala said:

@Vaasman said:

Lol TGR thread.

My sentiments exactly

LOL, a Vaasman/Musalala idiot reply

Classic TGR response, you threads are so predictable, they fall in the following categories

Dick ride Bioware threads

SE bashing threads

and recently Bioshock bashing threads

And they always end with you being buthurt .

Same sh*t Differnt Day

Wow, you are a complete moron, you really do not understand the positions on which I post.

"Dragon Age is overrated", remember that, but I guess you are too stupid. Go play in traffic

Don't get all bent out of shape just because he nailed you down to a tee.

Obviously he didn't. How do you nail me down when you don't know what I even argue or believe?

lol. Anyone who's ever attempted to post in the same thread as you knows exactly how you post, this isn't rocket science. Your modus operandi hasn't change once. Only real question is how bad you gonna get devastated over this fact?

No, people are just clueless morons including you. And no, you really do not know my positions.. If you think I am a Birdrone who hates Bioshock and SquareEnix, you are simply an idiot.

Percisely....look at "one Winged Angel" Sephiroth...I want FFVII fans to tell me that's not borrowed from FFVI and Heartless Angel Kefka, so I can laugh in their face.

Sounds like extreme denial to me lol. "OBVIOUSLY I'M RIGHT EVERYONE IS STUPID, THAT'S WHY I MADE A THREAD, TO TELL YOU ALL HOW SUPERIOR I AM!"

Are you going to keep crying because you were called out? I find it rather amusing watching you rage about nothing. I guess that's all I can expect from a Bird-drone though.

@DerekLoffin: Why ? he brings up good points... FFVI is just nostalgia attack on most of you. The story it's actually quite stupid with plot holes and things that didn't make sense with in the boundaries of it's own imaginary world. The customization in the game were just like the Materia system of FF7 which was simple.. effective but simple which was cool and it seemed to me FF7 was riding on the FFVI mechanics and added a bit of depth to it ( such as making a better limit break system ) The story on FF7 is actually better than the one on 6. It's not a grammy winning story but it's far more interesting. A clown with the excuse that he became mad because of an experiment imagined the world being destroyed and so it happened yet he can't beat a group of people trying to kill him for no logical explanation? No one bother trying to kill him infront of the statues that clearly absorbed magic that he himself told everyone they did and was struggling to push them when you have a karate and bushido master in your group and some ninja out of nowhere has to come to do something about it while your group is just standing there watching. I was like literally What the **** is wrong with this scene right here? It made no sense either why terra had to calm down the scions for them to absorb them when they absorbed them immediately anyways from a safe distance.

Wow, I don't think you were even paying attention to the story or its scenes.

If you were paying attention to the scene with the statues, you would see that Kefka and Gesthal (a powerful mage of his own right) stunned everyone but Celes. They offer Celes glory to the Empire if she would kill her friends, giving her a sword to do so. She attempts to kill Kefka instead, stabbing him. they counter and KO Celes. So, they did try to kill Kefka, they could not do it. Shadow rescues Celes and her party and occupies Kefka while they escape. You weren't paying attention, you are making up plot holes in your head.

Nope, I am not in denial....I really do like the Obsidian sequels to NWN and KOTOR better than the Bioware original (one thing me and DarkLink agree), that DAO is overrated, Jade Empire is flawed, and that Drew Karpyshyn is an overrated writer that ruined Revan. So I am far from a Biodrone.

For calling me out, you guys do a moronic job. I am not mad, I am just pointing out the obvious. You don't know my positions and you are ignorant. Good day.

And now you're on to stuff that has nothing to do with the point I made. Denial AND following your shtick. Classic. If you're going to say you don't follow a pattern, don't follow the pattern while you deny it rofl.

Yeah the game has aged, unfortunately wont stop FF fans from jumping you.

However, it has aged well, more so than many of its successors.

You immediately lost me when you said it was a good thing the translator "westernized" the dialogue in the game.

No, taking someone elses written dialogue and translating it as your own, is not something worth applauding.

That is some high tier butthurt right there lol. Can't even pretend you don't do the same crap over and over, ya just ended up crying about it. Keep it up I love it.

And for the record, you've derailed your own topic. You were and are perfectly capable of ignoring this dissension like every topic creator, but you never do, because you're predictable.

Go ahead though, don't respond to this post, if you don't follow a pattern. Feel free not to quote this and prove me wrong.

Its to bad really FFVI was the last good main final fantasy.

Too*, and I think 7 was the last great main FF, you're probably just reminiscing about the SNES.

FFIX is the last great FF, and FFXII would have been great if they let Matsuno do what he wanted.

SquareEnix could also learn from FFIX, because that game successfully brought the series back to its roots. Now you have Princess Robot Bubblegum garbage brought to you by Toriyama and Nomura.

@texasgoldrush: stunned them in-front of statues that were absorbing every other spell of his? ._.

watch the scene again, they use the statues to stun the party.

@ActicEdge: Kefka is an insanely great villain. He plays his role perfect to a T.

Act like a screw up, hide in the shadows while causing some serious havok and Keep your true abilities hidden until everything comes into Fruition. How is Kefka not the perfect villain?

Here are some of the evil things Kefka goes about doing.

Burning cities to dust

Poisoning water supply of even the innocent

Trying to burn Figaro to the ground.

Killing the leader/general of his nation (whats not more evil then this)

Burning the world into ruin.

Kefka is crazy mad villain with a sinister twisted mind. He is unpredictable yet ingenious at the same time. He's the ideal super villain. Hell he's more evil then any Bond Villain

Well SE can't always make games like VI, can they?

You have to admit that VII had (technically) a larger impact than VI, although at the cost of creating an obnoxious fanbase. And thus good enough to make spin-offs and compilations whenever they were good or not. On a/n (extremely off track) side note, Lightning from XIII, was meant to be the 'Rule 63' Cloud Strife, your mileage may vary from there.

It's not Sephiroth, Ultimecia, Kuja and Sin.

Incidently, I've failed to complete FF6 many times, while the opposite is true for 7, 8, 9 and 10.

Cool another thread where we can all argue over which FF game is best!

I will contribute: Out of the ones I played 7 is best and the worst was 9. Everyone else is WRONG.

However, objectively, most sites consider VI the best and not only that, even Kitase says that a large portion of fans in the West prefer VI to VII.

Its not Vayne or Delita either.

Kefka is quite unique of a villain in the series where the means are the ends. He definitely is the Joker of the FF series.

FF was pretty damn great overall before XIII :)

I never thought about it before, but I see your point. Kefka really IS the Joker.

Would you happen to know which version they used for IOS/Android? I remember feeling slightly burnt by Chrono Trigger because it was'nt the PSX version.

Edit: Just did my own research. Seems like the mobiel version is the definitive one apart from not featuring the FMVs.

Maybe I should just dump my PSX disc and see how the load times are on my Android devices....

I'd actually be super excited if it was a Bayonetta/Devil May Cry caliber game with leveling and status effects. It'd be the best action game ever. As it stands now, I worry about it like I do for every action jrpg. The combat will probably be ass. Terrible. An abomination of an action game. Action RPGs are incredibly hard to make because you have to make a good action game and a good rpg. Even counting western RPGs, 90% are terrible action games and decent rpgs, 9% are decent action games but terrible RPGs. I'll make up that 1% nails both, although I've never played a single one. Maybe it exists somewhere.

The last action game Square made was that dogshit "The Bouncer" back on PS2, right? I'm looking forward to FFXV but I'm totally prepared for it to have really terrible action gameplay.

There is some differences between the Joker and Kefka......Joker is an agent of chaos who believes that order is an illusion and that humans by nature will end up destroying eachother when the chips are down, Kefka is an agent of death who believes life is meaningless because everything has to end and be destroyed, so they have different motives. Kefka brings a higher body count, however, he is not interested in corrupting others to do evil like the Joker (although Kefka rather you lose hope, maybe his form of corrupting others, Strago for example). That's another key difference. So I am not entirely accurate calling Kefka the Joker, but he is very similar. Kefka is not always portrayed as a clown either.

Another villain from the early 90's that Kefka reminds me of is Verminous Skumm from Captain Planet and the Planeteers. Instead of destroying the environment or commit human rights or animal rights violations for profit or power like the other bad guys in the show, he does it because he wants to watch the world burn. He also poisoned a city's water supply.

Jesus CHRIST I had to respond to this because of the ignorance of the situation being unanswered

The reason Kefka was both insane AND evil is because

1. He was Gestahl's loyal court jester. He whether he was planning to betray Gestahl is unclear at the time.

2. Kefka offered his services as a test subject for magitek infusion. He became a prototype to magic infusion to help further it's progress. He probably got closer than anyone else to surviving it. But, it also made him mentally ill.

3. Kefka was probably already hatefilled since he was already working for the Empire. However, I'm sure over time, that mental illness became worse and worse. Gestahl probably didn't accept or acknowledge it. He continued to wage his war.

So yes, there is a reason he's evil.

FF15 is less japanese taste... its heavily westernised....

FF9 tried the classic FF feel... and was the least popular of the PS1 era.... only the FF14 stays true to the medieval fantasy elements.

They are listening, they are remaking the REAL standard FF ... FF7.... f*cking hipsters and their loved for FF6... yea its great, but many more people lived FF7 and is the main entry in the franchise... get over it.

That being said, FF6 did many things very well. but these turn based games are dying.... they simply arn't challenging... no matter what you do.... at least in Action-JRPG's you have a mix of stat building/RPG elements/Reflex to account for.

Don't pretend to me that debuffing and buffing makes you a smart human being..

Hell if Final Fantasy: Brave Exvius wasn't a god damn Gatcha game I would say its a pretty good tribue to traditional FF... but shows all the same weaknesses of that game loop/.

You mean a FF game with horrific storytelling and a dated open world, with dated quest design and gameplay. Oh, and its now underperforming in sales compared to XIII in Japan and the UK?

FFIX is more popular now than it was at release and is considered one of the best FF titles.

They aren't listening.

Final Fantasy VII is a deal with the devil, just like Resident Evil 4, The Walking Dead, Assassin's Creed II, and Call of Duty 4 Modern Warfare are...........immediate success of a very flawed game that leads to the downfall of the series, the genre, or the company in the long run.

Its not the gameplay or the game design that made VI the classic it was. It was the storytelling and event design as well as a game changing soundtrack. And once again, VI tops most best of series lists from 2008 on.

Why was this bumped?

yea no.

If it was any of that, it would of received more love by now. it was a one time deal, the hipster choice.

@MBirdy88: If I were to do a poll of Final Fantasy fans who played 8 or 9 main titles or more......FFVI would win

The generation gap helps FFVII as there is a large one between VI and VII. If I sift out this gap, VI beats VII.

Its the same as Fallout. If I polled Fallout fans in general, I think 3 will win. If I polled fans that played one of the Black Isle games, Fallout 2 wins and New Vegas would be the top Bethesda era Fallout game.

The long time fanbase tilts toward VI being the best.

bullshit, back it up or just go back to your hole.

Best at story, FF5 was best at classes (if you dont include the MMOs).

Story alone doesn't make the best game. you say you know the majority of FF fans... yet alot of them were born from the PS error... I bet more of them can name FF7-10 characters compared to the cast of 6.