Why doesn't Nintendo broaden their audience?

The difference is Pixar isnt trying to regain a foothold in the industry

@aigis: They better be after that The Last Dinosaur disaster.

@iandizion713: lol I think they can afford a good dinosaur after an inside out though :P

They lost a lot of critical praise after Cars 2. I think Inside Out is their biggest hit in a while. They're being outdone by Disney's own animation studio thanks to Frozen. Me thinks Pixar does have a lot of catching up to do but that doesn't mean they need to turn to live action R rated movies to do it.

There's also this idea that geeks and gamers are growing up and want all media to aim for their target audience. Kids can't have Batman anymore. He's made for geeks stucks in arrested development and they want him to be R rated, violent, and killing everything around him. I want Mario to be around because that's what my kids will be playing. Not gears, not halo, and not the last of us. If certain adults are too selfish to realize that not all things are made for them then they need to wake up.

@Heirren: I wouldn't say Bloodborne has no logic. I Platinum'd the game (it's one of the rare cases where it actually means you have to explore every bit of the game and adapt as you go) and there most definitely was a lot of learning to do as you progressed despite the mechanics being fairly simple. It's especially true for the final Chalices, I feel. A lot of memorizing boss patterns, finding/creating gaps to attack, trying out different setups (either armour or weapons) to see what worked (or not). I didn't really have any issue with the hit boxes either, the game felt very fair (despite it's difficulty) to me. In fact thats exactly what pushed me on to beat it, that feeling of "Ok, I know I can pull this off" despite dying plenty of times.

DriveClub is surprisingly though to master. Didn't really expect that of an arcade racer to be honest. Once you go for the better times/higher scores (depending on the mode) it gets really, really hard. You have to practise the course plenty of times (and with different cars) to beat those higher scores. GT I recall being fun enough for SIM noobs like me to play but very much a beast to mastered too.

The UC4 maps (the ones in the beta at least) are pretty great. They're really tailored to the size of the teams and make great use of the new mechanics (like the grappling hook) and the verticality of the series (basically each map had some 2-3 layers to it, which players can make use of ). You can check out some videos and see it for yourself. To make things better, besides some issues here and there with some weapons and some of the power-ups (which must be gained in-game btw, creating an interesting dynamic where even a losing team can make a comeback if they manage to kill 4-5 people in a row) the gameplay felt really balanced for a beta. You could actually have fun with most weapon types, which doesn't happen a lot (usually there is this one super effective/popular which people spam for eternity).

And sure, most Ninty games may have more of this, but that doesn't mean others don't. As I've said the issue Ninty faced this whole gen was not the lack of games (okay, maybe in that first year of the WiiU) but a lack of proper marketing. Like the one that made the Wii a massive success. And the one that is making the PS4 the success it is today.

@aigis: Now you sounds like them Nintendo fans clinging to the Wii success. I kid, i kid.

Pixar makes tons of money on most of their films. Even their clunkers like cars 2 doubles their investment.

I'm not saying that they shouldnt make Mario games, but when they make so many series that hit the same demographic it leaves out a huge amount of people. There is not reason why mario, kirby, donkey kong, and yoshi are series and then the one new ip they make hits that same demo. They should make a new ip that branches out or get third party support on the console that fills that gap. Pixar can fill its niche because its in an ecosystem that has R rated movies already, Nintendo needs to fill its console to hit a bunch of demos

@Bread_or_Decide: What the hell on you on about? Do you know what "broaden" means?

They should make a new ip that branches out or get third party support on the console that fills that gap.

__

Splatoon and Bayonetta 2. And look how those were received by double mint twin gamers. (That's Sony and Microsoft.) One game even earned a ten and that wasn't enough for people to jump on board.

A good idea if you want to have a bigger market share. Nobody is saying don't make any kids games, but making it 80% of what you make is a stupid idea.

They need to have more variety with system sellers, the more categories that are not in the less people are going to buy the console over other offerings, not exactly rocket science.

It doesn't necessarily have to be violent games, what about racing sims, what about strategy games, what about space sims, what about dungeon crawlers, what about stealth games, what about adventure games.

For me a good racing sim is a system seller for me the other games are just a bonus. Gran Turismo sold me on the Playstation ever since the PS1. Final Fantasy used to the the other game, but that turned to shit and went multiplatform.

Kids and the parents of those kids are a huge market. That's not even factoring merchandise. Nintendo just need to reconnect with their audience. Tablets and phones have stolen their attention. I feel the NX will rectify this problem. Honestly Nintendo doesn't need these MATUREZ GAMERZ who really are just a bunch of pompous pricks. The Wii did just fine without them and so will the NX.

So NX will sell as well as Wii?

hmmmm

Maybe...the market needs a shake up. PS4 is the top seller but I feel people are mostly bored by gaming nowadays. It's all the same, nothing new, same games as last gen except worse. It's the perfect time for Nintendo to pull another Wii.

I'm not bored and motion controls certainly didn't make it more interesting for me, from any of the console makers. Console sales for X1/PS4 are over the previous models, so I dont think gamers as a whole are bored either,

I'm glad MS dropped Kinect and Sony seems content at leaving it as an option at best.

Not you, the gamer. Casuals are bored and I'm afraid VR will be the next motion controls.

Splatoon didnt branch out demo wise, Bayonetta is a step in the right direction, but if you think one game is going to make everyone come over, no matter how great it is, you are only kidding yourself

If the casual gamers are bored and not buying any more, that only proves they are not a reliable source of income. I mean the Wii was a fad and once people got tired of it, the sales plummeted whereas the PS3 and Xbox 360 enjoyed strong sales for a longer time. Unless Nintendo pulls a rabbit out of its hat and finally gets that fabled third party support, I'm afraid the NX will be their last entry in the home console market.

Nintendo never takes a risk they can't afford. This is why they don't go out of business. If they listened to half these yahoos on the internet they would have been out of business a long long time ago. There's no such thing as a reliable source of income. The 360 audience didn't move on to the xbox one. The PS3 took many years and reboots to find success and none of it could match what they had with the ps2. Nintendo owned gaming on the SNES and then lost it on the N64. The Wii came and went well so did the xbox 360 gaming audience. The Vita was everything the PSP was and more and that also failed to find it's audience. This so called reliable gaming audience does not exist. Whatever's hot is on top, end of story. Right now that's the PS4. Next gen Sony could be where the xbox one is now, easily, and with little reason.

Considering the Xbox One is selling at a faster or similar pace than the 360, I think you're wrong.

N64 didn't sell as much because it was the Wii U of its time except it was actually quite powerful. 0 third party support and all the games the fans loved moved to Playstation(90% of JRPG's, Street Fighter etc). It's a perfect example of why the more hardcore crowd will come back if they are given what they want.

The PS3 was a year late to the party and initially had nothing over the 360. They kept chugging out games and what do you know, they came back and apparently outsold the 360. It couldn't match the PS1 because it faced much stronger competition. Saturn and N64 were jokes in terms of sales.

I dont think they are capable of making mature games.

Edit: And they would cost a lot whole more to produce than some shitty mascot spinoffs.

Nintendo is a company ran by myopic old men chasing antiquated ideals.

N64 had lacking third party support, but it wasn't zero. By that logic, I guess it was the PlayStation that got the Turok games, the superior version of The World is Not Enough, AKI Wrestlers, and the four quality Star Wars games (Shadows of the Empire, Episode I Racer, Rogue Squadron, Battle for Naboo) and the N64 carts were all but a dream... jeez.

I think super mario 3d world is far more mature than the majority of AAA titles.

Its third party support was definitely stronger than the Wii U but nothing compared to the original PlayStation which had almost all of the SNES big third party franchises.

The hardcore casual crowd, what ever you want to call the dudebros, will never come back. They would rather go PC then go back to that silly Nintendo they spent most there lives making fun of. Wii U had third party, it destroyed it and nobody bought the games. Not even hardcore Nintendo fans bought them games. I refused to buy a Wii U went i saw all them third party games. First thing i thought was why did Nintendo abandon me?

Third Party has made it clear that they will release on the platform that gives them good profit. Same reason third party is moving away from Xbox One some is kinda same reason they moved from Wii U. Sure them console sells of Xbox One look good, but are they buying the games? Why is third party still treating Xbox One that way.

I think third party goes were the people go, third party saw majority bought PS4, so they flock to PS4.

Wii U had third party support? That's news to me. Go on, list the 5-10 games it got from third party publishers in its 3 years on the market.

@Juub1990: Madden, CoD, Tekken, Batman, Need For Speed, Assassins Creed, and Deus Ex.

Nintendo never abandoned you. Maybe it was you who abandoned Nintendo.

#deep

#thinkaboutit

90% consumer desertion rate from the Wii to the WiiU .... something to think about seriously.

Well where's Nintendo's Marvel?

@emgesp:

I don't follow? Marvel has been butchered. All the comic properties have.

Pixar is a subsidiary to Disney. Think of them like one of Nintendo's EAD teams. They have specific task to create animated movies for all age groups. Disney also has Marvel Studios which makes movies for teens and up. The closest thing to a Marvel for Nintendo is Platinum Games, but outside Bayonetta 2 there really isn't any games made specifically for an older audience from Nintendo.

Lastly, Pixar movies are way more emotionally engaging and charming than any Nintendo game.

You would need to have the mind of a child to truly think that.

Gran Turismo, Trials Fusion, Street Fighter V to name a few.

For real?

Disney wouldnt ok an R-Rated movie, Fox ok'd it, they have the rights to it still, Disney can do nothing. Its a big war that continues today. Its one of the reasons some cheered when Fantastic 4 flopped, they were hoping Fox would lose the rights. Deadpools success is pissing a bunch of people off.

@Juub1990: I understand your overall logic but before we diss Nintendo not following current era trends lets be fair.

Nintendo tried , really tried , to appeal to gamers outside the "kiddish" formula with Gamecube. First of all they had RE4/RE remake and RE zero , as exclusives for a long time. One of the most popular franchises of its time plus nowhere near to "kiddish".

Even Zelda TP had a darker tone. Then games like Eternal Darkness , Metroid Prime . Twin Snakes further proves my point.

And guess what , still Gamecube failed..and it did failed hard sales wise. So there was a logic behind Nintendos focus on their more traditional "kiddish" style AAA caliber franchises more than ever with Wii and Wii U if you ask me ...

Its not that i dont agree with you , i feel the same with Nintendo since Wii , but its not that they havent tried to please all in the past ... it just didnt work for them and it might not work in the future as well.

Only children are preoccupied with something they buy watch or play being "mature" or "adult."

So any game that goes out of its way to make the hero super masculine and super mature and super adult to me reeks of the mind of a child. Whereas something that is secure and knows what it is, without apology, is more line with how real adults think. If you think bright colors makes something childish and dark gritty colors makes something adult well then your thinking is more in line with that of a tween or teenager. The ones most concerned with shedding childish things.

C.S. Lewis has the ultimate quote on this subject. This is normal behavior and thinking for children. But adults who are preoccupied with it, this is abnormal and a sign of immaturity on their part.

So yes, a game like mario 3d world, that knows what it is and doesn't apologize for it, is a far more mature game to me than the last of us or gears of war. Games that seem overly preoccupied with being adult while exhibiting the most childish attributes of adulthood. Namely blood, gore, shock value, and cursing.

Yep. Read my explanation above.

They might have to if we see more R-Rated Super Hero movies from other studios. Once a new standard becomes cemented then you either adapt or die. That is one of the big reasons Nintendo is so behind the curve and losing marketshare every generation with the exception of gen 7, they have a huge problem adapting with the times.

2 factors stunted the popularity of the N64 (and Nintendo itself):

Game cost. This hurt both the consumer and the developer. N64 games typically cost $60-$80, adjusted for inflation to a cost of $90-$120 per game. That is a lot of scratch for a kid to come up with. Even with these high price points the publishers didn't enjoy high margins. All cartridges were manufactured by Nintendo themselves, consequently they kept most of the profits. The publisher would only net ~$6-$7 per sale.

Since cartridges were so costly to produce there wasn't as much flexibility to compete on price. PS1 games were $20 to $40 dollars cheaper ($30-$60 adjusted) and because it only cost $3-$5 to produce each PS1 game there was more freedom to flex a price advantage.

tl;dr N64 games were expensive to produce and purchase and afforded little room to maneuver on price.

Adult gaming. I was on the wrong side of the field in this battle. The N64 had a superior pedigree, hardware, and a stable of quality IPs. How could a new comer, sporting delicate and slow spinning discs, possibly compete? As it turns out the PS1 appealed to a much wider demographic. For the first time ever a significant number of adults were spending a lot of time and money on gaming. Suddenly adults were buying consoles for themselves. Gaming was no longer relinquished to the domain of children.

tl:dr Despite having superior hardware and popular established titles the N64 lost 3:1 to an otherwise inferior competitor because they failed to take advantage of the entire market.

I agree with the sentiment that dark and gritty doesnt make something mature, but your conclusion that the lack there of makes it mature is just as valid as saying dark and gritty is mature

Why do you think Nintendo chooses that artstyle? You really think Nintendo makes cutesy and colorful games to appeal to 35 yr old men? No, they choose that palette with the specific goal to appeal to little kids who are especially stimulated by said artstyle.

3D world, like most mario games doesn't preoccupy itself with tutorials. The gameplay comes first. The level design is intricate and challenging. Completing that game requires real time and dedication and skill. Easy to play, difficult to master, to me that's the sign of a mature gameplay experience.

A game made for children would be too easy and provide no challenge or depth. But beware because sometimes even the easiest looking Nintendo game can provide a devilish amount of complexity when you play it for completion. Take Yoshi's Woolly World for example. That game is insanely difficult and nobody warned me before I played it. That's not what I would call a game for children.

If you honestly think Nintendo's main priority isn't to target children then you are just lying to yourself. Just because some Nintendo games can be challenging doesn't change the fact that Nintendo has its sights on children and young teens before anyone else.

Miyamoto pretty much confirmed this last year.

“We are going to be far more aggressive in using our IP, and not just stop with licensing, as in the past. We want our IP to better reach more children, and smart devices is just one vehicle.” — Shigeru Miyamoto

I never said Nintendo didn't target children. Pixar targets children but that doesn't mean Inside Out isn't magnificently layered and complex. Not unlike most Nintendo games, in terms of gameplay.

I guess if someone is looking for a thematic story experience they can play other games or watch a movie or read a novel. I play games to play the game. Not watch the game or feel like I've been cultured in some way.

^ Thats what you just wrote without the bullshit, but thats not how it works.

Next you are gonna tell me amiibos are classical and cultural art pieces.

No. But I see you don't intend to have an actual discussion on my point of view.

@Bread_or_Decide:

There is nothing to discuss on this matter and my reduction of your argument is spot on.

You are just living in the nintendo bubble and it shows.