Why hasn't A.I. become smarter as graphics improve?

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

ragincoley86

[QUOTE="ragincoley86"]

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

Dante2710

Never played it, but how exactly are they more aggressive? I don't see that as a good thing, I see aggressive as them seeking you out and shooting the crap out of you, is that what they do?

[QUOTE="ragincoley86"]

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

Dante2710

Maybe more aggressive but they're not any smarter.Seriously Halo 3 isn't a good example of advanced A.I.Infact for a flagship title the A.I is incredibly lame imo.The friendly A.I is crap.smashing vehicles into nearby scenery and running directly into enemy fire PS1 style.

GEOW is a better example of advances in enemy A.I.

[QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="ragincoley86"]

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

bobbetybob

Never played it, but how exactly are they more aggressive? I don't see that as a good thing, I see aggressive as them seeking you out and shooting the crap out of you, is that what they do?

[QUOTE="bobbetybob"][QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="ragincoley86"]

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

Dante2710

Never played it, but how exactly are they more aggressive? I don't see that as a good thing, I see aggressive as them seeking you out and shooting the crap out of you, is that what they do?

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

[QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="ragincoley86"]

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

stvee101

Maybe more aggressive but they're not any smarter.Seriously Halo 3 isn't a good example of advanced A.I.Infact for a flagship title the A.I is incredibly lame imo.The friendly A.I is crap.smashing vehicles into nearby scenery and running directly into enemy fire PS1 style.

GEOW is a better example of advances in enemy A.I.

I guess because the mayority of devs don't put the same efford towards tweaking the A.I. than towards graphics.

After all graphics will always be more showcasing and impressive for the average gamer, since it's something clearly apparent while the A.I. is something more subtle that only more dedicated gamers tend to appreciate.

You present a great question. The one thing that dissapointed me about Halo 2 / Halo 3 was that the A.I. was almost exactly the same A.I. featured in Halo : CE.

For me Halo : CE and Half-Life are about the only two games I ever got wow'd from the A.I.

I still remember the first time in Half-Life that I ran into the marines. They dropped out of a helicoptor onto the roof, and so naturally I pulled back to the elevator. Well unfortunately for me they took up positions behind cover, and trapped me in the elevator. Then they started chunking grenades in there, and that's when I was like, "Dude wtf, did they just trap me?"

My guess would be that representing the spontaneous reactions of living beings is very complicated. Behaviour isn't something easy to reproduce, so they pretty much have to follow a pattern. Uncharted did a great job on animation blending and all, shame it was just for the main character. Imagine shooting a bullet grapsing the head of theenemy as he goes 0.5 seconds later: "Oh my god! as he falls to the floor, unable to react". All those behaviours would means thousands of animations that no developer wants to do just for the sake of detail. Same reasonw hy Blu-ray isn't having a true advantage: You can put so more stuff than in a DVD9, but are you really going to develop so much time and content?

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

samusarmada

[QUOTE="samusarmada"]

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

Dante2710

Having better and better AI takes a lot of time, is hard to do, and difficult to show people until they already have the game. Making prettier and prettier graphics is very easy and makes for great advertising and PR.

And that doesn't even touch on the fact that AI walks a fine line between being realistic (and boring or too difficult) and being fun (cannon fodder). Many times developers are only concerned about AI being "good enough" to make the game fun and still present some challenge for better gamers.

halo enemy AI is good, but friendlies truly suck. that might just be because they aren't very storng, can't jump 2 metres, etc etc. but i love the way the enemies react on halo: the timeless grenade dive, they regroup, run away (grunts), flank you...crunchUK

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

ragincoley86

simple answer :

1-because the AI wourld hav never improved scince it started (no breakthroughs).

2- because software companies are hiring no gamer engineers who have no idea who is Chun li or Snake.

[QUOTE="samusarmada"]

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

Dante2710

[QUOTE="ragincoley86"]

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

Dante2710

Agression =/= Intelligence.

Not by a long shot.

[QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="samusarmada"]

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

blitzcloud

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

ragincoley86

Halo has a really good AI whcih shined especially with the Elites. Too bad they were removed as badies in Halo 3.

[QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="samusarmada"]

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

smokeydabear076

and the fact that in that particular scenario there were 4 jet-packing brutes, 3 light armoured brutes, 2 hearvy armoured brutes, a wraith, two golden brutes with fuel rod canons and a phantom with reinforcements.

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="samusarmada"]

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

samusarmada

and the fact that in that particular scenario there were 4 jet-packing brutes, 3 light armoured brutes, 2 hearvy armoured brutes, a wraith, two golden brutes with fuel rod canons and a phantom with reinforcements.

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="samusarmada"]

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

samusarmada

and the fact that in that particular scenario there were 4 jet-packing brutes, 3 light armoured brutes, 2 hearvy armoured brutes, a wraith, two golden brutes with fuel rod canons and a phantom with reinforcements.

the AI on halo 3 is terrible. On driving missions on halo 1 I liked going on the turrets on vehicles and shooting. on halo 3 the ai hit everything in the way, then stop infront of the enemys!

[QUOTE="samusarmada"][QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="samusarmada"]

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

Dante2710

and the fact that in that particular scenario there were 4 jet-packing brutes, 3 light armoured brutes, 2 hearvy armoured brutes, a wraith, two golden brutes with fuel rod canons and a phantom with reinforcements.

[QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="samusarmada"][QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="samusarmada"]

They arent really that aggressive in legendary. On the tsavo highway checkpoint they wont come anywhere near you unless you go towards them. Even then you can simply pedle backwards and they wont seek you out, it's quite an easy thing to exploit in that section.

smokeydabear076

and the fact that in that particular scenario there were 4 jet-packing brutes, 3 light armoured brutes, 2 hearvy armoured brutes, a wraith, two golden brutes with fuel rod canons and a phantom with reinforcements.

Actually, AI has improved for the most part. Play FEAR, Crysis, or Halo 3 on Legendary and you'll understand.

It still takes a good developer to make advanced AI though. You'll always see games where your allies or enemies are stupid. It's a matter of programming.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most games with bad A.I. want you to focus more on their Online then story mode.

Condemned is a good example that used clever AI and was creative it had me sppoked and surprised at the things they did such as turning off the lights before you get to an area, run and hide and take alternate routes, and ect. Why cant AI be more like that......

Halo: CE was the last game to really impress me with its AI, that was 7 years ago.samusarmada

FEAR impressed me a lot.

[QUOTE="ragincoley86"]

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

Dante2710

Aggression doesn't mean AI, by the way. Most AI I find play as if they're military robots running drills, they rarely deviate from predictable patterns to beat you. They might be smart patterns like running around corners and flanking you, but they do the similar things.

[QUOTE="samusarmada"]Halo: CE was the last game to really impress me with its AI, that was 7 years ago.mjarantilla

FEAR impressed me a lot.

people have said good things about stalker as well. I'll have to try them out.

[QUOTE="Dante2710"][QUOTE="ragincoley86"]

I have owned a playstation, dreamcast, xbox, gamecube, and now I own a 360. Over the years I've seen graphics improve and.....that's about it. Sure games now are good and some of them are great but A.I. isn't. When you have difficulty levels, such as easy and hard, the difference shouldn't be on easy it takes 5 hits to die and hard it takes 3. The A.I. should get smarter on harder levels or they could have improve A.I. for boss battles. For now, I have no problem with online being the main source of competition because there's no substitute for playing against a human. With the power of the 360 and ps3 I'm sure some aspects should get better??

thrones

Aggression doesn't mean AI, by the way. Most AI I find play as if they're military robots running drills, they rarely deviate from predictable patterns to beat you. They might be smart patterns like running around corners and flanking you, but they do the similar things.

Good AI in shooters is a matter of sleight-of-hand. If the characters move and act realistically, it's "good AI," even if they make dumb decisions. FEAR and Crysis have this kind of AI. The enemies are pretty dumb, but they keep on moving and keep on reacting to your actions, and they have a much wider range of movement and reactions than enemies in lesser games (like Halo and COD). So, people perceive that they have better AI.

AI is much more difficult and requires much more talent.Dreams-Visions

Because AI is completely unrelated to graphics.

And because it's a lot harder to make AI better without making it cheap

AI isn't really relative to processing power, it's down to the person that wrote it, if they aren't good at it, the AI will be awful. It's very difficult to write smart AI.ithilgore2006

lol its very difficult to write ANY AI. Programming is the hardest part of game development, hence why they get paid the most.

Guess it's just too complicated to make great ai lot of work involved.