Why Japanese Games Are Breaking Up With the West (1up)

The thread screams nothing but blindness... If you think about it there are 2 Japanese systems that are dominating worldwide. Genres such as fighting, action-adventure, RPG, and racing are dominated by Japanese games. The only thing western games are dominating are RTS and shooters.Bazooka_4ME

[QUOTE="Bazooka_4ME"]The thread screams nothing but blindness... If you think about it there are 2 Japanese systems that are dominating worldwide. Genres such as fighting, action-adventure, RPG, and racing are dominated by Japanese games. The only thing western games are dominating are RTS and shooters.heretrix

If anything, its the west that's changed. In the 90s and for the greater part of the past era, it wasn't a worry if games were "too Japanese" or not like we seem to worry about now. The cultural differences were accepted with Japanese games, quirks and all, skyrocketed in popularity.

Recently, however, the west has been distancing itself from Japan and in turn Japan has been unable to produce the same cultural output in terms of games that they had before.

I actually agree with you completely. I disagree with the article in that tastes in the two regions have diverged recently. That is BS. The tastes in the two regions have always been very different but big Japanese companies were still able to make their mark in the NA market regardless.

But what HAS changed this gen is that since Squaresoft became Square/Enix, the majority of games they put out now are not that good compared to past games - FF being a prime example.

As you have said, the innovation just isn't there. With the PS1 and PS2, Japanese devs ruled much of the top games with FPS still being the big NA genre. But years and years of releasing the exact same game (or clone) over and over, with little to no innovation in gameplay, storytelling, plot, etc has turned off even some of the biggest long time supporters.

I look at my own gaming habbits over the past decade +. My collection went from RE, SH, FF, MGS, JRPGs, Fighters to Open-world, action adventure, WRPGs, etc. My tastes aren't any different than they were in the past, but what HAS changed is my lack of desire to buy yet another RE game when the story hasn't changed one bit since RE1 and the gameplay took a drastic fall with RE5. SH has sucked, in my opinion, and while the first 3 are still some of my favorite games of all time, the others are not good at all. Square I already touched on, but other JRPGs are stuck in the early 90s. Why would I buy yet another JRPG when I can just plug in my past console and play the older version?

Meanwhile, as much as I liked MGS4, the whole series turned off tons of gamers with its crazy/wierd story and countless hours of movie watching instead of actual gameplay. And Devil May Cry has also gone from an innovative game to trash.

Finally, the NA audience has always loved FPS games and that is just a genre that Japanese devs don't seem that interested in because their own home market isn't.

Japan has always been about tradition. When those gamign traditions were first being brought over to NA in droves, back in the PS1/PS2 days, people were amazed. But that amazement quickly shifted to apathy as years went by and the game seemed to stay the same.

ZIMdoom

Give me break, you're talking about a couple of japanese companies that failed this generation with rehashed games (and rightfully so), but you're ignoring the other ones that succeded with quality games.

Just like I could single out the CoD milkage, how Bioware diluted the RPG genre (and now people don't even have a clue about what a RPG is) and uses the same rehashed back bone of a story (they haven't really changed anything since BG1) with a cliche infected plot, how western devs rely on shooters so heavily up to a point were they will change a well estableshed IP (X COM), or hell, maybe other people out there that aren't that familiar with western gaming are just thinking about Activision and Microsoft and generalizing thinking "this is western gaming".

Each side has its demons. But at the same thing, each side has its diamonds.

Dang it.

That means, No Final Fantasy, Resident Evil, Street Fighter, Ninja Gaiden, Dead or Alive, Monster Hunter, Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Tales, Golden Sun, Ace Attorney, Megaman, Kingdom Hearts, BlazBlue, King of Fighters, Samurai Shodown, etc....

[QUOTE="Bazooka_4ME"]The thread screams nothing but blindness... If you think about it there are 2 Japanese systems that are dominating worldwide. Genres such as fighting, action-adventure, RPG, and racing are dominated by Japanese games. The only thing western games are dominating are RTS and shooters.DarkLink77

But the vast majority of all retail RPGs released are Japanese.

[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Japanese developers as a whole haven't kept up with the development and innovations of developers from the rest of the world. Pretty much that simple.finalfantasy94

As you have said, the innovation just isn't there. With the PS1 and PS2, Japanese devs ruled much of the top games with FPS still being the big NA genre. But years and years of releasing the exact same game (or clone) over and over, with little to no innovation in gameplay, storytelling, plot, etc has turned off even some of the biggest long time supporters.

You act like jpn is the only one gulity of clone thing. Also I havent seen huge innovation on the west part ether. You just feel they make good game and jpn doesint now. That is all.

I would argue the merging of PC with console genres, is a type of innovation. I would argue that taking the GTA mold and applying it to games like Read Dead Redemption, was innovation. I would argue that effectively merging a movie/entertainment experience with great gameplay as Uncharted does, is innovation. As long as these things, and more, continue to stay fresh enough to be entertaining to gamers, gamers will continue buying them.

It appears to me that the Japanese market has failed in this regard. Sure, if one wants to extremely oversimplify, then we've all been playing the same games since Castle Wolfenstein or Super Mario, etc. But that is missing the main point...that people want to new ideas, even small ones, that keep recurring ideas fresh or that inspire new "wow" moments in the games they play.

Give me break, you're talking about a couple of japanese companies that failed this generation with rehashed games (and rightfully so), but you're ignoring the other ones that succeded with quality games.

Just like I could single out the CoD milkage, how Bioware diluted the RPG genre (and now people don't even have a clue about what a RPG is) and uses the same rehashed back bone of a story (they haven't really changed anything since BG1) with a cliche infected plot, how western devs rely on shooters so heavily up to a point were they will change a well estableshed IP (X COM), or hell, maybe other people out there that aren't that familiar with western gaming are just thinking about Activision and Microsoft and generalizing thinking "this is western gaming".

Each side has its demons. But at the same thing, each side has its diamonds.

Lucianu

Sure, there are diamonds and demons. But the Japanese diamonds aren't the massive blockbusters they used to be. Those blockbusters are now coming out of Europe or NA.

But the article in question is why the seemingly large shift in popularity or massive success from Japanese games to western games. The article says people's tastes have changed and as someone gaming for 3 decades now, I don't believe that at all. People's tastes are pretty much the same as always. The issue is that any market will only support a certain product as long as they see a reason to buy it over a new product. Clearly, by and large, the mass gaming audience doesn't feel that buying the next JRPG or whatever is as palatable as it used to be. HOwever, they still believe that buying the newest Call of Duty IS worth the money.

FPS has been popular since the internet has risen in popularity. And more popular on consoles as consoles have moved more to the net as well. But action/adventure is just as popular as always, RPGs are still very popular as well. But people want more customization or interaction or control in RPGs.

Hell, just look at Nintendo even. They make a ton of money off their hardware these days and making games seems secondary. INstead they just keep pumping out the same games over and over. People still love those TYPES of games, and still admit the gameplay is great, but their interest in paying money for yet another Mario, Zelda, etc. is waning. And I think the slowly slumping sales for these big name titles speaks volumes.

[QUOTE="finalfantasy94"]

[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"]

As you have said, the innovation just isn't there. With the PS1 and PS2, Japanese devs ruled much of the top games with FPS still being the big NA genre. But years and years of releasing the exact same game (or clone) over and over, with little to no innovation in gameplay, storytelling, plot, etc has turned off even some of the biggest long time supporters.

ZIMdoom

You act like jpn is the only one gulity of clone thing. Also I havent seen huge innovation on the west part ether. You just feel they make good game and jpn doesint now. That is all.

I would argue the merging of PC with console genres, is a type of innovation. I would argue that taking the GTA mold and applying it to games like Read Dead Redemption, was innovation. I would argue that effectively merging a movie/entertainment experience with great gameplay as Uncharted does, is innovation. As long as these things, and more, continue to stay fresh enough to be entertaining to gamers, gamers will continue buying them.

It appears to me that the Japanese market has failed in this regard. Sure, if one wants to extremely oversimplify, then we've all been playing the same games since Castle Wolfenstein or Super Mario, etc. But that is missing the main point...that people want to new ideas, even small ones, that keep recurring ideas fresh or that inspire new "wow" moments in the games they play.

Im sorry but those are terrible examples of innovation. Putting something on PC then on consoles or vice versa is not innovation. Making gta in the wild west is not innovation its just changing a scenirio. Making really nice graphics and cutscenes is not innovation.

[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]

If anything, its the west that's changed. In the 90s and for the greater part of the past era, it wasn't a worry if games were "too Japanese" or not like we seem to worry about now. The cultural differences were accepted with Japanese games, quirks and all, skyrocketed in popularity.

Recently, however, the west has been distancing itself from Japan and in turn Japan has been unable to produce the same cultural output in terms of games that they had before.

AncientDozer

Japan has produced an equivalent amount of output from previous generations...

The only thing that's changed in the Japanese market is a paradigm shift away from the console and towards the handheld.

I really don't know what's wrong with Americans today.

It's almost like an anti-Japanese bias is developing in western culture, where Americans are getting increasingly intolerant of anything Japanese.

Well, if Americans can no longer tolerate the eccentricity and quirkiness of Japanese game design it's too bad for them, because they're missing out on excellent stories, gripping gameplay, and revolutionary game designs.

[QUOTE="ActionRemix"]

Anime appeals to westerners if the weeaboo stuff is left out.

el3m2tigre

What do you mean by that?

If you've played Metal Gear Solid, Otacon is a weeaboo.

Anime turns off most Americans when it tries to be softcore hentai.

[QUOTE="el3m2tigre"]

[QUOTE="ActionRemix"]

Anime appeals to westerners if the weeaboo stuff is left out.

ActionRemix

What do you mean by that?

If you've played Metal Gear Solid, Otacon is a weeaboo.

Anime turns off most Americans when it tries to be softcore hentai.

I'd say the main reason Japanese games tend to flop in the west is because the content doesn't appeal to the west.

Can't say I'm surprised. Most Japanese games I've seen localized recently had at least one of these:

1. fan service (creepy upskirts, bouncy body parts, female characters wearing next to nothing, etc.)

2. "sexy" characters that look ~10 years old

3. Characters wearing animal costumes (bunny ears, cat ears, cat tails, etc.)

4. weird stuff in general

There just isn't an audience for this in the west.

.

.

There's no underlying hidden reason. No analysis needed. There's just not a demand for this content outside of Japan. It's that simple.

Japanese developers as a whole haven't kept up with the development and innovations of developers from the rest of the world. Pretty much that simple.KC_Hokie

I don't understand what the big deal is. The Western world has different tastes than the Eastern World. I think that's pretty obvious, or should be by now.

The Western world isn't interested in pink-haired, orange-eyed anime'ish looking characters. I don't care how good the game is. I'm not knocking their styles that they use, but the vast majority of western gamers just don't like or want that. If they did, there wouldn't be a problem. Not to mention, the game genre's the Japanese developersusuallywork with are also not favored in the west imo.

The JP's companies that are successful actually make games that the Western world wants, they don't force unwanted products down our throats and then cry about them not selling afterwards. If worse came to worse, they could just hire Western Developers and publish the titles.... ya know, kind've like what Nintendo and Retro have going on.

Interesting read. I kind of recognise the issue as, looking at my gaming habits over the years, I went from playing 80% Japanese games to like 5%. It also has a lot to do with how the markets evolved, like the article mentions. Though me switching from Nintendo consoles to PC has more to do with Nintendo's changing business model (and target audience) than it does with a growing cultural gap.

By the way, I found the comment on that executive calling BioShock 'cheap' very interesting, as it goes to show how differently Europeans and North Americans perceive and experience games from Japanese: I had the exact same sentiment when I played Silent Hill 3.

boo hoo, bye bye. I've come to dislike Japanese games. Too much adherence to a formula developed in the late eighties and early nineties. I played all those old game when they were new, and I'm over them. It's been decades, it's time to change it up a bit.

[QUOTE="ActionRemix"]

[QUOTE="el3m2tigre"]

What do you mean by that?

Bigboi500

If you've played Metal Gear Solid, Otacon is a weeaboo.

Anime turns off most Americans when it tries to be softcore hentai.

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]

[QUOTE="ActionRemix"]

If you've played Metal Gear Solid, Otacon is a weeaboo.

Anime turns off most Americans when it tries to be softcore hentai.

Riverwolf007