Will Nintendo franchises ever become irrelevant?

I saw this thread on NeoGAF, which was asking if Nintendo franchises will ever go out of styIe and become irrelevant, and I decided to see what System Wars thinks of this.

Nintendo has done an amazing job- it has remained relevant for twnety five years. Franchises such as Mario, Zelda, Donkey Kong, Pokemon, Mario Kart and Kirb have all remained consistent for over two decades, and have retained and expanded their fanbase.

There are of course those that like to state that Nintendo games are only ever as highly received as they are because of 'nostalgia-' to them I ask, why didn't nostalgia help franchises like Castlevania? Megaman? Sonic? The fact is that Nintendo remains relevant because all of its games are consistently high quality.

But really System Wars, how long do you think Nintendo franchises can continue to stay relevant? And for those franchises that are now, for all intents and purposes, dead (such as Star Fox, F-Zero and Metroid), what 'reboot' or 're-invention' would you suggest to make them relevant again?

F-Zero and Star Fox are largely irrelevant. Metroid is on the verge.foxhound_fox

I think it's quite sad to see that I once thought Metroid was part of the Big 3 of Nintendo (Along with Mario and Zelda.)

Turns out it was Pokemon and the Metroid Games really don't meet up with the Sales that Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon get.

Take starfox off the rails, nintendo had like the most obvious, well received game they could copy a formula exclusively on their own console yet never took the opportunity to learn from it and use some ideas.

F-zero as far as I'm concerned, has no way back into this.

Metroid just needs a change of formula or something to help it on its way. Improved combat and strong exploration elements would do wonders, HD graphics would also benefit the game.

As far as the others go, I have no idea, I'd like for zeldas to be more like MM but with improved combat and more freedom. This artificial barriers nonsense needs to stop. DK already got reboot and they won't change mario so whatever with that.

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]F-Zero and Star Fox are largely irrelevant. Metroid is on the verge.charizard1605

Take starfox off the rails, nintendo had like the most obvious, well received game they could copy a formula exclusively on their own console yet never took the opportunity to learn from it and use some ideas.

F-zero as far as I'm concerned, has no way back into this.

Metroid just needs a change of formula or something to help it on its way. Improved combat and strong exploration elements would do wonders, HD graphics would also benefit the game.

As far as the others go, I have no idea, I'd like for zeldas to be more like MM but with improved combat and more freedom. This artificial barriers nonsense needs to stop. DK already got reboot and they won't change mario so whatever with that.

GD1551

For Starfox Nintendo should go the "Rouge Squadron" Route. It would make the game so much more awesome.

For Metroid they just need to Fuse Prime and the 2D Metroids together. Other M they were getting to the right direction, they just needed more exploration.

F-Zero, They should just reboot it.

[QUOTE="charizard1605"][QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]F-Zero and Star Fox are largely irrelevant. Metroid is on the verge.call_of_duty_10

How good do you think those 2 DS games were?

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

Take starfox off the rails, nintendo had like the most obvious, well received game they could copy a formula exclusively on their own console yet never took the opportunity to learn from it and use some ideas.

F-zero as far as I'm concerned, has no way back into this.

Metroid just needs a change of formula or something to help it on its way. Improved combat and strong exploration elements would do wonders, HD graphics would also benefit the game.

As far as the others go, I have no idea, I'd like for zeldas to be more like MM but with improved combat and more freedom. This artificial barriers nonsense needs to stop. DK already got reboot and they won't change mario so whatever with that.

LegatoSkyheart

For Starfox Nintendo should go the "Rouge Squadron" Route. It would make the game so much more awesome.

For Metroid they just need to Fuse Prime and the 2D Metroids together. Other M they were getting to the right direction, they just needed more exploration.

F-Zero, They should just reboot it.

Rogue Squadron was the exact game I was talking about.

Sadly, gamers think Nintendo's franchises share Sonic's relevancy and have been that way since 1996. They don't care how the game is praised and they don't care if the game sells well, and thus, they consider those series dead.

Rogue Squadron was the exact game I was talking about.

GD1551

And I was agreeing with you! :D

Although it wasn't exactly a "Nintendo" game.

If they ever start losing their quality then perhaps.

[QUOTE="LegatoSkyheart"]

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

Take starfox off the rails, nintendo had like the most obvious, well received game they could copy a formula exclusively on their own console yet never took the opportunity to learn from it and use some ideas.

F-zero as far as I'm concerned, has no way back into this.

Metroid just needs a change of formula or something to help it on its way. Improved combat and strong exploration elements would do wonders, HD graphics would also benefit the game.

As far as the others go, I have no idea, I'd like for zeldas to be more like MM but with improved combat and more freedom. This artificial barriers nonsense needs to stop. DK already got reboot and they won't change mario so whatever with that.

GD1551

For Starfox Nintendo should go the "Rouge Squadron" Route. It would make the game so much more awesome.

For Metroid they just need to Fuse Prime and the 2D Metroids together. Other M they were getting to the right direction, they just needed more exploration.

F-Zero, They should just reboot it.

Rogue Squadron was the exact game I was talking about.

Sadly, gamers think Nintendo's franchises share Sonic's relevancy and have been that way since 1996. They don't care how the game is praised and they don't care if the game sells well, and thus, they consider those series dead.

nintendoboy16

About as irrelevant as Sesame Street and the Muppets.percech

About as irrelevant as Sesame Street and the Muppets.percech

[QUOTE="percech"]About as irrelevant as Sesame Street and the Muppets.charizard1605

About as irrelevant as Sesame Street and the Muppets.percech

[QUOTE="percech"]About as irrelevant as Sesame Street and the Muppets.ImSwordMan

Seeing how younger players don't care for Nintendo games and only nostalgia blind gamers praise every new Nintendo game like the second comming, I can see the nostalgia guys dying away with the time

[QUOTE="ImSwordMan"][QUOTE="percech"]About as irrelevant as Sesame Street and the Muppets.percech

Sadly, gamers think Nintendo's franchises share Sonic's relevancy and have been that way since 1996. They don't care how the game is praised and they don't care if the game sells well, and thus, they consider those series dead.

nintendoboy16

[QUOTE="percech"][QUOTE="ImSwordMan"] so loved by everyone?ImSwordMan

How long has Sesame Street been around for? The topic title says "ever," so it's fair to say that it could die down in, I don't know, 1000 years.

The topic is stupid to begin with as it's nearly impossible to foreseegoogol-plex years into the future, like the topic creator expects us to.

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"]

Sadly, gamers think Nintendo's franchises share Sonic's relevancy and have been that way since 1996. They don't care how the game is praised and they don't care if the game sells well, and thus, they consider those series dead.

ImSwordMan

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]F-Zero and Star Fox are largely irrelevant. Metroid is on the verge.charizard1605

[QUOTE="charizard1605"][QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]F-Zero and Star Fox are largely irrelevant. Metroid is on the verge.campzor

[QUOTE="charizard1605"][QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]F-Zero and Star Fox are largely irrelevant. Metroid is on the verge.campzor

really? there were fzero games on Gamecube? wow..nintendo , u failed at marketing!campzor

I knew there was one.Don't know about the other ones though. (not that I'm an F-Zero fan or anything)

really? there were fzero games on Gamecube? wow..nintendo , u failed at marketing!campzor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzUeddOOv7k

Then again, it was a gen where things were getting even worse for Nintendo.

As long as they make good games I don't see how they can become irrelevant. They don't have many milkage titles.
Pokemon gets milked bigtime, so I can see that disappearing.

The word irrelevant is a bit silly when you think about on this topic. If a game sells over a million units it is not irrelevant. Nearly all Nintendo games do this without any issues. They will always be relevant. When you have so many IPs some will have ups and downs that hardly makes those series irrelevant becuase they have the ability to resurrect any of those games at anytime they choose to. I'm sure most developers wished they had as many IPs to pull from.

Mario has already become irrelevant for me. Their main franchises are from NES. Let's stop beating a dead horse.

I dont still support Nintendo because of its franchises, I support Nintendo because they seem to be one of the only developers with even an ounce of creativity left. These days games have been getting dumbed down and simplified with every release. They hold your hands the whole way through, and most are the same ol' repetitive shooters. Don't get me wrong, Nintendo isnt the only company with creativity, who make games I love, but most off these mainstream crap I hate.

Games are taking less time to make, this means that they have less quality. I will rue the day if Nintendo ever stops taking so long to release a zelda. I even lost faith in the AC series to be an awesome franchise after they now kept releasing a game yearly. Square (who become crap after FFX mind you) is even falling prey to the money making buisness of making these dumbed down games.

Heck, even Nintendos been weakened by the mainstream fashion. In Ocarina of Time 3DS they added a stupid feature where you can go near your house and click on this stone and ask for help and it'd tell you exactly what to do. The game was supposed to be hard and it ishard. Why did they have to ruin the experince for those who will ask for help? Themain point of zelda is to figure out how to do it yourself.

I dont still support Nintendo because of its franchises, I support Nintendo because they seem to be one of the only developers with even an ounce of creativity left. These days games have been getting dumbed down and simplified with every release. They hold your hands the whole way through, and most are the same ol' repetitive shooters. Don't get me wrong, Nintendo isnt the only company with creativity, who make games I love, but most off these mainstream crap I hate.

Games are taking less time to make, this means that they have less quality. I will rue the day if Nintendo ever stops taking so long to release a zelda. I even lost faith in the AC series to be an awesome franchise after they now kept releasing a game yearly. Square (who become crap after FFX mind you) is even falling prey to the money making buisness of making these dumbed down games.

Heck, even Nintendos been weakened by the mainstream fashion. In Ocarina of Time 3DS they added a stupid feature where you can go near your house and click on this stone and ask for help and it'd tell you exactly what to do. The game was supposed to be hard and it ishard. Why did they have to ruin the experince for those who will ask for help? Themain point of zelda is to figure out how to do it yourself.

simomate

Your objectivity is refreshing. Square needs to get their act together and stop making garbage.

I only slightly disagree with one thing. Their creativity within games is astounding (Galaxy!), but the overall franchise is very very old. Although Mario games are consistently solid, Mario spinoffs and the same old goomba enemies is tiring.

Now that I think about it, Nintendo is one of the best when it comes down to time between sequels. I hate yearly releases. I agree with AC. I'm a diehard fan, but Brotherhood and Revelations are almost identical.

As long as they make good games I don't see how they can become irrelevant. They don't have many milkage titles.
Pokemon gets milked bigtime, so I can see that disappearing.

KungfuKitten

I thought Nintendo would expand upon Rare's "Starfox Adventures" for GCN. I thought that game rocked. Even the Assault series was.. it could of used improvement but I for one loved taking control of Fox outside the Arwing. (Is that what they're called? I can't believe I may have forgotten.) I think they need to take Fox out of the Arwing for a bit in some of the games, while at the same time keepingsegments that have thegreat feeling of combat in the Arwing.

As for Metroid? Hmm..I think they should make a 2D Side scroller for the WiiU. More in the form of Super Metroid. Not a remake, but keep that exploration a factor, and maybe throw in a few bells and whistles for good measure. The DK:Returnsdid pretty well didn't it? I haven't played Other M so I can't comment on how that went. All I know is the first person exploration the Prime series did extremely well has run it's course.

I don't think they will ever become irrelevant as I think Nintendo will always have a large, dedicated fanbase. If they could spend more $$ on marketing I think they could have more success.

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

Take starfox off the rails, nintendo had like the most obvious, well received game they could copy a formula exclusively on their own console yet never took the opportunity to learn from it and use some ideas.

F-zero as far as I'm concerned, has no way back into this.

Metroid just needs a change of formula or something to help it on its way. Improved combat and strong exploration elements would do wonders, HD graphics would also benefit the game.

As far as the others go, I have no idea, I'd like for zeldas to be more like MM but with improved combat and more freedom. This artificial barriers nonsense needs to stop. DK already got reboot and they won't change mario so whatever with that.

LegatoSkyheart

For Starfox Nintendo should go the "Rouge Squadron" Route. It would make the game so much more awesome.

For Metroid they just need to Fuse Prime and the 2D Metroids together. Other M they were getting to the right direction, they just needed more exploration.

F-Zero, They should just reboot it.

I think the only reason they havn't done a new F-Zero game is because they'd feel the need to put motion controls on that wouldn't work. Maybe on the Wii U, they may. I hope Sega does it again though.

[QUOTE="LegatoSkyheart"]

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

Take starfox off the rails, nintendo had like the most obvious, well received game they could copy a formula exclusively on their own console yet never took the opportunity to learn from it and use some ideas.

F-zero as far as I'm concerned, has no way back into this.

Metroid just needs a change of formula or something to help it on its way. Improved combat and strong exploration elements would do wonders, HD graphics would also benefit the game.

As far as the others go, I have no idea, I'd like for zeldas to be more like MM but with improved combat and more freedom. This artificial barriers nonsense needs to stop. DK already got reboot and they won't change mario so whatever with that.

HalcyonScarlet

For Starfox Nintendo should go the "Rouge Squadron" Route. It would make the game so much more awesome.

For Metroid they just need to Fuse Prime and the 2D Metroids together. Other M they were getting to the right direction, they just needed more exploration.

F-Zero, They should just reboot it.

I think the only reason they havn't done a new F-Zero game is because they'd feel the need to put motion controls on that wouldn't work. Maybe on the Wii U, they may. I hope Sega does it again though.

[QUOTE="HalcyonScarlet"]

[QUOTE="LegatoSkyheart"]

For Starfox Nintendo should go the "Rouge Squadron" Route. It would make the game so much more awesome.

For Metroid they just need to Fuse Prime and the 2D Metroids together. Other M they were getting to the right direction, they just needed more exploration.

F-Zero, They should just reboot it.

nintendoboy16

I think the only reason they havn't done a new F-Zero game is because they'd feel the need to put motion controls on that wouldn't work. Maybe on the Wii U, they may. I hope Sega does it again though.

Why, what did he say? :(

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"][QUOTE="HalcyonScarlet"]

I think the only reason they havn't done a new F-Zero game is because they'd feel the need to put motion controls on that wouldn't work. Maybe on the Wii U, they may. I hope Sega does it again though.

HalcyonScarlet

Why, what did he say? :(

Entertainment Weekly (Geoff Keighley): You've had great success in your ability to predict what players will find fun to play. Have there been games that you thought would be fun but didn't turn out that way?

Shigeru Miyamoto: Yes, that has definitely happened. In the past we've worked with some outside development houses on titles like F-Zero and Starfox — and let me just say that we were disappointed with the results. Consumers got very excited about the idea of those games, but the games themselves did not deliver. And, well, to be honest with you, Zelda: Twilight Princess is not doing very well at all in Japan. It is very disappointing. But it is doing okay here in America.

[QUOTE="HalcyonScarlet"]

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"]After Miyamoto's negative stance on F-Zero GX, it won't happen.nintendoboy16

Why, what did he say? :(

Entertainment Weekly (Geoff Keighley): You've had great success in your ability to predict what players will find fun to play. Have there been games that you thought would be fun but didn't turn out that way?

Shigeru Miyamoto: Yes, that has definitely happened. In the past we've worked with some outside development houses on titles like F-Zero and Starfox — and let me just say that we were disappointed with the results. Consumers got very excited about the idea of those games, but the games themselves did not deliver. And, well, to be honest with you, Zelda: Twilight Princess is not doing very well at all in Japan. It is very disappointing. But it is doing okay here in America.

But F-Zero GX was awesome :(. He just doesn't like anything that isn't in house. He practically said DKC was all graphics. I just think he feels threatened when franchises he has been involved with in the past have come out well from others.

F-Zero GX was one of the few GC that blew me away. The graphics were stunning, the speed was amazing, and I like the sense of aero dynamics that were added when your making jumps, it adds a bit more technical depth to the gameplay. Plus I love that added Arcade feel that Sega puts in its games.

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"]

[QUOTE="HalcyonScarlet"]

Why, what did he say? :(

HalcyonScarlet

Entertainment Weekly (Geoff Keighley): You've had great success in your ability to predict what players will find fun to play. Have there been games that you thought would be fun but didn't turn out that way?

Shigeru Miyamoto: Yes, that has definitely happened. In the past we've worked with some outside development houses on titles like F-Zero and Starfox — and let me just say that we were disappointed with the results. Consumers got very excited about the idea of those games, but the games themselves did not deliver. And, well, to be honest with you, Zelda: Twilight Princess is not doing very well at all in Japan. It is very disappointing. But it is doing okay here in America.

But F-Zero GX was awesome :(. He just doesn't like anything that isn't in house. He practically said DKC was all graphics. I just think he feels threatened when franchises he has been involved with in the past have come out well from others.

F-Zero GX was one of the few GC that blew me away. The graphics were stunning, the speed was amazing, and I like the sense of aero dynamics that were added when your making jumps, it adds a bit more technical depth to the gameplay. Plus I love that added Arcade feel that Sega puts in its games.

IGN: I was interviewing them earlier, and even though you weren't directly involved you were definitely very inspirational in making sure certain things were done in that game correctly. I'm wondering, which parts of Donkey Kong Country did you like versus not like? And what did you address with them?

Miyamoto: The first point that I want to make is that I actually worked very closely with Rare on the original Donkey Kong Country. And apparently recently some rumor got out that I didn't really like that game? I just want to clarify that that's not the case, because I was very involved in that. And even emailing almost daily with Tim Stamper right up until the end.

And with this game too, I'll be involved on a check/confirmation level, looking over the game and checking the content. So it'll probably be a similar role to what I played in the development of Donkey Kong Jungle Beat.

In terms of things that I really wanted to see them focus on, particularly was the idea that in the original Donkey Kong Country the rendering and the effects that they used were very different from what you'd see in a Mario game. It had a very distinct feel. I thought it was important for them to keep that in mind. And also the fun of seeing the motion of that Donkey Kong hand slap is something that you don't get in other games as well.

[QUOTE="HalcyonScarlet"]

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"]It's from here: http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20037961,00.html

Entertainment Weekly (Geoff Keighley): You've had great success in your ability to predict what players will find fun to play. Have there been games that you thought would be fun but didn't turn out that way?

Shigeru Miyamoto: Yes, that has definitely happened. In the past we've worked with some outside development houses on titles like F-Zero and Starfox — and let me just say that we were disappointed with the results. Consumers got very excited about the idea of those games, but the games themselves did not deliver. And, well, to be honest with you, Zelda: Twilight Princess is not doing very well at all in Japan. It is very disappointing. But it is doing okay here in America.

nintendoboy16

But F-Zero GX was awesome :(. He just doesn't like anything that isn't in house. He practically said DKC was all graphics. I just think he feels threatened when franchises he has been involved with in the past have come out well from others.

F-Zero GX was one of the few GC that blew me away. The graphics were stunning, the speed was amazing, and I like the sense of aero dynamics that were added when your making jumps, it adds a bit more technical depth to the gameplay. Plus I love that added Arcade feel that Sega puts in its games.

IGN: I was interviewing them earlier, and even though you weren't directly involved you were definitely very inspirational in making sure certain things were done in that game correctly. I'm wondering, which parts of Donkey Kong Country did you like versus not like? And what did you address with them?

Miyamoto: The first point that I want to make is that I actually worked very closely with Rare on the original Donkey Kong Country. And apparently recently some rumor got out that I didn't really like that game? I just want to clarify that that's not the case, because I was very involved in that. And even emailing almost daily with Tim Stamper right up until the end.

And with this game too, I'll be involved on a check/confirmation level, looking over the game and checking the content. So it'll probably be a similar role to what I played in the development of Donkey Kong Jungle Beat.

In terms of things that I really wanted to see them focus on, particularly was the idea that in the original Donkey Kong Country the rendering and the effects that they used were very different from what you'd see in a Mario game. It had a very distinct feel. I thought it was important for them to keep that in mind. And also the fun of seeing the motion of that Donkey Kong hand slap is something that you don't get in other games as well.

http://www.metro.co.uk/ DKC Returns review. [sorry can't link, the html error comes up :roll:]

"'Donkey Kong Country proves that players will put up with mediocre gameplay as long as the art is good' - Shigeru Miyamoto.*

That infamous quote has been retracted many times, and attributed to Miyamoto's frustration at having his vision for Yoshi's Island questioned."

-

While sources say he tried or has retraced the comment (this next part is my opinion), I often feel what people say in anger or frustration can often be the truth about how they feel.

[QUOTE="simomate"]

I dont still support Nintendo because of its franchises, I support Nintendo because they seem to be one of the only developers with even an ounce of creativity left. These days games have been getting dumbed down and simplified with every release. They hold your hands the whole way through, and most are the same ol' repetitive shooters. Don't get me wrong, Nintendo isnt the only company with creativity, who make games I love, but most off these mainstream crap I hate.

Games are taking less time to make, this means that they have less quality. I will rue the day if Nintendo ever stops taking so long to release a zelda. I even lost faith in the AC series to be an awesome franchise after they now kept releasing a game yearly. Square (who become crap after FFX mind you) is even falling prey to the money making buisness of making these dumbed down games.

Heck, even Nintendos been weakened by the mainstream fashion. In Ocarina of Time 3DS they added a stupid feature where you can go near your house and click on this stone and ask for help and it'd tell you exactly what to do. The game was supposed to be hard and it ishard. Why did they have to ruin the experince for those who will ask for help? Themain point of zelda is to figure out how to do it yourself.

lild1425

Your objectivity is refreshing. Square needs to get their act together and stop making garbage.

I only slightly disagree with one thing. Their creativity within games is astounding (Galaxy!), but the overall franchise is very very old. Although Mario games are consistently solid, Mario spinoffs and the same old goomba enemies is tiring.

Now that I think about it, Nintendo is one of the best when it comes down to time between sequels. I hate yearly releases. I agree with AC. I'm a diehard fan, but Brotherhood and Revelations are almost identical.

why pump money into creating new franchises when you have solid ones that have time and time again managed to reinvent themselves from a gameplay standpoint it makes little to no sense.