Xbox 360 disc scratches. Microsoft's fault?

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge, someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.Mandingo101

Can I get a detailed copy of MS's accounting books that you obviously have to make these claims. I mean you know exactly how much they make and how much up keep costs, so you MUST have some sort of inside knowledge, right?

[QUOTE="Fruity_Fantasy"][QUOTE="whitetiger3521"][QUOTE="Fruity_Fantasy"]

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]Microsoft should ensure they use good quality parts when making the console.def_mode

SOny should do that as well since they are a hardware company.

Obviously they have :|

How so? Haven't heard about the laptop batteries recently or Ken Kutargi making a statement about how Sony hardware may not be up to par. Or the Ps3 controller randomly having disconnectioning issues?

Sony hasn't learned either and they are "a hardware company"

theres no "perfecr company" okay? everyone makes mistakes.

Well people should start holding MS to those same standards then and stop expecting them to be perfect.... 

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge,  someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.Mandingo101

If you want to talk about things that are a rip off It is going to be a pretty big list. The list of things that are not a rip off will be shorter. Almost anything you can name is a ripoff if you look at it a certain way.

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge, someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.snyper1982

Can I get a detailed copy of MS's accounting books that you obviously have to make these claims. I mean you know exactly how much they make and how much up keep costs, so you MUST have some sort of inside knowledge, right?

It's about time that Microsoft took some of the blame instead of pushing it off as Consumer Error.Telekill

Omg the lemmings, how can you defend this? I have moved my Wii and i have yet to have a disc scratch.... hell, even my first generation Ps1 didn't scratched disc when i had to turn it around so I could play games.

"Many times people are either putting a sub woofer next to the 360, jumping around next to it, or causing vibrations in some other way and not even aware of what they are doing."

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge,  someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.Riverwolf007

If you want to talk about things that are a rip off It is going to be a pretty big list. The list of things that are not a rip off will be shorter. Almost anything you can name is a ripoff if you look at it a certain way.

If people are so afraid of their disks getting damaged they should rent it......shameless plug to rent from Blockbuster :D

Omg the lemmings, how can you defend this? I have moved my Wii and i have yet to have a disc scratch.... hell, even my first generation Ps1 didn't scratched disc when i had to turn it around so I could play games.

"Many times people are either putting a sub woofer next to the 360, jumping around next to it, or causing vibrations in some other way and not even aware of what they are doing."

This utterly ridiculous... That remembers me those Krusty seal of Quality Products "It gets very hot if left connected".loco145

[QUOTE="loco145"]

Omg the lemmings, how can you defend this? I have moved my Wii and i have yet to have a disc scratch.... hell, even my first generation Ps1 didn't scratched disc when i had to turn it around so I could play games.

"Many times people are either putting a sub woofer next to the 360, jumping around next to it, or causing vibrations in some other way and not even aware of what they are doing."

This utterly ridiculous... That remembers me those Krusty seal of Quality Products "It gets very hot if left connected".Riverwolf007

Well, i didn't quoted your name because it wasn't directed specifically to you, but ll the people who say:

"The xbox360 is perfectly fine!, you just need to keep it in one of those controlled environment rooms with controlled pressure, temperature and humidity, also on magnetic suspension so doesn't get affected by the daily micro-earthquakes, noob!"

All I have to say is that the defective nature of these drives really makes me question any future purchases of Hitachi or Samsung products. TekkenMaster606

 Didn't you already mention numerous times you get discounts from Sony? Why would you even concider competing products if you do?

[QUOTE="TekkenMaster606"]All I have to say is that the defective nature of these drives really makes me question any future purchases of Hitachi or Samsung products. DXGreat1_HGL

Didn't you already mention numerous times you get discounts from Sony? Why would you even concider competing products if you do?

Because sometimes, their stuff is available at a lower price than Sony's super high priced consumer electronics. And my discounts are through points with the Sony Card. When I run out of them, bye bye discounts.  

If you don't read the manual... That tells you how to place a disc in a vertical standing 360... That's your fault if anything happens.

You must place your disc in the tabs along the side of the drive.

You move your 360... You scratch your disc.

If you do everything proper and it scratches the disc. Then its the drive.

P.S.

I don't understand why this is being brought up again.

Rehash of launch? I think so.

Definately is MS's fault. DVD drives are dirt cheap yet they put a really loud one in that completely ruins discs when tilted.... these aren't records here there's no read needle. It's just a horrible design flaw with no excuse and MS obviously just let it go. They won't even do people the service of making the new quieter drive they're starting to use standard yet.Lazy_Boy88

 They have used 3 different manufacturersfor the DVD drive, all of them are loud. My PC's dvd drive is loud when it spins up as well. That should tell you womething.

When i bought mine, the guy told me, "do not move your xbox360 while its playing a disc", and in the manual it says the same thing. Xbox 360 is the junk food of the gaming industry, its soo goooood, but its badly made console. The American way.Aldojr000

I hate to break it to you Einstein but the DVD rom was made by a japanese company.

If you don't read the manual... That tells you how to place a disc in a vertical standing 360... That's your fault if anything happens.

You must place your disc in the tabs along the side of the drive.

You move your 360... You scratch your disc.

If you do everything proper and it scratches the disc. Then its the drive.

P.S.

I don't understand why this is being brought up again.

Rehash of launch? I think so.

Truth_Hurts_U

FFS, it happens on horizontaly placed consoles. You should be able to move it period without damaging our $60 discs. My discman could be moved 15 years ago.

And its being brougt up because they finnaly admited it can happen after a Dutch tv show found out the error about the missing rubber padding while they said in the past it was consummer error. Watch the video and hope yours doesn't do it (allong with the red lights and dre's). Its built like crap and people need to know about it so that they'll finnaly do someting about it without shoving responsibility in our shoes.

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"]they rushed the console to get it out a year ahead and contracted everything out to the lowest bidder, so yeah its their fault. xbox1 wasnt rushed and it was pretty good quality except for the frying wire which killed mine, they never sent me a damn letter cus mine wasnt within the date they said the falty ones were from, but the wire killed my xbox anyways.InsaneBasura

This is apparently not so much a problem with early consoles. Joystiq reports that "the problem is mostly found in consoles produced in Dec. 2006, and the show estimates that 1 to 2 million units are affected."

I can't believe how much Microsoft has messed up.

so you're using estimates a proof they messed up?  just wow....:roll:

come back when the real numbers are in.

FFS, it happens on horizontaly placed consoles. You should be able to move it period without damaging our $60 discs. My discman could be moved 15 years ago.

And its being brougt up because they finnaly admited it can happen after a Dutch tv show found out the error about the missing rubber padding while they said in the past it was consummer error. Watch the video and hope yours doesn't do it (allong with the red lights and dre's). Its built like crap and people need to know about it so that they'll finnaly do someting about it without shoving responsibility in our shoes.

elcoholic

So because people don't read the manual... They assume that it can be moved like a portable disc player. That is their fault. There are manuals for a reason.

Would you pick up your DVD player while it was playing a movie? I don't think so. Why would you?

[QUOTE="snyper1982"]

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge, someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.Mandingo101

Can I get a detailed copy of MS's accounting books that you obviously have to make these claims. I mean you know exactly how much they make and how much up keep costs, so you MUST have some sort of inside knowledge, right?

You have no idea how much they make, or how much it cost them to maintain their servers, not to mention it cost them God knows how much to set up the Live infrastructure. Don't act like you do. I don't know how much it cost them to maintain or set up, or how much they make off of it, so you will not see me making numbers up like you are. If you don't like MS or their business model, don't buy it. I am sure they DO make money off of Live, but seeing as that is part of their business model, you can hardly fault them for that. If you think they are ripping you off, don't let them. You whinning about it on here solves what exactly? I like Live, and think it is worth the price. If I didn't I would not pay for it. Just like the content on Live. If I think it is to expensive, or should be free, I will not buy it. 

[QUOTE="elcoholic"]FFS, it happens on horizontaly placed consoles. You should be able to move it period without damaging our $60 discs. My discman could be moved 15 years ago.

And its being brougt up because they finnaly admited it can happen after a Dutch tv show found out the error about the missing rubber padding while they said in the past it was consummer error. Watch the video and hope yours doesn't do it (allong with the red lights and dre's). Its built like crap and people need to know about it so that they'll finnaly do someting about it without shoving responsibility in our shoes.

Truth_Hurts_U

So because people don't read the manual... They assume that it can be moved like a portable disc player. That is their fault. There are manuals for a reason.

Would you pick up your DVD player while it was playing a movie? I don't think so. Why would you?

But it's not just moving consoles. Apparently, now you have to keep your subwoofer a thousand feet away from your Xbox 360.  

[QUOTE="elcoholic"]FFS, it happens on horizontaly placed consoles. You should be able to move it period without damaging our $60 discs. My discman could be moved 15 years ago.

And its being brougt up because they finnaly admited it can happen after a Dutch tv show found out the error about the missing rubber padding while they said in the past it was consummer error. Watch the video and hope yours doesn't do it (allong with the red lights and dre's). Its built like crap and people need to know about it so that they'll finnaly do someting about it without shoving responsibility in our shoes.

Truth_Hurts_U

So because people don't read the manual... They assume that it can be moved like a portable disc player. That is their fault. There are manuals for a reason.

Would you pick up your DVD player while it was playing a movie? I don't think so. Why would you?

You are the one assuming they all moved the console. Everyone complaining about damaged discs say they haven't moved it and MS admitted it can happen. Stop defending something that's a proven fact by the manufacturers.

I can pick up my dvd player while its playing a movie and all that will happen is it will skip. It won't ruin my discs unless I start shaking really hard. Once again, you should be able to move it if it has the rubber padding but THEY FORGOT TO PUT THEM IN=MS FAULT!

But it's not just moving consoles. Apparently, now you have to keep your subwoofer a thousand feet away from your Xbox 360.  

TekkenMaster606

I told people this along time ago. You can look it up in my history.

All drives are different and they all react in different ways.

I could go over all of what I said in the past and I just don't feel like it.

You are the one assuming they all moved the console. Everyone complaining about damaged discs say they haven't moved it and MS admitted it can happen. Stop defending something that's a proven fact by the manufacturers.

I can pick up my dvd player while its playing a movie and all that will happen is it will skip. It won't ruin my discs unless I start shaking really hard. Once again, you should be able to move it if it has the rubber padding but THEY FORGOT TO PUT THEM IN=MS FAULT!

elcoholic

Stop making excuses. This has been all brought up during launch and all debated about.

Rubber padding all you want. User error is the main cause.

[QUOTE="Truth_Hurts_U"]

If you don't read the manual... That tells you how to place a disc in a vertical standing 360... That's your fault if anything happens.

You must place your disc in the tabs along the side of the drive.

You move your 360... You scratch your disc.

If you do everything proper and it scratches the disc. Then its the drive.

P.S.

I don't understand why this is being brought up again.

Rehash of launch? I think so.

elcoholic

FFS, it happens on horizontaly placed consoles. You should be able to move it period without damaging our $60 discs. My discman could be moved 15 years ago.

And its being brougt up because they finnaly admited it can happen after a Dutch tv show found out the error about the missing rubber padding while they said in the past it was consummer error. Watch the video and hope yours doesn't do it (allong with the red lights and dre's). Its built like crap and people need to know about it so that they'll finnaly do someting about it without shoving responsibility in our shoes.

A discman was designed to be portable during operation, the 360 was designed to be stationary in operation. So your argument is specious.

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="snyper1982"]

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge, someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.snyper1982

Can I get a detailed copy of MS's accounting books that you obviously have to make these claims. I mean you know exactly how much they make and how much up keep costs, so you MUST have some sort of inside knowledge, right?

You have no idea how much they make, or how much it cost them to maintain their servers, not to mention it cost them God knows how much to set up the Live infrastructure. Don't act like you do. I don't know how much it cost them to maintain or set up, or how much they make off of it, so you will not see me making numbers up like you are. If you don't like MS or their business model, don't buy it. I am sure they DO make money off of Live, but seeing as that is part of their business model, you can hardly fault them for that. If you think they are ripping you off, don't let them. You whinning about it on here solves what exactly? I like Live, and think it is worth the price. If I didn't I would not pay for it. Just like the content on Live. If I think it is to expensive, or should be free, I will not buy it. 

What infrastructure is that? Its a peer to peer service. We are the infrastructure and it was there before xbox live.

[QUOTE="elcoholic"]

You are the one assuming they all moved the console. Everyone complaining about damaged discs say they haven't moved it and MS admitted it can happen. Stop defending something that's a proven fact by the manufacturers.

I can pick up my dvd player while its playing a movie and all that will happen is it will skip. It won't ruin my discs unless I start shaking really hard. Once again, you should be able to move it if it has the rubber padding but THEY FORGOT TO PUT THEM IN=MS FAULT!

Truth_Hurts_U

Stop making excuses. This has been all brought up during launch and all debated about.

Rubber padding all you want. User error is the main cause.

Not according to the people it happened to.

Let me ask you, if it was proven that all it needed was the rubber padding, like most drives have standard, to avoid this problem alltogether would you still say its ok that they left it out? Wether they knew about it and thus did it on purpouse i don't believe but is it that hard to admit there's an error? MS says its our fault while it is their fault, that's the core of the argument. They're making a fool of the people this happened to. Very arrogant.

[QUOTE="snyper1982"][QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="snyper1982"]

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge, someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.elcoholic

Can I get a detailed copy of MS's accounting books that you obviously have to make these claims. I mean you know exactly how much they make and how much up keep costs, so you MUST have some sort of inside knowledge, right?

You have no idea how much they make, or how much it cost them to maintain their servers, not to mention it cost them God knows how much to set up the Live infrastructure. Don't act like you do. I don't know how much it cost them to maintain or set up, or how much they make off of it, so you will not see me making numbers up like you are. If you don't like MS or their business model, don't buy it. I am sure they DO make money off of Live, but seeing as that is part of their business model, you can hardly fault them for that. If you think they are ripping you off, don't let them. You whinning about it on here solves what exactly? I like Live, and think it is worth the price. If I didn't I would not pay for it. Just like the content on Live. If I think it is to expensive, or should be free, I will not buy it.

What infrastructure is that? Its a peer to peer service. We are the infrastructure and it was there before xbox live.

So I guess all those demos, videos, etc. just appear out of cyberspace heaven? Come on....  

Not according to the people it happened to.

Let me ask you, if it was proven that all it needed was the rubber padding, like most drives have standard, to avoid this problem alltogether would you still say its ok that they left it out? Wether they knew about it and thus did it on purpouse i don't believe but is it that hard to admit there's an error? MS says its our fault while it is their fault, that's the core of the argument. They're making a fool of the people this happened to. Very arrogant.

elcoholic

4 errors they made with the drive.

1. It's not 16x

2. You can't use a disc drive clearer on it.

3. To close to the heatsink.

4. It's not fool proof.

Other then that, the drive is fine.

[QUOTE="elcoholic"][QUOTE="snyper1982"][QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="snyper1982"]

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge, someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.snyper1982

Can I get a detailed copy of MS's accounting books that you obviously have to make these claims. I mean you know exactly how much they make and how much up keep costs, so you MUST have some sort of inside knowledge, right?

You have no idea how much they make, or how much it cost them to maintain their servers, not to mention it cost them God knows how much to set up the Live infrastructure. Don't act like you do. I don't know how much it cost them to maintain or set up, or how much they make off of it, so you will not see me making numbers up like you are. If you don't like MS or their business model, don't buy it. I am sure they DO make money off of Live, but seeing as that is part of their business model, you can hardly fault them for that. If you think they are ripping you off, don't let them. You whinning about it on here solves what exactly? I like Live, and think it is worth the price. If I didn't I would not pay for it. Just like the content on Live. If I think it is to expensive, or should be free, I will not buy it.

What infrastructure is that? Its a peer to peer service. We are the infrastructure and it was there before xbox live.

So I guess all those demos, videos, etc. just appear out of cyberspace heaven? Come on....  

You also get those on the free silver account. PS3 and pc also offer them for free.

[QUOTE="elcoholic"]

Not according to the people it happened to.

Let me ask you, if it was proven that all it needed was the rubber padding, like most drives have standard, to avoid this problem alltogether would you still say its ok that they left it out? Wether they knew about it and thus did it on purpouse i don't believe but is it that hard to admit there's an error? MS says its our fault while it is their fault, that's the core of the argument. They're making a fool of the people this happened to. Very arrogant.

Truth_Hurts_U

4 errors they made with the drive.

1. It's not 16x

2. You can't use a disc drive clearer on it.

3. To close to the heatsink.

4. It's not fool proof.

Other then that, the drive is fine.

You didn't answer my question. My $40 dvd player is fool proof.

You didn't answer my question. My $40 dvd player is fool proof.elcoholic

I already did... User error is the main factor.

I have used over 300 discs in my 360 to date. From 360 & Xbox games to music cd's and movies.

Not 1 single issue.

[QUOTE="elcoholic"]You didn't answer my question. My $40 dvd player is fool proof.Truth_Hurts_U

I already did... User error is the main factor.

I have used over 300 discs in my 360 to date. From 360 & Xbox games to music cd's and movies.

Not 1 single issue.

Good for you but not all 360 drives are the same. Its the tsst drives that seem to be missing the part while pc drives of the same brand do have them.

I only got R6:V from a friend for my birthday and it wouldn't play. When i looked at it it had those scratches all over. i assumed they bought it like that at the store and i had it replaced. So either my 360 did do that or someone returned it to the store before me. The replacement works fine.

Anyway, i trust atleast some of the people who say they didn't move it. If you don't that's ok but i have a feeling we haven't heard the last of this story and it can really hurt MS like sony got hurt last gen if they don't admit the mistake and replace those games.

[QUOTE="snyper1982"][QUOTE="elcoholic"][QUOTE="snyper1982"][QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="snyper1982"]

[QUOTE="Mandingo101"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]Thats a good point somebody should make a thread about that sometime. Maybe in the middle of that thread about MS forcing epic to charge, someone that can't argue the actual topic can attempt to change it into a different topic.elcoholic

Can I get a detailed copy of MS's accounting books that you obviously have to make these claims. I mean you know exactly how much they make and how much up keep costs, so you MUST have some sort of inside knowledge, right?

You have no idea how much they make, or how much it cost them to maintain their servers, not to mention it cost them God knows how much to set up the Live infrastructure. Don't act like you do. I don't know how much it cost them to maintain or set up, or how much they make off of it, so you will not see me making numbers up like you are. If you don't like MS or their business model, don't buy it. I am sure they DO make money off of Live, but seeing as that is part of their business model, you can hardly fault them for that. If you think they are ripping you off, don't let them. You whinning about it on here solves what exactly? I like Live, and think it is worth the price. If I didn't I would not pay for it. Just like the content on Live. If I think it is to expensive, or should be free, I will not buy it.

What infrastructure is that? Its a peer to peer service. We are the infrastructure and it was there before xbox live.

So I guess all those demos, videos, etc. just appear out of cyberspace heaven? Come on....

You also get those on the free silver account. PS3 and pc also offer them for free.

So? 

[QUOTE="elcoholic"]You didn't answer my question. My $40 dvd player is fool proof.Truth_Hurts_U

I already did... User error is the main factor.

I have used over 300 discs in my 360 to date. From 360 & Xbox games to music cd's and movies.

Not 1 single issue.

[QUOTE="elcoholic"]You didn't answer my question. My $40 dvd player is fool proof.Truth_Hurts_U

I already did... User error is the main factor.

I have used over 300 discs in my 360 to date. From 360 & Xbox games to music cd's and movies.

Not 1 single issue.

You are guessing just like everyone else is guessing.  Fact, the X360 can scratch your disk whether or not you move it.  Fact, the X360 can overheat no matter where you place it. 

Fact, not all X360 will see this error...infact most will not.  That's why some people say it's the luck of the draw....most figures I've seen could be 3% to as high as 10%.  Who is right and who is wrong....well know one knows except Microsoft and I can assure you they are not going to release actual figures on their defective hardware.