Is Microsoft forcing us to pay for Downloadable content?

qhat does QTF mean?Zigmond1

If you re-read my other arguments i clearly said, I wouldn't be bugged if the devs wanted to charge us. It's because MS is imposing a charge on somthing they have little right to do so. They put no effort into making said patch/maps ect. So why should they have the right to decide the price? And i'm putting too much on price, it's the principle aswell.

And like I said, just because my family are well off, doesn't mean I am. I donated before you go all fundamentalist on me, I'm doing geography GSCE, so me and all my class mates got a pack together with basic essentials like old cloths ect, and sent it to some charity along with a £1 each. The same went for thailand. SImply because we were studying it at the time, and I'm not an ass like you think i am.

death1505921

Honestly man - I get it. I get your point about the developers. That's enough about the developers. I don't care if your uncle Gumby is the one charging you, or creating the material that Microsoft if profiting from. My point is, you're paying for content. Microsoft gets to establish a price because they are the company who can offer the service and make it marketable. I'm not saying it's 100% great. I'm not even saying that they SHOULD do it. I'm saying that they are doing it and in the scheme of things this is small potatoes to be complaining about.

If your family is well off, then you're well off. No, you don't have money because you're a kid. I get that. However, you get free food, shelter, electricity, internet access, access to video games, clothes, birthday/Christmas gifts, shall I go on??? So, when I hear someone being upset about paying for content (I don't care to whom or who sets the price - it's irrelevant), it to me is just a sign of how spoiled some of us are.  

Only ads I see is for marketplace content. What do you see?limpbizkit818

Quit whining.

Microsoft needs to make money from Xbox Live to recover (and then some) the cost of continually having to upgrade their server farms for more and more users and games. If you don't like it: tough. Blizzard does the same with World of Warcraft to an extent for the exact same reason. If you think Microsoft should stop upgrading their Xbox Live server farms, then send them a petition for that. Yours will probably be the only signature on it though.

Also, if developers want to give us content for free, then they should host it themselves. Which they don't. So somewhere down the line, if the developers want Microsoft to host their content, some financial transaction must take place to recover the cost of that. And guess which two parties are involved in that transaction. I'll give you a hint: one of those is Microsoft.

"Tough, business is business. If you don't like it don't buy it." How ignorant is that? So we as customers have no right
and no obligation to try and guide the industry that thrives off our dollars? That the company that has charged us $60 for a piece of
plastic that is infinitelymanufacturable can't give us the slightest bit more content so that we might get attached to the brand and to provide future incentive to buy the product. Nah, that's just silly. Also (some guy already said it.) Much of the time you cannot play online UNLESS you have payed for content everyone else has. Which is having a feature you already payed for, removed.

"It isn't very much after you have a 360, TV and internet connection." No, but it's not worth much either. I hear this for the PS3 as well, in that its price doesn't matter so much because you will have plenty of fun out of it anyway. Great, so? Does that mean it's still insane to pay more then a dollar for a can of pop or something? What if it is a dollar fifty? It's
only fifty cents more,that's' almost nothing right? Its still overpriced.

MS does this, making free content cost us, to protect other companies that don't give it away. EA makes everything cost now, cheats, courses, races, cars and everything else they can think of. MS tries to insure no free content so they dont look as greedy as they are. Why do you people excuse them? Why do you argue for their decision to make us pay for free content when they have contributed nothing to it?

And the guy who used victims of Katrina to complain about us complaining about overpriced content: How much lower can you go man? You argue against us wanting free content made free like it is on PC then you lay a guilt trip about victims of a natural disaster? This is about trying to stop micro-transactions before they kill online gaming, it doen't change that fact just because we wont go bankrupt because of it.

Microsoft needs to make money from Xbox Live to recover (and then some) the cost of continually having to upgrade their server farms for more and more users and games.ashghan

I don't like some of these arguments.

"Tough, business is business. If you don't like it don't buy it." How ignorant is that? So we as customers have no right
and no obligation to try and guide the industry that thrives off our dollars? That the company that has charged us $60 for a piece of
plastic that is infinitelymanufacturable can't give us the slightest bit more content so that we might get attached to the brand and to provide future incentive to buy the product. Nah, that's just silly. Also (some guy already said it.) Much of the time you cannot play online UNLESS you have payed for content everyone else has. Which is having a feature you already payed for, removed.

"It isn't very much after you have a 360, TV and internet connection." No, but it's not worth much either. I hear this for the PS3 as well, in that its price doesn't matter so much because you will have plenty of fun out of it anyway. Great, so? Does that mean it's still insane to pay more then a dollar for a can of pop or something? What if it is a dollar fifty? It's
only fifty cents more,that's' almost nothing right? Its still overpriced.

MS does this, making free content cost us, to protect other companies that don't give it away. EA makes everything cost now, cheats, courses, races, cars and everything else they can think of. MS tries to insure no free content so they dont look as greedy as they are. Why do you people excuse them? Why do you argue for their decision to make us pay for free content when they have contributed nothing to it?

And the guy who used victims of Katrina to complain about us complaining about overpriced content: How much lower can you go man? You argue against us wanting free content made free like it is on PC then you lay a guilt trip about victims of a natural disaster? This is about trying to stop micro-transactions before they kill online gaming, it doen't change that fact just because we wont go bankrupt because of it.

blue-fish

First of all - not buying something guides the industry as well. There aren't a whole lot of developers jumping to make the great trilogy of Aquaman...cuz no one bought it. If people stopped buying the content, it wouldn't continue to appear, or it may come down in price. Also, the point simply is - you don't HAVE to buy this stuff. If you need to buy this to play a game, I will fully support the idea that it has gotten out of hand. However, this is EXTRA content that yoU CAN buy. It also tells you the price before you buy it. So, if you don't like it or you think it's overpriced, don't buy it. But, don't buy it then complain that you got ripped off - that makes no sense.

Finally, although the content may be priced higher than you like - it is still extra content. I think getting something for nothing is a little ridiculous, too. Why should we, as gamers, get something for free? We know that these consoles were sold at a loss already. How much did they lose on the sale of each console? I forget, but it wasn't cheap. 

My point about Hurricane Katrina was only to point out that maybe we need to tone down the anger over this issue. People are ready to organize and protest over this. Are you kidding me? If you're going to put that much time into something, let it be for a good cause - not online gaming prices. Quite honestly - THAT is the ultimate low. 

[QUOTE="ashghan"]Microsoft needs to make money from Xbox Live to recover (and then some) the cost of continually having to upgrade their server farms for more and more users and games.teebeenz

The price of Xbox Live is to cover production costs of Xbox Live, and maintain it's profit margins.

In case you haven't noticed, Microsoft is not a not-for-profit organisation.

Un-der-stand?

Absolutely this pisses me off.  MS didn't want Geometry wars or Gears content to be free, both so they could get money but also to make companies like EA who charge for everything not look bad in comparison.  Epic had to fight MS for the first Gears update and maps to be free and then they had to fight them again for the second pack.  MS is being insane on this one and it makes me angry that they are denying companies the freedom to charge what they want for their own products.  Petition.blue-fish

you know a game cost about 3 dollars to actually produce right? all they gotta do is get a blank game disc stamp there artwork on it and run it throught the machine that codes it. it really isnt mass profit because they gotta pay the people who made it. but considering gears of war sold llike 2 or 3 million copies i think they can give some free content.spyman333

No, you are wrong. A game costs several million dollars to produce. The disc on which that game is finally stored and shipped costs barely anything. But I didn't say disc, did I?

[QUOTE="spyman333"]you know a game cost about 3 dollars to actually produce right? all they gotta do is get a blank game disc stamp there artwork on it and run it throught the machine that codes it. it really isnt mass profit because they gotta pay the people who made it. but considering gears of war sold llike 2 or 3 million copies i think they can give some free content.ashghan

No, you are wrong. A game costs several million dollars to produce. The disc on which that game is finally stored and shipped costs barely anything. But I didn't say disc, did I?

Exactly - not to mention the cut to the stores that sell it, the production companies, and the millions it costs to advertise. The disc itself may be cheap to produce, but it's like a movie - you have to sell a TON to break even.

Also, I'm sorry - but I think they've actually given us plenty. For example, the 360 cost more to produce and put out than the sticker price. I forget how much they lost on each console, but it was a good chunk of change. There was something they gave us - a lower price. They let us download demos for free. How awesome is that? I basically never rent games anymore as a result. A free month of xbox live came with the console - I realize that's not necessarily a lot, but for someone like me who doesn't play online - it was something. And my final point - why do we feel like we deserve something for free? This is an exchange - they provide a product or service, and we pay for it. We need them to continue to do this to enjoy gaming, and they need us to pay them to keep doing it. How come we should expect them to hand out stuff to us for free? And like I pointed out - they have and DO provide things for free. 

In April's Game Informer News, they had an article called, ""The Content Microsoft Doesn't Want You to Have" on page 32. It talks about the publishers wanting to put out "free" downloadable content but Microsoft isn't letting them. According to the article Microsoft is placing prices on content that the companies wanted to give us for free, because "Microsoft wanting to make gamers accustomed to paying money for goods above and beyond wallpapers."

I almost wrote this off as an April Fools joke or something like that until I remembered an interview that Ben Ward of Bizarre Creations (Geometry Wars: Retro Evolved) had with IGN UK.

I think that maybe we should do some kind of petition, so this problem is brought up to Microsoft just to let them know that, as customers, we don't like being "nickel and dime" for content that game companies want to give us free.

Does anyone have any ideas about this? I think this is more legit then petitioning Capcom over Devil May Cry having a multiplatform release. I want to gauge everyone about this idea, and perhaps someone noticed this too.

IGN UK interview: http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/772/772651p2.html

thomasonfa

[QUOTE="ashghan"]

[QUOTE="spyman333"]you know a game cost about 3 dollars to actually produce right? all they gotta do is get a blank game disc stamp there artwork on it and run it throught the machine that codes it. it really isnt mass profit because they gotta pay the people who made it. but considering gears of war sold llike 2 or 3 million copies i think they can give some free content.slidet22

No, you are wrong. A game costs several million dollars to produce. The disc on which that game is finally stored and shipped costs barely anything. But I didn't say disc, did I?

Exactly - not to mention the cut to the stores that sell it, the production companies, and the millions it costs to advertise. The disc itself may be cheap to produce, but it's like a movie - you have to sell a TON to break even.

Also, I'm sorry - but I think they've actually given us plenty. For example, the 360 cost more to produce and put out than the sticker price. I forget how much they lost on each console, but it was a good chunk of change. There was something they gave us - a lower price. They let us download demos for free. How awesome is that? I basically never rent games anymore as a result. A free month of xbox live came with the console - I realize that's not necessarily a lot, but for someone like me who doesn't play online - it was something. And my final point - why do we feel like we deserve something for free? This is an exchange - they provide a product or service, and we pay for it. We need them to continue to do this to enjoy gaming, and they need us to pay them to keep doing it. How come we should expect them to hand out stuff to us for free? And like I pointed out - they have and DO provide things for free. 

So how do you explain the price of the 20GB hard drive?

[QUOTE="slidet22"][QUOTE="ashghan"]

[QUOTE="spyman333"]you know a game cost about 3 dollars to actually produce right? all they gotta do is get a blank game disc stamp there artwork on it and run it throught the machine that codes it. it really isnt mass profit because they gotta pay the people who made it. but considering gears of war sold llike 2 or 3 million copies i think they can give some free content.madskills6117

No, you are wrong. A game costs several million dollars to produce. The disc on which that game is finally stored and shipped costs barely anything. But I didn't say disc, did I?

Exactly - not to mention the cut to the stores that sell it, the production companies, and the millions it costs to advertise. The disc itself may be cheap to produce, but it's like a movie - you have to sell a TON to break even.

Also, I'm sorry - but I think they've actually given us plenty. For example, the 360 cost more to produce and put out than the sticker price. I forget how much they lost on each console, but it was a good chunk of change. There was something they gave us - a lower price. They let us download demos for free. How awesome is that? I basically never rent games anymore as a result. A free month of xbox live came with the console - I realize that's not necessarily a lot, but for someone like me who doesn't play online - it was something. And my final point - why do we feel like we deserve something for free? This is an exchange - they provide a product or service, and we pay for it. We need them to continue to do this to enjoy gaming, and they need us to pay them to keep doing it. How come we should expect them to hand out stuff to us for free? And like I pointed out - they have and DO provide things for free.

So how do you explain the price of the 20GB hard drive?

Wow...just...wow...I suspect Microsoft is not making up all their money on the hard drives. Moreover, how in the world do we know how much it costs to produce that? We can all sit around and pretend to know how much, but in the end, we have no idea. Also, if you THINK it's overpriced and simply a rip-off - you do NOT have to buy it. You do not have to buy any of this stuff. The original question here is - is Microsoft FORCING us to buy downloadable content? The answer is unequivocally..."NO." Nobody is forcing you to buy anything.

 I also got back to the point here - why do we feel like we deserve something for free? I you didn't get to that part of my argument, please read it. I just cannot understand why this is even an issue.

Yes, we remember them talking about microtransactions but the point is charging us for FREE stuff. If a game company comes out and want to give this stuff away for free, why should we pay for it? thomasonfa

See- my point is not that what Microsoft is doing is the RIGHT thing...I would love free content. I'm saying - if it's not free, it doesn't mean we're being forced to buy it. And why should we expect it to be free? I also still stand by the fact that Microsoft has given us a LOT for free. I don't see why we should be upset when they ask for $5 - $10 for additional content...

I also think that article only gave one side of the story. Maybe Microsoft is simply trying to Microshaft us. However, don't you ever watch lawyers duke it out? When you hear one side you think "this guy is guilty as sin" then when you hear the opposing view you think "this is a witch-hunt." Perhaps it's not always to that extreme, but the point is - there are two sides to every story. 

[QUOTE="death1505921"]MS, are theiving bastards. They charge us to use the online, then put ads on aswell so they make money, and then charge us for content companies want free. QTF?kyle_1865

Well I think its alright that they price things it costs money to develop, publish, provide, and host the content so there should be a small price. Just be glad promotional stuff is free I guess.dunit13

I don't think paying for downloadable content is an issue whatsoever.  I don't mind paying for something extra for a game.  If I don't want to pay for it, I don't get it.  Simple.

The only issue I have is when the devs want to post it for free, but Microsoft forces them to charge for it.  That's not right.

The only issue I have is when the devs want to post it for free, but Microsoft forces them to charge for it.  That's not right.

Zero-Pirate

It would be nice to get some of that free content...but MS are greedy S.O.B.'s...I just buy what i need to buy to get the best playin experince outta the game...as should everyone esle whould do.

my god bill gates probably couldnt pick up a lancer second you werent just a bit curious to see what came with it and i hate Bill Gates

gears content is free, and supposedly GHII content will be free. So idk about that article's arguement. it sounds plausible, but really i don't mind paying, its not like its that expensive.

 

i just read that IGN article and i must say that is intruiging that MS made them do that. 

butkis689

[QUOTE="thomasonfa"]Yes, we remember them talking about microtransactions but the point is charging us for FREE stuff. If a game company comes out and want to give this stuff away for free, why should we pay for it? slidet22

See- my point is not that what Microsoft is doing is the RIGHT thing...I would love free content. I'm saying - if it's not free, it doesn't mean we're being forced to buy it. And why should we expect it to be free? I also still stand by the fact that Microsoft has given us a LOT for free. I don't see why we should be upset when they ask for $5 - $10 for additional content...

I also think that article only gave one side of the story. Maybe Microsoft is simply trying to Microshaft us. However, don't you ever watch lawyers duke it out? When you hear one side you think "this guy is guilty as sin" then when you hear the opposing view you think "this is a witch-hunt." Perhaps it's not always to that extreme, but the point is - there are two sides to every story. 

"In an interview with IGN, Ward said that Bizarre didn't really view Arcade as a way to make money and initally the dev was keen to make the action-packed shooter a free download. However, due to restrictions Bizarre was forced to charge for the game, although insisted Microsoft put it out in Live's lowest price bracket - 400 MS points."

http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/772/772652p1.html

This will be the last point that I bring up on this topic. I think that people just read the title and not the post. Microsoft is a great business but sometimes they need to look past just making TONS of money by giving back to its loyal customer i.e. Gold Members. If a game developer wants to hook us up with some free content, Microsoft should respect that. Maybe in the future we could bring this issue up again and get a greater number of participates for a petition.

I'm sorry, I'm just failing to see the point here where I think this is an issue that seriously needs to be addressed. For my first three reasons, read my post above.

 

Fourthly, you're now asking for content for free. You're asking for someone to simply hand something over to you for no cost. The additional content is something that people put in time and work on. They're trying to turn a profit. Why would someone just give it to you for free? This isn't some noble volunteering opportunity. If I'm going to give something away for free, it's going to be something that someone NEEDS - like help providing food, clothes, or any other number of charitable things.  

Fifth - I'm not buying the "some of us are just less fortunate." The fact that you own a 360 and have internet access right now tells me that you're at least doing well enough to buy those things instead of the necessities in life.

 

Look, I'm not suggesting that Microsoft isn't turning a huge profit here. I'm suggesting that if this is what we have to complain about, maybe we should appreciate everything we've got cuz it can't be too bad. 

slidet22