[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

[QUOTE="mephie25"]

rawsavon

1. I just used what you wrote…I can only work with what you give me…you said you were free to attack and inflame…in the broadest sense we are all free to do as we wish, but there are consequences for said actions

2. Altruism had many roots…one of which is religion…you are correct
-but many times religion is the cause…religion does a great deal of good in the world (as well as evil…just like everything else)

3. You say that "Never are awful acts carried out by cause of atheism"

But Atheism is defined as:
In the broadest sense, it is the absence of belief in the existence of deities.
-so any act without a deity as the cause, would be rooted in atheism (both good and bad)

4. I was interested to see your comments on the last part of my last post…I was afraid you would take it as an attack instead of an observation…but you did not say anything about it

[QUOTE="rawsavon"]

[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

Challenge/attack/question it seems the same to me. I am not imposing or infringing at all and my attack is not incited by hatred. What is the difference? I am doing the person no physical harm. If I cause this person mental harm that is unfortunate but you still cannot inhibit my speech because of this. My statement "Religion poisons everything" is not just opinion, I can justify it. It is a bold statement I know, however, there are so many accounts of Religion causing harm in our world. It is incredibly totalitarian.

mephie25

Your quote:
"We are free to attack and inflame. You cannot tell us "you cannot challenge my faith". Some of us are anything but happy that people have faith."

You said that you are free to attack people…your words not mine.
If you are not smart enough to know the difference between attacking someone and asking them a question, than there is no further point in us talking.
-However, I think that you are perfectly aware of the difference

You are free to do as you choose in this world.
No one can limit you, but there are consequences for every action you take…free speech is not really free…there are consequences for saying and doing certain things

I can find just as many things to support my "bold" statement as you can for yours
-for every "holy' war there are countless acts of altruism…we would be in an endless cycle…so it is like I said: an opinion that cannot be proved.

IMO…you just sound young, inexperienced, and angry at God...something that you should resolve internally before extolling your beliefs externally.
-in other words, people need to be clear on what they believe before they question and accost others for theirs...but this is just my opinion and not one shared by many
-I just think you need to figure out exactly what you believe (it does not sound like you do), before you attack others' beliefs

[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"] Poison, eh? Seems to be taking its sweet time killing us.

PannicAtack

[QUOTE="muthsera666"]

[Well, not believing in God is not the same as believing that God does not exist. I don't believe in God, but I don't presume to assert the belief that He does not exist.

LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

What is my belief?

LJS9502_basic

"I am a non-believerLeon2793

[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

[QUOTE="rawsavon"]

1. I believe that people SHOULD question their OWN faith...for their own benefit
BUT
It is not your place to question anyone else's faith...discuss, talk about, explain YES

2. People carry out awful acts regardless.
-religion is just used as an excuse
-people invade, take, steal, plunder because they want stuff...the crusades were about riches (they did not go places with nothing to offer)
My point is that if not religion, countries would just use something else (the love of the crown, whatever)
GREED is the root, not religion (just the excuse used)

3. There will never be "proof"...that is the point of a faith based religion

4. There is nothing wrong with a. not believing and b. thinking that the world would be better if no one did
-just like I think the world would be a better place if all believed
However
It is wrong to attack and inflame...It is not your place (or mine) to dictate or attack

Just because you do not agree, does not make something wrong
-people have a RIGHT tobelieve as they please, as long as they do not infringe on others' rights

Where you see religion holding the world back, I see it holding it together...to each their own

rawsavon

You have the right to question others (questioning and discussion are great and lead to learning about others and self), but you do not have the right to attack...there is a difference
-free speech/behavior is not what you make it out to be...you are not free to infringe upon others rights

Your statement about "Religion poisons everything, it aggravates these situations" is just opinion...just as it is my opinion that "Where you see religion holding the world back, I see it holding it together"...
-we can discuss it, but prove nothing

[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"] So you're intolerant?

PannicAtack

[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] I mean those making the threads are presenting their personal beliefs to others.....

LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

[QUOTE="curono"]Religion is not based of facts or evidence, it is based upon faith. THAT IS THE CORNERSTONE OFRELIGION. If you try to prove or disprove you are going on the wrong side. Think of it as follow: Prove me that chocolate is tasty. You may eat as much chocolate as you can to prove that chocolate is tasty. You can make a survey, but if you dont like it, that is it. There is no way around. You may like it eventually, but if you positively dislike chocolate there is no proof that can tell you otherwise. Religion is like that. Either you believe or you dont. It is not proof based knowledge.curono

John knows and tells Gabriel that he believes in god and all that Gabriel answers him: No, you know, it is different.

So instead of having a religion you have a dogmatic knowledge. People will try to base their faith upon something. It is as valid as stating why do you like rap. You may say it is good, the power of the lyrics or the rythm. The case is that you are describinghow rap is, not why you like it.There may be other music genres which are good but you are not into.We, as humans tend to "prove why" when there may not be a real reason behind it.

[QUOTE="Leon2793"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] I'd say the quote should be applied to the thread creators myself....LJS9502_basic