If you add up times in the bible to the time of Jesus birth, it would mean earth was created like in 2000 b.c. or something. I think all those machines that dates back stuff to 2mil years are wrong. and that evolution happens much more faster than what people think.playmynutzI'm sorry, but that doesn't make sense scientifically. Did you read my section on carbon dating? Carbon Dating Carbon dating is carbon dating. The essence of examining the physical attributes of organic compound is not against G-d. Every organic compound by definition has carbon. If it has carbon, it is an organic compound. We can with a reasonable degree of accuracy determine the dating and origin by virtue of the analysis of degrading carbon atoms in comparison to non-degrading carbon atoms. The fact of the matter is that G-d speaks in language that can be understood by humankind. When G-d says “evening” or “morning” or “# day” of, he is speaking in cardinal numbers, indicating order. The unit of time, or a “day” could be a billion years. They are not fixed days, but rather fixed epochs of history.
Thanks-'s forum posts
[QUOTE="Thanks-"][QUOTE="Nisstyre_56"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="Thanks-"][QUOTE="Hewkii"]Q: how did he create all of this?ErasornG-d is the only being that is able to bend the laws of science and create matter where there was once none. He created energy where there was once none. He created physical space where there was once none. Does this answer your question? Why would you believe this though? There isn't any proof.
this is probably a good example of people believing something is true for fear of persecution and because "everyone else believes it"
Groupthink
I believe it because it is the most sensible option available. Certainly the atheistic view that life is coincidence isn't as realistic. That is merely your opinion. I personally think the idea that some creator somehow got the great idea to create humans to be good to other humans is quite preposterous.It may be perposterous to you, but life being chance is more perposterous. Scientifically, coincidences indicate a higher power.
[QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="Thanks-"][QUOTE="Hewkii"]Q: how did he create all of this?Nisstyre_56G-d is the only being that is able to bend the laws of science and create matter where there was once none. He created energy where there was once none. He created physical space where there was once none. Does this answer your question? Why would you believe this though? There isn't any proof.
this is probably a good example of people believing something is true for fear of persecution and because "everyone else believes it"
Groupthink
I believe it because it is the most sensible option available. Certainly the atheistic view that life is coincidence isn't as realistic.
[QUOTE="Thanks-"][QUOTE="rimnet00"]Thanks-, great read and personally I agree with you on many of your points. However, I have a slightly different view point. I don't believe God can be proven or disproven and instead is a descision the soul makes in its own heart. I have yet to see anyone use the logic or a scientific process to create a well defined argument to prove or disprove the existance of God. Clearly, this will make sense to any follower of the Abrahamic faith, who believes in this life being a test. If the existance or non-existance of God could be proven or disprove so easily, then having this life as a test wouldn't make any sense -- it would be too easy. Everyone would believe or disbelieve because the answer would be so simple.I must admit that I have not read the Qur'an, but I agree with most of your statement and am glad to see that we can find common ground. I am assuming you are a Muslim, I would also like to note that I am not Ashkenazi Jewish. I am Sephardic, and many of my people have been living amongst the Muslims for generations without problems. Its nice to meet you brother. I do have a question for you though. Where did you get the quote: "He who saves a single life, it is as though he has saved the entire world". This is very similiar, if not the same as a line from Surah 5.32 from the Qur'an. However, since it is in reference to the 'Children of Israel' I am assuming it is found in the Old Testament/Torah. Pirke D'Rav Eliezer, Chapter 48.
So the question becomes, how does a soul believe in it's creator? I believe there are two ways people come to believe. The first way is through education. As a person educates themselves they eventually get to a point where they say, all of this must be a creation, and its creator is God. Some people never get to that point, because even as they continously uncover the next sheet of wrapping paper, there will always be another piece packed underneath it.
The second way people usually come to believe in God is coming to the conclusion that the revalation of a particular religion, must be the word of God. Whether it is the Torah, the Bible, or the Qur'an there are many out there who claim that it is the word of God.
Some people like myself have more or less been convinced by both methods Through my studies of the complexities of this world, i felt that there had to be a creator. At the same time, through my studies of the Qur'an, I came to the conclusion that none other then God could have written the words found in them.
rimnet00
[QUOTE="Thanks-"]But Hitler didn't run the concentration camps, and Stalin didn't run the Gulags. Don't you understand that Hitler and Stalin were merely the top of a huge chain of command, and that it was the people towards the bottom of the chain that actally did all the murdering. Were they all psychos, or were they atheists/pagans that were so influenced by their beliefs that they were willing to kill millions to reach their objectives?In the case of Hitler it was Christians, so don't try to pin this on a group.It's not my problem that you lack an understanding of history.yoshi-lnex
[QUOTE="Thanks-"]Didn't you read the orignal post? I will simply copy and paste a section from the original post.I do believe those people you mentioned, Stalin, Hitler etc... were psychos. You see, someone's beliefs or non-beliefs are no judge of their morals. Take, for instance, the war that has been raging in the middle east for over 50 years. This was caused because the fanatical Muslims (religion) thought the Jews (religion) should be wiped off the face of the earth. The same thing goes with Nationalism. As John Lennon would have said it, religion, nationalism, materialism, and greed are the causes of all the problems in the world. Now just because the last few dictators "happened" to be atheists does not mean religious dictators aren't as bad. They just happened to be motivated by their lust for power and the chemical inbalances in their brains and not religion. But Hitler didn't run the concentration camps, and Stalin didn't run the Gulags. Don't you understand that Hitler and Stalin were merely the top of a huge chain of command, and that it was the people towards the bottom of the chain that actally did all the murdering. Were they all psychos, or were they atheists/pagans that were so influenced by their beliefs that they were willing to kill millions to reach their objectives?Man’s Inhumanity to Man
The core principle of Judeo-Christian teachings is the sacredness of human life. He who saves a single life, it is as though he has saved the entire world. This teaching is unfortunately being lost by all the hate being slung as rhetoric coming out against Christians and Jews today. These beautiful transcendental humanistic teachings are essential to our survival of human beings.
This current theme of man’s inhumanity to man is what’s playing out on television, on the internet, in the games, and in the movies day and night. This social barbarism is descending mankind into madness allover again. What we thought we left behind in the last millennium is coming back to haunt us, perhaps even worse than the last century.
In the last century, over 100,000,000 people were slaughtered by atheists, pagans, and Marxists such as Hitler (Pagan), Stalin (Marxist, Atheist), Pol Pot (Marxist, Atheist), and Mao Zedong (Marxist, Atheist). Over 100 million killed because of the false prophets of communism and paganism, and I am afraid that we are going backwards towards these teachings.
One has to be optimistic to survive-- optimism tempered with the realism of our very uncivilized civilization. We have lost our sense of stability, but we have not yet fallen into the abyss of which I spoke. However, we are losing ground very quickly.
It is a ‘shout-out,’ to use the vernacular of the day, and as course and abrupt reminder that we have got to reassess and revaluate our moral compass and get back online here. We’ve got to learn that our future as a human race, our future as a civilization is very much a function of our ability to reintegrate a sense of decency, kindness and culture that is rooted in understanding the divinity that is manifested in every human being.
Nisstyre_56
Thanks-, great read and personally I agree with you on many of your points. However, I have a slightly different view point. I don't believe God can be proven or disproven and instead is a descision the soul makes in its own heart. I have yet to see anyone use the logic or a scientific process to create a well defined argument to prove or disprove the existance of God. Clearly, this will make sense to any follower of the Abrahamic faith, who believes in this life being a test. If the existance or non-existance of God could be proven or disprove so easily, then having this life as a test wouldn't make any sense -- it would be too easy. Everyone would believe or disbelieve because the answer would be so simple.I must admit that I have not read the Qur'an, but I agree with most of your statement and am glad to see that we can find common ground. I am assuming you are a Muslim, I would also like to note that I am not Ashkenazi Jewish. I am Sephardic, and many of my people have been living amongst the Muslims for generations without problems.
So the question becomes, how does a soul believe in it's creator? I believe there are two ways people come to believe. The first way is through education. As a person educates themselves they eventually get to a point where they say, all of this must be a creation, and its creator is God. Some people never get to that point, because even as they continously uncover the next sheet of wrapping paper, there will always be another piece packed underneath it.
The second way people usually come to believe in God is coming to the conclusion that the revalation of a particular religion, must be the word of God. Whether it is the Torah, the Bible, or the Qur'an there are many out there who claim that it is the word of God.
Some people like myself have more or less been convinced by both methods Through my studies of the complexities of this world, i felt that there had to be a creator. At the same time, through my studies of the Qur'an, I came to the conclusion that none other then God could have written the words found in them.
rimnet00
[QUOTE="Thanks-"][QUOTE="Hewkii"]Q: how did he create all of this?HewkiiG-d is the only being that is able to bend the laws of science and create matter where there was once none. He created energy where there was once none. He created physical space where there was once none. Does this answer your question? but how did he do it?Well, possibly by infusing his own energy into the creation of the universe and life. That's all I currently understand, so why don't you ask G-d if you have any other questions.
[QUOTE="Thanks-"][QUOTE="Nisstyre_56"][QUOTE="Thanks-"]The problem is which "proof" are you asking for? How do you identify what one must question? Coincidences are most questionable, and the atheistic argument that life is mere coincidence is what I am currently questioning.Nisstyre_56Did you read my quote? "after due examination and analysis, you find to be conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings" God is not beneficial, nor is the idea of God. Religion is one of the causes of all the problems in the world, and "God" doesn't do anythingThat is a myth. Atheism has killed far more people in the last century than religion. Prove it Didn't you read the orignal post? I will simply copy and paste a section from the original post.
Man’s Inhumanity to Man
The core principle of Judeo-Christian teachings is the sacredness of human life. He who saves a single life, it is as though he has saved the entire world. This teaching is unfortunately being lost by all the hate being slung as rhetoric coming out against Christians and Jews today. These beautiful transcendental humanistic teachings are essential to our survival of human beings.
This current theme of man’s inhumanity to man is what’s playing out on television, on the internet, in the games, and in the movies day and night. This social barbarism is descending mankind into madness allover again. What we thought we left behind in the last millennium is coming back to haunt us, perhaps even worse than the last century.
In the last century, over 100,000,000 people were slaughtered by atheists, pagans, and Marxists such as Hitler (Pagan), Stalin (Marxist, Atheist), Pol Pot (Marxist, Atheist), and Mao Zedong (Marxist, Atheist). Over 100 million killed because of the false prophets of communism and paganism, and I am afraid that we are going backwards towards these teachings.
One has to be optimistic to survive-- optimism tempered with the realism of our very uncivilized civilization. We have lost our sense of stability, but we have not yet fallen into the abyss of which I spoke. However, we are losing ground very quickly.
It is a ‘shout-out,’ to use the vernacular of the day, and as course and abrupt reminder that we have got to reassess and revaluate our moral compass and get back online here. We’ve got to learn that our future as a human race, our future as a civilization is very much a function of our ability to reintegrate a sense of decency, kindness and culture that is rooted in understanding the divinity that is manifested in every human being.
[QUOTE="Thanks-"]The problem is which "proof" are you asking for? How do you identify what one must question? Coincidences are most questionable, and the atheistic argument that life is mere coincidence is what I am currently questioning.Nisstyre_56Did you read my quote? "after due examination and analysis, you find to be conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings" God is not beneficial, nor is the idea of God. Religion is one of the causes of all the problems in the world, and "God" doesn't do anythingThat is a myth. Atheism has killed far more people in the last century than religion, but that is neither here nor there. G-d exists, and therefore religion exists. Whether or not it is beneficial to the world is not the point.
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