[QUOTE="Vangaurdius"]

Stop abusing the enter key you tit. Secondly, you still haven't added anything to the argument. Once again, you can play Diablo 3, it's not idle ramblings. You do not have to play a game to know if the gameplay is good. And seriously, cut it out with the dialogue. It makes skimming through your actual points a pain in the ass. By watching something you are interacting with it. You're not sophisticated, your insipid, trying to make yourself more appealing by feigning intelligent dialogue. It doesn't mean **** on the internet, just like it doesn't mean **** in real life. PC gaming is no longer exclusive to adults anymore because it is far more affordable than it was in the past in addition to having a fully functioning computer growing increasingly important. I shouldn't even have to direct your attention at WoW to prove my point about a young audience. The rest of your ramblings are utterly meaningless and serve nothing more than an attempt to stroke your ego.

Grammaton-Cleric

The continued name-calling is amusing and further serves to demonstrate how intellectually hollow your arguments actually are.

And no, watching something is not interactivity, it's passivity. Novels, films and other forms of media that do not require interaction are passive mediums. Gaming by sharp contrast is based on interactivity; that is its defining characteristic and why it occupies an entirely different space than passive forms of expression and entertainment. Watching a game and playing a game are two entirely separate experiences and to deny this is to misunderstand the crux of the medium.

As it pertains to DiabloIII, I'll freely admit I'm not a fan of the franchise and have only played the second game briefly. That said, the game is clearly making some large changes to the formula and while those changes may be controversial within the hardcore community they are far from universally despised.

David Sirlin, a man who knows more about game design than you and I combined, wrote an extensive blog on the game and lavished its changes with praise. The article is here onGamasutra:

http://gamasutra.com/blogs/DavidSirlin/20120507/169854/Diablo_3s_Ability_System.php

Of course the man has also played the beta extensively which is more than can be said of you.

As to the issue of PC gaming, a game like Diablo III most certainly appeals to an older demographic regardless of platform, especially as the game is a sequel to a title released twelve years ago. Blizzard caters to a certain hardcore demographic and they certainly have little interest in a casual community of children who will abandon the game in six months.

Or is your hubris such that you think to understand their clientele and fan base better than Blizzard themselves?

Also, the average age of a WOW player, according to various surveys, is 30 years of age. So thank you again for making it that much easier to dismantle your arguments.

Of course once again I would direct you to the issue at hand: the notion that watching a video of a game offers the same probative value as actually playing said game.

Again, it is an outlandishly juvenile and illogical philosophy to employ when critiquing games but let me know if you ever muster the audacity to actually define and defend your personal metric.

[QUOTE="Vangaurdius"]

I just explained the ghost recon. Your direct quotation supported my argument. No where in there did I say specifically Advanced Warfighter was a Call of Duty clone. I said it's become that, and that the downhill trend started with Advanced Warfighter. That does not mean it was inspired by Call of Duty as you insist. I mean it's fallen into the same category of desperately trying to reward the player with superficial items to hide the empty husk of a game that it truly is. Twisting the meaning only works for sensationalist news. Akin to the childish bickering of politicians. And I'm not emotional. I always have, and always will swear a lot and insult people without feeling any anger. You did as well, albeit not as direct as me. I don't mind people insulting me, I do when you try to hide it though, thinking you're super sneaky when it's as obvious as UN peacekeeper hiding in the bushes. I've already heard the "you can't judge from footage" argument thousands of times. And every one of those times the response is the same. You can judge from the footage easily. I'm not talking about some pre-rendered trailer here. That may simply tell you that the story is terrible. I'm talking actual gameplay footage. You can easily make a well informed decision. Once again, enough with attempting to sound like a Harvard professor. I took English in university, it was mandatory. I have yet to not know a word you have typed. They are unnecessary, pretentious as I already stated, and if I didn't know any better I'd say your vapid. Diablo 3 was not a clear evolution. The skill tree is very dumbed down and the cash shop was a pathetic attempt and dealing with the trading in the previous games. Diablo has become a cartoon. The first 2 were grimdark, but not on the ludicrous scale of Warhammer. It's their blatant attempt at getting at a younger and less intelligent audience. Path of Exile is what should have happened with Diablo 3. I understand that you retreat behind your vocabulary to avoid coming up with any sort of argument, but that doesn't work when you are arguing with people who are familiar with it. Also, don't flatter yourself. I'm not hunting down everything you say on this site, or any site, or anywhere for that matter. On a closing note, the only emotion I'm feeling is pity, with a side of amusement. I've seen plenty of people such as yourself (don't take that as an insult, because that's not intended). I'm not so harsh as to tear you apart as I've seen others do, but someone will eventually. And you'll gain nothing of it, because you're not making people angry, you're providing entertainment, much like laughing and feeling pity for those teenagers that wear fedoras thinking they are the coolest thing since sliced bread and look like a 50's gangster or detective.

Grammaton-Cleric

It's fantastic that you took English at the university level. I'm assuming at some point they refreshed you on the use of paragraphs and how their utilization makes your points far more cogent by way of concise organization.

Also, you're not the first to attack my vocabulary usage rather than address the issue at hand and I'll share with you the same rebuttal I've implemented before: I've been posting on these boards for ten years and I assume those I discuss this medium with are intelligent people so I don't bother to employ a low-brow vernacular and rather assume the best - intellectually speaking - of my fellow enthusiasts.

If that makes me pretentious so be it but frankly the elitist mentality that permeates your pedestrian ramblings makes you come off as far snobbier, especially with all those allusions to the casual gamer.

As to your quote, regardless of your intent it read as a direct comparison to COD and furthermore your analysis of the games is wholly incorrect. Both Ghost Recon AW games play very similar to the earlier installments and it's of interest to note that your critique of those games is vague and undefined.

You traffic in vagaries because specificity requires edification and it's clear you have no intention of actually playing many of the games you deride.

Then we come back to the main issue: the ridiculous notion that you can effectively and accurately critique a game you haven't played based on some gameplay footage. The very fact that I must point out the clear and inherent fallacy of such a stance suggests you are either purposely obstinate or you are generally clueless as to how ridiculously baseless such an assertion is. Videogames are an INTERACTIVE medium which means we gauge them by interacting and playing them. Passivity is to miss the point of gaming and no one can fully grasp software until they've actually played at least some measure of it.

It's a very simple and obvious truth.

For example, you assert you've made some viable argument with Diablo III but when distilled it comes off as nothing more than random speculation and a heap of conjecture about the mechanics and the game being simplified and geared towards a younger audience, none of which seems true based on what beta testers (aka people who have played the actual game) have said. Also, if the game was aimed at a younger crowd as you claim, why is it currently an exclusive on the PC, which by default skews to an older demographic?

Lastly, I don't usually lose arguments because, unlike most bravado-infused chest-thumpers, I only tackle issues that I'm versed in or can logically and intelligently debate. If you think you possess the requite tools to dismantle my arguments then by all means do so, though you may find that task difficult if you continue employing poor logic and vacuous postulations.

Above all else please understand one thing: my knowledge of this medium is vast and unlike you I actually take the time to play the games I comment upon.

[QUOTE="Vangaurdius"]

First things first, your dialogue, shove it up your posterior you pretentious **** You don't sound smart, you sound like an idiot. Now that the insults are out of the way. I never said that the first Advanced warfighter was influenced by Call of Duty, I said the quality started to go down with that release, and now they want CoD's audience with the upcoming game. You can easily judge from gameplay footage unless your mental capacity is similar to that of a squirrel with downs syndrome, and that's impossible. And you can play Diablo 3. Go back to your hugbox and shorten your response. It was unnecessarily long. Now I really wish I could find that image where a man has his pants and underwear down to his ankles and has feces starting coming out of his rear, parked over a man's plate. The man the plate belongs to said "DUDE! Why are you s***ing on my plate?" And the man doing said action, said "How do you know it's s***, it's not even out yet."

Grammaton-Cleric

I'll ignore the insults (A clear violation of the TOS) because you strike me an overtly emotional person. You should learn to control that temper and perhaps a bit more logic would find its way into your writing.

As to Ghost Recon, this is a direct quote: "Ghost Recon: Went from a tactical game to another Call of Duty clone starting with advanced warfighter."

You clearly call the game derivative of COD. If that wasn't your intention then perhaps you should learn to articulate yourself better.

I do find it amusing that you feebly defend the notion that you can judge a game entirely from footage. It's a specious and illogical assertion but since you are clearly entrenched in your own myopic philosophy I won't bother attempting to pry you from your convictions, tenuous as they are.

I will state that your comments on Diablo III seem ridiculous given both the pedigree of the developer and the overwhelmingly positive impressions from those who have played the beta. A close friend of mine who played it extensively stated it was clear evolution of Diablo II but with vast improvements.

But then again, he only played the game.

You watched a video.

There really isn't much to be done about somebody who thinks they can formulate an opinion on something they haven't experienced. It's the apex of ignorance and worse, you extol such vapidity as if it is something worthy of praise.

[QUOTE="Vangaurdius"]Splinter Cell Conviction: Not a stealth game. Not negotiable. Ghost Recon: Went from a tactical game to another Call of Duty clone starting with advanced warfighter. The upcoming Hitman: It's a re-skinned Conviction, yet another series ruined by casuals. Rainbow Six: Went down hill after Raven Shield and the terrible Vegas games. The planning was removed because casuals are too stupid and ADHD to deal with it. Doom 3: Lost the pacing of the others. Became just another corridor shooter with cheap jump scares that failed to even scare you. Level complexity gone to cater to brain dead casuals along with secrets. Deus Ex HR: Removed a lot of complexity, shoe horned boss fights, went out of it's way to encourage a half-assed stealth approach Empire Total War: Utterly broken mess that remains that way today. Diablo 3: Pay2win korean cartoony game Dawn of War 2: Removed any sort of complexity, lost the feel of the WH40k, encourages cheese, no actual fighting, just a game of whack-a-mole. Starcraft 2: Based entirely around rushing. Empire Earth 3: Ditched the great things about the first game to dumb it down. Quake 4: Once again, pacing ruined and turned into a casual disaster. Also lost all the secret areas and map complexity. Bad Company 1/2, Battlefield 3: Ditched the strategy required in previous titles, consistently got rid of features, doesn't support modding, still using punkbuster. Civilization 5: A lot of the complexity removed, dlc everywhere, no mod support so they don't have to compete with dedicated modders who aren't in it for the money Every Call of Duty after 2: Self Explanatory Cliffs of Dover: Still utterly broken, much of the realism is gone. Sniper Elite V2: Corridor shooter with bullet cam. Elder Scrolls: Consistently dumbed down. Ruined Magic. No proper mod support and you can't add in new behaviors because the planned DLC would already be done by mod creators. Resident Evil: Self Explanatory. Went from zombies to tentacle monsters. No actual concerns about surviving. Always have plenty of resources, even on hardest difficulty. Microsoft Flight: The simulation is gone. But, at least there are far superior alternatives. Sim City: Sim City 4 was an incredibly complex game. Once again, casuals can't handle complexity because they don't apply themselves in life. Jagged Alliance Back in Action: Dumbed down, a lot of removed features. Homeworld 2: Much of the complexity was removed. Though mods do fix this. Sword of the Stars 2: Didn't learn from their mistakes. Stronghold 2 and 3: What made the first one and crusader great was gone along with any sort of passion. Both are incredibly buggy and lackluster. Crysis 2: Casual mess. The open ended nature, graphical quality made for gamers, skill based gameplay, excellent power set up down to selection, enemies, and atmosphere were gone and became a generic super soldier game. Command and Conquer 3/4/RA3: Units removed because the engine couldn't handle it, dumbed down, lost the feel and atmosphere of the previous games, especially with cutscenes. At least the casuals can't ruin grand strategy and rougelikes. Of course, now that I say that they somehow will.Grammaton-Cleric

Diablo III and the next Hitman game are on your list?

So do you honestly think you can legitimately gauge the quality of a game without playing it?

Because you can't.

All you've accomplished is ensuring that nobody with even a modicum of intelligence would take your critiques seriously.

Also, on what do you predicate the assertion that Hitman is a "re-skinned" version of Conviction when these two games are entirely different both thematically and in terms of core mechanics? Do you have any evidence to back up that claim?

I would also point out that your attack on Ghost Recon is nonsensical, since Advanced Warfighter was released well before the Call of Duty franchise hit its stride. The notion that it or its sequel was influenced by COD makes no sense given the fact that it was released a full two years before Modern Warfare. It also retained the gameplay from the earlier entries in the franchise and stuck to a third person perspective so again, I find your postulations illogical.

Actually, based on your list and rationale, I have this suspicion you don't necessarily play all of the games you critique but rather make hasty judgments based on gameplay footage. The irony here is that it comes off as the type of kneejerk and vapid assessment you would find in a casual consumer, something you seem to vehemently rally against in your post.

You are of course entitled to your opinion but if you are slandering and deriding some of these games without playing them then that opinion isn't worth a piece of well-trodden toilet paper on a men's room stall.

[QUOTE="NightmareP3"]

Holy mother of god, it's like we both share the same mind. I agree with you on everything except for Homeworld 2, i found the game to be alot of fun and not disappointing mainly becuse i didn't play the first game.

NightmareP3

this message was ment for Vangaurdius but for some reason it didn't Quote his post . _ .

Should I buy the Witcher 2? What's the typical game length if you do the side quests? Is it a rich RPG or just a hack n slash?Solid_Snake325