Sony on PS4: Pre-Owned Games Block "is a publishers decision".

There it is folks. Left up to the publishers, they'll lock them down for sure.

its always been up to the publisher, it just hasn't been brought up as a problem untill the new digital age.jcopp72

No. 

The same guy said this yesterday after the round table. This has already been posted multiple times.

Eurogamer: One of the questions my readers really want an answer to is whether you're going to block the use of second-hand or 'used' games, because it's a huge concern for them.

Shuhei Yoshida: Do you want us to do that?

Eurogamer: No. I think if you buy something on a disc you have a kind of moral contract with the person you've bought it from that you retain some of that value and you can pass it on. Do you agree?

Shuhei Yoshida: Yes. That's the general expectation by consumers. They purchase physical form, they want to use it everywhere, right? So that's my expectation.

Eurogamer: So if someone buys a PlayStation 4 game, you're not going to stop them reselling it?

Shuhei Yoshida Aaaah. [Asks PR adviser.] So what was our official answer to our internal question? [Consults adviser.] So, used games can play on PS4. How is that?Eurogamer

It's still a cagey answer but they cannot block Single player or offline portion of the games. It's impossible. Especially when he says this earlier in the interview.

Eurogamer: Does the console always need to be connected to the internet?

Shuhei Yoshida: You can play offline, but you may want to keep it connected. The system has the low-power mode - I don't know the official term - that the main system is shut down but the subsystem is awake. Downloading or updating or you can wake it up using either the tablet, smartphone or PS Vita.

Eurogamer: Are all of those things optional? For people who have broadband data limits, for example? They can customise everything?

Shuhei Yoshida: Oh yes, yes, you can go offline totally. Social is big for us, but we understand there are some people who are anti-social! So if you don't want to connect to anyone else, you can do that.Eurogamer

My guess is that in the roundtable he is talking about the activation codes or the online pass. But anyway, both Tretton and him came out and said they are against blocking used games sales. This is old outdated news.

What they could be hinting at is activation codes that unlocks single player content as well as multiplayer. Them being elusive and not wanting to talk about it is a clear sign it's true.

Something to consider is that if this was left up to the individual publisher, and not you know a full Sony mandate those few publishers would essentially be going to war with Gamestop. Then you could see GS threatening to pull any support for those publishers games. Besides just being an outlet to sell games they have a lot of advertising and such that helps sell the games more. It would be pretty risky to be one of the few publishers who do it. Not saying it's impossible though, but you can bet GS will fight it anyway they could.GodModeEnabled

You are right. They still need Gamestop. EA practically came out in support for used games a couple of weeks ago. They are not going to block used games.

Publishers decision or not, blocking used games would be a suicidal move. Online passes for multiplayer are borderline enough to work because that's just paying for access to an online function. Locking an entire game behind such a pass, however, would spell disaster. There are still too many people who never take their systems online, so you'd be blocking a large portion of consumers by default.

I can't see the idea taking off. It's too risky.

[QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"]Something to consider is that if this was left up to the individual publisher, and not you know a full Sony mandate those few publishers would essentially be going to war with Gamestop. Then you could see GS threatening to pull any support for those publishers games. Besides just being an outlet to sell games they have a lot of advertising and such that helps sell the games more. It would be pretty risky to be one of the few publishers who do it. Not saying it's impossible though, but you can bet GS will fight it anyway they could.S0lidSnake

You are right. They still need Gamestop. EA practically came out in support for used games a couple of weeks ago. They are not going to block used games.

I disagree. Publishers have been wanting to kill Gamestop for a while now, and they could if they really want to. There are other retailers - Walmart, Bestbuy, etc. to sell consoles and physical games at. And of course they will offer more games digitally as well now. 

When it comes down to it, Gamestop needs the publishers a lot more than the publishers need Gamestop. Gamestop could fight it, but it's inevitably going to be a battle they lose one day. 

What they could be hinting at is activation codes that unlocks single player content as well as multiplayer. Them being elusive and not wanting to talk about it is a clear sign it's true.Bigboi500

If it is true, they might as well just get out of the console business then. They'd be signing their death warrant by instituting online DRM. I don't think they'd be that stupid.

I disagree. Publishers have been wanting to kill Gamestop for a while now, and they could if they really want to. There are other retailers - Walmart, Bestbuy, etc. to sell consoles and physical games at. And of course they will offer more games digitally as well now. 

When it comes down to it, Gamestop needs the publishers a lot more than the publishers need Gamestop. Gamestop could fight it, but it's inevitably going to be a battle they lose one day. 

Vari3ty

Maybe so, but lossing GameStop would still deal a large blow. They're a necessary evil as game-centric retailers are still in demand and GameStop is the only big-name one still standing.

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]What they could be hinting at is activation codes that unlocks single player content as well as multiplayer. Them being elusive and not wanting to talk about it is a clear sign it's true.c_rake

If it is true, they might as well just get out of the console business then. They'd be signing their death warrant by instituting online DRM. I don't think they'd be that stupid.

I totally agree. That's why I can't understand why Sony is being so non-responsive in spilling the beans. It seems to me that's exactly what they are planning on doing, but don't want to admit it this early on, and spread negative vibes on PS4. But a move like that would be disastrous on so many levels.Bigboi500

That they said it's a "publisher's decision" makes me think they had enough requests to add such a feature that they had little choice but to add it. I doubt Sony themselves wanted it -- that Yoshida confirmed the PS4 can play used games suggests as much -- but it might be that certain partnerships depended upon it. So now they're trying to figure out how to convey these plans without shooting themselves in the foot. It's a very delicate situation. I'd be cagey too if I were them.

I don't think a used-game blocking would be enforced system-wide, though, if such a thing does exist. Hell, I doubt many publishers would be able to get away with using it.

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]I totally agree. That's why I can't understand why Sony is being so non-responsive in spilling the beans. It seems to me that's exactly what they are planning on doing, but don't want to admit it this early on, and spread negative vibes on PS4. But a move like that would be disastrous on so many levels.c_rake

That they said it's a "publisher's decision" makes me think they had enough requests to add such a feature that they had little choice but to add it. I doubt Sony themselves wanted it -- that Yoshida confirmed the PS4 can play used games suggests as much -- but it might be that certain partnerships depended upon it. So now they're trying to figure out how to convey these plans without shooting themselves in the foot. It's a very delicate situation. I'd be cagey too if I were them.

I don't think a used-game blocking would be enforced system-wide, though, if such a thing does exist. Hell, I doubt many publishers would be able to get away with using it.

Yoshida has confirmed that you will be able to play games offline. How would they go about implemeting these activation codes if it's not done online? Will every game be tied to the console? 

I just dont think they can implement such a feature without being always online. 

[QUOTE="c_rake"]

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]I totally agree. That's why I can't understand why Sony is being so non-responsive in spilling the beans. It seems to me that's exactly what they are planning on doing, but don't want to admit it this early on, and spread negative vibes on PS4. But a move like that would be disastrous on so many levels.S0lidSnake

That they said it's a "publisher's decision" makes me think they had enough requests to add such a feature that they had little choice but to add it. I doubt Sony themselves wanted it -- that Yoshida confirmed the PS4 can play used games suggests as much -- but it might be that certain partnerships depended upon it. So now they're trying to figure out how to convey these plans without shooting themselves in the foot. It's a very delicate situation. I'd be cagey too if I were them.

I don't think a used-game blocking would be enforced system-wide, though, if such a thing does exist. Hell, I doubt many publishers would be able to get away with using it.

Yoshida has confirmed that you will be able to play games offline. How would they go about implemeting these activation codes if it's not done online? Will every game be tied to the console? 

I just dont think they can implement such a feature without being always online. 

Perhaps you have to activate the game online, but then can play offline if you choose to... similar to Steam's offline mode. 

[QUOTE="c_rake"]

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]I totally agree. That's why I can't understand why Sony is being so non-responsive in spilling the beans. It seems to me that's exactly what they are planning on doing, but don't want to admit it this early on, and spread negative vibes on PS4. But a move like that would be disastrous on so many levels.S0lidSnake

That they said it's a "publisher's decision" makes me think they had enough requests to add such a feature that they had little choice but to add it. I doubt Sony themselves wanted it -- that Yoshida confirmed the PS4 can play used games suggests as much -- but it might be that certain partnerships depended upon it. So now they're trying to figure out how to convey these plans without shooting themselves in the foot. It's a very delicate situation. I'd be cagey too if I were them.

I don't think a used-game blocking would be enforced system-wide, though, if such a thing does exist. Hell, I doubt many publishers would be able to get away with using it.

Yoshida has confirmed that you will be able to play games offline. How would they go about implemeting these activation codes if it's not done online? Will every game be tied to the console? 

I just dont think they can implement such a feature without being always online. 

I have to wonder how much is getting lost in translation here. I wonder if Yoshida isn't simply talking about online passes that we already have, and ether he's not not explaining that clearly. I'm guessing English isn't a primary language for Yoshida, if he speaks it at all. So ether he's got conveying what he means clearly, or he's speaking through and interpreter and his meaning is getting lost somewhat. The conversation did, to me, seem hindered by a language barrier.

good

I don't support intrusive DRM as is, and will certainly not support the straight-up banning of used games without a substitute that more than makes up for it (like Steam on the PC).

Looks like PSN games also won't transfer over to PS4 though, so I don't know if I can trust purchasing digital content on consoles either...

This is basically the impression I got from his initial response. You can play used games, sure (...just pony up the $10 activation fee) That's something I can't get behind. Charge $80 if you want but if you're going to start DRM'ing games I'll look for alternative ways to play them.istuffedsunny

[QUOTE="istuffedsunny"]This is basically the impression I got from his initial response. You can play used games, sure (...just pony up the $10 activation fee) That's something I can't get behind. Charge $80 if you want but if you're going to start DRM'ing games I'll look for alternative ways to play them.Bigboi500

Yes, but the cost of servers should be taken care of from the initial purchase.

A retail game can only be used by one system at a time. Whether someone holds onto a multiplayer game for three years, or it trades hands between 100 people over the course of three years, the servers are still only dealing with one player at a time, and thus the same exact cost is imposed.

Those $10 activation fees are the publishers just scamming $10 extra dollars from you.

There it is folks. Left up to the publishers, they'll lock them down for sure.

Bigboi500

What did you expect him to say when they asked him about activation codes? You still need these codes to unlock multiplayer, DLC-s, and maybe even some single player parts. This wont change, and never will. How do you know he wasn`t talking about that? A simpel "NO" would have been wrong to. 

But if they block both single and multiplayer, that would be wrong. 

But how will that work? Its confirmed that you can play offline.

No. 

The same guy said this yesterday after the round table. This has already been posted multiple times.

[QUOTE="Eurogamer"]Eurogamer: One of the questions my readers really want an answer to is whether you're going to block the use of second-hand or 'used' games, because it's a huge concern for them.

Shuhei Yoshida: Do you want us to do that?

Eurogamer: No. I think if you buy something on a disc you have a kind of moral contract with the person you've bought it from that you retain some of that value and you can pass it on. Do you agree?

Shuhei Yoshida: Yes. That's the general expectation by consumers. They purchase physical form, they want to use it everywhere, right? So that's my expectation.

Eurogamer: So if someone buys a PlayStation 4 game, you're not going to stop them reselling it?

Shuhei Yoshida Aaaah. [Asks PR adviser.] So what was our official answer to our internal question? [Consults adviser.] So, used games can play on PS4. How is that?S0lidSnake

It's still a cagey answer but they cannot block Single player or offline portion of the games. It's impossible. Especially when he says this earlier in the interview.

Eurogamer: Does the console always need to be connected to the internet?

Shuhei Yoshida: You can play offline, but you may want to keep it connected. The system has the low-power mode - I don't know the official term - that the main system is shut down but the subsystem is awake. Downloading or updating or you can wake it up using either the tablet, smartphone or PS Vita.

Eurogamer: Are all of those things optional? For people who have broadband data limits, for example? They can customise everything?

Shuhei Yoshida: Oh yes, yes, you can go offline totally. Social is big for us, but we understand there are some people who are anti-social! So if you don't want to connect to anyone else, you can do that.Eurogamer

My guess is that in the roundtable he is talking about the activation codes or the online pass. But anyway, both Tretton and him came out and said they are against blocking used games sales. This is old outdated news.

How is that? Steam does not require you to always play online. You simply have to activate the code and play offline.

It actully pisses me off that Sony are unable to give us a straith forward answer on this. I was really hyped for Sony, but because of this im just pissed off. If MS can provide us with a real answer I would go for them right away. **** Sony.

Blocking multiplayer with a code is OK. The multiplayer will eventully die anyway. Blocking single players makes the games useless in the future. If I had to activate a Sega Mega Drive game online these days it would be impossible because Sega would have shut down the servers long ago. But these days im able to collect retro games because this activation code **** didnt excist back then.

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]

[QUOTE="istuffedsunny"]This is basically the impression I got from his initial response. You can play used games, sure (...just pony up the $10 activation fee) That's something I can't get behind. Charge $80 if you want but if you're going to start DRM'ing games I'll look for alternative ways to play them.Ly_the_Fairy

Yes, but the cost of servers should be taken care of from the initial purchase.

A retail game can only be used by one system at a time. Whether someone holds onto a multiplayer game for three years, or it trades hands between 100 people over the course of three years, the servers are still only dealing with one player at a time, and thus the same exact cost is imposed.

Those $10 activation fees are the publishers just scamming $10 extra dollars from you.

Im happy I live in Europe if they pull this crap.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/European-Court-of-Justice-Opens-Door-to-Digital-Game-Used-Market-279151.shtml

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]

There it is folks. Left up to the publishers, they'll lock them down for sure.

BuldozerX

What did you expect him to say when they asked him about activation codes? You still need these codes to unlock multiplayer, DLC-s, and maybe even some single player parts. This wont change, and never will. How do you know he wasn`t talking about that? A simpel "NO" would have been wrong to. 

But if they block both single and multiplayer, that would be wrong. 

But how will that work? Its confirmed that you can play offline.

My best guess is it works quite similar to Steam's offline mode - you need to first activate the game online before you can play it, but then after that you can play offline if you need to. 

[QUOTE="BuldozerX"]

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]

There it is folks. Left up to the publishers, they'll lock them down for sure.

Vari3ty

What did you expect him to say when they asked him about activation codes? You still need these codes to unlock multiplayer, DLC-s, and maybe even some single player parts. This wont change, and never will. How do you know he wasn`t talking about that? A simpel "NO" would have been wrong to. 

But if they block both single and multiplayer, that would be wrong. 

But how will that work? Its confirmed that you can play offline.

My best guess is it works quite similar to Steam's offline mode - you need to first activate the game online before you can play it, but then after that you can play offline if you need to. 

That's stupid. You know exactly what Activision will do with the COD series now (even though it won't effect me because I won't be buying any).

That's stupid. You know exactly what Activision will do with the COD series now (even though it won't effect me because I won't be buying any).

Venom_Raptor

the statement could just mean that things will be the same way sa they are now.

Anyway, what stops the publishers from blocking anything on the Wii U with actiavtion codes?

Anyway, what stops the publishers from blocking anything on the Wii U with actiavtion codes?

BuldozerX

[QUOTE="BuldozerX"]

Anyway, what stops the publishers from blocking anything on the Wii U with actiavtion codes?

BuldozerX

Did you just quote yourself? And then proceeded to own yourself? WTF!

That doesnt make any sense. Some developers have been crying in the media about this like a block thing would be some gift from heaven. Why dont block it themself?BuldozerX

Probably because they don't want to be the ones to pull the trigger on that either. They talk big, but eveyone's too afraid of the potential backlash.

[QUOTE="BuldozerX"][QUOTE="BuldozerX"]

Anyway, what stops the publishers from blocking anything on the Wii U with actiavtion codes?

Did you just quote yourself? And then proceeded to own yourself? WTF!

[QUOTE="BuldozerX"]That doesnt make any sense. Some developers have been crying in the media about this like a block thing would be some gift from heaven. Why dont block it themself?c_rake

Probably because they don't want to be the ones to pull the trigger on that either. They talk big, but eveyone's too afraid of the potential backlash.

That's stupid. You know exactly what Activision will do with the COD series now (even though it won't effect me because I won't be buying any).

Venom_Raptor

Why would they? They still haven't put an online pass into COD, something EA made standard in all of their games a few years ago. If anything I believe Activision would be one of the last companies to institute an anti-used games system. 

But also, like i said, they want people to buy the game used so they might pay for either online multiplayer passes, DLC or to unlock single player contant that new copies gets for free. A block would just turn gamers off from buying the game in the first place. Also, Gamestop would probably ignore the game.BuldozerX

The online passes are only locking out very small portions of content, though. What's seven quests in comparison to hundreds? They're akin to pre-order bonuses in that the content is a small addition. Obviously you can't quite say the same about multiplayer, but locking that behind a pass makes sense. If you really want multiplayer, $10 isn't a big deal.

[QUOTE="Venom_Raptor"]

That's stupid. You know exactly what Activision will do with the COD series now (even though it won't effect me because I won't be buying any).

Why would they? They still haven't put an online pass into COD, something EA made standard in all of their games a few years ago. If anything I believe Activision would be one of the last companies to institute an anti-used games system. 

[QUOTE="BuldozerX"]But also, like i said, they want people to buy the game used so they might pay for either online multiplayer passes, DLC or to unlock single player contant that new copies gets for free. A block would just turn gamers off from buying the game in the first place. Also, Gamestop would probably ignore the game.c_rake

The online passes are only locking out very small portions of content, though. What's seven quests in comparison to hundreds? They're akin to pre-order bonuses in that the content is a small addition. Obviously you can't quite say the same about multiplayer, but locking that behind a pass makes sense. If you really want multiplayer, $10 isn't a big deal.

Or am I talking non sense?

Publishers decision or not, blocking used games would be a suicidal move. Online passes for multiplayer are borderline enough to work because that's just paying for access to an online function. Locking an entire game behind such a pass, however, would spell disaster. There are still too many people who never take their systems online, so you'd be blocking a large portion of consumers by default.

I can't see the idea taking off. It's too risky.

[QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"]Something to consider is that if this was left up to the individual publisher, and not you know a full Sony mandate those few publishers would essentially be going to war with Gamestop. Then you could see GS threatening to pull any support for those publishers games. Besides just being an outlet to sell games they have a lot of advertising and such that helps sell the games more. It would be pretty risky to be one of the few publishers who do it. Not saying it's impossible though, but you can bet GS will fight it anyway they could.ZhugeL1ang